Is guild Matching for TW broken???

Well our guild got 109mil vs 109mil the 1st round.

But we got 113mil(my guild) vs 129mil the second.

Does not seem to be fair. The opponent has a 16mil GP advantage and they are in the next tier of rewards. "They are already guaranteed rewards that we have to win to get"

Replies

  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    There is more to the match making than GP you see for the whole guild.
  • jpierrard17
    172 posts Member
    edited January 2018
    Its not broken but not optimal as the key metric is "Active" GP registered for the match and pretty easy to tell they probably have less registered and lower "Active" GP. However the algorithm doesn't seem to account for the mismatch in quality of squads between the guild. Example you can have 2 guilds at 75 mill each where one has been finishing HAAT for a while and every member has GK 7* where the other guild is just starting to finish HAAT and only has a few GKs unlocked. We won every match but one so far we were 72 mill GP they were 84 mill GP but they would have only had 41/42 members active as we only set 21 defensive units so "Active" GP was most likely very close however that guild was loaded with a bunch of Golden MT NS squads, KRU FO squads etc.. and we are mostly a F2P guild so don't have any of these mega squads. If the calculation took into account the top 25 toons for each member avg. them out they would have seen that this was a mismatch.
    Post edited by jpierrard17 on
  • That is how I and most seemed to think matchmaking worked - active GP. According to a post about a week or so ago active GP is NOT the matchmaking criteria but a bunch of unspecified things including GP of units. Active GP is for reward brackets.

    https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/comment/1423046#Comment_1423046
  • Correct. It's not active GP or at least not solely based on that. I've confirmed it with opposing teams that we've had recently that showed they were in higher reward brackets.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    There is more to the match making than GP you see for the whole guild.

    This. Kozi herself even stated as such in one of the notes. Kyno has quoted it many times in many posts. So complaining about differences in GP is somewhat pointless.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • gunff
    287 posts Member
    Last TW we were matched against a guild 9m GP higher this time is 20m GP higher. we don't have a chance. Just because it isn't using active GP as the count doesn't mean it's working correctly.

    I think it is because we're on the high end (151m GP) and there are so few guilds up here that the highest end 170m GP have played each other already and there must be some rule that they can't play each other again for some # of times (probably 10?). so they are now getting sent down into much lower guilds that are less ideal matchups just so they can participate.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    gunff wrote: »
    Last TW we were matched against a guild 9m GP higher this time is 20m GP higher. we don't have a chance. Just because it isn't using active GP as the count doesn't mean it's working correctly.

    I think it is because we're on the high end (151m GP) and there are so few guilds up here that the highest end 170m GP have played each other already and there must be some rule that they can't play each other again for some # of times (probably 10?). so they are now getting sent down into much lower guilds that are less ideal matchups just so they can participate.

    I am not saying it's WAI, just trying to point out that comparing the size of an orange to a clementine, doesn't prove anything about the apple.
  • Possibly, but since the developers refuse to let us know how it's supposed to work there is no way for us to tell
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    c1ever_pun wrote: »
    Possibly, but since the developers refuse to let us know how it's supposed to work there is no way for us to tell

    I don't think they will give us those details for fear of guilds trying to work the system.
  • I get that we don't get all the behind the scenes look but I can tell you that my guild has been massively outmatched in the last 3 TWs...between 10 and 15 mil GP difference and about half that for active GP. This current TW...we are at about 88 mil and got matched up against a 106 mil GP with super whales (3 mil+ members). Their average GP is like 500K higher than our average.GP.

    That is made significantly worse by the fact that they have to deploy fewer squads, leaving them with a lot more good squads to leave on offense.

    I am not a CS Engineer but we have had no chance for the last 2 TWs and will probably not have any chance this time.
  • I don't think they will give us those details for fear of people on forum whining it doesn't work.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    thomssi wrote: »
    I don't think they will give us those details for fear of people on forum whining it doesn't work.

    That's going to happen either way, no point in fearing the inevitable.
  • True, but when someone is going to attack you then best not give them a machine gun.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    thomssi wrote: »
    True, but when someone is going to attack you then best not give them a machine gun.

    People tend to use misunderstanding as a weapon as well, better to leave it to speculation then load that gun.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    thomssi wrote: »
    True, but when someone is going to attack you then best not give them a machine gun.

    People tend to use misunderstanding as a weapon as well, better to leave it to speculation then load that gun.

    Give a man a fish and you feed him for the day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.
    SWGOH Guild: Peace Is A Lie SWGOH Profile: Boofpoof Discord: Buffpuff#3065
  • Well it has happened to us. Here is us...

    https://swgoh.gg/g/6839/peace-is-a-lie/

    We had 46 out of 50 sign up with an active GP of 57M and some change.

    And this is who we got pitted against...

    https://swgoh.gg/g/25099/conjugate/

    I count EIGHTEEN people over 2M GP (and keep in mind that is for their members who synced their accounts to swgoh.gg). Compared to our 2 (1 who is signed up in SWGOH.gg and the other who is not). I saw so many G12 Kenobis it made my eyes bleed. I did a quick search and that guild reportedly had an active GP of greater than 90M back in late November. I don't mind a hard fight but this one has reached the level of impossible. So I challenge anyone to say that THIS is a fair match making experience. Because I just don't see it.
    SWGOH Guild: Peace Is A Lie SWGOH Profile: Boofpoof Discord: Buffpuff#3065
  • gunff wrote: »
    Last TW we were matched against a guild 9m GP higher this time is 20m GP higher. we don't have a chance. Just because it isn't using active GP as the count doesn't mean it's working correctly.

    I think it is because we're on the high end (151m GP) and there are so few guilds up here that the highest end 170m GP have played each other already and there must be some rule that they can't play each other again for some # of times (probably 10?). so they are now getting sent down into much lower guilds that are less ideal matchups just so they can participate.

    I believe you are correct. I don't think rematches are probably allowed until a certain amount of TWs pass so guilds can end up in matches where the GP disparity can be significant. I wonder how long it can be before you can rematch a guild?
  • Its not broken but not optimal as the key metric is "Active" GP registered for the match and pretty easy to tell they probably have less registered and lower "Active" GP. However the algorithm doesn't seem to account for the mismatch in quality of squads between the guild. Example you can have 2 guilds at 75 mill each where one has been finishing HAAT for a while and every member has GK 7* where the other guild is just starting to finish HAAT and only has a few GKs unlocked. We won every match but one so far we were 72 mill GP they were 84 mill GP but they would have only had 41/42 members active as we only set 21 defensive units so "Active" GP was most likely very close however that guild was loaded with a bunch of Golden MT NS squads, KRU FO squads etc.. and we are mostly a F2P guild so don't have any of these mega squads. If the calculation took into account the top 25 toons for each member avg. them out they would have seen that this was a mismatch.

    I had it confirmed by a dev that active GP is not a factor in to matchmaking
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Its not broken but not optimal as the key metric is "Active" GP registered for the match and pretty easy to tell they probably have less registered and lower "Active" GP. However the algorithm doesn't seem to account for the mismatch in quality of squads between the guild. Example you can have 2 guilds at 75 mill each where one has been finishing HAAT for a while and every member has GK 7* where the other guild is just starting to finish HAAT and only has a few GKs unlocked. We won every match but one so far we were 72 mill GP they were 84 mill GP but they would have only had 41/42 members active as we only set 21 defensive units so "Active" GP was most likely very close however that guild was loaded with a bunch of Golden MT NS squads, KRU FO squads etc.. and we are mostly a F2P guild so don't have any of these mega squads. If the calculation took into account the top 25 toons for each member avg. them out they would have seen that this was a mismatch.

    I had it confirmed by a dev that active GP is not a factor in to matchmaking

    The statement was that matching is not necessarily within rewards brackets. Not the same thing.
  • While it's true that there is more to it than just the GP you see( for example the active GP which is dependent on how many players joined in TW from the enemy guild) the fact remains that a 129m gp guild is more likely to have players with much better rosters than a 110m GP guild. So it is still broken.
  • Too many questions have and will remain unanswered and for what reason is anyone's guess. I've posted a couple of times and it's like trying to get an answer from a politician
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    edited January 2018
    Boofpoof wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    thomssi wrote: »
    True, but when someone is going to attack you then best not give them a machine gun.

    People tend to use misunderstanding as a weapon as well, better to leave it to speculation then load that gun.

    Give a man a fish and you feed him for the day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Teach a man to fish and he will tell you he caught a fish [ ------------------------------------------------------------------ ] This big.
  • Varlie
    1286 posts Member
    Discord is your friend. A lot of people that have profiles on SWGOG.GG also have their Discord IDs listed there. For the next war, check out the opposing team and then reach out to anyone that has their ID listed and ask for general details to help figure out the matching.

    While people won't give up information about their strategies, you can easily ask how many out of 50 are engaged. You probably won't get information on who is in and who isn't ( I wouldn't provide that) but if you ask general enough questions primarily to figure out matching profile information.
  • But come on... the active GP is definitely flawed.

    This has to be matched on Average GP/Player.. A guild with 130M has a ridiculous advantage of GP per player which means DEEPER ROSTERS, especially if versus a 116M guild...
  • We are fighting a 69 million GP guild and we are only at 33m GP, any matchmaking system that pairs you in a match that is over double your guild must be broken.

    A matchup where you are 36m GP weaker than your opponent is terrible, but when that difference is more than the GP of your entire guild it is just wrong.

    Has anyone else faced such a big margin, where your opponent is 110% stronger?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    But come on... the active GP is definitely flawed.

    This has to be matched on Average GP/Player.. A guild with 130M has a ridiculous advantage of GP per player which means DEEPER ROSTERS, especially if versus a 116M guild...

    They use many factors, not just active GP to do match making.
  • "Registered GP" This is crap. We have to go against a group of 40 players, to our 50. They have AN ENTIRE First row of All GK/Barris teams...we won't break through either one, and we are guaranteed to lose, with out even having a fighting chance. Yes, I would say TW Matchmaking is broken.
  • Karmas_pet
    2 posts Member
    edited October 2018
    So my 88M GP guild has for the 4th time in a row been matched with a guild over 110M.
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