Star Wars: The Last Jedi Spoiler thread

Replies

  • Boo
    3589 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    this thread started in 2017

    2016 was a fantastic year.

    Yes it was - the year I got married!
  • Boo wrote: »
    jawa7778 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    LordDirt wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    New question: What if ALL the Star Wars Movies had Rogue One's edge? There wasn't always a happily ever after each movie? Not debating they were good or bad, just what if?

    The only Saga movies to have happy endings are A New Hope and Return of the Jedi. The others' were either bittersweet or deviously "happy".

    Lot of people died blowing up the Death Star in ANH.
    Luke wasnt too happy his father died in RotJ.

    A New Hope: the greatest threat facing the galaxy was destroyed.
    Return of the Jedi: the galaxy is freed.
    My guess is your kids will see it as very very bad

    Future generation will be saved from the hype and will view it with fresh minds and hearts and zero expectations.

    zero expectations for the new generation over this sequel trilogy, especially TLJ, will never make them good movies. What is wrong with these movies will always carry forward.

    Yes the last generation enjoyed the PT but whenever the franchise needs to make money they always revert to OT content - another reason they flood the new ST with so much nostalgia.

    Where the PT fell short on what the OT were, the ST will always fall short against the PT and OT - the ST just isn't good and cannot compare.

    As for the "new" generation to which the ST is aimed at, merchandise sales are way down - no one likes them enough. Simple as that really.

    In 15 years everyone will hate the new trilogy, and the entire Skywalker Saga will be praised. The narrow minded mega OP fans will be too old to troll and complain. Films are getting worse; but it doesn’t make them any less enjoyable.

    Praised? I don't think so. The negative hype will die down, but they wont be "praised". The hatred the PT received has certainly lessened over the years, but no one really praises the PT, yet most people recognize the PT as superior over the ST any day.

    No one likes bad or poorly written stories, and that's what the ST is and always will be.

    That’s a very subjective analysis. And if the trend continues, they will be praised. If movies keep getting worse, then even our less liked films will be praised.

    Its not subjective - the prequel trilogy had its complaints but it didn't fracture an entire fanbase and make Lucasfilm take a step back to look at what they are doing wrong. The PT had a story arc that was connective throughout each movie - the ST does not, its just a big mess full of different people with different ideas with no overall story being told.

    Bad script is neither here nor there - every star wars movie has had a bad script generally speaking, but its story and characters is what brought the movies to life - again, something the ST is severely lacking.

    The PT didn’t split the fan base because everyone hated it; the sequel trilogy split the fan base because there was a divide.

    Yet most fans look back on the PT and realize it wasn't as bad as they thought since watching the ST.

    Like it or not the franchise has never been in such dire straits as it has been since TLJ - that's a fact.

    For you - not for some. Disney will probably change their tactics soon because of The Last Jedi; but that’s only if they listen to the Internet whiners and their money. Their decisions have nothing to do with quality.

    Dude - TLJ fractured the fanbase and Star Wars has been losing money across the board ever since - That never happened with the PT.

    Its not just "internet whiners" its literally at least half the fanbase of the franchise, lol.

    That is fact, like it or don't, that's the truth.

    No it’s not lol, you have presented no evidence for that. That’s opinion. The biggest difference between the ST and the PT is that the TLJ tried something new; every other Star Wars movie has the same build, the same characters, the same plot, the same themes. They had become predictable. So Johnson tried something new, not something bad, just new.

    Tried something new??? Hah, that's laughable. This entire trilogy has been a re-hash of the original trilogy. Random farm girl/boy on desert planet. Check. The Empire is back. Check. Stormtroopers with bad aim. Check. Star destroyers. Check. A planet that is white, but it's salt instead of snow. Wow so creative. Small rebel fleet that is fleeing from the big bad reborn Empire. Wow, it's not like they have an entire government called the New Republic to support them. Man, tried something new? Yeah definitely.
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    LordDirt wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    New question: What if ALL the Star Wars Movies had Rogue One's edge? There wasn't always a happily ever after each movie? Not debating they were good or bad, just what if?

    The only Saga movies to have happy endings are A New Hope and Return of the Jedi. The others' were either bittersweet or deviously "happy".

    Lot of people died blowing up the Death Star in ANH.
    Luke wasnt too happy his father died in RotJ.

    A New Hope: the greatest threat facing the galaxy was destroyed.
    Return of the Jedi: the galaxy is freed.
    My guess is your kids will see it as very very bad

    Future generation will be saved from the hype and will view it with fresh minds and hearts and zero expectations.

    zero expectations for the new generation over this sequel trilogy, especially TLJ, will never make them good movies. What is wrong with these movies will always carry forward.

    Yes the last generation enjoyed the PT but whenever the franchise needs to make money they always revert to OT content - another reason they flood the new ST with so much nostalgia.

    Where the PT fell short on what the OT were, the ST will always fall short against the PT and OT - the ST just isn't good and cannot compare.

    As for the "new" generation to which the ST is aimed at, merchandise sales are way down - no one likes them enough. Simple as that really.

    In 15 years everyone will hate the new trilogy, and the entire Skywalker Saga will be praised. The narrow minded mega OP fans will be too old to troll and complain. Films are getting worse; but it doesn’t make them any less enjoyable.

    Praised? I don't think so. The negative hype will die down, but they wont be "praised". The hatred the PT received has certainly lessened over the years, but no one really praises the PT, yet most people recognize the PT as superior over the ST any day.

    No one likes bad or poorly written stories, and that's what the ST is and always will be.

    That’s a very subjective analysis. And if the trend continues, they will be praised. If movies keep getting worse, then even our less liked films will be praised.

    Its not subjective - the prequel trilogy had its complaints but it didn't fracture an entire fanbase and make Lucasfilm take a step back to look at what they are doing wrong. The PT had a story arc that was connective throughout each movie - the ST does not, its just a big mess full of different people with different ideas with no overall story being told.

    Bad script is neither here nor there - every star wars movie has had a bad script generally speaking, but its story and characters is what brought the movies to life - again, something the ST is severely lacking.

    The PT didn’t split the fan base because everyone hated it; the sequel trilogy split the fan base because there was a divide.

    Yet most fans look back on the PT and realize it wasn't as bad as they thought since watching the ST.

    Like it or not the franchise has never been in such dire straits as it has been since TLJ - that's a fact.

    For you - not for some. Disney will probably change their tactics soon because of The Last Jedi; but that’s only if they listen to the Internet whiners and their money. Their decisions have nothing to do with quality.

    Dude - TLJ fractured the fanbase and Star Wars has been losing money across the board ever since - That never happened with the PT.

    Its not just "internet whiners" its literally at least half the fanbase of the franchise, lol.

    That is fact, like it or don't, that's the truth.

    No it’s not lol, you have presented no evidence for that. That’s opinion. The biggest difference between the ST and the PT is that the TLJ tried something new; every other Star Wars movie has the same build, the same characters, the same plot, the same themes. They had become predictable. So Johnson tried something new, not something bad, just new.

    Johnson didn't try anything new - more x-wings and tie fighters, another throne room saber fight, another hermit jedi, another scene of speeders against ATATs - ya he really gave us something new - don't make me laugh.

    Check out merchandise sales - action figures are in decline, most dollar stores have TLJ action figures for 50 cents or $1 - its a joke.

    Resistance show had poor reviews and fan feedback. Galaxy's Edge has been losing money, Solo flopped - it goes on and on and on - but ya, keep you head in the sand and keep claiming I am not producing any evidence - a simple google search will tell you everything I am saying.

    I’m not gonna find your evidence for you - I’ll let you do the google search.

    Johnson used many of the same Star Wars ideas, but different creative ideas. You can’t judge on similar stories when you ignore the different themes. The sequel trilogy isn’t trying to enhance Star Wars nerds who buy the merchandise; it’s trying to attract new generations and a very large general audience. Now, I can tell you that it’s succeeding at that goal, but I can’t guarantee that that goal should be their main focus. That’s where you and I agree.

    Most people just attack the wrong parts of the new trilogy, which makes them look like 40 year old grumpy white men; they aren’t, they are just attacking the wrong points for the right reasons.
  • Boo
    3589 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    jawa7778 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    LordDirt wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    New question: What if ALL the Star Wars Movies had Rogue One's edge? There wasn't always a happily ever after each movie? Not debating they were good or bad, just what if?

    The only Saga movies to have happy endings are A New Hope and Return of the Jedi. The others' were either bittersweet or deviously "happy".

    Lot of people died blowing up the Death Star in ANH.
    Luke wasnt too happy his father died in RotJ.

    A New Hope: the greatest threat facing the galaxy was destroyed.
    Return of the Jedi: the galaxy is freed.
    My guess is your kids will see it as very very bad

    Future generation will be saved from the hype and will view it with fresh minds and hearts and zero expectations.

    zero expectations for the new generation over this sequel trilogy, especially TLJ, will never make them good movies. What is wrong with these movies will always carry forward.

    Yes the last generation enjoyed the PT but whenever the franchise needs to make money they always revert to OT content - another reason they flood the new ST with so much nostalgia.

    Where the PT fell short on what the OT were, the ST will always fall short against the PT and OT - the ST just isn't good and cannot compare.

    As for the "new" generation to which the ST is aimed at, merchandise sales are way down - no one likes them enough. Simple as that really.

    In 15 years everyone will hate the new trilogy, and the entire Skywalker Saga will be praised. The narrow minded mega OP fans will be too old to troll and complain. Films are getting worse; but it doesn’t make them any less enjoyable.

    Praised? I don't think so. The negative hype will die down, but they wont be "praised". The hatred the PT received has certainly lessened over the years, but no one really praises the PT, yet most people recognize the PT as superior over the ST any day.

    No one likes bad or poorly written stories, and that's what the ST is and always will be.

    That’s a very subjective analysis. And if the trend continues, they will be praised. If movies keep getting worse, then even our less liked films will be praised.

    Its not subjective - the prequel trilogy had its complaints but it didn't fracture an entire fanbase and make Lucasfilm take a step back to look at what they are doing wrong. The PT had a story arc that was connective throughout each movie - the ST does not, its just a big mess full of different people with different ideas with no overall story being told.

    Bad script is neither here nor there - every star wars movie has had a bad script generally speaking, but its story and characters is what brought the movies to life - again, something the ST is severely lacking.

    The PT didn’t split the fan base because everyone hated it; the sequel trilogy split the fan base because there was a divide.

    Yet most fans look back on the PT and realize it wasn't as bad as they thought since watching the ST.

    Like it or not the franchise has never been in such dire straits as it has been since TLJ - that's a fact.

    For you - not for some. Disney will probably change their tactics soon because of The Last Jedi; but that’s only if they listen to the Internet whiners and their money. Their decisions have nothing to do with quality.

    Dude - TLJ fractured the fanbase and Star Wars has been losing money across the board ever since - That never happened with the PT.

    Its not just "internet whiners" its literally at least half the fanbase of the franchise, lol.

    That is fact, like it or don't, that's the truth.

    No it’s not lol, you have presented no evidence for that. That’s opinion. The biggest difference between the ST and the PT is that the TLJ tried something new; every other Star Wars movie has the same build, the same characters, the same plot, the same themes. They had become predictable. So Johnson tried something new, not something bad, just new.

    Tried something new??? Hah, that's laughable. This entire trilogy has been a re-hash of the original trilogy. Random farm girl/boy on desert planet. Check. The Empire is back. Check. Stormtroopers with bad aim. Check. Star destroyers. Check. A planet that is white, but it's salt instead of snow. Wow so creative. Small rebel fleet that is fleeing from the big bad reborn Empire. Wow, it's not like they have an entire government called the New Republic to support them. Man, tried something new? Yeah definitely.
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    LordDirt wrote: »
    chron wrote: »
    New question: What if ALL the Star Wars Movies had Rogue One's edge? There wasn't always a happily ever after each movie? Not debating they were good or bad, just what if?

    The only Saga movies to have happy endings are A New Hope and Return of the Jedi. The others' were either bittersweet or deviously "happy".

    Lot of people died blowing up the Death Star in ANH.
    Luke wasnt too happy his father died in RotJ.

    A New Hope: the greatest threat facing the galaxy was destroyed.
    Return of the Jedi: the galaxy is freed.
    My guess is your kids will see it as very very bad

    Future generation will be saved from the hype and will view it with fresh minds and hearts and zero expectations.

    zero expectations for the new generation over this sequel trilogy, especially TLJ, will never make them good movies. What is wrong with these movies will always carry forward.

    Yes the last generation enjoyed the PT but whenever the franchise needs to make money they always revert to OT content - another reason they flood the new ST with so much nostalgia.

    Where the PT fell short on what the OT were, the ST will always fall short against the PT and OT - the ST just isn't good and cannot compare.

    As for the "new" generation to which the ST is aimed at, merchandise sales are way down - no one likes them enough. Simple as that really.

    In 15 years everyone will hate the new trilogy, and the entire Skywalker Saga will be praised. The narrow minded mega OP fans will be too old to troll and complain. Films are getting worse; but it doesn’t make them any less enjoyable.

    Praised? I don't think so. The negative hype will die down, but they wont be "praised". The hatred the PT received has certainly lessened over the years, but no one really praises the PT, yet most people recognize the PT as superior over the ST any day.

    No one likes bad or poorly written stories, and that's what the ST is and always will be.

    That’s a very subjective analysis. And if the trend continues, they will be praised. If movies keep getting worse, then even our less liked films will be praised.

    Its not subjective - the prequel trilogy had its complaints but it didn't fracture an entire fanbase and make Lucasfilm take a step back to look at what they are doing wrong. The PT had a story arc that was connective throughout each movie - the ST does not, its just a big mess full of different people with different ideas with no overall story being told.

    Bad script is neither here nor there - every star wars movie has had a bad script generally speaking, but its story and characters is what brought the movies to life - again, something the ST is severely lacking.

    The PT didn’t split the fan base because everyone hated it; the sequel trilogy split the fan base because there was a divide.

    Yet most fans look back on the PT and realize it wasn't as bad as they thought since watching the ST.

    Like it or not the franchise has never been in such dire straits as it has been since TLJ - that's a fact.

    For you - not for some. Disney will probably change their tactics soon because of The Last Jedi; but that’s only if they listen to the Internet whiners and their money. Their decisions have nothing to do with quality.

    Dude - TLJ fractured the fanbase and Star Wars has been losing money across the board ever since - That never happened with the PT.

    Its not just "internet whiners" its literally at least half the fanbase of the franchise, lol.

    That is fact, like it or don't, that's the truth.

    No it’s not lol, you have presented no evidence for that. That’s opinion. The biggest difference between the ST and the PT is that the TLJ tried something new; every other Star Wars movie has the same build, the same characters, the same plot, the same themes. They had become predictable. So Johnson tried something new, not something bad, just new.

    Johnson didn't try anything new - more x-wings and tie fighters, another throne room saber fight, another hermit jedi, another scene of speeders against ATATs - ya he really gave us something new - don't make me laugh.

    Check out merchandise sales - action figures are in decline, most dollar stores have TLJ action figures for 50 cents or $1 - its a joke.

    Resistance show had poor reviews and fan feedback. Galaxy's Edge has been losing money, Solo flopped - it goes on and on and on - but ya, keep you head in the sand and keep claiming I am not producing any evidence - a simple google search will tell you everything I am saying.

    I’m not gonna find your evidence for you - I’ll let you do the google search.

    Johnson used many of the same Star Wars ideas, but different creative ideas. You can’t judge on similar stories when you ignore the different themes. The sequel trilogy isn’t trying to enhance Star Wars nerds who buy the merchandise; it’s trying to attract new generations and a very large general audience. Now, I can tell you that it’s succeeding at that goal, but I can’t guarantee that that goal should be their main focus. That’s where you and I agree.

    Most people just attack the wrong parts of the new trilogy, which makes them look like 40 year old grumpy white men; they aren’t, they are just attacking the wrong points for the right reasons.

    No, the criticisms of the ST and in particular TLJ are completely justified.

    In the process of targeting a new generation, they are alienating many of their current fanbase, who also have children.

    The fact that merch and everything else I have already told you across the board is losing money is huge evidence that their agenda of targeting a new audience isn't going so well.

    Spin it however you want - fact is fact.

    Johnson gave us nothing new - just a disastrous movie with pointless plot lines, destruction of beloved character, lore breaking events and the same old stuff we have already seen from prior movies.
  • Boo
    3589 posts Member
    edited November 13
    https://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/solo-star-wars-story-blasts-massive-opening-weekend/

    https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2018/06/solo-star-wars-box-office-flop

    https://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/films/969852/Star-Wars-Solo-box-office-flop-fail-why-marketing

    Not many people liked Alden Ehrenreich replacing Harrison Ford as Han Solo, but he did an okay job - marketing and choice of actor doesn't make up for the loss Solo suffered. Was marketing of one of the biggest known franchises in the world really to blame? I highly doubt that.

    Bob Iger explains that "Star Wars Fatigue" is the cause of Solo's flop - but again, as the previous article suggests, Marvel would be feeling the same fatigue. So "franchise fatigue" is just another excuse.

    https://www.indiewire.com/2019/09/disney-ceo-bob-iger-star-wars-solo-flop-1202175861/

    http://thathashtagshow.com/2019/06/03/ron-howard-blames-solo-box-office-blunder-on-the-last-jedi/
    Post edited by Boo on
  • Boo
    3589 posts Member
    @Nihion - like I say, spin it however you like, you are entitled to your opinion in the same way the "flat-Earthers" are entitled to theirs, but fact is fact.
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