Sith raid... are we missing something?

So, after several rounds of being stuck at low tier (3) Sith Triumvirate, I wonder if there is something in the strategy there I am missing...

It feels like nothing I can throw at the raid works there. Now, I get that raids should require a different approach compared to arena or nodes, heroic rancor takes special team revolving around turn meter, HAAT has phases with special needs, but in this raid, I cannot seem to find what each phase needs. All of them are countered by some other mechanic of the boss.

Below I will write some frustration filled observation I made by our time trying to figure out, HOW to play this **** raid. Spoiler: We did not. We are tackling HAAT, farm HRancor, yet our guild is stuck at T3 of Triumvirate. The time investment is huge, yet still, the T3 is not as fluent as it should be (remember: level 60 g7 recommended, which we outgear tenfold) And rewards are tuned towards level 60 g7 players, although I can't see them beating the raid. In other words, they suck.

So basically, before I start my rant about the raid, I can't believe that a raid would be released so ****. Therefore I suspect there is something we did not realize as a guild. Therefore any tips to consider are appreciated. Thank you in advance

Only thing I know about is that we have only one JTR in our guild roster, therefore we cannot build groups around her. But do not tell me that whole raid depends on single worst-attainable character locked behind 5 cantina battles grinds and half-year timer.


//////////////////////////////// Now, let the rant begin.

Let's consider Darth Nihilus.

Thanks to massive Tenacity, no debuff squad works. And although he is not immune to turn meter reduction, he will resist it anyway. We cannot tenacity down him, nothing. The only possibility is zVader leadership and I found it more interfering and messing up shield timing than helping with damage.

Also, no buff squad works because it will annihilate the hell out of your squad with dispells and cooldown reductions. You can't even taunt, because Nihilus will just dispell it first thing morning. And of course, you cannot blow the shields for undispellable taunt, because your charges are limited and you need to save them for Annihilate. Also, protection regeneration.

Assist and counter groups do not work because he will regenerate half of his protection bar. Phoenix squadron deals absolute nothing. One of the most consistent groups I have with gear levels ranging from 9 to 11 equipped with 5star mods does damage in a 50k~ish range in a raid that is recommended for level 60 gear 7.

Brute forcing it with CLS and Han Solo alongside other rebels yield moderate results with lots of unpredictable Annihilates because of that one Defense Down that popped right before Drain.

The only thing I managed to find, that works, is to shred him to pieces with Thrawn, Magmatrooper, and Death Trooper combo, that closes in 2M dmg range and is inconsistent with how the shields are distributed and resists of Defense Down happens.

Up to Darth Sion
This one is just plain old fat. Apart from the high tenacity that is common to all three bosses and cripples half of the roster he is actually OK, if you have any sanity left after Nihilus, you can actually enjoy this phase... which is why whole guild flocks in like vultures and shreds him in 2 hrs.


Following to Darth Traya
This phase is annoying as hell. The isolation sucks, there is no way to get rid of it, also, there is not much of the strategy in this phase. AoE sabers, whack the granny, AoE swords, whack the granny. Repeat 7 times and die to enrage. Unlike previous raids, there are no bonuses for toppling the boss, she does not even drop her high tenacity and to add insult to injury, recovers 100% turn meter when she recovers, taking a turn immediately, reducing enrage timer by 2. Yes, we can Stand Alone which relieves some of the damage from omnipresent ticking damage while giving three OP hits but that is pretty much it. And thanks to that turn meter manipulation, even Terminate does not work as well as in previous phases.

And when finally the granny drops, the guild mood killer, phase 4 begins.
Everything wrong with the raid combined into a single phase of misery and annoyance.
Saw that long list of issues with Nihilus above? Ye, they all are here. No relief. Into that, Sion is doing his thing somewhere on the side. And of course in a phase, where management and concentration is everything, saving cooldowns to use special just in time for the defense down to drop so that Nihilus does not reduce his Annihilate cooldown... Darth Traya just messes that all with that drain she has that increases cooldown and transfers turn meter... most likely to Nihilus that will just Annihilate in response because your shield is not yet up because if it were up, it would expire before Nihilus would hit.

To make matters worse, because Isolation management is tied to attackers and tanks, and the Pain and Bonds management is tied to supports and healers, you cannot even reuse the groups from previous phases if they do lean heavily on one side.

When Nihilus and Sion finally drop, the fight is not any easier. With the goddamn buffs Traya gets, she is insanely fast, enrages before you have time to rev up some dmg (BB8 cant even get his illuminated destiny off), my G11 CLS typically takes 4 to 5 turns, might be more if he does not get drained and isolated on almost any occasion... Even the heaviest hitters in the guild drop to 500k damage range. Noone likes the phase, no one enjoys the phase, it takes longer than previous three combined and just tears good mood in guild apart because someone outright declines to participate, others are angry because they have to pull off that much more... and yet I can't really blame them. Seeing the squads that I invested lots of time and lots of money into, being reduced to the role of mundane scratchers, is not something I love to see.




Replies

  • Options
    I have no idea about the Sith Raid. And not much desire to know. It's just not fun.
  • Options
    up to 5 Zader lead, zEP, zThrawn, Zbarris, zSid deliver a solid result. key is to get potency up on vader and sid to land DOTs, the dots can give 1million plus damage alone. I can get up to 13 stacking on nihilus and then vader culling blade delivers a punch. Biggest hit ive managed is 3.5 million. Before realising lvl of potency required I was getting 0.5 million with this team. get potency >90%

    Agree tho that this raid is a ball ache. heroic is a long way off for many of us.
  • Options
    up to 5 Zader lead, zEP, zThrawn, Zbarris, zSid deliver a solid result. key is to get potency up on vader and sid to land DOTs, the dots can give 1million plus damage alone. I can get up to 13 stacking on nihilus and then vader culling blade delivers a punch. Biggest hit ive managed is 3.5 million. Before realising lvl of potency required I was getting 0.5 million with this team. get potency >90%

    Agree tho that this raid is a ball ache. heroic is a long way off for many of us.

    Will consider this build up. But having to have 5+ zetas just for 1 group of P1 looks like total overkill, which of them can be dropped without sacrificing too much?

    also, how you potency-up Vader in these conditions? as far as my knowledge go, EP, Thrawn, barris nor sidious can grant PotUp to anyone. Although I am not familiar with their zetas. Or did you mean just generally up his potency with mods?
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    Options
    There are several options.

    Phase 1:
    Detonators and irresistable TM reduction both work well on lower tiers. Zader lead was already mentioned. Add Assaj lead NS (zeta lead works best — non—zeta is ok). NS acolyte can really dish out some dmg. And finally jawa teams with scavenger for detonators, or a team built around JE and making him take turns all the time both work well. The latter could be:
    Thrawn lead, JE, FOO, Hera and JC, but Wicket could also work well. Always give TM to JE and call him to assist.
    You could split your Jawas to create both a JE team and a team with Luminara lead and the 4 remaining jawa.

    Phase 2:
    Ackbar lead with Leia as the only other rebel works fine. Add a tank (GK is good) and 1—2 healers (f.ex. EE, Zarris etc.) or other characters with non—attack skills (BB8 f.ex. since you don't need it for JTR teams). The idea is to have Leia stealth and then do all the damage, through her assists (Ackbar Lead). Omega on her stealth is important. Let leia get full stacks for extra damage. The fun thing is, that when ever you remove stacks from the 4 other team members it also activates assists through AA's lead ability.

    Phase 3:
    ChexMix doesn't work the same on low tiers, since sabers die too easy. However, I believe, you can still benefit from using stand alone in teams of various attackers with death mark (DT), offense up (JKA / Pao) and counters (f.ex. rebels under CLS lead).

    Phase 4:
    Use nightsisters under Assaj lead for Nihilus. Use the weaker attacks like Daka's basic on Sion. Let acolyte and Assaj go to town on DN. Be aware of shields/annihilate.

    There are several other options, but the above should work well for guilds/players with lower GP rosters.
  • Erewien
    4 posts Member
    Options
    Thank you for your suggestions. I will try to make guildies try these. As for
    Waqui wrote: »

    Phase 2:
    Ackbar lead with Leia as the only other rebel works fine. Add a tank (GK is good) and 1—2 healers (f.ex. EE, Zarris etc.) or other characters with non—attack skills (BB8 f.ex. since you don't need it for JTR teams). The idea is to have Leia stealth and then do all the damage, through her assists (Ackbar Lead). Omega on her stealth is important. Let leia get full stacks for extra damage. The fun thing is, that when ever you remove stacks from the 4 other team members it also activates assists through AA's lead ability.

    I am running this squad with Ackbar, Leia, GMYoda (the buffs from adds are juicy), Shoretrooper and BB8 and it is probably best team I can sport. to P2
  • Options
    Yeah, you have definitely experienced the marathon we call the Sith Triumvirate Raid. It's a tough nut. I imagine putting all of that down into words was a cathartic experience.

    2% brother. All you need to do is 2% each phase. If everyone does their 2%, you win! Keep grinding that gear and it will happen.
  • Options
    Yeah, you have definitely experienced the marathon we call the Sith Triumvirate Raid. It's a tough nut. I imagine putting all of that down into words was a cathartic experience.

    2% brother. All you need to do is 2% each phase. If everyone does their 2%, you win! Keep grinding that gear and it will happen.

    The problem is that most players can't/won't do the 2%, esp in phases 1/4 (with Nihilus). So you have to lean heavily on those who can/will.
    Ally Code 766-465-766 swgoh.gg/u/trystansr/collection/
  • Erewien
    4 posts Member
    Options
    Would you recommend focusing or Nihilus or Sion in P4? Why?
  • TVF
    36859 posts Member
    Options
    Do you have R2s in your guild? His smokescreen is useful in P3 to force isolate to the best toon to take it on. Of course you have to time it right (harder without JTR reducing his cooldowns) and once you use it on him, you can't do it again until isolate goes on someone else.

    Re the tenacity problem you can overcome it in the first two phases with high-potency characters and good timing (i.e. use debuffs immediately after the boss attacks and their tenacity has reset). Phase three is difficult because Traya gets stacking tenacity every time an ally (i.e. saber) dies, so you can't do much there except the first topple or two.

    A Nightsister team can do a lot in P4 against Sion and Nih. I use a zeta Asajj lead with Acoylte and Talzin. Acolyte gains health and attacks twice on crit/stealth, and the zeta gives her 50% TM when she heals fully. Combined with the BOW damage, she can take lots of turns in a row. And Talzin can put plague on the adds, which then spreads to the bosses and they pass it back and forth.

    Summary: There are strategies that work, you just have to work on your rosters to take advantage of them.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Options
    I think what has eveyone so down in the dumps about this raid is that it requires everyone to pull equal or greater weight. In my guild, we have several people who solo rancor, so its not even a challenge. For Haat, there are guilds where people post 0's and then have a few heavy hitters take out the raid, especially if you have a highly geared Ackbar (L), Thrawn, BB-8, Assajj, and CLS team.

    The sith raid is completely different. It is designed so that at all tiers everyone has to contribute. They also changed a lot of the mechanics, because they did not want TMR do be the be all end all of how to beat raids. There is no challenge to that. While I agree that the difficulty of the lower tiers are a little extreme for the rewards given, my guild, which still has yet to complete a Haat, beats tier 4 once every 4-5 days. It's a grind, but we have found some things that work.

    P1- Zader has been mentioned, but the two best squads I have run are:

    Thrawn (L), Magma, DT, Vader, Palp.

    I run Vader/Palp because I do not have shore/Director Krennic. The team works off of the magma TM gain and deathmark procs, but also has some survivability from palp giving everyone health steal up. A lot of people also like to use FOO, but I do not because...

    KRU (L), Kylo Ren, FOO, Phasma, FOE

    ..he is here. The basis behind this team is FEED THE EXECUTIONER. FOE's death sentance has a short CD, so he can spam it and stack health/damage as long as he does not kill anyone. The most I have done with this team is about 1.2 million, and FOE did 900k of that. If I had better gear/mods on the other 4 that damage would also go up, but essentially this team is about lots of CD's so you can avoid using your basics and giving Nihilus protection.

    BH's also work well, but mine are still a work in progress (Boba and IG-88 are gear 8, Greedo and Dengar are gear 7. My only other one is cad)

    P2-
    Of everything in the Sith Raid, this is usually everyones favorite because almost anything works, especially at lower levels where Sion doesn't do a ton of damage until he enrages. I have seen Phoenix work well, Clones, Empire, FO, Resistance, droids, pretty much any squad at lower tiers does good damage here. At higher levels you have to think more, but I'll tackle that when my guild gets there.

    P3-
    Not going to claim to be the expert on this phase, but some nice teams I have seen are:

    Chexmix- CLS (L) zHan, Pao, DT, another attacker.-Apply Deathmark on Traya, stand alone with Han, sit back and laugh as he counterattacks for 2 million+ damage.

    Nightsisters- Zombie takes the punishment, Assajj gains a lot of damage from the swords dying, other nightsisters do their jobs.

    Imperial Troopers- TM Gain, Lots of AoEs to wipe out the swords, solid damage.

    Also to what you were saying about traya taking an instant turn after coming out of topple. I believe she has to do that, otherwise one person could realistically solo P3. She doesn't gain speed or chains of weakness while she is toppled, so if she didn't immediately take a turn you could just hit an aoe or 2, topple her, do some damage, she stands up, and you repeat until she is dead without ever being at risk of your team dying.

    P4- All of the above teams for the individual ones, with the exception of P3 since stand alone is not a thing. The best I do is just throw teams and hope for the best, but the best team I have seen online is

    Rex (L), Baze, 5ves, Echo, Clone Sergeant.

    Rex lead gives a lot of TM everytime she Crits, which is a lot, essentially just pop the undying on baze, and go to town with clones.

    TL;DR-
    The point of the sith raid, in my opinion, was for it to be an entire guild effort rather than just a few people carrying it. It was also to test out different teams so that the things that work for Rancor or Haat will not be as effective for this one. It forces you to think more, use more of your roster, and for everyone in your guild to put forth the same effort.
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