Star Wars: The Last Jedi Spoiler thread

Replies

  • Boo wrote: »
    I am actually surprised at all the deaths of major characters in TLJ, lets recap:

    * Admiral Ackbar
    * Vice Admiral Holdo (although she was new to the saga - she was an important character)
    * Capt. Phasma
    * Snoke
    * Luke

    That's quite a lot of major characters killed in one movie!

    Not so sure about Phasma. And it's more than wishful thinking.
  • Ariella
    219 posts Member
    edited December 2017
    phinfan309 wrote: »
    People seem to forget that very little was known about the emperor. Everyone fears him so you don't need to know more than that really. Snoke's undoing was his overconfidence as has been a theme in SW many times.

    Phasma was wasted. I hope she doesn't come back.

    Palpy actually had a bit of screen time and plenty of epic dialogue though. 1 hour 41 minutes worth of screen time to be precise across the first 6 movies, 16 minutes of which were in ROTJ.

    In contrast,
    Snoke had 4 minutes' screen time in TFA (1 more than the Wampa did in Empire)
    He got 8 minutes in TLJ (2 fewer than Paploo did in ROTJ). And that'll be it really, unless they do something really dumb and resurrect him :s
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    edited December 2017
    https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-last-jedi-pros-cons/

    I do not agree with all of them namely 9, 8, 7 and certainly 4.

    I would hardly say the Rey & Ren throneroom fight aws the best lightsaber battle ever, nor the battle of Crait being the best battle ever (however they were both very good).

    I would also argue that BB8 is not OP - he can handle himself and save/help others - its better than having an annoying droid that needs recuing all the time and I believe what he is able to do stays within his character - I think he is great.

    Number 4 - is apparently a complaint about LGBT. Apparently Holdo is a pansexual whatever that means and some fans are upset that her sexuality is not demonstrated - may I remind that Anaking and Padme's love story was supposed to be the most epic forbidden love in the existence of star wars and look what we got?

    Do we need something more awkward than that to fill the need of the LGBT community. If Disney starts crossing that line then they can create new transexual Disney Princesses etc etc - where will it end. Disney is a family and childhood franchise and not all concerns in the world should be projected on families and innocent little children - so why this issue is even mentioned as a "con" about the movie is totally lost on me.
    Post edited by Boo on
  • Ariella wrote: »
    phinfan309 wrote: »
    People seem to forget that very little was known about the emperor. Everyone fears him so you don't need to know more than that really. Snoke's undoing was his overconfidence as has been a theme in SW many times.

    Phasma was wasted. I hope she doesn't come back.

    Palpy actually had a bit of screen time and plenty of epic dialogue though. 1 hour 41 minutes worth of screen time to be precise across the first 6 movies, 16 minutes of which were in ROTJ.

    In contrast,
    Snoke had 4 minutes' screen time in TFA (1 more than the Wampa did in Empire)
    He got 8 minutes in TLJ (2 fewer than Paploo did in ROTJ). And that'll be it really, unless they do something really dumb and resurrect him :s

    Why would it be dumb for them to resurrect him? Maul was cut in half the same way, and he fell a few stories, and maul lived. Snoke was likely far more powerful than maul, so I'm guessing that he could've survived. I don't think it would be dumb for them to resurrect him.
  • It worked out well for Maul purely because in both the Clone Wars and Rebels, he had multiple plot lines based around him, and Savage at times. They dedicated story arcs and screen time to him. Thus far the creators have not shown this ambition for Snoke, hence it wouldn’t be a good move
  • Snoke's not dead lol
  • Ariella wrote: »
    phinfan309 wrote: »
    People seem to forget that very little was known about the emperor. Everyone fears him so you don't need to know more than that really. Snoke's undoing was his overconfidence as has been a theme in SW many times.

    Phasma was wasted. I hope she doesn't come back.

    Palpy actually had a bit of screen time and plenty of epic dialogue though. 1 hour 41 minutes worth of screen time to be precise across the first 6 movies, 16 minutes of which were in ROTJ.

    In contrast,
    Snoke had 4 minutes' screen time in TFA (1 more than the Wampa did in Empire)
    He got 8 minutes in TLJ (2 fewer than Paploo did in ROTJ). And that'll be it really, unless they do something really dumb and resurrect him :s

    Palpatine got more screentime retroactively, but it wasn't needed. He was an effective big-bad when only the original trilogy existed, just like how Snoke was an effective big-bad this time around. They gave us just enough information in TFA to make everyone speculate about him and put all this effort into working out who and what he is, so we all went into TLJ imagining Snoke to be some all-powerful bad guy like the Emperor before him.

    Then, they showed just enough of his power to validate what we thought of him as a threat, before using him to build the even greater threat: Kylo.

    Now we're left with an incredibly powerful, galaxy-spanning military under the command of an utterly unhinged man who had the power to cloud Snoke's mind. That's good villain building right there.
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    edited December 2017
    phinfan309 wrote: »
    People seem to forget that very little was known about the emperor. Everyone fears him so you don't need to know more than that really. Snoke's undoing was his overconfidence as has been a theme in SW many times.

    Phasma was wasted. I hope she doesn't come back.

    @SpadeFreeman This is my issue:

    Long ago a group of force users split - some chosing to practice light became Jedi, those that practiced dark became Sith.

    The two factions, Jedi and Sith are opposites in the force and have battled each other for thousands of years.

    The Sith continued on in secret after supposed destruction by the Jedi. 2 active Sith Lords existing at the same time Master and Apprentice, the latter killing the former restarting the cycle for ages on.

    Eventually we get to the Sith Master, Darth Sidious. Using his cunning and powers manipulates his way into galactic politics, causes a civil war, tanks the losing side and takes over the galaxy. He then reigns over the galaxy as its Emperor.

    The OT and PT and even R1 was all about Good v. Evil and Sidious was the devil.

    Finally he is destroyed in ROTJ - 6 movies with Sidious as the evil villain.

    Now suddenly Snoke pops up out of nowhere. All that battle against evil - the star wars saga as we know it, you may as well flush down the toilet with the appearance of snoke.

    Snoke needs a back story. I am not saying he needs his own spin-off movie, I am not saying his background needs to be lengthy, but something that can link him to how he came to be. This could have been achieved from a few lines in a movie. Something - not nothing, which is what we got and people seem to think that is ok?

    Its not ok, at least not for me.

    The OT was about Anakin's redemption. We knew he was seduced by the Emperor, just as we know Kylo was seduced to the darkside by Snoke. ROTJ and the OT was about a heroe's journey (Luke) and redemption (Vader/Anakin) good triumphs over evil - it was not important to know EP's backstory other than he was an evil galactic emperor. This is different to TFA and TLJ and I'll explain why:

    Then came to the PT and Anakin's fall to the DS - we learned of the history of Jedi v. Sith and that Darth Vader was Sith and his Emperor was a Sith Master - Darth Sidious - we got the back story.

    Because of the combination of the PT combined with the OT the audience is more invested in what the heroes were fighting for and that the evil in the galaxy was destroyed - yay!

    Then Snoke pops his ugly mug outta nowhere - at this point, seeing and experiencing what we have throughout the whole saga - then a sudden re-appearance of galactic evil, supposedly someone more powerful and even more evil than EP, deserves and explanation - at least to some degree.

    Tell me this - we do not get (in my opinion at least) a needed back story for a influential figure that restored utter turmoil to, as we left it, a peaceful galaxy - but we get a back story spin-off movie on Han Solo regarding everything we already know about the character:

    He meets and befriends a wookie who pledges a life debt. He wins a ship, the Millennium Falcon, from fellow scoundrel and friend, Lando Calrissian. Han then flies in some sort of galactic race, known as the Kessel Run and wins by beating it in a record distance run of 12 parsecs

    - Do we need to see all of that in a movie? NO.
    - Don't you think it would be nice if Snoke got some sort of explanation? Certainly not a whole movie, but some degree of an explanation? I'd answer YES.

    Until there is factual cannon evidence that clearly states Snoke is not Plagueis - then in my eyes he was. That's my belief and I am entitled to it.
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    Nauros wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    I am actually surprised at all the deaths of major characters in TLJ, lets recap:

    * Admiral Ackbar
    * Vice Admiral Holdo (although she was new to the saga - she was an important character)
    * Capt. Phasma
    * Snoke
    * Luke

    That's quite a lot of major characters killed in one movie!

    Not so sure about Phasma. And it's more than wishful thinking.

    If Phasma did not die then she has become the star wars Wile E. Coyote to Finn's Roadrunner - ridiculous, she is dead.
  • Varlie
    1286 posts Member
    jejuzang wrote: »
    There is no more Resistance. In order for for there to be resistance they have to be RESISTING something. They are now Rebels as the are REBELLING aganist the FirstOrder.

    No i don't agree with how this is but it should still be corrected in game. So Rey, and all new toons from the movie are NOT resistance. They are REBELS.

    Even the characters in the movie called themselves Rebels. This should be reflected in game as well.

    It's sad but I actually thought this while watching the movie.
  • Crazylazyguy
    1786 posts Member
    edited January 2018
    Saw the movie yesterday and I'm 50/50 about it.. I really liked the first couple of minutes, Poe being a total kitten destroying cake around all on his own, I like the sound and visual effects, the part with Holdo's sacrifice when she ruined Snoke's flagship was just beautiful, the way the sound lagged behind, the visual with the smaller ships getting destroyed was a 10/10.

    Then we have Jedi Master Luke Skywalker - best fisherman in the galaxy lol. Chewie is a kitten to Porgs.

    Yoda appeared and used Force Storm like a kitten.

    And this is where the good things end for me. I didn't see any purpose for that new character(the mechanic). It's like Disney thought "Hey it's 2017 we need to bring more characters that are from different race so we don't seem racist" ... She was mostly irrelevant to the story.

    Then we get to the really bad part... Luke.. tries... to kill his nephew? WHAT? Why? Why? That's not what this character would ever do, let alone before the kid had done something bad in the first place...

    Luke dies. Yes. I mean I'm more of a fan of the prequels, but if I were viewing this from the point of the old generation, boy those people waited for 40+ years to find out how powerful their beloved character has become and in the end.. he projects himself from across the galaxy, stalls the enemy and that's it? Really? I can't be the only one who thought that once Luke stood 1 against the entire Battalion of soldiers, he would've done something like ultra-powerful force push and destroy all of their toys, right? Why kill him so early? Why not show us some more of his amazing power?

    And then we got to the "Sequal disease" part. Don't know what that is? It's basically repeating the Original Trilogy all over again. "If you kill me now..." part from the "master" ugh, where have I heard that before?
    Good guy stalls evil guy and his soldiers, while the good guys escape, and then the good guy dies, turning into a force ghost, sounds familiar?

    That sums it up for me.
    Post edited by Pyrefly on
  • This may seem out of left field, but after letting my thoughts marinate on the movie for several days, I've decided not to see any more new SW movies until Kathleen Kennedy has no more influence on them. Not only has she shoehorned her political views into the movies, but that shoehorning has resulted in bad characters (Rey is OP because she's a woman and apparently needs no character development) and bad story arcs (Casino arc is garbage...the whole point is that rich people are bad?)

    Also Rian Johnson shouldn't be allowed to direct any new SW movies, at least if they exist within the canon timeline. He ruined Luke Skywalker and that's unforgivable. I would hate to see him ruin somebody else.
  • Thor_Odinson1
    1995 posts Member
    edited December 2017
    Boo wrote: »
    https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-last-jedi-pros-cons/

    I do not agree with all of them namely 9, 8, 7 and certainly 4.

    I would hardly say the Rey & Ren throneroom fight aws the best lightsaber battle ever, nor the battle of Crait being the best battle ever (however they were both very good).

    I would also argue that BB8 is not OP - he can handle himself and save/help others - its better than having an annoying droid that needs recuing all the time and I believe what he is able to do stays within his character - I think he is great.

    Number 4 - is apparently a complaint about LGBT. Apparently Holdo is a pansexual whatever that means and some fans are upset that her sexuality is not demonstrated - may I remind that Anaking and Padme's love story was supposed to be the most epic forbidden love in the existence of star wars and look what we got?

    Do we need something more awkward than that to fill the need of the LGBT community. If Disney starts crossing that line then they can create new transexual Disney Princesses etc etc - where will it end. Disney is a family and childhood franchise and not all concerns in the world should be projected on families and innocent little children - so why this issue is even mentioned as a "con" about the movie is totally lost on me.

    4 is totally ridiculous. Don't be different to be different, be different because its interesting or serves the plot. I generally despise seeing LGBT themes and characters in movies because they are, almost without fail, inorganic and inserted purely out of political motivation. If you can write those themes and characters into the story naturally then by all means, do so. But the minute I think (even for a second) that a movie contains an LGBT element to it to make a point, you've lost me and done it wrong.

    The only example that I can think of that almost does it right is with Sulu in the last Star Trek movie. It was a slight inclusion without focusing on it unnecessarily.
  • In regards to Super Leia :




    Can we rotate out the Moderators?
  • Honestly, I don't know anything about what "pansexual" is, but I'm guessing it's not "I'm being chased and will die shortly so let's go get some." How can you honestly show anything of a character that would be so utterly at odds with what they should be feeling/doing in the film? Holdo is introduced, is in a few scenes, then dies heroically. I don't see how a director could work their sexuality into that in any sensible way. If she lived and carried on into ep9, then sure, maybe there's time for more character development.
    But hey, we got to see that Porgs lay eggs and makes nests, and whatever that manatee/anteater thing is is vaguely mammalian, that's about all the time we had for in ep8.
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
  • Finally saw it.

    I enjoyed it because it was Star Wars, not because it was a great movie.

    The pacing was poor. Just full throttle from start to finish and this was largely responsible for the things that felt off.

    Moments that should have meant something were glossed over too quickly or interrupted by comedy for comedy sake.

    Most character development wasn't earned at all and some characters were pointless.

    Finn's entire arc was a waste of time. Completely unnecessary and built around scene after scene of ex-machina.

    It really just felt like too much was crammed into the film when a lot of it served no real purpose.

  • JaggedJ wrote: »
    Moments that should have meant something were glossed over too quickly or interrupted by comedy for comedy sake.

    Most character development wasn't earned at all and some characters were pointless.

    Finn's entire arc was a waste of time. Completely unnecessary and built around scene after scene of ex-machina.

    It really just felt like too much was crammed into the film when a lot of it served no real purpose
    The most cringeworthy part for me in the movie was Finn saying he used to "mop the control room" when describing how to disable the hyperspace tracking

    I very much agree with most of your comment.

    The Solo movie in may is gonna be similar I think. Too much forced comedy, in between people dying etc. Not apropos to the events
    Two Time Golden Poo Award Winner
  • Finn's story was fine. He's spent 2 movies trying to run from a fight that the friend he's portrayed as caring about the most (Rey, up until Rose) dives head first in to. Now he's in the same boat with Rose as Rey was with him at the end of TFA.
    I'm stranded in space, lost without trace, I haven't a chance of getting away.
  • Boo wrote: »
    They are making it up as they go.

    TFA - Abrams did what he normally does. He played it safe and regurgitated ANH to capture the audience and threw whatever else he could at a wall to see if it stuck. Two great mysteries came out: Who are Rey's Parents? and Who is Snoke?

    TLJ - Johnson took over and did not like what Abrams was doing so destroyed these two mysteries by quickly killing off Snoke, making him an insignificant character and making Rey's parents insignificant nobodies.

    E 9 - Abrams will take the reins again. And will undue everything Johnson did. Snoke will come back to life because he never died. Snoke too was a force projection just as Luke was. Snoke's existence and identity will be revealed much to everyone's disappointment because whatever Abrams comes up with - it does not make sense (like LOST).
    Kylo was lying to Rey about her parentage and suddenly that plot point will be significant again.

    Meanwhile the audience is all totally confused.

    But if it has good effects and cute creatures like the Porgs to sell as cuddly toys, Disney is on board...regardless.

    And this is how Star Wars dies - With thunderous applause!

    JJ Abrams may well undo some of TLJ details, or he may roll with what he's been given, we will all just have to wait and see.

    That being said, Abrams gets a lot of undeserved hate. He had nothing to do with the stupid disappointment that was the end of Lost. He wrote the 2 part pilot, and the first episode of season 3. That's all. Although he did continue to be executive producer, everyone involved is clear he had no creative control, he was basically just backing the project.

    I like ep8, much of it anyway, not all, but I am still glad Johnson won't be doing 9. I only hope Abrams can give the end the gravitas it needs, and not **** the audience around too much more.
  • LordDirt
    2528 posts Member
    No way they can wrap up everything in one last movie. It cant make any sense.

    The Resistance/Rebels have been fighting the Empire/First Order for 40 years. The First Order has endless people and vehicles at their disposal. It has already been shown that once you take out the leadership that it will be filled by others and continue.

    Meanwhile the Rebels have run out of help and vehicles. Not much left for them. If they do somehow win it would make now sense as the First Order could just keep rolling and not just fall apart when the Supreme Leader is destoyed.

    Now with the Force, it has now been set that there must be balance and that when one side is out of balance the other rises to meet it. So now it will be an endless fight between the two sides of the Force as one cant be without the other. Endless Force users will contine to be born and the fight will go on forever.

    I just cant see a good ending with only one movie left.
    Free at last
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    I am concerned about what they are going to do with Leia.

    He character dies, has such strong untapped connection to the force that she comes back to life and floats safely back to the ship like Mary Poppins. Only to, essentially, do absolutely nothing for the rest of the movie.

    Carrie Fisher herself passed away after filming E8 and will not be around for E9 - so what is going to happen to her character?

    Is she simply going to disappear from the franchise, like Luke did or like Snoke popped up with no explanation?

    I thought it would have been fitting to have re-shot some of the end of the movie and have Leia switch places with Holdo to crash the rebel/resistance cruiser into Snoke's Star Destroyer at lightspeed - it would have been an appropriate heroic and climactic end to her character using minimal digital Leia effects to accomplish.

    Perhaps Luke could then have carried over into E9 for a more deserving end to his character.

    What we got makes no sense and Leia will mysteriously just disappear from the franchise in E9 - what is this sequel trilogy doing?

    Destroying everything people hold dear about star wars, killing off main/original/loved characters with little to no explanation and also create a new galactic empire/super power with a figure (Snoke) spearheading a galactic invasion - again, with no explanation (in the movies at least) as to why - especially Snoke's origins!

    These movies, although have great effects and entertaining to the masses make 0 sense and are destroying the franchise for the invested fans.

    Its really sad.
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    LordDirt wrote: »
    No way they can wrap up everything in one last movie. It cant make any sense.

    The Resistance/Rebels have been fighting the Empire/First Order for 40 years. The First Order has endless people and vehicles at their disposal. It has already been shown that once you take out the leadership that it will be filled by others and continue.

    Meanwhile the Rebels have run out of help and vehicles. Not much left for them. If they do somehow win it would make now sense as the First Order could just keep rolling and not just fall apart when the Supreme Leader is destoyed.

    Now with the Force, it has now been set that there must be balance and that when one side is out of balance the other rises to meet it. So now it will be an endless fight between the two sides of the Force as one cant be without the other. Endless Force users will contine to be born and the fight will go on forever.

    I just cant see a good ending with only one movie left.

    With that theme of balance at play in the force, I think it would be a fitting end if Rey and Kylo kill each other in the last movie.
  • Izza
    85 posts Member
    I'm really sad about what they did to SW legacy with this new movie. It was the poor plot, cheap humor and sloppy character handling that ruined it for me. Looking at how they're shoving unnecessary gender politics and SJW nonsense in my face, I'm not excited to see anymore SW content from these producers and the director. I did enjoy R1 a lot and TFA had me excited about new content. After watching TLJ, I'd rather think the SW saga ended after ROTJ.
  • Izza wrote: »
    I'm really sad about what they did to SW legacy with this new movie. It was the poor plot, cheap humor and sloppy character handling that ruined it for me. Looking at how they're shoving unnecessary gender politics and SJW nonsense in my face, I'm not excited to see anymore SW content from these producers and the director. I did enjoy R1 a lot and TFA had me excited about new content. After watching TLJ, I'd rather think the SW saga ended after ROTJ.

    How they shoved gender politics and SJW things, I do not understand. When I watched the movie I do not saw that Holdo is a pansexual ladie. I just came to this forum and everybody said that. Maybe from some books it is obvious but from the movie it was not.

    Even more in the Star Wars universe there is no black people, asian people, white people they are just humans who is differ from eg.: kel-dor, togruta, etc.
  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    Fürkész wrote: »
    Izza wrote: »
    I'm really sad about what they did to SW legacy with this new movie. It was the poor plot, cheap humor and sloppy character handling that ruined it for me. Looking at how they're shoving unnecessary gender politics and SJW nonsense in my face, I'm not excited to see anymore SW content from these producers and the director. I did enjoy R1 a lot and TFA had me excited about new content. After watching TLJ, I'd rather think the SW saga ended after ROTJ.

    How they shoved gender politics and SJW things, I do not understand. When I watched the movie I do not saw that Holdo is a pansexual ladie. I just came to this forum and everybody said that. Maybe from some books it is obvious but from the movie it was not.

    Even more in the Star Wars universe there is no black people, asian people, white people they are just humans who is differ from eg.: kel-dor, togruta, etc.

    The fact that Holdo is meant to be a toon representing the LGBTQ community and did nothing that showed us that (you are right and I am glad about that - she was just a lady with pink hair - how can you show such sexuality representation in a Disney movie!), the LGBTQ community view this as a "con"bout the movie and feel they need deeper representation to what was seen on screen - its only a matter of time before a feeling of mere right to be included as group turns into something completely unnecessary and wrong to be seen in a movie designed for children - but with the world getting crazier its only a matter of time.

    I feel I agree with @Izza - the star wars saga ended with ROTJ. What we have now is borderline nonsensical garbage.
  • Boo wrote: »
    I feel I agree with @Izza - the star wars saga ended with ROTJ. What we have now is borderline nonsensical garbage.
    That’s the standard feedback I m getting from old peeps.
    They don’t like the new movies. I think it’s a generation thing.

  • Boo
    4116 posts Member
    Boo wrote: »
    I feel I agree with @Izza - the star wars saga ended with ROTJ. What we have now is borderline nonsensical garbage.
    That’s the standard feedback I m getting from old peeps.
    They don’t like the new movies. I think it’s a generation thing.

    I think its a logical thing. Even watching the star wars saga in order PT then OT now these sequel trilogy movies - they just don't add up.

    The trick is a may not likely have an issue with them if they were from a completely different time period in the star wars universe - but continuing on with OT characters and doing what these movies are doing just destroys what all prior movies have done and their stories told. These new sequel trilogy movies are just destroying everything star wars stood for on principal

    If you like an entertaining movie with a poor story, character development and flashy effects then these movies are for you.
  • I really dont get the humor haters hear you look through every star wars parys EG films tv series games whatever there is always humor and its always terrible
  • Mad how Disney wanna phase out slave Leia in the golden bikini but have Kylo Ren shirtless. Feminist hypocritical sexism at its finest
This discussion has been closed.