@CG_RyDiggs -- is that event calendar update accurate that JTRey comes back in 3 days?
Correct, but off topic
JTR coming back in 3 days?!?!? This just adds insult to injury... no one has time to prepare with such a small heads up. Looks like we've got no chance at heroic for an other 4 months as a 135M gp guild.... great... just great...
Umm.. you have had a couple of months to be prepping for her. While the other gripes in this thread are legit, this one is ridiculous.
Most of us expected to have another couple months to prep for her--the general expectation was that she wouldn't be back until May or June--and would have been in a better position had we had them. I mean, I would've been cutting it close even if she'd been back in May or June as expected, and now I--and a lot of other people who were counting on that extra time--have a snowball's chance in kitten.
They could've just said, "Expose squads, particularly Rey Jedi Training squads, negativity affect our plans to release P2P characters that will make the Sith Triumvirate raid significantly easier. Therefore, we've decided to nerf Expose in an effort to maximize our profits when those characters are finally released.". At this point, just be upfront and honest... You aren't fooling anyone. Lol
Right?
I remember seeing a post in one of the massive feedback threads where, when called on plans for future raids, Diggs had to admit that he had none yet and no idea of knowing (this is probably very poorly paraphrased).
@CG_RyDiggs, I am an unhappy player. I am the customer. I know there are a lot of us, and we have different opinions. And I understand that you can’t make the whole spectrum of players happy.
But it would go a long way if CG said what we all can see is coming - level increases, mod increases, etc. Be honest with us. We deserve full disclosure. CG does not want guilds completing heroic yet. Just admit it. Admit that CG wants this raid to be a challenge for a long time and that means it will be awfully hard (and not fun) for many guilds. Even pointless. Admit that as I type this feedback, developers are designing characters specifically to succeed in the Sith Raid. CG needs to make money, I get it.
But don’t pretend that there is some magic set of existing synergies that your player base has missed that make the raid more manageable or fun.
I think they very much designed the raid for two things - to encourage/force acquisition of JTR teams by middle players, and to make sure that at the beginning at least, heroic can only be cleared by top few guilds. They stumbled on that last one, or maybe not - they maybe let st Han into production to give more people a chance to beat it a few times before it gets hard?
If I were c.g. I would not want lots of guilds to beat heroic in the beginning. But I would also not want to encourage burnout in the player base.
I know she’ll still work but all they did was make it harder. Unless they lowered the tenacity of the raid bosses were still outta luck
Right, they are asserting that reducing expose will make other teams more viable which is absolute nonsense. Teams that don't clock in useful amounts of damage will be exactly 0% more useful than before.
And when the next raid comes out, expose gets docked again? This is the least elegant solution to their problem.
Letting you all know, I'm aware this got out late in the day. I'll be here tomorrow answering what I can. We hope the data above helps with clarifications.
Sooooo no changes to tier 6 and lower rewards? Because unless you can clear this raid in under two days right now it’s just flat out a pain/boring as heck for the junk rewards we get. Not even fun playing anymore.
Honestly the way I see it they are sick of the tenacity down and TM removal strategy that dominates the Pit and Tank and fine so be it. Make them immune to Tencity down but stacking Speed and Tenactiy on every hit means that every team will be useless excepting the one who cannot be resisted. Please drop the stacking speed and tenacity leave them immune to tenacity down and let the debuff centric characters do what they are supposed to do.
We're trying to let you know what we do and be more transparent on why we do it when we can. If this still isn't meeting expectation, know we'll keep working to do so as best we're able. As always, we'll be considering the overall long-term good of the game in every change and addition we make.
Tks for the support!
RT
Do you honestly believe this is the best course of action for the overall long term good of the game? You could quite possibly be doing more harm than good with these choices. I am willing to try these changes but nerfs have never gone over well with the player base. Ever. Not mods, not any toon. Not one. Ever.
Hm, was hoping for more, so guess we'll be dropping down to T4 for the guild coin. Gear rewards untouched, health barely budged and only for p1, and the time commitment increased due to these loopholes closing. Half my guild doesn't even want to bother with the new raid because the mechanics make squad selection too selective. Hope to see more tweaks soon, especially to stacking tenacity and rewards.
How many times are you going to blatantly ignore the questions regarding useless gear as a reward? Want to make amends for forgetting to test your latest legendary character in your newest raid, then remove useless gear as a reward in all raids.
We're trying to let you know what we do and be more transparent on why we do it when we can. If this still isn't meeting expectation, know we'll keep working to do so as best we're able. As always, we'll be considering the overall long-term good of the game in every change and addition we make.
Tks for the support!
RT
I think he was talking about how you posted on the way out the door. So you wouldn't have to respond to tons of questions.
We're trying to let you know what we do and be more transparent on why we do it when we can. If this still isn't meeting expectation, know we'll keep working to do so as best we're able. As always, we'll be considering the overall long-term good of the game in every change and addition we make.
Tks for the support!
RT
I think he was talking about how you posted on the way out the door. So you wouldn't have to respond to tons of questions.
@CG_RyDiggs
I'd like to save you time reading all posts. 3 things that player base says often:
1. Remove stacking Tenacity
2. Raid not fun. It's a factor of #1. Theorycrafting is only possible if Raid doesn't ignore every known game mechanic.
3. Change challenge gear from rewards into something useful.
Would you please address challenge rewards being included in the loot table? You could have earned so much goodwill if you had announce an improvement to the rewards instead of only a nerf.
I like the the raid is too hard for our guild right now. What I don't like is that only characters with unresistible debuffs are useful, whether that be expose or deathmark.
I'm in top 10 guild. We shall be able to clear it even after this Hotfix. We just have to brainlessly throw 5-10 teams each at it. As an officer I feel bad asking players to do that, cuz it's simply NOT FUN. As a game it should be more about fun, strategy and less about who's spent more $ or coordination. We got real life and military service for those
Speaking of long term game health, some catch up mechanics to allow newer players build solid 7 star, g10+ rosters would be nice. Then we can at least get through nihilus's protection with more than one team.
We're trying to let you know what we do and be more transparent on why we do it when we can. If this still isn't meeting expectation, know we'll keep working to do so as best we're able. As always, we'll be considering the overall long-term good of the game in every change and addition we make.
Tks for the support!
RT
It's not meeting expectations. You got a week of feedback ranging from outright rage, to insightful commentary, and significantly superior suggestions.
Then the design team made all the changes they said would with absolutely no adjustment or introspection.
I appreciate the long post about why, but it contained no appreciation of the issues players raised. What occured over this last week can in no way be classified as "listening to the players". You said what you'd do, we got upset, and then you did it anyway.
Nerfing jtr teams with the expose nerf does not make other teams better! Other teams still suck just as bad. Let's use common sense here please. All you did was nerf the best team which was working as intended. Very very bad choice on you're part. You say you listen to the community and by that you must mean you read what we say but do what you want. Nothing more nothing less.
I'm in a 50 person 90 million GP guild that's been around since the game launched, November 2015. We're a mix of FTP, dolphins with about 3 whales. We've run the sith raid 3 times. Tier 6 we got crushed with a 50/50 participation & abandoned it. Then we ran tier 5, it took us 6 days. By the end of the raid almost 20 people had completely given up and stopped playing. We launched tier 5 again two days ago, we've only had 38 people participate with roughly about ten people just autoing it.
We normally make events a requirement and have strict participation rules, but nobody likes this raid, it's not fun and I don't blame them.
The tier requirements don't come close to matching what is actually needed. The rewards are horrible for the amount of time needed to complete each tier, and quite frankly this raid is boring. All toons kits except Rey don't work and the devs just nerfed her. What's the point of this if our toons don't work at all?
So until this raid is fixed our 2+ year old guild will be ignoring it. I'm sure we'll launch it again, but let people play at their own accord. If anyone plays at all.
@CG_RyDiggs Signed up for the forums just to reply to this, thanks.
Additionally, the gap between Expose and other emerging strategies is less pronounced, which we believe will help spur on additional, lively theorycrafting.
You did it for us.
Testing indicates Rey (Jedi Training) remains one of the most effective squads in the Sith Triumvirate Raid in spite of the 50% reduction in damage from Expose.
Finished theory crafting, JTR is still the only useful character available. A 50% reduction in expose damage does nothing to counter the ever stacking Tenacity and Speed per hit, causing all other teams to remain useless.
Would additionally like to thank you for reducing to .00000000002 expose damage after we farmed up resistance for HAAT.
Icing on the cake.
Edit: Added Below:
We are a 2 year old guild at 108m total GP, clearing T5/T6 without using the STHan Cheese was virtually impossible, again, thank you for all you do at CG.
@CG_RyDiggs
Please at least take a look at the rewards. If we are spending 6 days of effort on T6 and I finish in the top 10, I should get better stuff than I do from HAAT or a daily challenge.
Point 2. It is difficult to theory craft when most of the other abilities are ineffective. Wasn’t there supposed to be some sort of bonus for a few classes and hero’s? GK is actually bad in two phases and should not be used, since the boss steals his buffs...
@CG_RyDiggs Signed up for the forums just to reply to this, thanks.
Additionally, the gap between Expose and other emerging strategies is less pronounced, which we believe will help spur on additional, lively theorycrafting.
You did it for us.
Testing indicates Rey (Jedi Training) remains one of the most effective squads in the Sith Triumvirate Raid in spite of the 50% reduction in damage from Expose.
Finished theory crafting, JTR is still the only useful character available. A 50% reduction in expose damage does nothing to counter the ever stacking Tenacity and Speed per hit, causing all other teams to remain useless.
Would additionally like to thank you for reducing to .00000000002 expose damage after we farmed up resistance for HAAT.
Icing on the cake.
Edit: Added Below:
We are a 2 year old guild at 108m total GP, clearing T5/T6 without using the STHan Cheese was virtually impossible, again, thank you for all you do at CG.
It's come to our attention that our hamburgers are much too delicious and that they are suppressing all the other items on our menu. We have swapped our 100% grilled beef burgers with much less delicious frozen burgers which will be microwaved for exactly 30 seconds too long. We believe this will help spur on additional, lively enjoyment of the subpar items on our menu.
We're trying to let you know what we do and be more transparent on why we do it when we can. If this still isn't meeting expectation, know we'll keep working to do so as best we're able. As always, we'll be considering the overall long-term good of the game in every change and addition we make.
Tks for the support!
RT
It's not meeting expectations. You got a week of feedback ranging from outright rage, to insightful commentary, and significantly superior suggestions.
Then the design team made all the changes they said would with absolutely no adjustment or introspection.
I appreciate the long post about why, but it contained no appreciation of the issues players raised. What occured over this last week can in no way be classified as "listening to the players". You said what you'd do, we got upset, and then you did it anyway.
Right now you do not have my support.
This is spot on, and probably the best summary of what will soon be another 1000 comment thread.
Also, raid rewards QOL challenege gear revamp is due
Replies
Most of us expected to have another couple months to prep for her--the general expectation was that she wouldn't be back until May or June--and would have been in a better position had we had them. I mean, I would've been cutting it close even if she'd been back in May or June as expected, and now I--and a lot of other people who were counting on that extra time--have a snowball's chance in kitten.
Right?
I remember seeing a post in one of the massive feedback threads where, when called on plans for future raids, Diggs had to admit that he had none yet and no idea of knowing (this is probably very poorly paraphrased).
1) Raid still boring
2) Here's JTR to distract you
But it would go a long way if CG said what we all can see is coming - level increases, mod increases, etc. Be honest with us. We deserve full disclosure. CG does not want guilds completing heroic yet. Just admit it. Admit that CG wants this raid to be a challenge for a long time and that means it will be awfully hard (and not fun) for many guilds. Even pointless. Admit that as I type this feedback, developers are designing characters specifically to succeed in the Sith Raid. CG needs to make money, I get it.
But don’t pretend that there is some magic set of existing synergies that your player base has missed that make the raid more manageable or fun.
If I were c.g. I would not want lots of guilds to beat heroic in the beginning. But I would also not want to encourage burnout in the player base.
Right, they are asserting that reducing expose will make other teams more viable which is absolute nonsense. Teams that don't clock in useful amounts of damage will be exactly 0% more useful than before.
And when the next raid comes out, expose gets docked again? This is the least elegant solution to their problem.
Nope
Do you honestly believe this is the best course of action for the overall long term good of the game? You could quite possibly be doing more harm than good with these choices. I am willing to try these changes but nerfs have never gone over well with the player base. Ever. Not mods, not any toon. Not one. Ever.
How many times are you going to blatantly ignore the questions regarding useless gear as a reward? Want to make amends for forgetting to test your latest legendary character in your newest raid, then remove useless gear as a reward in all raids.
and i want my zetas back
I think he was talking about how you posted on the way out the door. So you wouldn't have to respond to tons of questions.
Yep. Kicking the can down the road.
I'd like to save you time reading all posts. 3 things that player base says often:
1. Remove stacking Tenacity
2. Raid not fun. It's a factor of #1. Theorycrafting is only possible if Raid doesn't ignore every known game mechanic.
3. Change challenge gear from rewards into something useful.
I like the the raid is too hard for our guild right now. What I don't like is that only characters with unresistible debuffs are useful, whether that be expose or deathmark.
It's not meeting expectations. You got a week of feedback ranging from outright rage, to insightful commentary, and significantly superior suggestions.
Then the design team made all the changes they said would with absolutely no adjustment or introspection.
I appreciate the long post about why, but it contained no appreciation of the issues players raised. What occured over this last week can in no way be classified as "listening to the players". You said what you'd do, we got upset, and then you did it anyway.
Right now you do not have my support.
We normally make events a requirement and have strict participation rules, but nobody likes this raid, it's not fun and I don't blame them.
The tier requirements don't come close to matching what is actually needed. The rewards are horrible for the amount of time needed to complete each tier, and quite frankly this raid is boring. All toons kits except Rey don't work and the devs just nerfed her. What's the point of this if our toons don't work at all?
So until this raid is fixed our 2+ year old guild will be ignoring it. I'm sure we'll launch it again, but let people play at their own accord. If anyone plays at all.
You did it for us. Finished theory crafting, JTR is still the only useful character available. A 50% reduction in expose damage does nothing to counter the ever stacking Tenacity and Speed per hit, causing all other teams to remain useless.
Would additionally like to thank you for reducing to .00000000002 expose damage after we farmed up resistance for HAAT.
Icing on the cake.
Edit: Added Below:
We are a 2 year old guild at 108m total GP, clearing T5/T6 without using the STHan Cheese was virtually impossible, again, thank you for all you do at CG.
Please at least take a look at the rewards. If we are spending 6 days of effort on T6 and I finish in the top 10, I should get better stuff than I do from HAAT or a daily challenge.
Point 2. It is difficult to theory craft when most of the other abilities are ineffective. Wasn’t there supposed to be some sort of bonus for a few classes and hero’s? GK is actually bad in two phases and should not be used, since the boss steals his buffs...
It's come to our attention that our hamburgers are much too delicious and that they are suppressing all the other items on our menu. We have swapped our 100% grilled beef burgers with much less delicious frozen burgers which will be microwaved for exactly 30 seconds too long. We believe this will help spur on additional, lively enjoyment of the subpar items on our menu.
This is spot on, and probably the best summary of what will soon be another 1000 comment thread.
Also, raid rewards QOL challenege gear revamp is due
@CG_Kozispoon
@EA_Jesse
@CG_Carrie
@CG_Dan
@EA_MindTricks
@CG_isanyonelistening