The comparison with crit immunity is actually interesting, and also shows why I think tenacity/potency is so worthless. Crit Avoidance is actually a very good stat, and it is certainly helpful in doing what it is supposed to do. The problem is it’s only obtainable in place of speed, and the speed is so OP it’s ridiculous.
The reason Tenacity/potency is useless isn’t because there are simply better options. It’s useless because the vast majority of the time it literally does nothing. Putting a Crit Avoidance mod on a character will almost always help reduce crit chance, with the rare exception of when a character is over 100% crit rate. Adding a tenacity mod on a character will do absolutely nothing more often than it will do something.
crit avoidance is a very good stat? Is it not completely overruled by crit chance? Even if speed wasn't on the arrow you'd still be better off with any of the other primaries.
The 2nd part of your post isn't really a fair comparrisson.
Not really. It only gets overruled if crit chance goes over 100%. It might not take crit to 0, but 24% reduction is HUGE. By comparison a crit chance mod is 10%. Is argue it’s the 2nd best primary in the game. Unfortunately it’s tucked away behind the undisputed best primary.
It should be 60%(Potency) vs 40%(Tenacity) and not the 50% vs 50% stalemate, because a lot of the characters' mechanics are based on inflicting debuffs as opposed to a very few based on resisting debuffs!
Maybe I’m misunderstanding you, but are you suggesting potency be weighted higher? That’s mind boggling to me, because it’s already so powerful that 95% of the time it’s maxed out and adding more is useless. That would be like recommending speed play more of a factor.
It should be 60%(Potency) vs 40%(Tenacity) and not the 50% vs 50% stalemate, because a lot of the characters' mechanics are based on inflicting debuffs as opposed to a very few based on resisting debuffs!
Maybe I’m misunderstanding you, but are you suggesting potency be weighted higher? That’s mind boggling to me, because it’s already so powerful that 95% of the time it’s maxed out and adding more is useless. That would be like recommending speed play more of a factor.
I mean it should remain as it is now with no changes to Tenacity, because otherwise it will break the mechanics of so many toons that rely on inflicting debuffs!
But it wouldn’t. It would just mean that if you go up against a team than chose to mod for tenacity you would need to mod for potency to compensate for that.
Why should a character that chooses to ignore potency be able to inflict debuffs reliably? Might as well just get rid of the stats entirely if that’s what people want.
I think this would be the easiest way to fix it. Not every character should land every debuff at will. Now I would never run an all tenacity team but I would load up some tenacity on my tanks if tenacity was worth it.
When I ran Sunfac a long, long time ago I had him modded for over 105% tenacity. The difference was negligible.
I think this would be the easiest way to fix it. Not every character should land every debuff at will. Now I would never run an all tenacity team but I would load up some tenacity on my tanks if tenacity was worth it.
When I ran Sunfac a long, long time ago I had him modded for over 105% tenacity. The difference was negligible.
I agree, I tried maxing tenacity and the debuffs still rolled in, especially from a Vader with only 35% Potency with a Palp lead...hate that 3xDOT unless I'm the one dealing. I'm not saying tenacity is useless but it's definitely the least useful.
I think this would be the easiest way to fix it. Not every character should land every debuff at will. Now I would never run an all tenacity team but I would load up some tenacity on my tanks if tenacity was worth it.
When I ran Sunfac a long, long time ago I had him modded for over 105% tenacity. The difference was negligible.
I agree, I tried maxing tenacity and the debuffs still rolled in, especially from a Vader with only 35% Potency with a Palp lead...
With an EP lead that Vader had 2x35% bonus potency from the lead for a total 105%. This means that you would need more than 120% tenacity for it to have any effect.
I believe formula should be something like:
Resist chance = max(30+t-p,15)
Maybe even more then 30
As naturally we have potency much higher then tenancy.
And you should not have issues even with base stats as debuffer due to this.
So basically with even T & P you will have 30 resist chance, this is already something.
But unreliable at all. For example if we take QGJ only 65% tm removal chance - it is triggered almost everytime. I would call it pretty reliable from attacking side. And this is 35% failure chance.
If you use debuffer - you should work with your main parameter to be effective. Why you work only on speed?
If you do not care of your tenacity you will always get 15% resist chance which is basically none.
If you want to be recistance high, you need to invest alot, as potency is much higher normally and it is debuffer primary stat.
And if you do not want to be countered - you also need, but normally you already do as debuffer, don't you?
With this there still be still few really resistant chars.
But current tenancy is a laugh. Yoda's lead with it's tenancy increase of % just worseless. Even Luke with higher % is worseless.
Replies
This. Crit avoidance could be incredible...
Maybe I’m misunderstanding you, but are you suggesting potency be weighted higher? That’s mind boggling to me, because it’s already so powerful that 95% of the time it’s maxed out and adding more is useless. That would be like recommending speed play more of a factor.
But it wouldn’t. It would just mean that if you go up against a team than chose to mod for tenacity you would need to mod for potency to compensate for that.
Why should a character that chooses to ignore potency be able to inflict debuffs reliably? Might as well just get rid of the stats entirely if that’s what people want.
I think this would be the easiest way to fix it. Not every character should land every debuff at will. Now I would never run an all tenacity team but I would load up some tenacity on my tanks if tenacity was worth it.
When I ran Sunfac a long, long time ago I had him modded for over 105% tenacity. The difference was negligible.
I agree, I tried maxing tenacity and the debuffs still rolled in, especially from a Vader with only 35% Potency with a Palp lead...hate that 3xDOT unless I'm the one dealing. I'm not saying tenacity is useless but it's definitely the least useful.
With an EP lead that Vader had 2x35% bonus potency from the lead for a total 105%. This means that you would need more than 120% tenacity for it to have any effect.
Resist chance = max(30+t-p,15)
Maybe even more then 30
As naturally we have potency much higher then tenancy.
And you should not have issues even with base stats as debuffer due to this.
So basically with even T & P you will have 30 resist chance, this is already something.
But unreliable at all. For example if we take QGJ only 65% tm removal chance - it is triggered almost everytime. I would call it pretty reliable from attacking side. And this is 35% failure chance.
If you use debuffer - you should work with your main parameter to be effective. Why you work only on speed?
If you do not care of your tenacity you will always get 15% resist chance which is basically none.
If you want to be recistance high, you need to invest alot, as potency is much higher normally and it is debuffer primary stat.
And if you do not want to be countered - you also need, but normally you already do as debuffer, don't you?
With this there still be still few really resistant chars.
But current tenancy is a laugh. Yoda's lead with it's tenancy increase of % just worseless. Even Luke with higher % is worseless.
Give tenancy live and make it usefull.