I have been very supportive of CG. I was actually considering my first whale-Sion (while I have RJT, she cost me the vet pack plus $20-I wouldn't call that whaling). Till this point I'd call myself a dolphin. Periodically purchasing crystals as I've gone along.
I'm glad I've waited on Sion. I honestly don't believe I can put money into this game and more specifically exclusively into one character. This leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Maybe I'm biased and selfish as an RJT user.
My guild has 5 RJTs. We have about 85M GP. It's not easy to get through T4. It takes us three days. We're far and removed from attempting T7.
In all aspects this just seems like a punishment for non-top tier guilds. As well as those who went all out in order to obtain RJT. And I know a lot more people spent way more then I did.
While I'm still placing top 10 in my arena shard with RJT she's a dying breed in my Jan 2016 shard. A potential raid nerf (in regards to expose) especially for the HAAT will leave me no choice but to go completely f2p. I'd be doing myself a disservice to pay again for the chance that my investment is nerfed.
My faith isn't completely lost. If this doesn't really affect any other raids, or if this change is implemented I'll seriously reconsider my stance and def reconsider my plans for Sion.
I agree that Han needed changed. That loop was able to pump out absurd damage. But nerfing Rey and her exposes is the dumbest thing I think they could possibly do. The devs claim Rey overperforms, but the reality is, she’s fine. Truthfully, the ridiculous mechanics of the raid make it so that no other teams work at all. Instead of making other teams viable in the raid, they nerf the one team that does actually work. That’s a great move... If your goal is to start a riot. Some devs just want to watch the world burn, I guess.
'Balance' will occur when RJT is 'fixed' at the same time as STHan is 'fixed'. Without both fixes in place, there's nothing balanced about it.
Fix=nerf
In this context, at least. If anything the initial impression is that they want to run RJT into the ground if STHan is nerfed.
@swgohfan29 I stand by the statements I made regarding balance. And although I am shocked they actually did it, I offer kudos for their commitment to consistency.
Now, for the sake of consistancy regarding the dev's freshly stated intents.... the infinite TM reduction loop in the Pit needs to be closed just like the infinite TM gain loop needed to be closed in the Sith raid. Addressing one without addressing the other wouldn't be appropriate.
This is basically what I’ve been irritated with. It’s ok when they throw all our characters developed for the Pit raid in the trash for new OP toons that create the same imbalance, but when it happens with a toon everyone has the first week of the raid it’s a problem. Will they nerf the next P2P toon who they find can do massive damage in the raid? Past precedent says no.
I spend a bit here and there. Call it ~$20 a month (which is $240 a year) of SWGOH. You could buy quite a few PS4 games for that over a couple years! Don't have JTR yet, but now likely never. I had been plugging away at all the various parts of this game to get JTR through a combo of hard play and some cash, and now it seems all the investment is worthless. I WANT MY MONEY BACK (although I am realist and realize I should never have invested funds into a company I cannot trust).
JTR is very beatable in arena and now any raid advantages are gone. I also don't know why CA would take their most rare, and hardest to obtain toon, and downgrade her uses. Makes no sense. yea yea yea I know tier 7 mods, new toons, lvl 100 is coming, and we are supposed to spend even more money chasing that - BUT I WONT. There are a number of games (age of legends, force of war) that simply died off because micro-payers like me all left. A game cant live on whales and stolen credit cards alone. Some brainiac MBA at CA should realize this.
Put it this way. After I finish the 2k crystals I have left, at least I'll save the $240 a year I was spending cause it wont be on this game anymore. "Trust" is lost. So is the game.
So after the STH strategy made its way around within the first few days of release, I decided to zeta My Darth Vader's Leader ability so I could contribute more to my guilds attempt at the Tier 6 raid. Shortly after it was decided that STH should be nerfed and now I have totally wasted my 20 zetas, because a Darth Vader leadership really is not useful for anything for long time players like myself. I just feel like there should be compensation for doing something like this. Its already such a slow grind to get any zetas, and now that I have apparently wasted 20, I'm set back about 2 months.
Well if you're a long time player you should have been wise enough to know they'd be doing something about infinite loop solo-esque damage... But that's just common sense
Nothing was broken though, STH was finally a useful character again, along with him being this months character... To make matters worse in the letter talking about the nerfs they said that they wanted people to use characters outside of the meta, but so far JTR is the only team that can do any damage, and she certainly is meta. So all the evidence pointed to this being a legit strategy, but hey that's just me.
Our guild does HAAT in 2 hours. It took us 5 Days to complete T6 of the Triumvirate Raid, and that was only because we are lucky enough to have 20 JTR teams plugging away every reset. If "unintended" synergies and JTR were the only way through this UNREASONABLY difficult raid, and you take both away than that leaves No way through the raid. Instead of Nurfing teams that can barely do 6-12 million damage you should be adding synergies that allow MORE teams to do it.
Oh, and this announcement made one of our better players quit the game today. He said goodbye and uninstalled.
Nothing was broken though, STH was finally a useful character again, along with him being this months character... To make matters worse in the letter talking about the nerfs they said that they wanted people to use characters outside of the meta, but so far JTR is the only team that can do any damage, and she certainly is meta. So all the evidence pointed to this being a legit strategy, but hey that's just me.
If you’re going to reduce overall raid health, will this proportionately reduce Thermal Detonator damage as well? That’d be a shame because there are some very innovative and non-meta Jawa, Mob Enforcer, and Nute Gunray strategies floating around. Not to mention Bounty Hunters as a faction which you guys are actively incentivizing with a raid bonus. On that note can we get a TD rework or at least some transparency on how they work currently? Nobody seems to have a straight answer on whether the activating hero’s offense stat impacts the damage .
If you’re going to reduce overall raid health, will this proportionately reduce Thermal Detonator damage as well? That’d be a shame because there are some very innovative and non-meta Jawa, Mob Enforcer, and Nute Gunray strategies floating around. Not to mention Bounty Hunters as a faction which you guys are actively incentivizing with a raid bonus. On that note can we get a TD rework or at least some transparency on how they work currently? Nobody seems to have a straight answer on whether the activating hero’s offense stat impacts the damage .
That is what happened with Jawas and thermal detonators in Normal AAT when they nerfed the health there. Jawas went from a very good team to use to nearly useless.
If you’re going to reduce overall raid health, will this proportionately reduce Thermal Detonator damage as well? That’d be a shame because there are some very innovative and non-meta Jawa, Mob Enforcer, and Nute Gunray strategies floating around. Not to mention Bounty Hunters as a faction which you guys are actively incentivizing with a raid bonus. On that note can we get a TD rework or at least some transparency on how they work currently? Nobody seems to have a straight answer on whether the activating hero’s offense stat impacts the damage .
That would nerf total damage, but wouldn’t hurt how quickly you complete the raid. This is only a nerf if you are comparing how much raw damage you can do with TD vs a guildmate who uses straight damage in competing for a place in the raid. It will have no impact on your ability to complete the raid.
@CG_RyDiggs I'm confused on the expectations that some teams are under performing. Is this your way of stating that the fan base has missed intended synergies on the raid?
There is a history of rushing content that has not been properly tested into the game. There is a history of nerfing characters that were F2P that absolutely were WAI in Raids. I am done spending money in this game. Extremely disappointed in the devs at this point.
I have been very supportive of CG. I was actually considering my first whale-Sion (while I have RJT, she cost me the vet pack plus $20-I wouldn't call that whaling). Till this point I'd call myself a dolphin. Periodically purchasing crystals as I've gone along.
I'm glad I've waited on Sion. I honestly don't believe I can put money into this game and more specifically exclusively into one character. This leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Maybe I'm biased and selfish as an RJT user.
My guild has 5 RJTs. We have about 85M GP. It's not easy to get through T4. It takes us three days. We're far and removed from attempting T7.
In all aspects this just seems like a punishment for non-top tier guilds. As well as those who went all out in order to obtain RJT. And I know a lot more people spent way more then I did.
While I'm still placing top 10 in my arena shard with RJT she's a dying breed in my Jan 2016 shard. A potential raid nerf (in regards to expose) especially for the HAAT will leave me no choice but to go completely f2p. I'd be doing myself a disservice to pay again for the chance that my investment is nerfed.
My faith isn't completely lost. If this doesn't really affect any other raids, or if this change is implemented I'll seriously reconsider my stance and def reconsider my plans for Sion.
I understand your concerns, and decisions. Your views and feedback are certainly noted. Let's get through the changes next week and continue the process of change, evaluate, correct.
We'll be looking for feedback then too!
Thank you for all your support.
RT
Development Manager for Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes
Can someone even explain how this is a problem in P3? I get P4, but in P3 won't Traya get a turn before too long and just blow all your team away with one shot?
TVF, the stHan trick wouldn't work in P3 as you say, except when it is combined with characters who have unresistible TM reduction it can go on for the entire phase
@CG_RyDiggs I noticed you seem to be avoiding the questions pertaining to the expose nerf and challenge gear no one needs being in raids. The mk3 carbanti mk4 computers and mk 6 syringes we don't have a problem with. The complaints pertain to the gear we have thousands of and continue to get nearly every raid. We're ok with the sth nerf, that was super broken, literally game breaking(my guild froze a few phones stacking bonds of weakness) and SHOULD be patched. Nerfing the only team that can function in the mess of p1 mechanics is where we had the issue.
Lastly, I'd like to thank you for at least commenting with the players on this. I'm going to assume the lack of comments on the raid rewards and expose is because you can't. I don't envy you right now and feel like you lost a bet or something to be put in charge of this fire storm.
This is getting us nowhere. Can't have open dialogue with someone who has been clearly muzzled.
+1 agreed. He can only cherry pick responses he has been authorized to answer, everything else is ignored. "open dialogue" yea who knows if any of these concerns are or ever will reach the design team. lol what a joke
I agree that Han needed changed. That loop was able to pump out absurd damage. But nerfing Rey and her exposes is the dumbest thing I think they could possibly do. The devs claim Rey overperforms, but the reality is, she’s fine. Truthfully, the ridiculous mechanics of the raid make it so that no other teams work at all. Instead of making other teams viable in the raid, they nerf the one team that does actually work. That’s a great move... If your goal is to start a riot. Some devs just want to watch the world burn, I guess.
Thank you for understanding the Han change being necessary. We understand this change isn't popular, and your feedback is absolutely noted. Part of this is a long term fix future proofing ourselves, but you'll also see that the Sith Raid health will be reduced acknowledging the various impacts for players.
We don't want to miss player expectations, but we do need to do our best to ensure design goals are being met for the long term good of the game, which is inherently the long term good of the community.
I digress, let's circle back next week and talk about the changes we made and continue the cycle of updates.
Thank you again!
RT
Development Manager for Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes
Im with this guy,Shes a legendary toon,whats the problem here?Commander Luke can stomp a mudhole in the rancor by himself and not a peep about nerfing him.If our guild cant complete the heroic haat after this foolishness,say goodbye to a bunch of quality peeps.Are you guys seriously trying to destroy this game?
I have been very supportive of CG. I was actually considering my first whale-Sion (while I have RJT, she cost me the vet pack plus $20-I wouldn't call that whaling). Till this point I'd call myself a dolphin. Periodically purchasing crystals as I've gone along.
I'm glad I've waited on Sion. I honestly don't believe I can put money into this game and more specifically exclusively into one character. This leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Maybe I'm biased and selfish as an RJT user.
My guild has 5 RJTs. We have about 85M GP. It's not easy to get through T4. It takes us three days. We're far and removed from attempting T7.
In all aspects this just seems like a punishment for non-top tier guilds. As well as those who went all out in order to obtain RJT. And I know a lot more people spent way more then I did.
While I'm still placing top 10 in my arena shard with RJT she's a dying breed in my Jan 2016 shard. A potential raid nerf (in regards to expose) especially for the HAAT will leave me no choice but to go completely f2p. I'd be doing myself a disservice to pay again for the chance that my investment is nerfed.
My faith isn't completely lost. If this doesn't really affect any other raids, or if this change is implemented I'll seriously reconsider my stance and def reconsider my plans for Sion.
I understand your concerns, and decisions. Your views and feedback are certainly noted. Let's get through the changes next week and continue the process of change, evaluate, correct.
We'll be looking for feedback then too!
Thank you for all your support.
RT
I appreciate the response. And while my message me be a little preemptive, it states my concern. I've stated on reddit that I want my decision to be based off of the actual changes made and the actual effect when made. I'm sorry I didn't say that here.
But this is my mindset for the time being and if our (my) rash fears come to fruition this will sadly be the decision I make. I understand a potential nerf to this raid. I'll be sad but I won't be upset over it. A nerf to RJT on other raids, to the extent were she goes from a special toon to an ordinary one. That will be disappointing. I know you've mentioned that the effect in other raids won't necessarily be to the extent we fear but the wording from the official post leaves it still open.
Are you able to share any more information on the expose nerf and the potential effect on HAAT?
And one last time, thank you for responding to me personally. It's greatly appreciated.
I agree that Han needed changed. That loop was able to pump out absurd damage. But nerfing Rey and her exposes is the dumbest thing I think they could possibly do. The devs claim Rey overperforms, but the reality is, she’s fine. Truthfully, the ridiculous mechanics of the raid make it so that no other teams work at all. Instead of making other teams viable in the raid, they nerf the one team that does actually work. That’s a great move... If your goal is to start a riot. Some devs just want to watch the world burn, I guess.
Thank you for understanding the Han change being necessary. We understand this change isn't popular, and your feedback is absolutely noted. Part of this is a long term fix future proofing ourselves, but you'll also see that the Sith Raid health will be reduced acknowledging the various impacts for players.
We don't want to miss player expectations, but we do need to do our best to ensure design goals are being met for the long term good of the game, which is inherently the long term good of the community.
I digress, let's circle back next week and talk about the changes we made and continue the cycle of updates.
Thank you again!
RT
So basically, no matter how much we protest, nothing is going to change. You're still nerfing expose, regardless if the entire community you so want to 100% please isn't pleased. Explain, how is this going to affect the game long term? What is it that is coming? What? You're crushing the only leverage we have, because? Let me guess, you have to weaken our best chance at victory so that the new toons you're going to release in the future will be worth paying for. Well, until they need to be nerfed and the player base is out even more cash. Dirty tactics. I want what I've spent money to get. And after next week that will not be the case. I'll alive spent money on something that is useless. Thanks alot.
Replies
I'm glad I've waited on Sion. I honestly don't believe I can put money into this game and more specifically exclusively into one character. This leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Maybe I'm biased and selfish as an RJT user.
My guild has 5 RJTs. We have about 85M GP. It's not easy to get through T4. It takes us three days. We're far and removed from attempting T7.
In all aspects this just seems like a punishment for non-top tier guilds. As well as those who went all out in order to obtain RJT. And I know a lot more people spent way more then I did.
While I'm still placing top 10 in my arena shard with RJT she's a dying breed in my Jan 2016 shard. A potential raid nerf (in regards to expose) especially for the HAAT will leave me no choice but to go completely f2p. I'd be doing myself a disservice to pay again for the chance that my investment is nerfed.
My faith isn't completely lost. If this doesn't really affect any other raids, or if this change is implemented I'll seriously reconsider my stance and def reconsider my plans for Sion.
This is basically what I’ve been irritated with. It’s ok when they throw all our characters developed for the Pit raid in the trash for new OP toons that create the same imbalance, but when it happens with a toon everyone has the first week of the raid it’s a problem. Will they nerf the next P2P toon who they find can do massive damage in the raid? Past precedent says no.
JTR is very beatable in arena and now any raid advantages are gone. I also don't know why CA would take their most rare, and hardest to obtain toon, and downgrade her uses. Makes no sense. yea yea yea I know tier 7 mods, new toons, lvl 100 is coming, and we are supposed to spend even more money chasing that - BUT I WONT. There are a number of games (age of legends, force of war) that simply died off because micro-payers like me all left. A game cant live on whales and stolen credit cards alone. Some brainiac MBA at CA should realize this.
Put it this way. After I finish the 2k crystals I have left, at least I'll save the $240 a year I was spending cause it wont be on this game anymore. "Trust" is lost. So is the game.
Oh, and this announcement made one of our better players quit the game today. He said goodbye and uninstalled.
It was broken... Clearly...
http://imgur.com/zxOVoxI
Not as good as my sim tickets
That is what happened with Jawas and thermal detonators in Normal AAT when they nerfed the health there. Jawas went from a very good team to use to nearly useless.
That would nerf total damage, but wouldn’t hurt how quickly you complete the raid. This is only a nerf if you are comparing how much raw damage you can do with TD vs a guildmate who uses straight damage in competing for a place in the raid. It will have no impact on your ability to complete the raid.
I understand your concerns, and decisions. Your views and feedback are certainly noted. Let's get through the changes next week and continue the process of change, evaluate, correct.
We'll be looking for feedback then too!
Thank you for all your support.
RT
TVF, the stHan trick wouldn't work in P3 as you say, except when it is combined with characters who have unresistible TM reduction it can go on for the entire phase
Lastly, I'd like to thank you for at least commenting with the players on this. I'm going to assume the lack of comments on the raid rewards and expose is because you can't. I don't envy you right now and feel like you lost a bet or something to be put in charge of this fire storm.
Its because if they want to stay game changers they are not allowed to badmouth.
+1 agreed. He can only cherry pick responses he has been authorized to answer, everything else is ignored. "open dialogue" yea who knows if any of these concerns are or ever will reach the design team. lol what a joke
Thank you for understanding the Han change being necessary. We understand this change isn't popular, and your feedback is absolutely noted. Part of this is a long term fix future proofing ourselves, but you'll also see that the Sith Raid health will be reduced acknowledging the various impacts for players.
We don't want to miss player expectations, but we do need to do our best to ensure design goals are being met for the long term good of the game, which is inherently the long term good of the community.
I digress, let's circle back next week and talk about the changes we made and continue the cycle of updates.
Thank you again!
RT
Im with this guy,Shes a legendary toon,whats the problem here?Commander Luke can stomp a mudhole in the rancor by himself and not a peep about nerfing him.If our guild cant complete the heroic haat after this foolishness,say goodbye to a bunch of quality peeps.Are you guys seriously trying to destroy this game?
I appreciate the response. And while my message me be a little preemptive, it states my concern. I've stated on reddit that I want my decision to be based off of the actual changes made and the actual effect when made. I'm sorry I didn't say that here.
But this is my mindset for the time being and if our (my) rash fears come to fruition this will sadly be the decision I make. I understand a potential nerf to this raid. I'll be sad but I won't be upset over it. A nerf to RJT on other raids, to the extent were she goes from a special toon to an ordinary one. That will be disappointing. I know you've mentioned that the effect in other raids won't necessarily be to the extent we fear but the wording from the official post leaves it still open.
Are you able to share any more information on the expose nerf and the potential effect on HAAT?
And one last time, thank you for responding to me personally. It's greatly appreciated.
So basically, no matter how much we protest, nothing is going to change. You're still nerfing expose, regardless if the entire community you so want to 100% please isn't pleased. Explain, how is this going to affect the game long term? What is it that is coming? What? You're crushing the only leverage we have, because? Let me guess, you have to weaken our best chance at victory so that the new toons you're going to release in the future will be worth paying for. Well, until they need to be nerfed and the player base is out even more cash. Dirty tactics. I want what I've spent money to get. And after next week that will not be the case. I'll alive spent money on something that is useless. Thanks alot.