The Road Ahead: July 5, 2018 [MEGA]

Replies

  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
    NicWester wrote: »
    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    Read other comments, man. Read literally any mod guide available via Google. The chance for a green mod to upgrade its existing secondary stat at level 3 is 100 percent. It happens every time. It is literally not possible for a green mod that begins with secondary speed to not improve that stat at least once. I’ve never heard of a single bug report to the contrary. So you are either saying there is a bug that has only ever affected you and not any of the millions of other people who play the game, or you are suggesting every single person who has ever written a mod guide, not to mention the devs themselves who have repeatedly explained this, are wrong and you alone have the correct information.

    I choose option 3. You don’t understand how mods upgrade. There are tables out there. Seriously, go look at one.

    I know how mods work, that's why I was so surprised and disappointed whenever it happened. If I didn't know how they work I'd have just accepted it and moved on without reporting a bug because I would have assumed everything was working normally. Go do an advanced search, I've mentioned seeing this before in other threads.

    I know what I've seen, I know how annoyed I've been when it's happened. If you don't believe me, that's fine, I don't care.

    I’m not trying to be insulting. But given that no one else has ever reported this as an issue and given that it totally contradicts the mechanics of how mods work, the only plausible scenario is that you are mistaken. You either didn’t notice that speed upgraded once, upgraded a mod that didn’t have speed to begin with or upgraded a blue mod thinking it was a green and had bad RNG. It is simply not believable that this is a bug. If it were, many more people would have experienced it, and it would have been reported and discussed at length.
  • Banth
    158 posts Member
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are. Like yeah sure maybe yr data says a lot of toons don’t have mods on them but realistically the only reason unmodded toons could ever be statistically important is if you are counting all the dead accounts and toons that are never used. If you only are looking at active accounts and toons that are used they are all going to be modded basically across the board. This CG doublespeak is constantly used to twist things around to justify bad changes to the game that really are only in place to make profit. A major reason I stopped financially supporting this beautiful mess.
  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
    As a side note, why would you ever upgrade a green or blue mod to 15 without first seeing whether speed upgraded and by how much at levels 3 and 6? That is a massive waste of credits.
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    Banth wrote: »
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are. Like yeah sure maybe yr data says a lot of toons don’t have mods on them but realistically the only reason unmodded toons could ever be statistically important is if you are counting all the dead accounts and toons that are never used. If you only are looking at active accounts and toons that are used they are all going to be modded basically across the board. This CG doublespeak is constantly used to twist things around to justify bad changes to the game that really are only in place to make profit. A major reason I stopped financially supporting this beautiful mess.

    We just fought in back-to-back TW where the other guild clearly didn't use mods very well. Almost every toon I looked at had something like +5 to +15 speed....total! Not a speed arrow to be found.

    And these were both 100m GP guilds.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    As a side note, why would you ever upgrade a green or blue mod to 15 without first seeing whether speed upgraded and by how much at levels 3 and 6? That is a massive waste of credits.

    Totally agree. At most you would upgrade to 12 if you're in need of mods in general and want some more secondaries, because the credits from 12 to 15 are significant and you already know what you're getting there. And once you have a well developed mod roster this is no longer needed either.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • YaeVizsla
    3448 posts Member
    Banth wrote: »
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are. Like yeah sure maybe yr data says a lot of toons don’t have mods on them but realistically the only reason unmodded toons could ever be statistically important is if you are counting all the dead accounts and toons that are never used. If you only are looking at active accounts and toons that are used they are all going to be modded basically across the board. This CG doublespeak is constantly used to twist things around to justify bad changes to the game that really are only in place to make profit. A major reason I stopped financially supporting this beautiful mess.
    Not engaging and not using are not quite the same thing. Slapping semi-arbitrary stuff on folks and forgetting about it is not engaging with the system.
    Still not a he.
  • ZCD_9915
    356 posts Member
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.

    I didn't get why they would go into Legends before finishing the Canon. They went into characters from a game that's 15 years old rather than getting all the characters from the movies. I haven't heard of any of the characters from KOTOR but everyone has heard of Jango Fett and Original Trilogy Chewie
  • Pyrefly wrote: »
    The "ironic" part is that they start saying that mods are complicated and the solution is introducing new layers to overcomplicate things.
    See, I don't think you're looking at it the right way.

    They wanted to build up mods a bit, but they acknowledged that mods were already complicated. So they made sure they made ways to simplify mods (ie, saving modsets, recommendations, auto-fill, etc.) before updating mods with what people might view to be more complication.

    I, for one, think the amount of simplification they're attempting here is much greater than the amount of complication that they're adding with slicing, for a net positive result.

    Nope, it's just getting even more complicated than before.
    Which I'm fine with, but digress from CG goal.
  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
    Shiprek wrote: »
    2) All mods will show all 4 stats at level 3 and will retain their Tier (color: Grey, green, blue, purple, gold) while leveling to 15. Same secondaries will be shown at level 1. So by level 3 you will know all the secondaries it will have and can choose to upgrade or sell.

    Pretty sure you misread this part. This would only be true for a purple mod. At level 3, you would see the additional stat. At levels, 6, 9 and 12 you would have a chance to upgrade any of the four secondary stats. For a blue, you would see one new stat at 3 and another at 6, then get a stat upgrade at 9 and 12. Greens would show new stats at 3, 6 and 9 and upgrade one stat at 12. Gray mods would reveal secondary stats every three levels just like they do now.

    Showing all stats for all tiers at level 3 would make no sense. It would mean a green mod would show no new stats or upgrades at levels 6 and 9, blues would show new new stat or upgrade at level 6, and grays would show everything at 3 and not change anything but main stat after that. That isn’t what they are describing. It simply will work in reverse order to the way it currently does. Instead of upgrading existing stats first, then adding additional ones, upgrading will now reveal stats first and then upgrade once all new stats have been revealed.
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    None of this makes any sense yet lol.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • JacenRoe
    3016 posts Member
    Banth wrote: »
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are. Like yeah sure maybe yr data says a lot of toons don’t have mods on them but realistically the only reason unmodded toons could ever be statistically important is if you are counting all the dead accounts and toons that are never used. If you only are looking at active accounts and toons that are used they are all going to be modded basically across the board. This CG doublespeak is constantly used to twist things around to justify bad changes to the game that really are only in place to make profit. A major reason I stopped financially supporting this beautiful mess.

    If the info I've heard is correct around 800,000 people play this game regularly. It's a pretty small percentage that are hard core. By hard core I mean listening to podcasts, watching YouTube tutorials, joining shard chats, trolling the forum, etc. I'd bet a large number of people don't understand mods, and put minimal effort into them. I have a cousin who has played for almost two years, and he hasn't the slightest idea what mods do. He upgraded worthless mods, slapped random sets on toons, and then never looked at them again. I nearly had a brain aneurysm when I saw his mods. I think that is what they are talking about. If you're a high level player in a guild full of other good players then that could be shocking that players do that, but it happens.
  • NicWester wrote: »
    It's not cool, it's nostalgia.

    Nostalgia?

    This isn't nostalgia? -

    dxcl1jk8jjak.png



    KOTOR seems modern to me.

    I think it might be nostalgic for younger people. Personally, KOTOR was my first super-enjoyable experience of Star Wars - I hadn't even seen all the movies when I first played through it. Bioware did a really great job of drawing younger people into the Star Wars universe with the game. Obviously, everything KOTOR is is owed to the original trilogy. Nostalgia is less about the age of the thing remembered and more about the individual's relationship with the subject.
  • YKMisfit
    700 posts Member
    I just hope they're planning to change the energy used in mod battles (or just mods in general), because now that you're going to have to farm this unknown slicing resource though battles, cantina energy, which was already being stretched very thin, is going to have yet another thing that you need to farm with it.

    More than anything, THIS is what concerns me most about how the whole mod system is being changed.
  • Shiprek
    15 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    Shiprek wrote: »
    2) All mods will show all 4 stats at level 3 and will retain their Tier (color: Grey, green, blue, purple, gold) while leveling to 15. Same secondaries will be shown at level 1. So by level 3 you will know all the secondaries it will have and can choose to upgrade or sell.

    Pretty sure you misread this part. This would only be true for a purple mod. At level 3, you would see the additional stat. At levels, 6, 9 and 12 you would have a chance to upgrade any of the four secondary stats. For a blue, you would see one new stat at 3 and another at 6, then get a stat upgrade at 9 and 12. Greens would show new stats at 3, 6 and 9 and upgrade one stat at 12. Gray mods would reveal secondary stats every three levels just like they do now.

    Showing all stats for all tiers at level 3 would make no sense. It would mean a green mod would show no new stats or upgrades at levels 6 and 9, blues would show new new stat or upgrade at level 6, and grays would show everything at 3 and not change anything but main stat after that. That isn’t what they are describing. It simply will work in reverse order to the way it currently does. Instead of upgrading existing stats first, then adding additional ones, upgrading will now reveal stats first and then upgrade once all new stats have been revealed.


    I think you missed this paragraph:
    "To better represent the value of the mod, we are separating improving the level of the mod from improving the Tier of the mod. In the future, as you level a mod up to level 15, you will reveal all four secondary stats. You will not see the color change any longer as you level the mod. By revealing the secondary stats prior to leveling up the secondary stats, we’re trying to give players the choice whether they want to invest in a mod before spending anything on it."

  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    Young people don't deserve nostalgia. ;)
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    Yeah but there's two completely contradictory sentences in that paragraph. How can you level a mod to 15 in order to reveal all secondary stats, while at the same time reveal the secondary stats without spending anything?

    The whole thing makes no sense as written.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • swgohfan29
    1147 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    None of this makes any sense yet lol.

    tbh i thought i got it down pretty well in my comment
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    swgohfan29 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    None of this makes any sense yet lol.

    tbh i thought i got it down pretty well in my comment

    See post directly above yours. The paragraph Carrie wrote is contradictory. So you might be right, but as of now you're just guessing.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • NicWester wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.
    I'm fine with any character being added, really. Star Wars is big enough and the fans are so many that every character is going to be SOMEONE'S favorite character. Hell, my favorite characters are Kit Fisto (That name! That smile!) and Zam Wessel (That name! That informing the look and mechanics of the Imperial Agent Sniper in the MMO!) and they're in, so why not make someone happy?
    You can get Kotor for like 5$ off steam. It is considered one of the greatest RPGs ever... Not just star wars... all RPGs ever. All time. It introduced a younger generation who were too young to truly enjoy the original trilogy to the depth of the star wars universe.
    Considered one of the greatest RPGs ever--by people who played it when it was relatively new. Don't underestimate the importance of context. I know enough people who have watched Ghostbusters for the first time as adults to know that old things don't age well. Even something innovative like KOTOR is going to suffer because the best bits of it have been redone and recycled into later games and done better.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't like it or trying to be a wet blanket. I'm glad the folks who are fans are getting the thing that they want. I'm just saying why there's folks who read the news and thought "Meh."

    Actually it’s not just considered one of the greatest RPGs ever by people who played it when it was relatively new. Check top RPG lists by sources like Game Informer, IGN, etc. Kotor is always on the list and always near the top. Even to this day.
  • YKMisfit
    700 posts Member
    All this slicing thing is doing is giving you an opportunity to basically make any mod act as if it were a gold mod to start. It doesn't guarantee that the stat you want to upgrade will.

    And just because a green mod (for example) may show what all 4 secondary stats will become, it doesn't mean you get them all without levelling the mod to 12. It also doesn't change the fact that taking it to level 3 is only going to upgrade the one existing secondary. Upgrading past that will still only unlock the other secondary stats, not upgrade them. It's just that now you know what that stat will be. To upgrade those secondaries (or to get a chance to), you'll need to "slice" the mod.
  • TVF wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.

    I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't care about what toons are or aren't available in the slightest. I know it's a weird attitude, but all I care about is how good the toon is and how good the team is.

    Nope. I’m pretty frustrated that most of the 2018 discretionary content decisions has been pointed at making this game KOTOR 3....I get that if you happened to be playing and xBox 15 years ago this is awesome. Many of feel like the new content has stopped the good momentum this game had coming into 2018. I’m way less likely to invest in the game if they are going to use it to produce content that has no real broad SW appeal.
  • TVF
    31107 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    deleted
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • NicWester
    8211 posts Member
    Banth wrote: »
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are.

    I think they mean farming. Folks are hunting the Mod Store and buying one with credits or ship bucks if it’s already gold/purple with speed secondary, but that’s the only way.

    That and most folks have a couple sets thatbthey transfer from character to character instead of farming up mods for multiple characters.

    The goal—I think—is to encourage players to farm mods with energy and rely on swapping sets less, while at the same time making swapping more convenient when you need to do it.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • NicWester
    8211 posts Member
    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.
    I'm fine with any character being added, really. Star Wars is big enough and the fans are so many that every character is going to be SOMEONE'S favorite character. Hell, my favorite characters are Kit Fisto (That name! That smile!) and Zam Wessel (That name! That informing the look and mechanics of the Imperial Agent Sniper in the MMO!) and they're in, so why not make someone happy?
    You can get Kotor for like 5$ off steam. It is considered one of the greatest RPGs ever... Not just star wars... all RPGs ever. All time. It introduced a younger generation who were too young to truly enjoy the original trilogy to the depth of the star wars universe.
    Considered one of the greatest RPGs ever--by people who played it when it was relatively new. Don't underestimate the importance of context. I know enough people who have watched Ghostbusters for the first time as adults to know that old things don't age well. Even something innovative like KOTOR is going to suffer because the best bits of it have been redone and recycled into later games and done better.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't like it or trying to be a wet blanket. I'm glad the folks who are fans are getting the thing that they want. I'm just saying why there's folks who read the news and thought "Meh."

    Actually it’s not just considered one of the greatest RPGs ever by people who played it when it was relatively new. Check top RPG lists by sources like Game Informer, IGN, etc. Kotor is always on the list and always near the top. Even to this day.

    And when those lists aren’t compiled by 30-something white guys like me, they’ll mean something.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • Mzee
    1777 posts Member
    Other KOTOR toons now, released in marquee format so only whales have any chance at the upcoming Revan journey. Everybody else can get him in 6 months to a year.

    That's how I expect it will work out.

    It's like some of you haven't played this game before.

    This is why I don't get excited with Marquee characters.
  • NicWester wrote: »
    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.
    I'm fine with any character being added, really. Star Wars is big enough and the fans are so many that every character is going to be SOMEONE'S favorite character. Hell, my favorite characters are Kit Fisto (That name! That smile!) and Zam Wessel (That name! That informing the look and mechanics of the Imperial Agent Sniper in the MMO!) and they're in, so why not make someone happy?
    You can get Kotor for like 5$ off steam. It is considered one of the greatest RPGs ever... Not just star wars... all RPGs ever. All time. It introduced a younger generation who were too young to truly enjoy the original trilogy to the depth of the star wars universe.
    Considered one of the greatest RPGs ever--by people who played it when it was relatively new. Don't underestimate the importance of context. I know enough people who have watched Ghostbusters for the first time as adults to know that old things don't age well. Even something innovative like KOTOR is going to suffer because the best bits of it have been redone and recycled into later games and done better.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't like it or trying to be a wet blanket. I'm glad the folks who are fans are getting the thing that they want. I'm just saying why there's folks who read the news and thought "Meh."

    Actually it’s not just considered one of the greatest RPGs ever by people who played it when it was relatively new. Check top RPG lists by sources like Game Informer, IGN, etc. Kotor is always on the list and always near the top. Even to this day.

    And when those lists aren’t compiled by 30-something white guys like me, they’ll mean something.

    Just out of curiosity who should they be compiled by? In order to mean something?
  • Malgrin
    149 posts Member
    First of all, I am so excited for the new mod updates (and KoToR)!

    That being said, while you are redoing mods, would you please reconsider the color scheme of mods? As a color blind person, it's brutal, but it has been not too big of an issue, because you can currently check the numbers (3, 6, 9, 12). However, the way the new system is set up will make that impossible to differentiate if you can't tell the difference between the colors as they are now (I currently see grey, two greens and two blues, despite knowing one should be yellow, and one should be purple).

    I know this is not a tremendously impactful disability (I wouldn't even consider it a real disability), but it would put me at a pretty fair disadvantage under the new system.

    It would also be awesome if the same could be done for the gear tiers (although that is significantly less impactful).

    I brought this up once before and it got pretty good traction, but that was back when EA Jesse was still in charge, and I am afraid it may have since been forgotten about.

    Either way, thank you for your time, and I hope you at least consider it.
    Cheers

    I have trouble with Green/Gold, and Blue/Purple require a second glance to distinguish. There are much more friendly colors, and I hope you consider changing mod colors.
  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
    YKMisfit wrote: »
    All this slicing thing is doing is giving you an opportunity to basically make any mod act as if it were a gold mod to start. It doesn't guarantee that the stat you want to upgrade will.

    And just because a green mod (for example) may show what all 4 secondary stats will become, it doesn't mean you get them all without levelling the mod to 12. It also doesn't change the fact that taking it to level 3 is only going to upgrade the one existing secondary. Upgrading past that will still only unlock the other secondary stats, not upgrade them. It's just that now you know what that stat will be. To upgrade those secondaries (or to get a chance to), you'll need to "slice" the mod.

    Crumb said the exact opposite. He said upgrading will first reveal the hidden secondary stats BEFORE upgrading them. This would suggest ANY of the four stats that are revealed will have the chance to upgrade. Otherwise, why bother changing it?

    Consider their end goal here. This is meant to make mods a much bigger credit and resource sink. They are taking away the ability to cheaply see whether blue or gree mods upgrade secondary speed and replacing it with the outside chance you could turn any tier mod into a God mod if you spend enough resources. This is a classic casino tactic. Entice you to make many larger bets for worse odds by promising a huge jackpot. They are replacing low stakes Blackjack tables with high-stakes slot machines.
  • Ruark_Icefire
    834 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    Banth wrote: »
    “Many players don’t engage with mods at all”

    Really? It’s incredible how out of touch the devs really are. Like yeah sure maybe yr data says a lot of toons don’t have mods on them but realistically the only reason unmodded toons could ever be statistically important is if you are counting all the dead accounts and toons that are never used. If you only are looking at active accounts and toons that are used they are all going to be modded basically across the board. This CG doublespeak is constantly used to twist things around to justify bad changes to the game that really are only in place to make profit. A major reason I stopped financially supporting this beautiful mess.

    Actually I would say they are correct. Most of the players of this game just slap a pretty much random set of mods on a character and level them to 15 then forget about them.

    From my experience it isn't until you get to around the top 200 in Arena that people actually start paying attention to mods.
  • Ruark_Icefire
    834 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.
    I'm fine with any character being added, really. Star Wars is big enough and the fans are so many that every character is going to be SOMEONE'S favorite character. Hell, my favorite characters are Kit Fisto (That name! That smile!) and Zam Wessel (That name! That informing the look and mechanics of the Imperial Agent Sniper in the MMO!) and they're in, so why not make someone happy?
    You can get Kotor for like 5$ off steam. It is considered one of the greatest RPGs ever... Not just star wars... all RPGs ever. All time. It introduced a younger generation who were too young to truly enjoy the original trilogy to the depth of the star wars universe.
    Considered one of the greatest RPGs ever--by people who played it when it was relatively new. Don't underestimate the importance of context. I know enough people who have watched Ghostbusters for the first time as adults to know that old things don't age well. Even something innovative like KOTOR is going to suffer because the best bits of it have been redone and recycled into later games and done better.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't like it or trying to be a wet blanket. I'm glad the folks who are fans are getting the thing that they want. I'm just saying why there's folks who read the news and thought "Meh."

    Actually it’s not just considered one of the greatest RPGs ever by people who played it when it was relatively new. Check top RPG lists by sources like Game Informer, IGN, etc. Kotor is always on the list and always near the top. Even to this day.

    And when those lists aren’t compiled by 30-something white guys like me, they’ll mean something.

    Just out of curiosity who should they be compiled by? In order to mean something?

    I think he is saying the lists need to be compiled by a younger generation that didn't play the game when it first came out to mean something. Not sure why he brought race into it though.
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