What tier or tiers did you play?
Since the start we have played tiers 4,6&heroic
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
Currently our GP is down to 70ish million, 35 members. Several have quit, others left for stronger guilds so they wouldn't have to try as hard. Attempting Heroic requires a ton of coordination from the officers and the members have to be ready to go as soon as needed (within hours at least)
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Usual teams - JTR, NS, troopers, semi-chex mix, sink
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Since the first raid nothing has motivated us to do much. Traya shards would be nice but we are no longer able to attempt heroic. Other tiers rewards are garbage vs. effort when a far lesser effort in rancor or HAAT yields the same or better.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Now, nothing. It is a tedious grind. P2, P3 and P4 can have moments. P1 is poorly designed IMO. The mechanics are silly.
What tier or tiers did you play? I’ve played tier 5 & 6
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? I’ve been in 3 guilds since the release of the Sith raid. GPs ranging from 110-125m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? This would be a very large number of teams to completely answer. I’ll try to answer as best as I can. First Order (KRU lead), EP lead Empire and Sith teams, Phoenix, Wampanader, Nute Cheese, Imperial Troopers, Nightsister, QGJ lead jedi, Bounty Hunters, Chex Mix, Various Rebel teams.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? The absolute biggest demotivation was opening the reward box after completing the first raid. I found it to be insulting compensation for the amount of time I invested. I wanted to not participate any more as a message to CG about the raid. It ultimately led to me leaving a guild I had been with for over two years. I found another guild that was ok with me not parity.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? I don’t find anything about the raid to be enjoyable. I dislike the amount of health the non-heroic tiers have. I dislike the amount of effective characters a player has as options (JTR being the only viable option). I dislike the stacking tenacity and speed the raid targets have, effectively removing debuffs as a strategy. I dislike the rewards for non-heroic tiers. I dislike the amount of turmoil the raid has caused the community. I dislike having to restart the raid everytime my guild finishes because we can’t finish the raid before we generate enough tickets to start another.
I truly hope this feedback leads to positive changes. I also would like to say that while I may seem very negative in my feedback, I was as honest as I could be. One positive of the last few months has been CG Carrie. I very much respect what she has tried to do. I am not a fan of these forums. I prefer Reddit for various reasons. But I am posting here in the hopes that she sees it and am confident it will reflect the discussion that has already been happening on Reddit which I know she has seen.
My guild can't decide on a tier--though we've been running three most regularly--and initially tried to start with five, if I remember correctly. We abandoned that and moved down to either three of four, abandoned that and moved down to two, finished that, moved up to three, stayed at three until the reward rework hit, did two fours (though only finished one while the rework was alive; the GET were nice, the rest wasn't). When the reward rework was removed we moved back to three, eventually got fed up with three and moved down to two--did three in like a week and ran out of tickets--then moved back up to three waiting for our tickets to max out again (though nagging people to auto it now means we finish three much faster than we had been, so eh).
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
We're currently 43,603,348. We have players ranging from level 85 and 2.1 million to level 78 and 285 thousand (with one carry-on member at level 59 and 54.9 thousand). I'm currently at 85 and just under 1.1 million GP; I'm probably about average, or slightly above for my guild.
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I usually just auto it with various teams I've collected while working towards my legendary characters. Phoenix, my Empire/Sith arena team (seems to be my most consistent damage), First Order, my baby Imperial troopers, my baby Wiggs team, my HAAT/rancor raid teams, other various teams as whimsy strikes--ANH, Bounty Hunters, baby Nightsisters--etc. I just haven't cared enough about this raid, or Traya, to bend over or change what I'm farming to build teams specifically for this raid; though I probably will once I finish building TB/TW teams, which will help my guild more and which is my next long-term project (not that you asked).
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
The only thing we really get out of this raid is an extra infusion of guild currency; the rewards are nothing to write home about, and the raid itself simply isn't enjoyable. We know we're far from being able to take on Heroic, and we dislike/resent the new raid enough we've lowered the tier we do down to a point we can auto it for that extra infusion of currency.
We don't aim higher, though we certainly could, simply because we dislike the raid.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Phase two is the only thing I like; that sort of risk/reward play is fun.
Dislike? Pretty much everything else.
I can only speak for myself: it's tedious. Sure, at first it was new, exciting, challenging, but it got old very quickly. Nihilus is a lot of that--the way he hits through protection, has and regenerates his own, the stacking speed and tenacity, the way he steals debuffs, timing the raid-skill (that the AI apparently can't/won't use on auto)--but he isn't the whole of the problem. The massive amounts of health, the unenjoyable--though Phase 2 can be fun, sometimes--and overdeveloped mechanics, the way getting a proper run--with decent numbers--can take so much time, repetition and attention. It's just not fun. It's overwrought, overdesigned, and persnickety. I've been able to pay less attention in WoW heroic raids, and had much more fun, in roughly the same amount of time I would spend on this raid without autoing it.
That was a classic MMO with lots of hardcore nerds. This is a mobile game. Hm.
I don't mind being challenged, but it better be fun, or it better be worth the rewards. This is neither (and I'll take fun over rewards).
Edit: don't you hate it when you push the wrong button? And forget words. I give up, enough forums for today.
We have received a wide range of feedback about the newest raid, The Sith Triumvirate and we would like to hear more about your experience. Please include the following information in addition to your feedback:
What tier or tiers did you play?
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
1. Tried Tier 6, moved to Tier 5, moved to Tier 4 gave up and only do Tier 3 and 2 now.
2. 63 mil
3. Varies with each player. Only 3 people in guild have JTR.
Phase 1: Emprie with MagmaTrooper, zFinn Resistance, NS with zombie, Wiggs/ZCLS/Raid Han, Leia, BH
Phase 2: Emprie, Troopers, zFinn Resistance, BH, FO Kylo UM, temper tantrum Kylo, Phasma, FOO, FOTP
Phase 3: same as phase 2
Phase 4: same as phase 1
4. Phase 1 and Phase 4: Nihilus is too much. He holds his charge for no apparent reason. He force drains way too often. Is is made to be a bigger coward than GG. Phase 4 is just pure garbage with Traya shortening her enrage time because, reasons. We have purely given up with higher raid content because it’s easier to play tier 2 and 3 and buy gear from the Raid token store.
Demotivater is the absolute narrow character range for use in the raid that are practical. Rey performs better than CLS. That’s a problem when Rey is locked behind a 28k crystal refresh for 2 useless vets. Rewards are horrible for effort asked.
Motivator was Sion and Traya stand alone fights in phase 2 and 3. Those are actually fun. Raid in general is not an auto fight. You have to control your characters and highly involved fights.
5. See answer to 4. Rewards are terrible. Don’t even try to lessen the rewards in HAAT and HPit to make STR look more appealing, either. I would 100% be happy with more raid tokens rewards and similar credits to buy gear from Raid Store, than have the gear in the rewards Tier 1-4.
1. T6>t5>t7>t5>t7
2. 125M
3. P1 jtr; p2 empire, phoenix, ackbar leia; p3 chexmix; p4 nightsisters and zerg
4. The raid was very demotivating until we beat heroic. The first two times we tried heroic we got stuck at p3. The third time we were stuck at p4 with like 2 hours to go and not progressing. I went to work out and when I checked back there was 40 minutes left and we had Sion at 30%. We managed to beat it with 15 minutes left. The next time we tried, 3 days later, we beat it in 27 hours and it's been less than that since. Honestly a majority of it was mental. Once we knew we could beat it it got easier. HOWEVER. The RNG is insane in the battles and makes it a pain to do. Having to restart 10+ times per battle is very tedious. There is so much to keep track of, especially the nihilis fights. Another complaint would be t6. It is just too much of a time sink. As others have said by the time you can beat t6 you should be able to beat t7. They have sooo much health. I would suggest reducing the health or maybe removing one of the mechanics each phase. Have nihilus not ignore protection at t6. Something, it's just not worthwhile. I think t6 is harder than t7, just you have infinite time to do it. I will say now that the raid is on farm I enjoy it mostly. RNG is still annoying in a battle but since I know we can win I don't have to worry about getting the perfect run every time.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? about 83 million gp
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
- 3 jtr teams in the guild, only one actively plays the raid because of time commitment
- ns for p4
- pretty much everthing for p2 and 3
- jawa engineer for p1 as long with pretty much every other team because of the lack of jtr
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
- p2 and 3 are fun
- p1 and 4 are a struggle in every run
- my single jtr team does about double the dmg in 1 run than the 2. place in 5
- rewards for time commitment makes guildies not even try at the moment
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
- i really like the look and the animations
- p2 and 3 are some kind of different stuff that make fun and at least in t4 is approachable by a lot of variety of teams
- p1 is fun IF you have jtr
- p4 seems to be the worst for us beause of lack of good nightsister squads
- p4 also takes at least 2 resets and it is getting longer
- we barely reached the point to finish the raid before losing tickets to the cap
this has changed now
even though people get better geared teams and their damage goes up the participation goes down
it is really time consuming and a lot of people start just autoing if they do the 5 battles at all
so our finish time actually goes up at the moment and not down
(best case scenario is a participation of 40/49 while having 10+ listed with like 200k to 1million damage > moste likely some auto runs)
a lot of people seem to not understand nihilus mechanics in most of the scenarios and are not investing numerous restart attempts on a daily basis, because this raid is like running 24/7 because of the time it takes to finish
the rewards for the time investment especially p4 and to some extent p1 are demotivating for a lot of people
i am place 1 with like two times to three times the damage of place 2 because of having the only jtr team that plays actively (meaning having the time to manually fight the sith raid every day in addition to tw, tb, other raids, events)
30 million GP, 20 active players. We have several rancor solo-ers, two hAAT soloers.
We are kind of lazily repeating tier 2 for anyone who is bored after they finish their dailies. Because why bother when it takes days on end of slogging for a bit of guild credit and useless challenge gear? It would take at least heroic Rancor level rewards for even tier 2 to be worth the effort to take seriously. And a lot more than that to muck through tier 3 or 4 again.
I personally think the mechanics have the potential to be excellent, although my guild says boring. But I think their boredom is just a response to the slog. Cut HP by 50-70% (ie: to 1/3 or 1/2 of where it is) and it would be a good trade off for the prizes and the effort; decent damage reward for clever play could make the mechanics shine through.
It’s also sad that there doesn’t seem to be anything to build towards. In tank, it was exciting to build the teams that could do damage. I spent months knowing that if I just put together the right team, I could do something significant. That carried me through building Princess Zody, and Chirpatine, and finally Resistance and my Big Mix. There are none of those teams in Sith. I’ve got my JTR team; beyond that, what do I strive for?
So: rewards that aren’t worth the effort, mechanics that are buried by the sheer hit points you have to slog through, and all the clever team builds that got nerfed instead of celebrated.
It’s demoralizing. And it is especially frustrating because I can see what it could have been! It was SO CLOSE!
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? I’ve been in three guilds since the launch of the raid. GPs ranging from 115-125m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? First Order, Empire, Sith, Jedi, Nightsisters, Bounty Hunters, Wampanader, Nute Cheese, Chex Mix
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you? The absolute biggest demotivation was opening the reward box after finishing the first raid. I found it to be insulting compared to the time spent. It untimately led to leaving a guild I had been in for over two years. I didn’t want to raid the Sith raid.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? There is nothing about the raid I enjoy.
I dislike the amount of health the non-heroic tiers have. I dislike the non-heroic rewards. I dislike the lack of diversity in effective teams especially since this is a collection game. I have a +3 million GP and I can’t contribute to the raid because I don’t have one character (JTR). I dislike the stacking tenacity and speed of the raid enemies. Removing debuffs as a strategy. I dislike having to do the raid every day since it was released because it has so much health my guild can’t finish before we regenerate enough tickets to start another. I dislike the turmoil it has caused the community.
My feedback is very negative. I would like to finish with something positive. I find CG Carrie to be genuinely caring for the game and I believe that she wants it to be better. Thank you for your efforts. I hope this feedback and the feedback where this was started on Reddit can be used to improve the raid.
We have received a wide range of feedback about the newest raid, The Sith Triumvirate and we would like to hear more about your experience. Please include the following information in addition to your feedback:
What tier or tiers did you play?
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Tier 3. Guild GP 58m
Wiggs rebels, nightsisters, Phoenix, Jawas, Sith.
Just a time drain phase 1 and 4. Can’t get the guild motivated to hit it everyday or dedicate resources for such low payout in rewards. Are guild is sitting on 38 members and I can only get 5 to hit. Wind up throwing tickets away because we can’t beat it before we max them.
I like the fact that we have to use the entire roster. One day we will get there. But with all the events and new toons I can’t get the guild motivated for such low rewards.
@CG_SBCrumb
To sum up all responses:
1) The RNG in phases 1&3 is very annoying
2)Heroic rewards and time/reward ratio is fine on its current state.
3)Rewards in tiers 1-6 are abysmal and the time/rewards ratio is demoralizing. You seriously need to either significantly boost rewards in those tiers or significantly reduce the time needed to complete them. Tier 6 could lose half it’s health pool and it would still be hard and challenging but it would finish in a reasonable time frame and would save the soul crushing need to get in every single day and do 5 fights.
4) The look and feel of the raid is amazing as are the animations. Sadly this get lost in the daily slog if you’re not doing heroic.
We tried t6 at launch, immediately canceled after seeing less than 2percent damage dealt with most of the guild attacking. Tried 5 and slogged through over a week to complete. Now on a 2 tier 4 then tier 5 rotation to keep tickets in check.
In a 105mil gp guild. Only about 10 have jtr, then they use the usual already stated teams if they have them.
I only have troopers "decent" for their respective phase. No jtr, deathtrooper, ns, or blah blah for me as of yet. My only other chars "decent" for this monstrosity are zcls, raid zolo, fulcrum, zylo and zthrawn. I have no interest in investing in the multiple chars and/or squads needed to even put a dent in the other phases nor do I have the resources.
I'm an officer and can't get myself motivated to do this raid much less care if anyone else does. Due to the fact that reward doesn't match investment only about 35 to 40 people contribute and I honestly can't blame them.
The raid at 4 takes us over 2 days to complete and at 5 just at 5 days. Its constantly on cue and never seems to be over. No breaks have beaten morale to a pulp.
I generally don't care for any raids due to the fact, that in my 2 and half year experience, rewards for me have been very, very, very garbage like in every aspect of the game. I only do them to help the guild out and to get coins to spend on gear I actually need.
But thank you for trying, I think they might have a few in my guild that actually try and/or enjoy the raid. For me, it's boring. Imo not challenging just overcharged with health and tenacity and like everyone is saying, nihilus is just flatout rank.
We have received a wide range of feedback about the newest raid, The Sith Triumvirate and we would like to hear more about your experience. Please include the following information in addition to your feedback:
What tier or tiers did you play?
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
-Tier 5 (Takes us 3-4 days)
-Guild GP-103 Million
-Too many teams to really list. But ive used the standard JTR team, DT teams, Nightsister etc.
-Nothing. The gear is terrible, takes too long.
- Phase 2 & 3 are ok. Phase 1 & 4 are tedious. Honestly the entire raid is not fun. Seems like a guild would need to have 50 JTR teams to even remotely have a shot at Heroic which isnt realistic for MOST guilds.
- What tier or tiers did you play?
We play t4 and t2 rotation, to ensure not to lose tickets
- What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
42m GP guild
- What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
As a 1.7m gp player what ever i have at g12, g11 an some g10 heroes...
- What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Part of raid that motivated me - NONE
Part of raid that demotivated me - p1, p4 and continuously repeating the raid, loop without end, nihilus, nihilus and again nihilus. It is apsurd that we as guild need 2 or 3 refreshes for two phases, and two phases (2nd and 3rd) we finish within one refresh (t4), no balance whatsoever. Blod sucking time consuming mother in law... I did it just for the guild tokens, i need them to buy gear, and after 6 days of being bullied by nihilus i get just the amount to buy 30% of a prototype... NOT A WHOLE GEAR...
And who wrote those "Intended for"?!?!? What are those for, a month of playing one raid?!?
We clear HAAT WITHIN 2h...but this.. Just do something, at lower tier nihilus should have less healt, and i am not talking about 10%, i am talking about 50%, why, cause JTR is very rare in gilds that are 50 mil and below.
One queastion for you. How can you make something that depend so much on one hero (p1) and let it the same to all players. Thats what tiers are for, to make difference betwven strong and weak, but nooo you did it the same for everyone...
- What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Whell i think i answer that un previous q.
Sorry for my english.
Best regards.
Edited for language, let's not refer to the devs like that, thanks! - EA_Cian
I think with just a few tweaks the raid would be fine.
1. lower the insane health for non heroic.
2. lower the tenacity gain. it has seriously crippled 60-70% of all toons in the game.
3. rewards are a joke in non heroic.
I'm in a 90mil guild. we can do t6 but its dumb to do because it takes a week for no rewards. so we do t4 for crappy rewards. everyone sighs when we launch.
Our guild has done T4, T5, and T6. We started with a T6 and quickly figured out we shouldn't bother with Heroic. We've mostly been running T4. We just did a T5 this week to see how much worse it was.
I've tried running Jedi, Phoenix Squad, Empire (Palpatine lead and Thrawn lead), Resistance, Rebels, First Order, Droids, and just teams of random characters.
[*] What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
I literally cannot do damage with Nihilus with most of my teams. Even when I can it's minimal. Even when things DO work, Nihilus just randomly does or doesn't use his annihilate when he should. Meaning that Phases 1 and 4 are completely random. The extra tenacity in each phase basically rules out Resistance and Palpatine lead Empire teams, which are two of my three best teams. My rebels team using Commander Luke Skywalker, Biggs, Wedge, Lando, and ST Han or raid Han is literally the only team that can put up anything resembling damage in most phases. The entire raid feels like I'm slowly just getting ground to a pulp while making no progress. Everything feels tuned around 3 teams that all need to be G12. My characters that are G10 die fast and do little to no damage. My G12 toons are all debuff reliant, which means they're useless against the bosses 100% tenacity.
[*] What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Anihilus ignoring protection was a neat idea. It makes healers useful and wasn't completely degenerate. The cycle of pain debuff in Phase 2 was fun to manage. Phase 2 is hands down my favorite part. Managing damage out versus your damage in was a neat idea. Phase 3 is annoying, but manageable. The bonds of weakness thing isn't really fun, but doesn't make me want to throw my phone either. It feels balanced in P3.
Phase 1 and Phase 4 are completely and utterly degenerate. Nihilus is nearly impossible to damage with his protection. It's completely unnecessary mechanic that makes an already bad phase worse. The annihilate is completely inconsistent. I've had it come off cooldown and him not use it. Repeatedly.
Phase 4 is just a mess of mechanics. You have all the terribleness of Nihilus with bonus stuff to make it even harder. It's completely silly. Traya is frustrating on her own, but doable. Having all the mechanics thrown together is just horrible. It's impossible to manage and requires basically just out gearing and powering through it. Everything just piles up and stacks way, way too fast. It's far too punishing.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
About 55 mil GP
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Tried a bunch of combinations from JTR/Resistance, CLS/Wiggs/Chaze, to NS and Ewoks. I had hoped the BH rework would add a dimension, but it didn't.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated: KotOR era characters, something new that I can participate with my guild in.
Demotivated: The whole thing. It sucks a lot of time to try and do P1 & P4. P1 is RNG. It feels like there's no team/strategy to the raid aside from just enduring the endless cycle. I like the game, but STR is just not worth my time. Rather than not contribute I just choose what squads will earn any damage and hit auto. The rewards offer me nothing to try and get a better spot. I don't actually care about what rewards I get. That's how unmotivated I am. Rancor? HAAT? Yea, those rewards I care about because they're actually worthwhile. STR? Not really.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
I like that it involves characters from the KotOR era.
I dislike that I watched any of the initial strategies changed almost immediately (Expose, Traya triggering damage abilities, etc). Low rewards for *WAY* too much effort put in. I'm looking at a long time before my guild will even begin to be able to start the slow grind to unlock Traya. I just got GK unlocked after being in my guild a few months, and that's great! Now I see this new raid character and it's going to take a year or more before I can begin another grind.
1. T3/T2
2. 50mil GP
3. FO, CLS Han R2, zfinn, empire
4. Since p1 is more or less a heat check on "do you have enough RJTs", we decided as a guild not to even bother with t4 anymore. We had been running t4 but it would take 4-5 days to clear. The grind of p1 and p4 was taking a toll on morale and we would rather focus our efforts on keeping people participating in TB/TW than bothering them every day to hit with raid. Now we do t2/t3 strictly for currency. The rewards are so unequal to the effort level at all tiers minus heroic they require neither discussion nor reflection.
5. I dont have a problem with the difficulty, nor the requirement for RJT as a bottleneck to progress. She was the newest released hero, and this raid definitely made her a must farm. Right before the raid dropping, I remember people posting that the vet farm was simply not worth it since Palp would dethrone her in arena so what was the point of farming her. I'm glad she has uber utility because it makes her farm worth it. What I do have a problem with is poor design, specifically with P1 and the general RNGness of this raid. There is absolutely 0 enjoyment from having to restart 10 times after the 2nd toon goes because the shield didnt land on the right person in p1. There is absolutely 0 enjoyment when the shield lands on the right person, but one roll of the dice not going your way over the course of the next 30-40 dice rolls turns a respectable score into a restart. This is just bad design, plain and simple. If I wanted to gamble on dice rolls, I'd go to a casino where my money could actually turn into something other than frustrating restarts and non-existent enjoyment. There was a balance in the previous raids between RNG and performance, specifically you could have an alright run of luck and still post respectable numbers. This raid is the equivalent of trying to beat the hardest level in Guitar Hero. One wrong move over the course of an entire song and it's all sunk. That's not what this game was intended to be, and it's a shame that's the direction this raid went. There is some very positive risk/reward mechanics that are truly enjoyable and very fun within p2, but those wins are drowned by the requirement of perfect RNG like a sailor hearing the siren calling to the beach. Truly a shame in it's current state, a real opportunity missed.
We are 149 mil GP and we crush the heroic sith raid. We have implemented a 12 hour pre reg hold because we can beat it quickly. We love the raid, no so much at first lol. And definitely did not like the nerf to rewards. They are the best rewards in the game so please keep as is. I’m 8 more raids away from unlocking traya and can’t wait!! One of our top players just unlocked her yesterday. We are very happy for him and are getting great feedback from him.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
94m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I use mostly a rebel team (CLS, Princess Leia, R2D2, with Stormtrooper Han / Old Ben / BB8 depending on the phase). It performs well in the second and third phase.
I have been working hard on a Nihilus (L) Sith team, but most of the Sith available to me aren't performing very well so far. It seemed like a strong team for phase 1, but is falling short.
I also have an old Droid team from around the time of Jawa Engineer coming out, with Nebit / HK47(L) / 86 / 88 - they perform alright on every phase.
As a note, I generally run the raid on Auto; there's always a raid going and I don't have time to actually play out the attempts. I miss some days altogether, but most of the time I'll play out one or two attacks with my best team or two.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
I get demotivated by the fact that it's endless, all day every day, with 5 attacks each day. It's far too much. I get motivated by the cool new abilities that replace the old "retreat" ability (which I hated and never used) and enjoy battling the Sith Triumvirate, as the encounters are fairly diverse and definitely interesting.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
To add to my answer to the previous question, I dislike the rewards. I have to put in 5 attacks each day for several days, and receive next to nothing. Territory battles are less work than this, and about ten times the rewards. Why we bother, I can't quite figure out.
Although it integrates extremely badly into the rest of the game by demanding tons of extra time and rewarding next to nothing, the raid itself is amazing. It's been beautifully designed, visually and mechanically. Battling the Sith Triumvirate here is a reward in and of itself. There couldn't possibly have been a better raid developed at this time, and the theme is of great taste. Well done, bravo.
Now give us a reason to do it, and stop making us do it five times a day.
Edit: As a note, a lot of people seem to complain about tenacity, Raid Nihilus in general, and some other raid mechanics. I imagine that's to be expected, but I feel like it's nice that this raid doesn't have the usual obvious counters (like TMR-ing into oblivion). I'm grateful that we have to develop new strategies, and there's no clean-cut way to deal with these threats. Makes it a ton more interesting.
Mostly tier 4 raids
92 million gp.
I have tried many teams with my akbar lead and imperial troopers being my best.
Pros: tier 2 and 3 have enjoyable mechanics.
Cons: I can top damage in p1 but it is so much harder than phase 2 and 3(they give damage boosts) that by the time I can attack again those 2 phases are cleared and I have no chance to end in top 3. Raid is set up to encourage people to sit back and wait for easier phases to max out damage.
Solutions: unbreakable will reflects damage if annihilate is used against that target. Not all damage, but a lot of damage. Would make p1 and 4 more enjoyable and allow for people to keep up in damage with other phases if they are being careful.
Thank you for your time!
Most parts of the raid are fun, I just always get stuck with p1 and p4 which both suck.
Hey dev team, appreciate the effort to listen to us complain.
1. 60M guild, running T3 raids now, tried a few T4 but just took too long. Even on T3 our raid tickets sit on max for a few days before we can clear.
2. Running the JTR and NS teams mainly, but truly it is any/every thing available. Having some luck with Thrawn lead and Wedge lead.
3. Personally, I enjoy trying to beat my score everyday, keep a log etc..., and this is not that difficult in P2 and P3. However, in P1 this could mean 4 or 5 retreats. So now my “daily allowance” of game time is up. Im 45 years old, so this isnt like a forced thing, but rwl life exists.
4. The worst part of the raid is that it force drains the energy out of every memeber of the guild. We went from 90ish% participation at launch, down to 40% participation on a great day, normally 20%.
5. I totally get that you guys wanted to design a raid that could not be auto played. I say, keep that aspect, but change the damage ratios or maybe the rewards. If this raid were a stand alone game, you guys would have knocked it out of the park. But this is one raid, in a game with three raids, territory wars, territory battles, arena, ship arena, daily challenges, ship challenges, galactic war, special events....hopefully you are getting the picture.
6. Also, the Boba contract is basically not a factor. I saw my first chance to even take a swat at it today in Phase 1, but DN was one turn from enrage, so why bother? Small thing, doesnt really make a difference, but these contracts were touted as a big deal, and they dont really work in this raid.
7. Keep up the good work. We are like Soldiers.... if we are not complaining then something is wrong.
Our current rotation is that we are alternating between Tier 4 and Tier 5 while the guild is building up the Heroic Teams.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
We have 49 members and are at 103 Million GP
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
All of them in the intitial weeks. I eventually settled on several teams depending on the phase. The teams I use the most are the JTR P1 team, OG Nightsisters, KRU First Order, a version of Chex Mix, Troopers, and Phoenix are all options I use most often.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
The complexity and challenge are both motivators and demoralizing factors. I love that it's a challenge and requires complete guild readiness and participation. What I didn't like was this sense of the Raid being a moving target for a while as CG kept adjusting it.
What about the raid did you enjoy?
Challenge and ability to use a variety of teams I wouldn't have used otherwise.
What did you dislike about the raid?
Rewards seem light considering the effort. Nihilus HP is annoying, and Phase 4 Traya gets to enrage far too quickly for my tastes.
What tier or tiers did you play? - T7 (heroic)
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? - ~123M first time passing heroic
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? - P1 : RJT, P2 : Imperial Troopers, Phoenix, Sith, Nute/Leia/Acolyte, Wampa. P3 : Chex team, Rolo team, P4 : NS, and rest of the bench
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? - Were it not for the Traya shards.........
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? -There is absolutely nothing enjoyable about the raid , except the end! One of the most frustrating aspects of this game is rng... period! So you go and develop a raid that revolves around and is predicated by rng? This is what you consider good game development and enjoyable game play?? Well it isn’t.... not at all. I enjoy raids, love trying new teams and finding OP comps but all of that is negated in this raid, the only thing I look forward to is a 7* Treya so I can take a zero in this horrible experience you call a raid.
Same here. It is a lazy design to leave it to RNG to decide the ourcome of so many tries, tries, and more tries even after your have the right G12 teams and decent MODs..... You planners and designers think we have no real lives to live in?
We have received a wide range of feedback about the newest raid, The Sith Triumvirate and we would like to hear more about your experience. Please include the following information in addition to your feedback:
What tier or tiers did you play?
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Firstly, good to see you guys taking serious feedback on this. I would like to say "I'll keep this brief" but...you know...
At the moment my guild of 100mil (was 110mil but greener pastures and all that Trayas) is doing T5 with the occasional T4 just when we need a break. T4 is done in around 16 hours, T5 5-7 days depending on participation.
My usual teams are JTR, NS, and Imp Troopers. At T5 I can still use a dot team of Zader, Bobba, Zidious, Wampa, Shaman because dots still apply. I have doubts on the viability of that side at a higher level. My 5th team is usually a rotation of whoever I want to try. Rebels, Sith, Random mixes etc.
Right now my only real motivation is that I come first every time. Rewards are horrible but atleast they're better than other members are getting.
There's a lot about the raid that is demotivating.
1) Massive health pools drawing out the raid. I get the idea of wanting it to be a guild wide raid, but asking people to do 25-30 battles per raid is more than a guild wide activity. It's a chore.
2) DN. This guy is horrible. Ignores protection, gains protection, but the worst part about him is annihilate. Even when you successfully shield yourself you often can't recover health to make it worthwhile. Even with a healer, when DN drops your cooldowns right after annihilate you're done.
2A) The DN side effect. The first day everyone hits the raid, the second day very few people hit the raid because they don't want to be the ones who use up their attempts and miss out on p2/p3. Same thing happens at the beginning of P4. This definitely adds to the dragging out of the raid.
DN is horrible. Sorry to say it again, he really just is.
3) Resets. It's a complicated mechanic especially with DN and it leads to frustration and restarting. This just drags everything out further.
4) Demotivated guild. Hard to stay motivated when everyone is always complaining about the raid. I quit as an officer not long after the raid came out. I really tried to help my guild get through HAAT long ago but couldn't do it with this raid when I myself had so little interest in it.
5) Time sink. By the time we finish a T5 we have enough tickets to start again. Sometimes we do a T4 to give us a rest, but this raid is staring us in the face all day every day. You just did QOL updates and then added a raid that adds 20-30 minutes a day at least. I know you value engagement, but this is ridiculous.
6) It's not really fun. For so many reasons that I've listed. There's no feeling of "I want to do this raid" there's only a feeling of "I need to do this raid".
What I like and don't like...
1) Squads. I actually enjoy the fact that it makes me use toons and squads I haven't previously. However, it also makes the gear crunch (and horrible raid rewards) stand out even more. In Rancor/HAAT you usually had 2-3 toons ready to go and that meant to get a viable team you were focusing on 1-2 toons at a time.
This raid is built for squads with synergy. Few other combos work. You're not only forcing people to upgrade to g12 without releaving the gear crunch, but now they're required to focus on 3-5 toons at a time instead.
2) I like that each phase has something different about it, but I don't like how so many toons are essentially rendered useless due to there being too many effects being blocked. I imagine it's a logistics nightmare trying to get the balance right, but despite the differences in phases it does feel like the teams you can use have been pre-determined for you.
3) I hate everything DN, but you probably already guessed that.
My Biggest Complaint though....
This game is a grind, we know that and accept that, but there always needs to be a light at the end of the tunnel. I hated what you guys tried to do with Talzin/Wicket, but I understand the need to experiment. The reason I hated it was because generally a difficult to get toon was a 6 month grind. That's a long time, but it's close enough for us to see that light in the distance.
What you guys tried to do with Talzin/Wicket essentially removed that light which is why so many were upset about it.
Now look at the raid. Guilds filled with players who have been around for 18-24+ months are struggling to finish the raid in a reasonable time and then get rewards that don't even help them level the toons to get them to the next tier. 2+ years of grinding nearly every single day, and now there's no light in the distance. There's nothing more demotivating than that.
Again, appreciate you opening up this thread for debate. Hopefully you get some good feedback that helps you find the right balance between the companies needs and the player base.
I'm the guild leader of a relaxed 35mil GP guild that sees a lot of low to mid level players come through. We typically play tier 3, occasionally popping up to tier 4. As many of stated, the time sink is just not worth the effort. I'm having trouble getting even my officers to participate in phase 1 and phase 4... judging by their low scores, I'd say they are auto-battling or not doing a full five runs a day. It's incredibly frustrating because I'm almost soloing phase 1 over a couple of days, but as soon as we hit phase 2 everyone starts playing and we typically clear 2 and 3 within hours. Then everyone goes back to hibernating and I and a handful of others slog through phase 4. The rewards are nowhere near worth the grind, and I understand why my guild gives up, but I feel obligated as guild leader to finish. Definitely feels like a chore, unfortunately. If the phases were balanced better I think people would be more interested. Thanks for asking!
What tier or tiers did you play? Tiers 4 & 5 but will drop to finish lower for store tickets
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? 110 Million
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? Imperial Troopers, NS, BH, Rebel, FO, empire
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? Enjoy P2 P3 Hit auto and hate hate hate P1. P4 is also not enjoyable
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? Great art, P2 & P3 are actually enjoyable to try different teams. P1 & P4 are not fun and should be reworked. Rewards do not reflect the difficulty and being equal to the investment made. Fix P1 and P4 to make them enjoyable.
What tier or tiers did you play?
1-4 were staying at tier 2 right now cuz we can farm it in a day
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
75m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
random teams mainly ones suggested by youtubers we trust for raiding
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
nothing about this raid motivated us as a guild. this raid demotivated as a guild completely
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
we dont enjoy the raid what so ever. we launch the highest tier we can farm in a day so we can get rewards.
the effort in plus the rewards just dont equal out. we lost members that have been loyal to us for a year to join a heroic guild since we cant complete it nor are we close. this raid has gave us a high turn over rate lately.
i think this raid would be better if it just had a normal and a heroic. the fact i launch a 2 star raid. but i need to have 7 star gear 12 toons to beat it to be rewarded with low tier gear.....makes no sense if this raid was completely taken out of the game we would be happy.
The raid is so demotivating for the whole guild. This is because its so hard. Were doing tier 5 and it takes 9 refreshes atm. Every change it seems is a nerf, which just makes it harder. Nihilus' health needs to be reduced in tiers 1 & 4. Tier 4 is just the hardest. And the near requirement that a RJT team is needed makes it a near requirement to have her to join a raid focussed guild. This is bad for the game overall.
What tier or tiers did you play? T5,6,Heroic
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? 120m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? jtr,zader,it,hoda,ns,bh,jawa e,fo,ackbar/nute,cls
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? i already didn't like backing out and trying again to get a good score in T5/6. then we tried heroic and everyone spent hours trying to get scores good enough to get through p1. i don't know who finds it fun to back out and try again over and over but I don't, and most of our guild doesn't. we don't have that kind of time to play the game.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? I LOVE THAT I CAN USE MANY DIFFERENT TOONS. THE GAME IS WAY BETTER NOW THAT NON WHALES ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE DECENT SIZED ROSTERS AND PLACES TO USE MANY DIFFERENT AND WEAKER TOONS. but then theres the bad.... i think the biggest problem is that even if you do learn the mechanics, and you micromanage the battle, randomness can still kill you. which make you have to back out and retry. that is not fun. i don't mind losing cause I mess up. I do mind losing cause Nihilus took 3 turns that round instead of 2. or he decided to hit the same toon 3 times in a row but normally doesn't. there is just nothing fun about that. i don't like that the heroic tier is really only for super modded toons.
there is only one important thing to mention regarding this raid. The rewards are total crap and an absolute joke. For the time and energy required, the rewards need to be much higher. This raid is tearing apart guilds for no reason other than that the rewards suck and some higher level players want Traya shards but can't get them. We are a relatively free to play guild, and this is a huge problem for us.
Replies
- What tier or tiers did you play?
- What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
- What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
- What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
- What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
[/quote]Since the start we have played tiers 4,6&heroic
Currently our GP is down to 70ish million, 35 members. Several have quit, others left for stronger guilds so they wouldn't have to try as hard. Attempting Heroic requires a ton of coordination from the officers and the members have to be ready to go as soon as needed (within hours at least)
Usual teams - JTR, NS, troopers, semi-chex mix, sink
Since the first raid nothing has motivated us to do much. Traya shards would be nice but we are no longer able to attempt heroic. Other tiers rewards are garbage vs. effort when a far lesser effort in rancor or HAAT yields the same or better.
Now, nothing. It is a tedious grind. P2, P3 and P4 can have moments. P1 is poorly designed IMO. The mechanics are silly.
I’ve played tier 5 & 6
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
I’ve been in 3 guilds since the release of the Sith raid. GPs ranging from 110-125m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
This would be a very large number of teams to completely answer. I’ll try to answer as best as I can. First Order (KRU lead), EP lead Empire and Sith teams, Phoenix, Wampanader, Nute Cheese, Imperial Troopers, Nightsister, QGJ lead jedi, Bounty Hunters, Chex Mix, Various Rebel teams.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
The absolute biggest demotivation was opening the reward box after completing the first raid. I found it to be insulting compensation for the amount of time I invested. I wanted to not participate any more as a message to CG about the raid. It ultimately led to me leaving a guild I had been with for over two years. I found another guild that was ok with me not parity.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
I don’t find anything about the raid to be enjoyable. I dislike the amount of health the non-heroic tiers have. I dislike the amount of effective characters a player has as options (JTR being the only viable option). I dislike the stacking tenacity and speed the raid targets have, effectively removing debuffs as a strategy. I dislike the rewards for non-heroic tiers. I dislike the amount of turmoil the raid has caused the community. I dislike having to restart the raid everytime my guild finishes because we can’t finish the raid before we generate enough tickets to start another.
I truly hope this feedback leads to positive changes. I also would like to say that while I may seem very negative in my feedback, I was as honest as I could be. One positive of the last few months has been CG Carrie. I very much respect what she has tried to do. I am not a fan of these forums. I prefer Reddit for various reasons. But I am posting here in the hopes that she sees it and am confident it will reflect the discussion that has already been happening on Reddit which I know she has seen.
My guild can't decide on a tier--though we've been running three most regularly--and initially tried to start with five, if I remember correctly. We abandoned that and moved down to either three of four, abandoned that and moved down to two, finished that, moved up to three, stayed at three until the reward rework hit, did two fours (though only finished one while the rework was alive; the GET were nice, the rest wasn't). When the reward rework was removed we moved back to three, eventually got fed up with three and moved down to two--did three in like a week and ran out of tickets--then moved back up to three waiting for our tickets to max out again (though nagging people to auto it now means we finish three much faster than we had been, so eh).
We're currently 43,603,348. We have players ranging from level 85 and 2.1 million to level 78 and 285 thousand (with one carry-on member at level 59 and 54.9 thousand). I'm currently at 85 and just under 1.1 million GP; I'm probably about average, or slightly above for my guild.
I usually just auto it with various teams I've collected while working towards my legendary characters. Phoenix, my Empire/Sith arena team (seems to be my most consistent damage), First Order, my baby Imperial troopers, my baby Wiggs team, my HAAT/rancor raid teams, other various teams as whimsy strikes--ANH, Bounty Hunters, baby Nightsisters--etc. I just haven't cared enough about this raid, or Traya, to bend over or change what I'm farming to build teams specifically for this raid; though I probably will once I finish building TB/TW teams, which will help my guild more and which is my next long-term project (not that you asked).
The only thing we really get out of this raid is an extra infusion of guild currency; the rewards are nothing to write home about, and the raid itself simply isn't enjoyable. We know we're far from being able to take on Heroic, and we dislike/resent the new raid enough we've lowered the tier we do down to a point we can auto it for that extra infusion of currency.
We don't aim higher, though we certainly could, simply because we dislike the raid.
Phase two is the only thing I like; that sort of risk/reward play is fun.
Dislike? Pretty much everything else.
I can only speak for myself: it's tedious. Sure, at first it was new, exciting, challenging, but it got old very quickly. Nihilus is a lot of that--the way he hits through protection, has and regenerates his own, the stacking speed and tenacity, the way he steals debuffs, timing the raid-skill (that the AI apparently can't/won't use on auto)--but he isn't the whole of the problem. The massive amounts of health, the unenjoyable--though Phase 2 can be fun, sometimes--and overdeveloped mechanics, the way getting a proper run--with decent numbers--can take so much time, repetition and attention. It's just not fun. It's overwrought, overdesigned, and persnickety. I've been able to pay less attention in WoW heroic raids, and had much more fun, in roughly the same amount of time I would spend on this raid without autoing it.
That was a classic MMO with lots of hardcore nerds. This is a mobile game. Hm.
I don't mind being challenged, but it better be fun, or it better be worth the rewards. This is neither (and I'll take fun over rewards).
Edit: don't you hate it when you push the wrong button? And forget words. I give up, enough forums for today.
1. Tried Tier 6, moved to Tier 5, moved to Tier 4 gave up and only do Tier 3 and 2 now.
2. 63 mil
3. Varies with each player. Only 3 people in guild have JTR.
Phase 1: Emprie with MagmaTrooper, zFinn Resistance, NS with zombie, Wiggs/ZCLS/Raid Han, Leia, BH
Phase 2: Emprie, Troopers, zFinn Resistance, BH, FO Kylo UM, temper tantrum Kylo, Phasma, FOO, FOTP
Phase 3: same as phase 2
Phase 4: same as phase 1
4. Phase 1 and Phase 4: Nihilus is too much. He holds his charge for no apparent reason. He force drains way too often. Is is made to be a bigger coward than GG. Phase 4 is just pure garbage with Traya shortening her enrage time because, reasons. We have purely given up with higher raid content because it’s easier to play tier 2 and 3 and buy gear from the Raid token store.
Demotivater is the absolute narrow character range for use in the raid that are practical. Rey performs better than CLS. That’s a problem when Rey is locked behind a 28k crystal refresh for 2 useless vets. Rewards are horrible for effort asked.
Motivator was Sion and Traya stand alone fights in phase 2 and 3. Those are actually fun. Raid in general is not an auto fight. You have to control your characters and highly involved fights.
5. See answer to 4. Rewards are terrible. Don’t even try to lessen the rewards in HAAT and HPit to make STR look more appealing, either. I would 100% be happy with more raid tokens rewards and similar credits to buy gear from Raid Store, than have the gear in the rewards Tier 1-4.
2. 125M
3. P1 jtr; p2 empire, phoenix, ackbar leia; p3 chexmix; p4 nightsisters and zerg
4. The raid was very demotivating until we beat heroic. The first two times we tried heroic we got stuck at p3. The third time we were stuck at p4 with like 2 hours to go and not progressing. I went to work out and when I checked back there was 40 minutes left and we had Sion at 30%. We managed to beat it with 15 minutes left. The next time we tried, 3 days later, we beat it in 27 hours and it's been less than that since. Honestly a majority of it was mental. Once we knew we could beat it it got easier. HOWEVER. The RNG is insane in the battles and makes it a pain to do. Having to restart 10+ times per battle is very tedious. There is so much to keep track of, especially the nihilis fights. Another complaint would be t6. It is just too much of a time sink. As others have said by the time you can beat t6 you should be able to beat t7. They have sooo much health. I would suggest reducing the health or maybe removing one of the mechanics each phase. Have nihilus not ignore protection at t6. Something, it's just not worthwhile. I think t6 is harder than t7, just you have infinite time to do it. I will say now that the raid is on farm I enjoy it mostly. RNG is still annoying in a battle but since I know we can win I don't have to worry about getting the perfect run every time.
What tier or tiers did you play? T4
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? about 83 million gp
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
- 3 jtr teams in the guild, only one actively plays the raid because of time commitment
- ns for p4
- pretty much everthing for p2 and 3
- jawa engineer for p1 as long with pretty much every other team because of the lack of jtr
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
- p2 and 3 are fun
- p1 and 4 are a struggle in every run
- my single jtr team does about double the dmg in 1 run than the 2. place in 5
- rewards for time commitment makes guildies not even try at the moment
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
- i really like the look and the animations
- p2 and 3 are some kind of different stuff that make fun and at least in t4 is approachable by a lot of variety of teams
- p1 is fun IF you have jtr
- p4 seems to be the worst for us beause of lack of good nightsister squads
- p4 also takes at least 2 resets and it is getting longer
- we barely reached the point to finish the raid before losing tickets to the cap
this has changed now
even though people get better geared teams and their damage goes up the participation goes down
it is really time consuming and a lot of people start just autoing if they do the 5 battles at all
so our finish time actually goes up at the moment and not down
(best case scenario is a participation of 40/49 while having 10+ listed with like 200k to 1million damage > moste likely some auto runs)
a lot of people seem to not understand nihilus mechanics in most of the scenarios and are not investing numerous restart attempts on a daily basis, because this raid is like running 24/7 because of the time it takes to finish
the rewards for the time investment especially p4 and to some extent p1 are demotivating for a lot of people
i am place 1 with like two times to three times the damage of place 2 because of having the only jtr team that plays actively (meaning having the time to manually fight the sith raid every day in addition to tw, tb, other raids, events)
We are kind of lazily repeating tier 2 for anyone who is bored after they finish their dailies. Because why bother when it takes days on end of slogging for a bit of guild credit and useless challenge gear? It would take at least heroic Rancor level rewards for even tier 2 to be worth the effort to take seriously. And a lot more than that to muck through tier 3 or 4 again.
I personally think the mechanics have the potential to be excellent, although my guild says boring. But I think their boredom is just a response to the slog. Cut HP by 50-70% (ie: to 1/3 or 1/2 of where it is) and it would be a good trade off for the prizes and the effort; decent damage reward for clever play could make the mechanics shine through.
It’s also sad that there doesn’t seem to be anything to build towards. In tank, it was exciting to build the teams that could do damage. I spent months knowing that if I just put together the right team, I could do something significant. That carried me through building Princess Zody, and Chirpatine, and finally Resistance and my Big Mix. There are none of those teams in Sith. I’ve got my JTR team; beyond that, what do I strive for?
So: rewards that aren’t worth the effort, mechanics that are buried by the sheer hit points you have to slog through, and all the clever team builds that got nerfed instead of celebrated.
It’s demoralizing. And it is especially frustrating because I can see what it could have been! It was SO CLOSE!
T5 & 6
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
I’ve been in three guilds since the launch of the raid. GPs ranging from 115-125m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
First Order, Empire, Sith, Jedi, Nightsisters, Bounty Hunters, Wampanader, Nute Cheese, Chex Mix
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you?
The absolute biggest demotivation was opening the reward box after finishing the first raid. I found it to be insulting compared to the time spent. It untimately led to leaving a guild I had been in for over two years. I didn’t want to raid the Sith raid.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
There is nothing about the raid I enjoy.
I dislike the amount of health the non-heroic tiers have. I dislike the non-heroic rewards. I dislike the lack of diversity in effective teams especially since this is a collection game. I have a +3 million GP and I can’t contribute to the raid because I don’t have one character (JTR). I dislike the stacking tenacity and speed of the raid enemies. Removing debuffs as a strategy. I dislike having to do the raid every day since it was released because it has so much health my guild can’t finish before we regenerate enough tickets to start another. I dislike the turmoil it has caused the community.
My feedback is very negative. I would like to finish with something positive. I find CG Carrie to be genuinely caring for the game and I believe that she wants it to be better. Thank you for your efforts. I hope this feedback and the feedback where this was started on Reddit can be used to improve the raid.
Tier 3. Guild GP 58m
Wiggs rebels, nightsisters, Phoenix, Jawas, Sith.
Just a time drain phase 1 and 4. Can’t get the guild motivated to hit it everyday or dedicate resources for such low payout in rewards. Are guild is sitting on 38 members and I can only get 5 to hit. Wind up throwing tickets away because we can’t beat it before we max them.
I like the fact that we have to use the entire roster. One day we will get there. But with all the events and new toons I can’t get the guild motivated for such low rewards.
To sum up all responses:
1) The RNG in phases 1&3 is very annoying
2)Heroic rewards and time/reward ratio is fine on its current state.
3)Rewards in tiers 1-6 are abysmal and the time/rewards ratio is demoralizing. You seriously need to either significantly boost rewards in those tiers or significantly reduce the time needed to complete them. Tier 6 could lose half it’s health pool and it would still be hard and challenging but it would finish in a reasonable time frame and would save the soul crushing need to get in every single day and do 5 fights.
4) The look and feel of the raid is amazing as are the animations. Sadly this get lost in the daily slog if you’re not doing heroic.
In a 105mil gp guild. Only about 10 have jtr, then they use the usual already stated teams if they have them.
I only have troopers "decent" for their respective phase. No jtr, deathtrooper, ns, or blah blah for me as of yet. My only other chars "decent" for this monstrosity are zcls, raid zolo, fulcrum, zylo and zthrawn. I have no interest in investing in the multiple chars and/or squads needed to even put a dent in the other phases nor do I have the resources.
I'm an officer and can't get myself motivated to do this raid much less care if anyone else does. Due to the fact that reward doesn't match investment only about 35 to 40 people contribute and I honestly can't blame them.
The raid at 4 takes us over 2 days to complete and at 5 just at 5 days. Its constantly on cue and never seems to be over. No breaks have beaten morale to a pulp.
I generally don't care for any raids due to the fact, that in my 2 and half year experience, rewards for me have been very, very, very garbage like in every aspect of the game. I only do them to help the guild out and to get coins to spend on gear I actually need.
But thank you for trying, I think they might have a few in my guild that actually try and/or enjoy the raid. For me, it's boring. Imo not challenging just overcharged with health and tenacity and like everyone is saying, nihilus is just flatout rank.
-Tier 5 (Takes us 3-4 days)
-Guild GP-103 Million
-Too many teams to really list. But ive used the standard JTR team, DT teams, Nightsister etc.
-Nothing. The gear is terrible, takes too long.
- Phase 2 & 3 are ok. Phase 1 & 4 are tedious. Honestly the entire raid is not fun. Seems like a guild would need to have 50 JTR teams to even remotely have a shot at Heroic which isnt realistic for MOST guilds.
We play t4 and t2 rotation, to ensure not to lose tickets
- What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
42m GP guild
- What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
As a 1.7m gp player what ever i have at g12, g11 an some g10 heroes...
- What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Part of raid that motivated me - NONE
Part of raid that demotivated me - p1, p4 and continuously repeating the raid, loop without end, nihilus, nihilus and again nihilus. It is apsurd that we as guild need 2 or 3 refreshes for two phases, and two phases (2nd and 3rd) we finish within one refresh (t4), no balance whatsoever. Blod sucking time consuming mother in law... I did it just for the guild tokens, i need them to buy gear, and after 6 days of being bullied by nihilus i get just the amount to buy 30% of a prototype... NOT A WHOLE GEAR...
And who wrote those "Intended for"?!?!? What are those for, a month of playing one raid?!?
We clear HAAT WITHIN 2h...but this.. Just do something, at lower tier nihilus should have less healt, and i am not talking about 10%, i am talking about 50%, why, cause JTR is very rare in gilds that are 50 mil and below.
One queastion for you. How can you make something that depend so much on one hero (p1) and let it the same to all players. Thats what tiers are for, to make difference betwven strong and weak, but nooo you did it the same for everyone...
- What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Whell i think i answer that un previous q.
Sorry for my english.
Best regards.
Edited for language, let's not refer to the devs like that, thanks! - EA_Cian
1. lower the insane health for non heroic.
2. lower the tenacity gain. it has seriously crippled 60-70% of all toons in the game.
3. rewards are a joke in non heroic.
I'm in a 90mil guild. we can do t6 but its dumb to do because it takes a week for no rewards. so we do t4 for crappy rewards. everyone sighs when we launch.
Our guild GP is 106million.
I've tried running Jedi, Phoenix Squad, Empire (Palpatine lead and Thrawn lead), Resistance, Rebels, First Order, Droids, and just teams of random characters.
I literally cannot do damage with Nihilus with most of my teams. Even when I can it's minimal. Even when things DO work, Nihilus just randomly does or doesn't use his annihilate when he should. Meaning that Phases 1 and 4 are completely random. The extra tenacity in each phase basically rules out Resistance and Palpatine lead Empire teams, which are two of my three best teams. My rebels team using Commander Luke Skywalker, Biggs, Wedge, Lando, and ST Han or raid Han is literally the only team that can put up anything resembling damage in most phases. The entire raid feels like I'm slowly just getting ground to a pulp while making no progress. Everything feels tuned around 3 teams that all need to be G12. My characters that are G10 die fast and do little to no damage. My G12 toons are all debuff reliant, which means they're useless against the bosses 100% tenacity.
Anihilus ignoring protection was a neat idea. It makes healers useful and wasn't completely degenerate. The cycle of pain debuff in Phase 2 was fun to manage. Phase 2 is hands down my favorite part. Managing damage out versus your damage in was a neat idea. Phase 3 is annoying, but manageable. The bonds of weakness thing isn't really fun, but doesn't make me want to throw my phone either. It feels balanced in P3.
Phase 1 and Phase 4 are completely and utterly degenerate. Nihilus is nearly impossible to damage with his protection. It's completely unnecessary mechanic that makes an already bad phase worse. The annihilate is completely inconsistent. I've had it come off cooldown and him not use it. Repeatedly.
Phase 4 is just a mess of mechanics. You have all the terribleness of Nihilus with bonus stuff to make it even harder. It's completely silly. Traya is frustrating on her own, but doable. Having all the mechanics thrown together is just horrible. It's impossible to manage and requires basically just out gearing and powering through it. Everything just piles up and stacks way, way too fast. It's far too punishing.
Mostly 3, sometimes 4
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
About 55 mil GP
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Tried a bunch of combinations from JTR/Resistance, CLS/Wiggs/Chaze, to NS and Ewoks. I had hoped the BH rework would add a dimension, but it didn't.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated: KotOR era characters, something new that I can participate with my guild in.
Demotivated: The whole thing. It sucks a lot of time to try and do P1 & P4. P1 is RNG. It feels like there's no team/strategy to the raid aside from just enduring the endless cycle. I like the game, but STR is just not worth my time. Rather than not contribute I just choose what squads will earn any damage and hit auto. The rewards offer me nothing to try and get a better spot. I don't actually care about what rewards I get. That's how unmotivated I am. Rancor? HAAT? Yea, those rewards I care about because they're actually worthwhile. STR? Not really.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
I like that it involves characters from the KotOR era.
I dislike that I watched any of the initial strategies changed almost immediately (Expose, Traya triggering damage abilities, etc). Low rewards for *WAY* too much effort put in. I'm looking at a long time before my guild will even begin to be able to start the slow grind to unlock Traya. I just got GK unlocked after being in my guild a few months, and that's great! Now I see this new raid character and it's going to take a year or more before I can begin another grind.
2. 50mil GP
3. FO, CLS Han R2, zfinn, empire
4. Since p1 is more or less a heat check on "do you have enough RJTs", we decided as a guild not to even bother with t4 anymore. We had been running t4 but it would take 4-5 days to clear. The grind of p1 and p4 was taking a toll on morale and we would rather focus our efforts on keeping people participating in TB/TW than bothering them every day to hit with raid. Now we do t2/t3 strictly for currency. The rewards are so unequal to the effort level at all tiers minus heroic they require neither discussion nor reflection.
5. I dont have a problem with the difficulty, nor the requirement for RJT as a bottleneck to progress. She was the newest released hero, and this raid definitely made her a must farm. Right before the raid dropping, I remember people posting that the vet farm was simply not worth it since Palp would dethrone her in arena so what was the point of farming her. I'm glad she has uber utility because it makes her farm worth it. What I do have a problem with is poor design, specifically with P1 and the general RNGness of this raid. There is absolutely 0 enjoyment from having to restart 10 times after the 2nd toon goes because the shield didnt land on the right person in p1. There is absolutely 0 enjoyment when the shield lands on the right person, but one roll of the dice not going your way over the course of the next 30-40 dice rolls turns a respectable score into a restart. This is just bad design, plain and simple. If I wanted to gamble on dice rolls, I'd go to a casino where my money could actually turn into something other than frustrating restarts and non-existent enjoyment. There was a balance in the previous raids between RNG and performance, specifically you could have an alright run of luck and still post respectable numbers. This raid is the equivalent of trying to beat the hardest level in Guitar Hero. One wrong move over the course of an entire song and it's all sunk. That's not what this game was intended to be, and it's a shame that's the direction this raid went. There is some very positive risk/reward mechanics that are truly enjoyable and very fun within p2, but those wins are drowned by the requirement of perfect RNG like a sailor hearing the siren calling to the beach. Truly a shame in it's current state, a real opportunity missed.
Tier 4 usually, sometimes tier 5.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
94m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I use mostly a rebel team (CLS, Princess Leia, R2D2, with Stormtrooper Han / Old Ben / BB8 depending on the phase). It performs well in the second and third phase.
I have been working hard on a Nihilus (L) Sith team, but most of the Sith available to me aren't performing very well so far. It seemed like a strong team for phase 1, but is falling short.
I also have an old Droid team from around the time of Jawa Engineer coming out, with Nebit / HK47(L) / 86 / 88 - they perform alright on every phase.
As a note, I generally run the raid on Auto; there's always a raid going and I don't have time to actually play out the attempts. I miss some days altogether, but most of the time I'll play out one or two attacks with my best team or two.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
I get demotivated by the fact that it's endless, all day every day, with 5 attacks each day. It's far too much. I get motivated by the cool new abilities that replace the old "retreat" ability (which I hated and never used) and enjoy battling the Sith Triumvirate, as the encounters are fairly diverse and definitely interesting.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
To add to my answer to the previous question, I dislike the rewards. I have to put in 5 attacks each day for several days, and receive next to nothing. Territory battles are less work than this, and about ten times the rewards. Why we bother, I can't quite figure out.
Although it integrates extremely badly into the rest of the game by demanding tons of extra time and rewarding next to nothing, the raid itself is amazing. It's been beautifully designed, visually and mechanically. Battling the Sith Triumvirate here is a reward in and of itself. There couldn't possibly have been a better raid developed at this time, and the theme is of great taste. Well done, bravo.
Now give us a reason to do it, and stop making us do it five times a day.
Edit: As a note, a lot of people seem to complain about tenacity, Raid Nihilus in general, and some other raid mechanics. I imagine that's to be expected, but I feel like it's nice that this raid doesn't have the usual obvious counters (like TMR-ing into oblivion). I'm grateful that we have to develop new strategies, and there's no clean-cut way to deal with these threats. Makes it a ton more interesting.
92 million gp.
I have tried many teams with my akbar lead and imperial troopers being my best.
Pros: tier 2 and 3 have enjoyable mechanics.
Cons: I can top damage in p1 but it is so much harder than phase 2 and 3(they give damage boosts) that by the time I can attack again those 2 phases are cleared and I have no chance to end in top 3. Raid is set up to encourage people to sit back and wait for easier phases to max out damage.
Solutions: unbreakable will reflects damage if annihilate is used against that target. Not all damage, but a lot of damage. Would make p1 and 4 more enjoyable and allow for people to keep up in damage with other phases if they are being careful.
Thank you for your time!
Most parts of the raid are fun, I just always get stuck with p1 and p4 which both suck.
1. 60M guild, running T3 raids now, tried a few T4 but just took too long. Even on T3 our raid tickets sit on max for a few days before we can clear.
2. Running the JTR and NS teams mainly, but truly it is any/every thing available. Having some luck with Thrawn lead and Wedge lead.
3. Personally, I enjoy trying to beat my score everyday, keep a log etc..., and this is not that difficult in P2 and P3. However, in P1 this could mean 4 or 5 retreats. So now my “daily allowance” of game time is up. Im 45 years old, so this isnt like a forced thing, but rwl life exists.
4. The worst part of the raid is that it force drains the energy out of every memeber of the guild. We went from 90ish% participation at launch, down to 40% participation on a great day, normally 20%.
5. I totally get that you guys wanted to design a raid that could not be auto played. I say, keep that aspect, but change the damage ratios or maybe the rewards. If this raid were a stand alone game, you guys would have knocked it out of the park. But this is one raid, in a game with three raids, territory wars, territory battles, arena, ship arena, daily challenges, ship challenges, galactic war, special events....hopefully you are getting the picture.
6. Also, the Boba contract is basically not a factor. I saw my first chance to even take a swat at it today in Phase 1, but DN was one turn from enrage, so why bother? Small thing, doesnt really make a difference, but these contracts were touted as a big deal, and they dont really work in this raid.
7. Keep up the good work. We are like Soldiers.... if we are not complaining then something is wrong.
What tier or tiers did you play?
Our current rotation is that we are alternating between Tier 4 and Tier 5 while the guild is building up the Heroic Teams.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
We have 49 members and are at 103 Million GP
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
All of them in the intitial weeks. I eventually settled on several teams depending on the phase. The teams I use the most are the JTR P1 team, OG Nightsisters, KRU First Order, a version of Chex Mix, Troopers, and Phoenix are all options I use most often.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
The complexity and challenge are both motivators and demoralizing factors. I love that it's a challenge and requires complete guild readiness and participation. What I didn't like was this sense of the Raid being a moving target for a while as CG kept adjusting it.
What about the raid did you enjoy?
Challenge and ability to use a variety of teams I wouldn't have used otherwise.
What did you dislike about the raid?
Rewards seem light considering the effort. Nihilus HP is annoying, and Phase 4 Traya gets to enrage far too quickly for my tastes.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? - ~123M first time passing heroic
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? - P1 : RJT, P2 : Imperial Troopers, Phoenix, Sith, Nute/Leia/Acolyte, Wampa. P3 : Chex team, Rolo team, P4 : NS, and rest of the bench
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? - Were it not for the Traya shards.........
Same here. It is a lazy design to leave it to RNG to decide the ourcome of so many tries, tries, and more tries even after your have the right G12 teams and decent MODs..... You planners and designers think we have no real lives to live in?
Firstly, good to see you guys taking serious feedback on this. I would like to say "I'll keep this brief" but...you know...
At the moment my guild of 100mil (was 110mil but greener pastures and all that Trayas) is doing T5 with the occasional T4 just when we need a break. T4 is done in around 16 hours, T5 5-7 days depending on participation.
My usual teams are JTR, NS, and Imp Troopers. At T5 I can still use a dot team of Zader, Bobba, Zidious, Wampa, Shaman because dots still apply. I have doubts on the viability of that side at a higher level. My 5th team is usually a rotation of whoever I want to try. Rebels, Sith, Random mixes etc.
Right now my only real motivation is that I come first every time. Rewards are horrible but atleast they're better than other members are getting.
There's a lot about the raid that is demotivating.
1) Massive health pools drawing out the raid. I get the idea of wanting it to be a guild wide raid, but asking people to do 25-30 battles per raid is more than a guild wide activity. It's a chore.
2) DN. This guy is horrible. Ignores protection, gains protection, but the worst part about him is annihilate. Even when you successfully shield yourself you often can't recover health to make it worthwhile. Even with a healer, when DN drops your cooldowns right after annihilate you're done.
2A) The DN side effect. The first day everyone hits the raid, the second day very few people hit the raid because they don't want to be the ones who use up their attempts and miss out on p2/p3. Same thing happens at the beginning of P4. This definitely adds to the dragging out of the raid.
DN is horrible. Sorry to say it again, he really just is.
3) Resets. It's a complicated mechanic especially with DN and it leads to frustration and restarting. This just drags everything out further.
4) Demotivated guild. Hard to stay motivated when everyone is always complaining about the raid. I quit as an officer not long after the raid came out. I really tried to help my guild get through HAAT long ago but couldn't do it with this raid when I myself had so little interest in it.
5) Time sink. By the time we finish a T5 we have enough tickets to start again. Sometimes we do a T4 to give us a rest, but this raid is staring us in the face all day every day. You just did QOL updates and then added a raid that adds 20-30 minutes a day at least. I know you value engagement, but this is ridiculous.
6) It's not really fun. For so many reasons that I've listed. There's no feeling of "I want to do this raid" there's only a feeling of "I need to do this raid".
What I like and don't like...
1) Squads. I actually enjoy the fact that it makes me use toons and squads I haven't previously. However, it also makes the gear crunch (and horrible raid rewards) stand out even more. In Rancor/HAAT you usually had 2-3 toons ready to go and that meant to get a viable team you were focusing on 1-2 toons at a time.
This raid is built for squads with synergy. Few other combos work. You're not only forcing people to upgrade to g12 without releaving the gear crunch, but now they're required to focus on 3-5 toons at a time instead.
2) I like that each phase has something different about it, but I don't like how so many toons are essentially rendered useless due to there being too many effects being blocked. I imagine it's a logistics nightmare trying to get the balance right, but despite the differences in phases it does feel like the teams you can use have been pre-determined for you.
3) I hate everything DN, but you probably already guessed that.
My Biggest Complaint though....
This game is a grind, we know that and accept that, but there always needs to be a light at the end of the tunnel. I hated what you guys tried to do with Talzin/Wicket, but I understand the need to experiment. The reason I hated it was because generally a difficult to get toon was a 6 month grind. That's a long time, but it's close enough for us to see that light in the distance.
What you guys tried to do with Talzin/Wicket essentially removed that light which is why so many were upset about it.
Now look at the raid. Guilds filled with players who have been around for 18-24+ months are struggling to finish the raid in a reasonable time and then get rewards that don't even help them level the toons to get them to the next tier. 2+ years of grinding nearly every single day, and now there's no light in the distance. There's nothing more demotivating than that.
Again, appreciate you opening up this thread for debate. Hopefully you get some good feedback that helps you find the right balance between the companies needs and the player base.
Tiers 4 & 5 but will drop to finish lower for store tickets
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
110 Million
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Imperial Troopers, NS, BH, Rebel, FO, empire
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Enjoy P2 P3 Hit auto and hate hate hate P1. P4 is also not enjoyable
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Great art, P2 & P3 are actually enjoyable to try different teams. P1 & P4 are not fun and should be reworked. Rewards do not reflect the difficulty and being equal to the investment made. Fix P1 and P4 to make them enjoyable.
What tier or tiers did you play?
1-4 were staying at tier 2 right now cuz we can farm it in a day
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
75m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
random teams mainly ones suggested by youtubers we trust for raiding
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
nothing about this raid motivated us as a guild. this raid demotivated as a guild completely
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
we dont enjoy the raid what so ever. we launch the highest tier we can farm in a day so we can get rewards.
the effort in plus the rewards just dont equal out. we lost members that have been loyal to us for a year to join a heroic guild since we cant complete it nor are we close. this raid has gave us a high turn over rate lately.
i think this raid would be better if it just had a normal and a heroic. the fact i launch a 2 star raid. but i need to have 7 star gear 12 toons to beat it to be rewarded with low tier gear.....makes no sense if this raid was completely taken out of the game we would be happy.
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? 120m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with? jtr,zader,it,hoda,ns,bh,jawa e,fo,ackbar/nute,cls
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? i already didn't like backing out and trying again to get a good score in T5/6. then we tried heroic and everyone spent hours trying to get scores good enough to get through p1. i don't know who finds it fun to back out and try again over and over but I don't, and most of our guild doesn't. we don't have that kind of time to play the game.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? I LOVE THAT I CAN USE MANY DIFFERENT TOONS. THE GAME IS WAY BETTER NOW THAT NON WHALES ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE DECENT SIZED ROSTERS AND PLACES TO USE MANY DIFFERENT AND WEAKER TOONS. but then theres the bad.... i think the biggest problem is that even if you do learn the mechanics, and you micromanage the battle, randomness can still kill you. which make you have to back out and retry. that is not fun. i don't mind losing cause I mess up. I do mind losing cause Nihilus took 3 turns that round instead of 2. or he decided to hit the same toon 3 times in a row but normally doesn't. there is just nothing fun about that. i don't like that the heroic tier is really only for super modded toons.