A Plea to the Galactic War Dev Team
Can we please have some feedback on the intent of Galactic War? There are a number of posts of late related to its challenge. The lack of dev feedback about it, outside of changing a battle seed, has been a deafening silence. Even something as banal as 'yes, we read your posts - we don't see a big difference in completion percentage - your situation is unique' would be appreciated.
If your intent is for GW to be mostly impossible to complete, than for many of us that objective has been achieved. I would think a brief perusal into completion statistics for GW would bear this out. For me personally, my completion rate has gone from ~90% to ~10%. I added CLS and a Zeta on one account, maybe that explains it. On the second, no such improvements were made outside of possibly getting my first Gear 12 toon. Either way, given the importance of gear, I fail to see how a roster that has the following:
Gear 12: 0, Gear 11: 1, Gear 10: 4, Gear 9: 3
is supposed to somehow compete with a team that has 1 G12 and 4 G11 with arena class mods. FWIW, G12 Rex (L), G11 R2, GK, DN, Thrawn to be specific, but this is akin to every GW.
This change in difficulty at the same time we're all trying to improve our rosters for TB is a bit of a slap in the face. It's hard for me to justify spending time on a team that's good at GW with so many other farming priorities. I'm confident the community leaders of this forum and the development staff of the game care about their player base. Why not show it by loosening up GW just a bit?
From an algorithm standpoint, I'm sure many of use would happy to lend a hand. If you'd like some suggestions:
1. Limit the overall total modded speed increase to the players maximum modded speed increase. For example, I'm looking at Node 12 with a total speed enhancement of +432. My arena team has a woeful +227, and these are my best speed secondaries (except on the tank). So, there's a +206 speed differential against my best team. There is a significant fall off to the latter parts of my roster, which are already suffering from a gear imbalance of their own.
2. Limit the zeta imbalance. Zetas account for very little stat power, decent galactic power, and immense benefits when applied with the appropriate synergy. Zarriss for instance, under GK represents a significant challenge for anyone without the proper counters at the right gear level. If I have zero zetas on my roster, is it fair that I should face five of them throughout the course of a GW?
3. Limit the number of raid / legendary toons to either those toons on the players roster or remove them entirely. CLS, Thrawn, R2, GK, Han Solo are among the best toons in the game and present some of the greater imbalances based on their kit. Perhaps limit the number of appearances of a toon to 1 in a GW - if my character is unavailable when defeated during a node, why not yours as well? There are 60 characters needed in a GW - more than enough to go around. Besides, it is tiring seeing the same 12 characters all the time (Phasma, Vader, Dooku, Wedge, Biggs, over and over and over).
4. Limit the total gear level to some cap imposed by the player's roster. A cumulative five gear levels across a squad is too much given the protection benefits and access to more significant stat enhancements at the higher gear tier. Perhaps this could be tempered by the second-tier of the player's roster - for example, if they have 30 Gear 11 toons, then a full Gear 12 squad on Node 12 is reasonable. If they have five Gear 11 toons, then not so much.
Please understand that many of us are not asking for GW to be easy, but for it to be fair. My strategy for GW has changed such that I put my A team in around Node 9 now since I know I have no shot at Node 12 and basically only look at it to see how badly I'm going to get smoked. It used to be my favorite mode, now I just need the tokens to farm ships for TB...
If your intent is for GW to be mostly impossible to complete, than for many of us that objective has been achieved. I would think a brief perusal into completion statistics for GW would bear this out. For me personally, my completion rate has gone from ~90% to ~10%. I added CLS and a Zeta on one account, maybe that explains it. On the second, no such improvements were made outside of possibly getting my first Gear 12 toon. Either way, given the importance of gear, I fail to see how a roster that has the following:
Gear 12: 0, Gear 11: 1, Gear 10: 4, Gear 9: 3
is supposed to somehow compete with a team that has 1 G12 and 4 G11 with arena class mods. FWIW, G12 Rex (L), G11 R2, GK, DN, Thrawn to be specific, but this is akin to every GW.
This change in difficulty at the same time we're all trying to improve our rosters for TB is a bit of a slap in the face. It's hard for me to justify spending time on a team that's good at GW with so many other farming priorities. I'm confident the community leaders of this forum and the development staff of the game care about their player base. Why not show it by loosening up GW just a bit?
From an algorithm standpoint, I'm sure many of use would happy to lend a hand. If you'd like some suggestions:
1. Limit the overall total modded speed increase to the players maximum modded speed increase. For example, I'm looking at Node 12 with a total speed enhancement of +432. My arena team has a woeful +227, and these are my best speed secondaries (except on the tank). So, there's a +206 speed differential against my best team. There is a significant fall off to the latter parts of my roster, which are already suffering from a gear imbalance of their own.
2. Limit the zeta imbalance. Zetas account for very little stat power, decent galactic power, and immense benefits when applied with the appropriate synergy. Zarriss for instance, under GK represents a significant challenge for anyone without the proper counters at the right gear level. If I have zero zetas on my roster, is it fair that I should face five of them throughout the course of a GW?
3. Limit the number of raid / legendary toons to either those toons on the players roster or remove them entirely. CLS, Thrawn, R2, GK, Han Solo are among the best toons in the game and present some of the greater imbalances based on their kit. Perhaps limit the number of appearances of a toon to 1 in a GW - if my character is unavailable when defeated during a node, why not yours as well? There are 60 characters needed in a GW - more than enough to go around. Besides, it is tiring seeing the same 12 characters all the time (Phasma, Vader, Dooku, Wedge, Biggs, over and over and over).
4. Limit the total gear level to some cap imposed by the player's roster. A cumulative five gear levels across a squad is too much given the protection benefits and access to more significant stat enhancements at the higher gear tier. Perhaps this could be tempered by the second-tier of the player's roster - for example, if they have 30 Gear 11 toons, then a full Gear 12 squad on Node 12 is reasonable. If they have five Gear 11 toons, then not so much.
Please understand that many of us are not asking for GW to be easy, but for it to be fair. My strategy for GW has changed such that I put my A team in around Node 9 now since I know I have no shot at Node 12 and basically only look at it to see how badly I'm going to get smoked. It used to be my favorite mode, now I just need the tokens to farm ships for TB...
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While I am not a dev, I can say that try have stated exactly what you are saying. "They do read reviews and have are looking at the completion rate and are happy where it is. "
If this has changed I'm sure they would chime in as this is a hot button topic.
I believe there is a slight bit of confusion over the term "completion rate". I believe this is more about how many nodes you compete not the number of times you complete it 100%. In which case when people say they can't complete GW, they are probably averaging 75% or higher (beating node 9).
The intent of GW has always been to test your whole roster. This can mean 2 things, 1 having multiple geared toons ready to go into a fight. Second it can mean having a roster developed with the enough of the right toons to be able to handle the meta shift. Both of which is harder for f2p mid to early game players, and even some long term players depending on development strategy.
The last nodes are meant to push you to the limit being that they are at or above your rated GW power rating.
There are many strategies out there to help you compete in GW, (not a quick fix). Many things in this game are meant to be long haul projects that take priority and focus. We have all been there, you can get through the hump.
The devs care a great deal about the community and the player base. I believe that is why we have a game mode as dynamic as GW that changes and grows with the meta and players power respectively.
Perhaps, but they've also been understandably busy (I have an immense amount of empathy for developers).
Sure, then we need to agree on terminology for 'completing all 12 nodes of GW'. Let's call it a Twelver. I contend that the number of 'twelvers' observed since the advent of CLS / TB / Gear 12 has decreased, potentially significantly, from before. Twelvers are important since they comprise ~1/5 of the total rewards, depending on how you want to slice the pie.
Just so I'm clear on this. In order to get a Twelver, since you're facing a team that is on the order of 120% your top power rating, you basically need two arena teams, from a gear perspective. And you might need some specific toons to overcome particular kits (Zariss for example), like in the early days of Dooku under DN when Dooku could single handedly destroy your roster if you didn't have Daze, which a lot of people didn't because it was only on Maul (fleet and guild) or K2 (non-farmable at the time). Got it.
TM loading, suicide squads, etc. etc. I know - I've completed my share of GWs and up until recently had my hands full, but not too full.
Other GW strategies tend to boil down to 'Just gear up a resistance team and put a zeta on Finn' Sure - I'm a month or two into that project. Got some of 'em to Gear 8 - ooooh - still MONTHS away from getting five characters to G11 so they can compete with the G12's I'm starting to see on Node 9. My dad gum arena team isn't even all G11 yet.
The 20% (15%, whatever the number is) increase in max power was fine prior to the release of a new gear level. But now that G12 has been introduced, and we're seeing it over and over, and we have none ourselves on the tippity top of our roster, how is the 'depth' of our roster supposed to compete? Compound this with the fact that arena teams are being selected for competition, so they've got 'arena mods' on them, and any toon that is even one gear level below is doomed to be nothing more than turn meter fodder for the opposition.
I honestly can't envision that THIS is what the developers intended. It's not competitive. It's akin to my high school basketball team playing five on 3 against Kevin Durant, Steph Curry, and Draymond Green. It doesn't matter what the bench looks like - they just can't compete.
Here's today's team (It's amazing how many arena #1s I get to play!!!)
https://swgoh.gg/u/brennerchen/
3 G12s, 6 functional Zetas (meaning Leadership zetas for non-leaders don't count). 120% GP or Stat Power, take your pick.
Against this roster - already depleted by the multiple Wiggs teams on Nodes 1-6, zQGJ on 9, and zMaul on 11.
https://swgoh.gg/u/cann0nf0dder/
Where's the path to success?
This is a fair assumption but an assumption nonetheless. I understand that everyone wants 100% and that there are more rewards there but thats the point. its supposed to be a goal, and a that goal has been stated as something we are not supposed to get all the time. this makes me think that they are still happy with the completion rate of each persons completion rate. I understand everyone wants to focus on the twelver, but GW is not an all or nothing.
I believe the calculated value is closer to 112%, but i have not see the data in a while. I agree that you may need certain toons or teams to clear GW, hence why i believe when they say test your whole roster they mean it. This same thing happened at gear/lvl cap increases too, and it all balances out as you push through the hump.
You seem to know the path, but the road is long and you need to be patient and keep focus on your plan.
As stated you we are not supposed to beat GW every time.
I have been using my resistance since G9/G8, with TM advantage and high potency (but otherwise bad mods) it works great.
I have also never believed in suicide squads, you give up the most important advantage TM, and the ability to reset. but to each his own.
Yes one on one that doesn't seem fair but you have many more tools at your disposal. To enhance your example, your HS team could at least play ball against that team, if it was the whole roster with this spring loaded leg things vs those 3 and they had to play in flippers. that may be an exaggeration but a good mental image.
Again we have all been there and I am not a dev, maybe i'm wrong and they are out there trying to make a fix for GW. but i always prepare for the worst.
They don't need to be g11 to beat GW for you.
I've run the numbers a few different ways. That particular team was 120.7% of my highest possible GP (which isn't my arena squad, but close enough to it) and 114.7% of my highest possible Stat Power (old model, again not my arena squad but close enough).
I understand there are points in a roster's life cycle where GW becomes more challenging - it's just odd to me it's a step-wise function where it suddenly goes from fairly straight forward to downright impossible. It probably is just a small, yet vocal, minority of us with this issue. It would be great to have access to the data.
Edit: To expand on your expansion of my analogy - I would think maybe everyone gets has sneakers, but the three professionals didn't get their morning coffee, whereas my bench is all warmed up and ready to go, except for my top two backups which are out, and my starting five is in various stages of fatigue (partial or missing protection) or have minor sprains (no protection, specials on cool down,etc.). But at least they get the ball first.
The rewards do scale with lvl. If GW is you focus, which for most players it is not, then you can build accordingly and work out the best way to develop and push through the hump quicker. That is a very long road as would have to be your plan from the very beginning. A very not likely situation.
Yes, it does seem to be a wall that could be a better slope.
There are alot of variable to the bench that are in your control for the most part. And to be fair they get the ball first in the 3 point zone, while the other team starts at half court.
My main grief with GW is that it's hugely repetitive and still the largest unrewarding time-sink of this game. I do it every day because it's my salary: half of my credits come from there (plus tokens that I seem to use a lot too). This is why it's very often called a chore, much more than any other aspect of the game.
I also read a lot, like this post, that difficulty has gone through the roof in the last month. I am in those lucky few that complete it without sweat (but time) thanks for Finn, and enjoy a marshmallow Node 12 for dessert, but feel for those players who have seen it go from difficult to impossible, and need to spend 2h a day to get anything done (as I was doing in mid 2016).
Also nowadays, it gets very similar to TB combats, so on some days, adding up 4 TB combats and GW feels reaaaallly long.
I think GW should move to either something that is perceived as being optional (e.g. infinite Arena practice battles for a few ally points or credits each), or a week-long event (12 or a bit more battles per week, adjust rewards x7, maybe make it a real full-roster test by forcing you - and the opposing teams - to use any character just once), or drastically reduced (just 4 battles).
On the bright side - having insurmountable node 12s is a time saver since I don't spend a lot of time retrying nodes that don't work out in my favor and set my sights on Node 11.
Thanks for the dialog. It's genuinely appreciated.
Is this the Dev team's counter to Resistance being able to handle GW reasonably easily or just masochism at its finest. We have too much to do in this game already - making GW harder really just makes me want to remove the app from my device, never to pay for anything again.
Based on the retirements from our guild of long time players of late, I don't think I'm alone. General satisfaction with being essentially told what to farm (buy...) when, with little notice, is a bit troublesome. All of the outward observables (GW difficulty, short notice legendaries - sometimes with intentional obfuscation like Thrawn) seem to indicate that EA really doesn't care about its player base despite all of the lip service to the contrary.
All teams are player based teams, so it's not the devs doing anything to make it harder to beat with resistance.
Can't speak to why players want to leave. The game has always had short term farms and long term plans. Not getting something the first time around shouldn't be any surprise to a long term player.
The game is not meant to be easy, or quick to progress through, a lot of what we are seeing benefits long term players as they should have more developed rosters. They care greatly about the player base and they have been doing alot to improve communication and other things people have asked for. They can't make everyone happy, but they do seem to trying to listen to the masses.
Again, I'm not asking for easy...just possible...and I've posted a number of times about ways I think that could be achieved. If the intent is to test "roster depth", then total roster GP, or weighted GP around which toons can actually compete against a top tier, high speed arena squad would be considered in the matching algorithm. A simple percentage of the player's total power doesn't do this by any measure.
What's a "long term" player out of curiosity? Is 10 months not long enough yet? I missed GMY, planned for EP in time, missed R2, missed Thrawn, made CLS by the skin of my wallet, have exactly 0 unlocked First Order so no BB-8, and have been working towards Thrawn since CLS finished up. I completely understand and appreciate the grind. If you don't appreciate planning the work and working the plan, this game is not for you. None of these are my issue. Related back to the original post, GW in it's current simplistic matching incarnation is broke or the intent is for it to be unattainable. That's empirical, not an opinion.
I'm sure those at CG love their player base, since without their player base they would be writing other types of software. Their corporate masters on the other hand....there's a bit of a different intent there.