Jedi anti-Sith abilities

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Kurgen
207 posts Member
Several sith abilities are enhanced against Jedi.

Surely some Jedi abilities should be enhanced against Sith as well (yoda for example).

Replies

  • Jedi weren't exactly known for being good against Sith. If anyone had an anti-sith ability, it should be Mace. Do some research on his character.
  • I think if they brought in some Old Republic Jedi, we could get some anti-Sith abilities. But "modern" Jedi thought the Sith were extinct prior to the Clone Wars and only a handful of Jedi ever actually engaged a Sith in battle. And of those few Jedi who did, none had better than a 50% success rate (in the movies, anyway. I haven't counted up all the battles in the TV series but I think virtually all of them ended with one side retreating before the battle could be finished so those would count as draws at best).

    After the Clone Wars, any Jedi who survived Order 66 had virtually a 0% success rate against Sith.
  • The only ones who could would be jka, mace and Yoda.
  • The0n3
    984 posts Member
    And Obi Wan Kenobi.
  • The0n3 wrote: »
    And Obi Wan Kenobi.

    True
  • kalidor
    1484 posts Member
    Both General Kenobi and Old ben are good counters to sith. Old ben has evasion, and the ability to block most of the Sith's devasting effects in their specials. Kenobi can completely turn them around, give foresight, and taunt.
    Otherwise, all Jedi are good for against sith is dying.
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
  • To be fair, Darth Vader should have the ability to throw his lightsaber in an arch and murder an entire squad of 5 Jedi, unless Luke is on that team.

    Problem is that all Sith hunt Jedi, while very few Jedi hunt anyone. Point in case (Anakin the Jedi was a pussy, while Vader is a boss).
  • The0n3
    984 posts Member
    ExarTheKun wrote: »
    To be fair, Darth Vader should have the ability to throw his lightsaber in an arch and murder an entire squad of 5 Jedi, unless Luke is on that team.

    Problem is that all Sith hunt Jedi, while very few Jedi hunt anyone. Point in case (Anakin the Jedi was a pussy, while Vader is a boss).

    "(Anakin the Jedi was a pussy, while Vader is a boss)" - Are you kidding? JKA was one of the most badss Jedi during the CW, by the time of ROTS his reputation was known and respected across the galaxy...

    Anakin AND Vader are both bosses.... Well kid Ani is a pussy, i'll give you that...
  • the "modern" jedi were actually all training to fight against the sith when they returned, that was the main point of their training to fight the sith again when (or if) they returned and to protect the galaxy from them
    all jedi were trained to fight sith from almost the beginning of their training, the issue was they were all expecting the sith to just turn up one day with a big f you jedi and straight up attack which was the modus operandi from previous times, they did not expect nor were they prepared for the subtlety, misdirection and betrayel from within that palps instigated (it was pretty brilliant how palps did that) as that was very different from the usual sith approach
    realistically all jedi should have anti sith abilities and all sith anti jedi, although technically speaking the sith were interested in power and ruling/subjegating the galaxy but knew they would have to fight the jedi to achieve that whereas the jedi were there to protect the galaxy and specifically protect against the sith. opinion but i believe that really the jedi should be more anti sith than the sith anti jedi, as the greatest threat to absolutely everything they have sworn to protect and hold dear etc is the sith. and due to their own violation the siths greatest enemy is actuially themselves and if smart would actually make sure they are well trained in fighting the sith
    maul was the only sith that is ever mentioned to be specifically anti jedi and really he wasnt palpatine just says the jedi will be no match for your training which is ambigious but could possibly mean he was trained specifically to fight jedi
    its true that many jedi believed the sith to be extict but the masters didnt and even though many jedi believed them gone they still trained to fight them
    now in game terms palps, vader, maul, dooks for example who have anti jedi abilities in game
    maul in movies only ever fought 2 jedi and lost against one, so 1-1, in the cartoons he fought many times and never killed any and got defeated faaaaar more times by jedi than he ever won (i cant remember a single time except him and savage kinda wonish vs obi where they both ended up fleeing that encounter (although like i say i cant remember)), infact the only time he really kicked **** was against the inquisitors so really should have anti sith??
    palps only ever fought 4 jedi, he lost against mace (yes i know alot believe he did on purpose etc but both the book stated mace beat him fair and square as did senor lucas) and yoda which was a draw in which the books stated palps was afraid in that fight and couldnt believe the power yoda had, personal opinion but if the force explosion hadnt knocked yoda down and so far away from palps then palps would have lost that battle, and he defeated kit and was it eeth?. whereas he fought and defeated maul and savage. yes palps was certainly powerful and yeah i believe should have anti jedi but he didnt fight many
    vader yep this dude killed many many jedi, but mostly padawans and low level knights (extended universe he did defeat masters and full knights but not canon anymore although is still count shrug) he didnt defeat any jedi as vader that he could not of defeated as anakin the jedi. got schooled by obi when he first turned too.
    dooks in movies he was able to defeat anakin and obi but yoda defeated him, and then he defeated obi and lost to anakin. he also defeated syfo dius . dont really remember his win/loss count in the cartoons. he was also an ex jedi an ex grand master jedi and one of the best light saber duelists ever

    now with these records/results they have anti jedi abilities in game, so why dont mace, yoda, anakin, obi? they have atleast as good record?
    and also if in game they have anti jedi abilities because hey sith and jedi are the enemy, well why not jedi with anti sith as they are the jedi enemy?? also the sith have many enemies including themselves the jedi dont turn on each other as the sith do, they can completely concentrate on the sith with out worrying about getting backstabbed by their apprentices or having to kill their masters to advance
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group
  • MoBlaq
    526 posts Member
    If anyone should, it should be Yoda
  • War
    932 posts Member
    edited April 2017
    osamamatix wrote: »
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    There's more than two groups though, and Jedi beat some of those other groups, that's where the balance is.
  • War wrote: »
    osamamatix wrote: »
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    There's more than two groups though, and Jedi beat some of those other groups, that's where the balance is.

    Exactly. Paper beats rock beats scissors beats paper. That is why that simple game is so popular. Imagine if rock would beat paper, scissors, and rock!
  • War wrote: »
    osamamatix wrote: »
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    There's more than two groups though, and Jedi beat some of those other groups, that's where the balance is.

    except jedi dont have any "anti-x" abilities (only 2 useless jedi eeth and plo have an anti droid ability) like qgj has a couple great abilities but he doesnt have this great ability and it does extra stuff against a specific group
    whereas the sith have great abilities and also they have extra anti jedi added to it aswell

    im not saying jedi cant beat anyone or this group that group, what im saying is sith have these specific abilities against jedi whereas jedi dont so it makes one group stronger against another without any balance, there is nothing to balance out sith extra anti jedi abilities

    when any other group goes against jedi they dont have to worry that jedi have all these extra effects against them, but jedi not only have to look at a sith team and go hmm thats a great team but they also have to fight this great team with great abilities having all these unbalance bonus' against them
  • War wrote: »
    osamamatix wrote: »
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    There's more than two groups though, and Jedi beat some of those other groups, that's where the balance is.

    Exactly. Paper beats rock beats scissors beats paper. That is why that simple game is so popular. Imagine if rock would beat paper, scissors, and rock!

    except this game is not paper, rock, scissors
    its a game about balance and also picking the right team to fight opossing team synergy etc etc
    but what that should mean is certain toons should have certain advantages against certain toons/teams/etc but not one group just flat out wrecks another group
  • War
    932 posts Member
    osamamatix wrote: »
    War wrote: »
    osamamatix wrote: »
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    There's more than two groups though, and Jedi beat some of those other groups, that's where the balance is.

    except jedi dont have any "anti-x" abilities (only 2 useless jedi eeth and plo have an anti droid ability) like qgj has a couple great abilities but he doesnt have this great ability and it does extra stuff against a specific group
    whereas the sith have great abilities and also they have extra anti jedi added to it aswell

    im not saying jedi cant beat anyone or this group that group, what im saying is sith have these specific abilities against jedi whereas jedi dont so it makes one group stronger against another without any balance, there is nothing to balance out sith extra anti jedi abilities

    when any other group goes against jedi they dont have to worry that jedi have all these extra effects against them, but jedi not only have to look at a sith team and go hmm thats a great team but they also have to fight this great team with great abilities having all these unbalance bonus' against them

    Tenacity Up is the effect Jedi have against my Empire meta. Not every anti-synergy effect has to be double damage, or increased chance to do x effect. Some things are simply counters without having to specify when and where they're useful.
  • Ig88isboss
    1752 posts Member
    osamamatix wrote: »
    the "modern" jedi were actually all training to fight against the sith when they returned, that was the main point of their training to fight the sith again when (or if) they returned and to protect the galaxy from them
    all jedi were trained to fight sith from almost the beginning of their training, the issue was they were all expecting the sith to just turn up one day with a big f you jedi and straight up attack which was the modus operandi from previous times, they did not expect nor were they prepared for the subtlety, misdirection and betrayel from within that palps instigated (it was pretty brilliant how palps did that) as that was very different from the usual sith approach
    realistically all jedi should have anti sith abilities and all sith anti jedi, although technically speaking the sith were interested in power and ruling/subjegating the galaxy but knew they would have to fight the jedi to achieve that whereas the jedi were there to protect the galaxy and specifically protect against the sith. opinion but i believe that really the jedi should be more anti sith than the sith anti jedi, as the greatest threat to absolutely everything they have sworn to protect and hold dear etc is the sith. and due to their own violation the siths greatest enemy is actuially themselves and if smart would actually make sure they are well trained in fighting the sith
    maul was the only sith that is ever mentioned to be specifically anti jedi and really he wasnt palpatine just says the jedi will be no match for your training which is ambigious but could possibly mean he was trained specifically to fight jedi
    its true that many jedi believed the sith to be extict but the masters didnt and even though many jedi believed them gone they still trained to fight them
    now in game terms palps, vader, maul, dooks for example who have anti jedi abilities in game
    maul in movies only ever fought 2 jedi and lost against one, so 1-1, in the cartoons he fought many times and never killed any and got defeated faaaaar more times by jedi than he ever won (i cant remember a single time except him and savage kinda wonish vs obi where they both ended up fleeing that encounter (although like i say i cant remember)), infact the only time he really kicked **** was against the inquisitors so really should have anti sith??
    palps only ever fought 4 jedi, he lost against mace (yes i know alot believe he did on purpose etc but both the book stated mace beat him fair and square as did senor lucas) and yoda which was a draw in which the books stated palps was afraid in that fight and couldnt believe the power yoda had, personal opinion but if the force explosion hadnt knocked yoda down and so far away from palps then palps would have lost that battle, and he defeated kit and was it eeth?. whereas he fought and defeated maul and savage. yes palps was certainly powerful and yeah i believe should have anti jedi but he didnt fight many
    vader yep this dude killed many many jedi, but mostly padawans and low level knights (extended universe he did defeat masters and full knights but not canon anymore although is still count shrug) he didnt defeat any jedi as vader that he could not of defeated as anakin the jedi. got schooled by obi when he first turned too.
    dooks in movies he was able to defeat anakin and obi but yoda defeated him, and then he defeated obi and lost to anakin. he also defeated syfo dius . dont really remember his win/loss count in the cartoons. he was also an ex jedi an ex grand master jedi and one of the best light saber duelists ever

    now with these records/results they have anti jedi abilities in game, so why dont mace, yoda, anakin, obi? they have atleast as good record?
    and also if in game they have anti jedi abilities because hey sith and jedi are the enemy, well why not jedi with anti sith as they are the jedi enemy?? also the sith have many enemies including themselves the jedi dont turn on each other as the sith do, they can completely concentrate on the sith with out worrying about getting backstabbed by their apprentices or having to kill their masters to advance
    and in game balance its not really balanced if say the first group has extra abilities against the second group where the second group doesnt have extra abilities against the first group

    +1 This guy knows what he's talking about.
  • DatBoi
    3572 posts Member
    Yoda gives his team tenacity up so they can resist the debuffs that sith rely on. That sounds anti-sith to me. And wouldn't that be more consistent with the teachings of the Jedi? The Jedi are (supposed to be) defensive protectors who don't rely on brute force or strength to defeat their enemies. They cooperate, counter, use their opponents strength against them, etc.

    Actually, a neat Jedi ability would be to remove all debuffs on allies and inflict them on the enemy.
  • Generally speaking sith are stronger than jedi so..
  • War
    932 posts Member
    DatBoi wrote: »
    Yoda gives his team tenacity up so they can resist the debuffs that sith rely on. That sounds anti-sith to me. And wouldn't that be more consistent with the teachings of the Jedi? The Jedi are (supposed to be) defensive protectors who don't rely on brute force or strength to defeat their enemies. They cooperate, counter, use their opponents strength against them, etc.

    Actually, a neat Jedi ability would be to remove all debuffs on allies and inflict them on the enemy.

    That'd be cool idea for a Jedi zeta. Mace Windu maybe? Better yet, just add that effect to his smite. Would work well since it would also dispel their positive buffs.
  • Kurgen
    207 posts Member
    So many nerdy comments about the 'history' of Star Wars, etc.... well here's one for you.... sith operate in 2's... how about if you have more than 2 sith in a team, they try to kill each other....
  • Almost all Jedi in the game are from the period of clone wars. They had no experience fighting xom siths
  • War
    932 posts Member
    My idea for a Plo Koon zeta, would be when an enemy is pulled from stealth they're stunned for a turn, that would be the anti-Sith synergy you're looking for. And despite keeping a Zaul team under constant stun almost, it's still balanced by the lack of other metas it'd be good against.
  • Jedi squad can beat: 3 clean, rex lead, any empire lead, rebells, dn lead.

    They only struggle against GOOD zaul team.

    Sound fair enough to me.

    Ps; meta maul is gonna fade and your jedi will stay competitive, so sit back and relax
  • Olga
    1333 posts Member
    Ig88isboss wrote: »
    The only ones who could would be jka, mace and Yoda.
    Only JKA turned to the dark side though, so I guess it could make sense for JKA. Yoda and Mace are too disciplined to be involved in ideas of hatred and vengeance.

  • Moicaliss
    992 posts Member
    edited April 2017
    Ps 2; if they haven't rework sith, in particular maul, ZQgj will be meta by now.

    Edit 1: for those we still haven't see it, Ezra is really a good addition to any jedi team. Assist whit buff, dispel, good speed and hit like a truck!!

    Edit 2: ppl need to realise that jedi are a really good END game squad. Does jedi are good at lv70...no, are they good without GK...no, are they good without zeta...no and no! Your only problem is that the current meta beat your squad. But they can beat anything else, and even against zaul...if they don't have sa...it's pretty much a win.
  • This has been brought up SOOO MANY times. Why should the jedi in this game have anti-sith abilities when they didn't even know the sith had returned? Hell, the Jedi Council were all sitting in the same room with Palpatine, and couldn't sense that he was the Sith Lord. Including Yoda!! Grandmaster Yoda!!

    That is why they do not have anti-sith powers. They didn't learn the truth until it was too late. The sith ran around doing what they wanted. In 3 movies, Palpatine had 3 different Apprentices--Maul, Dooku, and Vader. Say what you want about Palp still being Darth Plagueis' Apprentice he had Maul, it doesn't matter. He had 3 Apprentices himself. And apparently managed to hide out on Corusant in what was clearly a creepy **** sith hideout (watch Episode II for when Dooku travels to Corusant). Right under the jedis noses!!!

    Oh, they could sense pain from across the galaxy, but not the dark side a couple miles away from them.

    You can point out lightsaber duels and records and all that all you want. But the fact is, the Jedi were, in large part, overwhelmed by the Sith. 2 Sith running around at a time, and all those Jedi Masters couldn't sense them.

    Shame, shame.


  • Jedi are weak, they need anti-sith abilities....yeah sure...
  • Zanhaep
    358 posts Member
    I think if they brought in some Old Republic Jedi, we could get some anti-Sith abilities.

    Exactly. Should Mace Windu have anti-Sith abilities? Not really. But someone like, say, Satele Shan, does deserve anti-Sith abilities if she is ever added, seeing as it would be far more fitting to her character than any movie-era Jedi.
  • Olga
    1333 posts Member
    edited April 2017
    Hm well Satele stopped the sith attacking that civilian ship, so maybe they can have abilites about appealing to the Sith's good side and turning them away. Also the Jedi who folowed Revan to Malachor would have anti-sith abilities.
  • War
    932 posts Member
    Olga wrote: »
    Hm well Satele stopped the sith attacking that civilian ship, so maybe they can have abilites about appealing to the Sith's good side and turning them away. Also the Jedi who folowed Revan to Malachor would have anti-sith abilities.

    Satele fought and defeated Darth Malgus, one of the most powerful Sith at the time, I think a few anti-Sith abilities would be fine. Plus that was only one of exploits in the war against the Sith Empire.
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