Why is Nihilus' Drain Force not landing on a toon when they have tenacity up?

chuckwing

I am fairly certain that it used to until a few days ago. Drain force does NOT apply a negative status effect which is what tenacity up (according to its description) guards against. Nothing in these descriptions says this is how this skill should interact with that buff. Was this a stealth nerf that wasn't mentioned in update notes? A bug?

Dark_Helmet152

Does it say resisted? There is only a 50% chance of it increasing cooldowns if the enemy is not debuffed. Toons who have tenacity up often are not debuffed.

UltimateSeaDog

it should, since TM removal is also resisted...
whatever. that's for a different argument

SnakesOnAPlane

Dark_Helmet152 wrote: »

Does it say resisted? There is only a 50% chance of it increasing cooldowns if the enemy is not debuffed. Toons who have tenacity up often are not debuffed.

This! BUT...since the latest update last week, it does seem as if Nilly isn't landing it as much as he used to. Just sayin...

Ben_kenobi

SnakesOnAPlane wrote: »

Dark_Helmet152 wrote: »

Does it say resisted? There is only a 50% chance of it increasing cooldowns if the enemy is not debuffed. Toons who have tenacity up often are not debuffed.

This! BUT...since the latest update last week, it does seem as if Nilly isn't landing it as much as he used to. Just sayin...

That's confirmation bias

chuckwing

I am on six battles against the triple cleanse team the last two days and haven't increased one cooldown through tenacity up in all of those battles. I could be the unluckiest person ever I suppose? I actually haven't even gotten to annihilate a single toon in all of those battles after averaging two per battle before this.

akaBen

Nihilus's Force Drain is not a debuff as stated above so Tenacity has no affect on it. It has a 50% chance to land on a toon with no debuffs and 100% chance to land on a toon with debuffs. This doesn't not mean it will land for sure. The attack still is that... an attack. It can be dodged. If you have no debuffs on any of their toons you have a 50% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. If their toon has a debuff you have a 100% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. if you really want to test it, turn off the x4 speed and watch carefully when you use it. I use my Nihilus daily in arena for sometimes 10 battles, my shard is hard to get back to #1 , and I have many Rex L, GK, Chaze, etc teams. I often land cooldown increases on toons with Tenacity increase. I have found it to be much more effective against Rex teams to use a very fast Sith Assassin and then my Maul, Palp, and Nihilus will go before they do and I can get Nihilus to land many more cooldown increases that way.

But I have not noticed any difference in the chance of cooldown increase landing or not against Tenacity up..

-akaBen tau-GGC

Snake2

akaBen wrote: »

Nihilus's Force Drain is not a debuff as stated above so Tenacity has no affect on it. It has a 50% chance to land on a toon with no debuffs and 100% chance to land on a toon with debuffs. This doesn't not mean it will land for sure. The attack still is that... an attack. It can be dodged. If you have no debuffs on any of their toons you have a 50% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. If their toon has a debuff you have a 100% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. if you really want to test it, turn off the x4 speed and watch carefully when you use it. I use my Nihilus daily in arena for sometimes 10 battles, my shard is hard to get back to #1 , and I have many Rex L, GK, Chaze, etc teams. I often land cooldown increases on toons with Tenacity increase. I have found it to be much more effective against Rex teams to use a very fast Sith Assassin and then my Maul, Palp, and Nihilus will go before they do and I can get Nihilus to land many more cooldown increases that way.

But I have not noticed any difference in the chance of cooldown increase landing or not against Tenacity up..

-akaBen tau-GGC

Turn meter removal isn't a debuff either. Just sayin'...

SnakesOnAPlane

Snake2 wrote: »

akaBen wrote: »

Nihilus's Force Drain is not a debuff as stated above so Tenacity has no affect on it. It has a 50% chance to land on a toon with no debuffs and 100% chance to land on a toon with debuffs. This doesn't not mean it will land for sure. The attack still is that... an attack. It can be dodged. If you have no debuffs on any of their toons you have a 50% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. If their toon has a debuff you have a 100% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. if you really want to test it, turn off the x4 speed and watch carefully when you use it. I use my Nihilus daily in arena for sometimes 10 battles, my shard is hard to get back to #1 , and I have many Rex L, GK, Chaze, etc teams. I often land cooldown increases on toons with Tenacity increase. I have found it to be much more effective against Rex teams to use a very fast Sith Assassin and then my Maul, Palp, and Nihilus will go before they do and I can get Nihilus to land many more cooldown increases that way.

But I have not noticed any difference in the chance of cooldown increase landing or not against Tenacity up..

-akaBen tau-GGC

Turn meter removal isn't a debuff either. Just sayin'...

Exactly! Kozi recently submitted the Drain Force vs TMR argument as a bug:

https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/comment/1037471/#Comment_1037471

JohnnySteelAlpha

SnakesOnAPlane wrote: »

Snake2 wrote: »

akaBen wrote: »

Nihilus's Force Drain is not a debuff as stated above so Tenacity has no affect on it. It has a 50% chance to land on a toon with no debuffs and 100% chance to land on a toon with debuffs. This doesn't not mean it will land for sure. The attack still is that... an attack. It can be dodged. If you have no debuffs on any of their toons you have a 50% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. If their toon has a debuff you have a 100% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. if you really want to test it, turn off the x4 speed and watch carefully when you use it. I use my Nihilus daily in arena for sometimes 10 battles, my shard is hard to get back to #1 , and I have many Rex L, GK, Chaze, etc teams. I often land cooldown increases on toons with Tenacity increase. I have found it to be much more effective against Rex teams to use a very fast Sith Assassin and then my Maul, Palp, and Nihilus will go before they do and I can get Nihilus to land many more cooldown increases that way.

But I have not noticed any difference in the chance of cooldown increase landing or not against Tenacity up..

-akaBen tau-GGC

Turn meter removal isn't a debuff either. Just sayin'...

Exactly! Kozi recently submitted the Drain Force vs TMR argument as a bug:

https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/comment/1037471/#Comment_1037471

Based on her response of submitting it as a bug to "see what we see" and Scuba's response as well, seems the bug flag is more just notification it will be investigated, but not confirmed yet to be a bug or definitely going to be changed. What's the proper way to interpret this?

LeoRavus

Tenacity shouldn't apply to this OR TM removal. If anything needs to be flagged it's TM removal being resisted.

The ONLY THINGS that should be resisted are debuffs (red icons over the characters). That's it. Having the TM bar and cooldowns reduced aren't status effects.

jackTHErandom

LeoRavus wrote: »

Tenacity shouldn't apply to this OR TM removal. If anything needs to be flagged it's TM removal being resisted.

The ONLY THINGS that should be resisted are debuffs (red icons over the characters). That's it. Tenacity wards off negative status effects. I guess it's debatable if TM removal is a status effect, but cooldown reduction is definitely not a status effect.

So lets just introduce red icons over characters when they are tmr'd and force drained

Kyno

JohnnySteelAlpha wrote: »

SnakesOnAPlane wrote: »

Snake2 wrote: »

akaBen wrote: »

Nihilus's Force Drain is not a debuff as stated above so Tenacity has no affect on it. It has a 50% chance to land on a toon with no debuffs and 100% chance to land on a toon with debuffs. This doesn't not mean it will land for sure. The attack still is that... an attack. It can be dodged. If you have no debuffs on any of their toons you have a 50% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. If their toon has a debuff you have a 100% chance of it landing *if you actually hit the toon*. if you really want to test it, turn off the x4 speed and watch carefully when you use it. I use my Nihilus daily in arena for sometimes 10 battles, my shard is hard to get back to #1 , and I have many Rex L, GK, Chaze, etc teams. I often land cooldown increases on toons with Tenacity increase. I have found it to be much more effective against Rex teams to use a very fast Sith Assassin and then my Maul, Palp, and Nihilus will go before they do and I can get Nihilus to land many more cooldown increases that way.

But I have not noticed any difference in the chance of cooldown increase landing or not against Tenacity up..

-akaBen tau-GGC

Turn meter removal isn't a debuff either. Just sayin'...

Exactly! Kozi recently submitted the Drain Force vs TMR argument as a bug:

https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/comment/1037471/#Comment_1037471

Based on her response of submitting it as a bug to "see what we see" and Scuba's response as well, seems the bug flag is more just notification it will be investigated, but not confirmed yet to be a bug or definitely going to be changed. What's the proper way to interpret this?

You are correct, it seems to have been flagged for investigation and we will find out later if they should be acting the same way or not. So technically not a bug yet.

To OP, nope I have seen no difference, what you are seeing is the 50% chance to proc.