Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
I have noticed however this trend that keeps punishing people who don't invest in bad factions or characters and reward those who do... Let's look at the evidence together and see for ourselves.
1. BB8 is released requiring 5 FO characters. That is prior to KRU, Panda and SF FO pilot being in the game, essentially forcing the community to use FO ST who is only available on hard nodes. Notice also how at the time hard nodes were limited to 3 per day unless you reset them using crystals.
At the time FO was a plain bad faction. Phasma and Kylo were the only two characters worthy of investing in at the time, with the other 3 being kind of inefficient to farm. The energy investment for a character like FO ST was definitely not worth it and spending gear on pilot or officer never seemed like the right choice when we had far superior choices like CLS, Finn, Phoenix, Empires, chaze, ect.
A. FOO was one of the best investments in the cantina shop along with QGJ, Boba, Daka and Poe. FOO was one of the very best characters for rancor raids until CLS was introduced. Many players already had him at 7* for that reason.
B. FOTP may have been one of the longest farms back then, but it was a good investment. FOTP was an absoloute beast in squad arena until the rebalancing when protection was introduced. The awe factor of having a 7* FOTP was only surpassed by having a 7* Vader og Grievous until they became available in fleet store. After ships were introduced even more players farmed FOTP for his ship.
C. This makes 4 of the 5 orginal FO characters really good investments already before BB8 was introduced. Kylo and Phasma were not the only ones.
D. FO ST was farmable from three diferent hard nodes - not just one.
E. When Kylo Ren's command shuttle became farmable, it was placed together with one of FO ST's hard nodes. You could farm two characters at the same time for the price of one - a quite good investment (that one node at least).
2. Rey is the next example and apart from the fact that unless you could place in the top 3 in both arenas or pay you stood no chance at farming the vets in time, on top of that the vets are just awful at the game. They are so weak that it's hard to justify those 16 energy cantina nodes. We're basically forced to sink a ton of resources into bad characters that under different circumstances nobody would care to invest in.
Part of good resource management is to invest your resources in characters that secure a continuous, steady income of valuable resources f.ex. by ranking high in arena(s). Yes, you needed a lot of crystals to farm the vets in time for the first time around - but it was doable. Good resource management was rewarded - not punished.
3. Then we have Chewbacca to talk about. I have a hard time believing that any reasonable person would gear Bounty Hunters, at least not the ones available at the time. I can see why it's a good decision to invest in Bossk, Boba, Jango, Embo, Dengar but the others were trash. I mean some of them got ships thankfully like cad bane and IG but that was after.
The only area in the game where Bounty Hunters were useful at was in dark side TB where they are required for an SM and a CM. The thing is g8 hunters with maybe a g11-12 Boba were enough, nobody had to actually dump any more resources into it, in order to get those missions done. When the event came requiring g11-12 it became very obvious that only those who had a legitimate love relationship with the faction would have those characters geared up.
Many already had Greedo geared for hSTR p3 and IG-88 geared for early hAAT or early arena during the droid META. (IG-88 is not that great for Chewie's event, I know). Yes, it may have been a race to gear the BH up, but at least most people already had a full team. Furthermore, the event was doable with less than those gear levels. A g12 Boba lead with the rest at a mix of g9 through g11 could suffice.
4. Now we have a similar situation with 3PO where basically we're once more forced to invest in a bad class for the sake of a legendary character. The gear requirements and zeta on chirpa is something that no sensible person would have done prior to this event.
Teebo, Elder and scout were quite good investments back in the early days of the Rancor Raid - with Teebo being the best of all. Chirpa was not bad, and could be used for a gimmick Rancor solo team. Elder was once also quite good in arena (not top tier, but above average). A 7* Wicket was a good investment for those extra zetas every month. Farming ewok from the forest moon also rewarded credits. Having a droid/trooper/empire team for that event was a good investment. Since the gear requirements for C-3P0's event are less than for One Famous Wookie, you really should be able to get a 7* C-3PO with mediocre resource management only.
I just don't to ever hear anyone speak to me about resource management ever again when it's pretty much a fact that on numerous occasions the game has favoured those who made poor roster decisions.
TL:DR : I disagree.
I agree completely and would only add that FOTP was one of the best ships before ships2.0 so there was gret incentive to farm him and Chirpa was needed for the Chirpatine teams in early HAAT so a lot of people farmed him then.
I would love to hear an intelligent rebuttal to my post above.
I think what bothers me about the matchmaking system is that it kind of forces people to play a certain way, if they want to be successful in GA. It used to be that as long as you built up the right toons, you'd be in good shape regardless of what you did with the rest of your roster. Now the best strategy is to just hoard. I dunno, just seems less fun to me.
Pro tip. Level all useless toons to seven stars when you can. CG has shown time and time again that rarely used toons are needed at some point for some event. Get your Holdo and Rose ready for the next FO unlock..when that comes.
Since they are only 1 hard node per char, I believe you we need them to get new FO...
Pro tip. Level all useless toons to seven stars when you can. CG has shown time and time again that rarely used toons are needed at some point for some event. Get your Holdo and Rose ready for the next FO unlock..when that comes.
Since they are only 1 hard node per char, I believe you we need them to get new FO...
Come on CG, even sion has 2 nodes...
Holdo and rose arent even that bad. Rose gives defence up and stuns and Holdo has that AOE daze
Mainly I think you need to manage your expectations. It sounds like your expectation is that CG will lead you down a path of farming only good and useful characters in order to obtain a legendary like JTR, Chewbacca, and C3P0. In reality, CG is going to try and make as much money as possible. They are a business after all and the goal of any business is to make a profit. To do that, they have to force people into farming and gearing characters that haven't been farmed or geared (one or the other) by the majority of the player base.
If, for example they said to get C3P0 you need g11/12 CLS, Rhan, Leia, Old Ben, and R2, the majority of the player base would be able to easily obtain C3P0 without spending any money, as those are characters that are already very useful, or were needed for other events. They can't do that. They have to make money in order to remain in business.
As hard as it is to do, one has to change one's expectations from "They should make legendary characters available by using characters that most of the player base has farmed and/or geared" to "CG is always going to make legendary characters available using characters that most of the player base hasn't farmed and/or geared."
Managing resources means putting the least necessary on toons that have less usefulness, not "not investing" in them.
The FO and vets situation is a good example of where you could manage them, but still needed to go down a path.
As for BH and Ewoks, that have always been decent teams but just not as widespread on the usefulness. Even the available BH at the time of the event were worth it. Both of the teams used for the events are good TW/GA teams.
There is always going to be required toons for whatever legendary or other event/game mode that comes down the pipeline, the management part of the game is having resources ready to make it happen.
I'm just bad at resource management...the way I G12 and doublezetad Aurra for P3 HSTR...and now people solo it.... A smart person would have put it into the ewoks
The longer you play the more you realize "good resource managment", is a crock. The devs goal from day one has been to make us use as close to all of our bench as possible. They have stated that goal repeatedly.
Gw was originally harder so it would take multiple t3ams to finish it.
Then tb was supposed to use the guilds entire bench.
Next tw same thing meant to force us to deepen our benches more.
Now GA i have to field at least 6 meta defense and 6 meta offense teams to have a chance.
The thing is i have been playing since day one, ihave quite a few obsolete toons that were needed for some team or another, but with the ridiculous power creep and release cadence 8 have seen many meta teams become useless junk.
It is easy to look at the field today and know which ones are important today, but we didnt have the luxury of choosing which 5 FO toons we wanted to farm, there were only 5. We didnt get to choose wich ewoks we wanted there were only 4.
The longer you play the more of your great resource management sitting unused, while you panic farm the new meta.
We know what this is. They are matching players purely off GP. This is wai. Big fish eats smaller fish.
Play the game how you want to. If you really love the pvp aspects of arena, ga, and tw- find a like minded guild and make sure you are in the meta and ready for the next one.
I have terrible resource management in this game because “you can’t take it all with you” and I enjoy leveling up toons I like.
Also to be fair and honest - I am not in top 10 arena and have been floating in that 100-50 range for awhile. With the time change I’m being more active in it as of now.
Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
my two favorite factions are bounty hunters and ewoks. have they always been good within the game? no, and I have often seen posts and youtube videos explaining how bad they are, but I invested in them because they're fun to play (ewoks) and because they look cool to me (bounty hunters).
the two latest legendary characters require these two factions and I get them easily (basically I got really lucky), and now I hear people that are having trouble getting them because they focused on other factions. my guess is that those other people are probably much better in the game than I am because of their different focus, but it is really tiresome hearing all the complaining because they don't ALSO get this as well.
Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
But the thing is, in the past you always were able to have your cake and eat it. The game was set up such that you could be successful in all game modes. Now some people can't. You say "tactical decision" as if people chose to fluff their rosters while knowingly sacrificing GA performance as a trade-off, but GA didn't exist when TB was introduced and people were fluffing.
If you could remove the fluff, then that would be totally fine, but that fluff is now a permanent disadvantage. If we had known that GA was coming and that fluff would be a disadvantage in the future, then that would also be fine. If we could use the fluff in GA, i.e. double the number of squads needed, then that would also be fine.
And I think I've used the word fluff enough for today!
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
If we had always had a choice between cake and pie I wouldn't have a problem with your argument. That said, when everyone is already bellied up to the table and eating cake because it's the only thing available, and then suddenly a nice pie comes along, it's too late for those who are already filled on cake.
And if we like pie better, tough cookies, the choice was taken out of our hands.
Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
But the thing is, in the past you always were able to have your cake and eat it. The game was set up such that you could be successful in all game modes. Now some people can't. You say "tactical decision" as if people chose to fluff their rosters while knowingly sacrificing GA performance as a trade-off, but GA didn't exist when TB was introduced and people were fluffing.
If you could remove the fluff, then that would be totally fine, but that fluff is now a permanent disadvantage. If we had known that GA was coming and that fluff would be a disadvantage in the future, then that would also be fine. If we could use the fluff in GA, i.e. double the number of squads needed, then that would also be fine.
And I think I've used the word fluff enough for today!
Lol. Totally agree on the fluff overload.
Padding toons to increase your GP is still a tactical decision made to get extra rewards.
The best way to actually help your guild is to farm those toons / squads to complete the missions and get the GP boost that way. Padding is generally easy and lazy.
People who put all the junk in their trunk and then don't improve those characters or pad more are at a disadvantage but they have the advantage of extra rewards for a considerable length of time.
So if CG said to players you can unpick / not activate certain toons but then because these toons gained you these zetas, omegas, crystals, etc you need to pay them back first - would anyone take them up on it? Probably not many but some people seem to think that they should be able to gain TB extra rewards but then be able to pick and choose their GP so they have an advantage in this mode as well.
The TB land of padding, milk and honey is still there but its just in GA land a leaner roster is better
Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
But the thing is, in the past you always were able to have your cake and eat it. The game was set up such that you could be successful in all game modes. Now some people can't. You say "tactical decision" as if people chose to fluff their rosters while knowingly sacrificing GA performance as a trade-off, but GA didn't exist when TB was introduced and people were fluffing.
If you could remove the fluff, then that would be totally fine, but that fluff is now a permanent disadvantage. If we had known that GA was coming and that fluff would be a disadvantage in the future, then that would also be fine. If we could use the fluff in GA, i.e. double the number of squads needed, then that would also be fine.
And I think I've used the word fluff enough for today!
Lol. Totally agree on the fluff overload.
Padding toons to increase your GP is still a tactical decision made to get extra rewards.
The best way to actually help your guild is to farm those toons / squads to complete the missions and get the GP boost that way. Padding is generally easy and lazy.
People who put all the junk in their trunk and then don't improve those characters or pad more are at a disadvantage but they have the advantage of extra rewards for a considerable length of time.
So if CG said to players you can unpick / not activate certain toons but then because these toons gained you these zetas, omegas, crystals, etc you need to pay them back first - would anyone take them up on it? Probably not many but some people seem to think that they should be able to gain TB extra rewards but then be able to pick and choose their GP so they have an advantage in this mode as well.
The TB land of padding, milk and honey is still there but its just in GA land a leaner roster is better
Sure, and I would completely agree with you...if we had known about GA all along. I think you're missing the point here. People who padded their rosters did get a marginal advantage in TB, and maybe helped their guild get in a higher TW bracket a bit earlier. And back before we knew about GA, that was the smart thing to do! Or at least, a very reasonable thing to do. Since we didn't know GA was coming, they didn't have the "tactical" option of choosing a leaner roster to do better in GA. And now many of those people are stuck in a long term losing situation in GA. You see?
Though it would be impossible to calculate what (guild-wide) benefits people got from fluffing their rosters (maybe one or two zetas/omegas, a little extra currency and gear), I bet most would indeed give it up to have a leaner roster and get significantly better rewards from every GA moving forward.
Look, the point isn't really whether spending some resources on "fluff" was or was not a good decision in the past. It was at least not unreasonable for people to spend their resources on collecting and leveling toons, even ones that weren't useful at the time. You could still be perfectly successful in events, TB, TW, and arenas using that approach. Excess GP didn't directly harm you like it does now.
The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
But the thing is, in the past you always were able to have your cake and eat it. The game was set up such that you could be successful in all game modes. Now some people can't. You say "tactical decision" as if people chose to fluff their rosters while knowingly sacrificing GA performance as a trade-off, but GA didn't exist when TB was introduced and people were fluffing.
If you could remove the fluff, then that would be totally fine, but that fluff is now a permanent disadvantage. If we had known that GA was coming and that fluff would be a disadvantage in the future, then that would also be fine. If we could use the fluff in GA, i.e. double the number of squads needed, then that would also be fine.
And I think I've used the word fluff enough for today!
Lol. Totally agree on the fluff overload.
Padding toons to increase your GP is still a tactical decision made to get extra rewards.
The best way to actually help your guild is to farm those toons / squads to complete the missions and get the GP boost that way. Padding is generally easy and lazy.
People who put all the junk in their trunk and then don't improve those characters or pad more are at a disadvantage but they have the advantage of extra rewards for a considerable length of time.
So if CG said to players you can unpick / not activate certain toons but then because these toons gained you these zetas, omegas, crystals, etc you need to pay them back first - would anyone take them up on it? Probably not many but some people seem to think that they should be able to gain TB extra rewards but then be able to pick and choose their GP so they have an advantage in this mode as well.
The TB land of padding, milk and honey is still there but its just in GA land a leaner roster is better
Your response is typical of someone who is either not at end game level or has not been there very long.
What you miss is there are long term end game players who have ~500k in GP fluff who have not had to make any sacrifices in any stage of the game. You assert there was a tactical decision when for many of us there was none. We already had the squads to complete every combat mission in TB. We already had one in arena. Fluffing had 0 opportunity cost at the time that we did it.
Sure, and I would completely agree with you...if we had known about GA all along. I think you're missing the point here. People who padded their rosters did get a marginal advantage in TB, and maybe helped their guild get in a higher TW bracket a bit earlier. And back before we knew about GA, that was the smart thing to do! Or at least, a very reasonable thing to do. Since we didn't know GA was coming, they didn't have the "tactical" option of choosing a leaner roster to do better in GA. And now many of those people are stuck in a long term losing situation in GA. You see?
Though it would be impossible to calculate what (guild-wide) benefits people got from fluffing their rosters (maybe one or two zetas/omegas, a little extra currency and gear), I bet most would indeed give it up to have a leaner roster and get significantly better rewards from every GA moving forward.
Not sure I am missing the point tbh. Games change, meta's change, things that were important at one time are not now (I am looking at you Jawa's).
GA is tailored towards a leaner, PVP style roster, simple as that.
I still will maintain that actually farming toons and squads to help you complete missions in TW is the best way to help your guild, padding has been very widespread because it is easy and lazy
I do see your point that there was no heads up that you might need a leaner roster to be uber competitive in GA but also they don't give heads up on other things you might need (which characters you need for the next legendary), etc.
Sure, and I would completely agree with you...if we had known about GA all along. I think you're missing the point here. People who padded their rosters did get a marginal advantage in TB, and maybe helped their guild get in a higher TW bracket a bit earlier. And back before we knew about GA, that was the smart thing to do! Or at least, a very reasonable thing to do. Since we didn't know GA was coming, they didn't have the "tactical" option of choosing a leaner roster to do better in GA. And now many of those people are stuck in a long term losing situation in GA. You see?
Though it would be impossible to calculate what (guild-wide) benefits people got from fluffing their rosters (maybe one or two zetas/omegas, a little extra currency and gear), I bet most would indeed give it up to have a leaner roster and get significantly better rewards from every GA moving forward.
Not sure I am missing the point tbh. Games change, meta's change, things that were important at one time are not now (I am looking at you Jawa's).
GA is tailored towards a leaner, PVP style roster, simple as that.
I still will maintain that actually farming toons and squads to help you complete missions in TW is the best way to help your guild, padding has been very widespread because it is easy and lazy
I do see your point that there was no heads up that you might need a leaner roster to be uber competitive in GA but also they don't give heads up on other things you might need (which characters you need for the next legendary), etc.
I am well aware that GA is tailored towards a leaner roster. And of course completing TB missions is still important to help your guild. No one is arguing these points. I'm also not sure what you mean by "easy and lazy". How it is "lazy" to build GP to help your guild? I would argue that those leaving their toons at g1 lvl1 are the "lazy" ones. But all of this is besides the point.
This game change is different from all previous legendary events, meta changes, etc because in all those situations, you just had to farm the appropriate toons/teams and you could catch up. In this situation, you have a permanent, unchangeable disadvantage in the form of excess GP, that will never go away. Obviously you can mitigate the disadvantage by maxing out your mods and top teams, but that doesn't change the GP problem you will always have.
I am well aware that GA is tailored towards a leaner roster. And of course completing TB missions is still important to help your guild. No one is arguing these points. I'm also not sure what you mean by "easy and lazy". How it is "lazy" to build GP to help your guild? I would argue that those leaving their toons at g1 lvl1 are the "lazy" ones. But all of this is besides the point.
I call using your resources (credits / training droids) given to you in game to level 'junk' toons to level 50, gear 6 and then not go back and improve them easy and lazy.
Actually farming the toons and then using your resources to level them to 7* level 85 G10/11/12 is more difficult and time consuming, so less appealing
For all the f2p out there it's time. Not everyone spends and some even have lives and families.
Unless we have undead orphans playing, everyone has lives and families...
What do you have against undead orphans? Are you anti-undead orphan? Do you not want them to play the game? Were you knocked out of your place in arena by an undead orphan? They have as much right to play the game as anyone else!
I am well aware that GA is tailored towards a leaner roster. And of course completing TB missions is still important to help your guild. No one is arguing these points. I'm also not sure what you mean by "easy and lazy". How it is "lazy" to build GP to help your guild? I would argue that those leaving their toons at g1 lvl1 are the "lazy" ones. But all of this is besides the point.
I call using your resources (credits / training droids) given to you in game to level 'junk' toons to level 50, gear 6 and then not go back and improve them easy and lazy.
Actually farming the toons and then using your resources to level them to 7* level 85 G10/11/12 is more difficult and time consuming, so less appealing
I like how you respond to the part that is besides the point while ignoring the meat of the argument.
But if you want to debate this, ok. You're making a false comparison. The choice isn't between taking them to level 50 gear 6 and taking them to level 85 gear 11. The choice is between leaving them at level 1 gear 1 versus taking them to level 50 gear 6 (with excess resources only). For example, if someone chose to use some extra blue/green gear to make their ugnaught gear 6, would you call them lazy for not bringing him up to g12? Of course not, because we're not talking about a useful toon. Even a g12 ugnaught would have no place in grand arena.
Go ahead and take a look at my roster if you like. I have many important GA teams ready at g12, working on others. I also have a bunch of toons at lower gear levels that I threw extra resources on, to improve my GP and help the guild. These two actions are not mutually exclusive. I am not sacrificing high end toons by putting some low level gear on useless toons.
And like I said, I'm undefeated in GA so not whining. I just don't think the system is fair on principle.
I've yet to see someone going on about this "permanent disadvantage" show proof of an actual mismatch based on this. At the point you have 500k in "fluff", surely you've got enough toons to cover offense and defense? So where is this mismatch coming in? If you have 14 awesome teams to your opponent's 16 awesome teams, but the game mode only uses 14, where's this advantage?
When I've had the overwhelming advantage in my matchups, it's been clear that the difference is not at the low end of a toon's GP. I took plenty to level 50-60, ability level 3, and gear 5-6 (even 7) because there was barely any opportunity cost. And yet I've had three out of five matchups so far where I had an overwhelming advantage, and from what I can see those people had eight billion more level 85 toons than me.
I've yet to see someone going on about this "permanent disadvantage" show proof of an actual mismatch based on this. At the point you have 500k in "fluff", surely you've got enough toons to cover offense and defense? So where is this mismatch coming in? If you have 14 awesome teams to your opponent's 16 awesome teams, but the game mode only uses 14, where's this advantage?
A single squad can top the scale in a competitive mode like this one. That's 100k so it doesn't have to be 500 or 400 or any of that. I love this mode but this doesn't mean that we should keep work it to come as close to perfection as we can. Don't be lazy or arrogant, small improvements can be made until wr achieve the best result, I don't get the negativity
When I've had the overwhelming advantage in my matchups, it's been clear that the difference is not at the low end of a toon's GP. I took plenty to level 50-60, ability level 3, and gear 5-6 (even 7) because there was barely any opportunity cost. And yet I've had three out of five matchups so far where I had an overwhelming advantage, and from what I can see those people had eight billion more level 85 toons than me.
I agree, I've had an advantage too because I was too lazy to bump up my GP for TB. It's not I don't wanna help my guild out but at the same time I don't want to waste some of that grey, green and blue gear because legendary events come and then you find yourself wasting crystals to farm grey and green pieces
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The issue is that all of a sudden and without warning, after the introduction of GA, it is very clear that spending resources on fluff is a bad idea. The equation of what makes you successful in game has changed. And people can't "unfluff" their rosters, so those who took a certain approach are now at a somewhat permanent disadvantage, because of reasonable decisions they made in the past.
Of course those who tended to leave their toons at level 1 are happy about this, and quick to call out "whiners" for complaining about the new game mode. As if they brought this upon themselves for all their poor choices in the past, when really those choices were made under a different set of parameters for success.
There are clearly better ways of making even matches. We'll see if they change it; I hope they do (even though I am undefeated so far). So many of my guildmates and shardmates have been in wildly uneven matches, where often the opponent doesn't even set defense or doesn't bother attacking. I doubt that is what CG wants out of this new game mode.
you're right, if anyone levelled them they don't suck. OP is wrong on all counts then. ty
I agree completely and would only add that FOTP was one of the best ships before ships2.0 so there was gret incentive to farm him and Chirpa was needed for the Chirpatine teams in early HAAT so a lot of people farmed him then.
I think what bothers me about the matchmaking system is that it kind of forces people to play a certain way, if they want to be successful in GA. It used to be that as long as you built up the right toons, you'd be in good shape regardless of what you did with the rest of your roster. Now the best strategy is to just hoard. I dunno, just seems less fun to me.
Since they are only 1 hard node per char, I believe you we need them to get new FO...
Come on CG, even sion has 2 nodes...
Holdo and rose arent even that bad. Rose gives defence up and stuns and Holdo has that AOE daze
If, for example they said to get C3P0 you need g11/12 CLS, Rhan, Leia, Old Ben, and R2, the majority of the player base would be able to easily obtain C3P0 without spending any money, as those are characters that are already very useful, or were needed for other events. They can't do that. They have to make money in order to remain in business.
As hard as it is to do, one has to change one's expectations from "They should make legendary characters available by using characters that most of the player base has farmed and/or geared" to "CG is always going to make legendary characters available using characters that most of the player base hasn't farmed and/or geared."
I'm just bad at resource management...the way I G12 and doublezetad Aurra for P3 HSTR...and now people solo it.... A smart person would have put it into the ewoks
Still hope though...still hope
That's just absurd
Why is it absurd.
I missed out on Revan last time. I wont miss out on a game changing character ever again.
Gw was originally harder so it would take multiple t3ams to finish it.
Then tb was supposed to use the guilds entire bench.
Next tw same thing meant to force us to deepen our benches more.
Now GA i have to field at least 6 meta defense and 6 meta offense teams to have a chance.
The thing is i have been playing since day one, ihave quite a few obsolete toons that were needed for some team or another, but with the ridiculous power creep and release cadence 8 have seen many meta teams become useless junk.
It is easy to look at the field today and know which ones are important today, but we didnt have the luxury of choosing which 5 FO toons we wanted to farm, there were only 5. We didnt get to choose wich ewoks we wanted there were only 4.
The longer you play the more of your great resource management sitting unused, while you panic farm the new meta.
Play the game how you want to. If you really love the pvp aspects of arena, ga, and tw- find a like minded guild and make sure you are in the meta and ready for the next one.
I have terrible resource management in this game because “you can’t take it all with you” and I enjoy leveling up toons I like.
Also to be fair and honest - I am not in top 10 arena and have been floating in that 100-50 range for awhile. With the time change I’m being more active in it as of now.
In all honesty fluffing toons up to over-inflate your GP is a tactical decision to gain better rewards in a certain game mode.
I believe that all persons that have gained extra rewards have enjoyed gaining them and using them
So now a game type comes along that doesn't give an advantage to fluff rosters. You can still use the extra fluff for the other game mode still and still get the extra rewards but not on THIS game mode
You can't expect to have your cake and eat it surely?
the two latest legendary characters require these two factions and I get them easily (basically I got really lucky), and now I hear people that are having trouble getting them because they focused on other factions. my guess is that those other people are probably much better in the game than I am because of their different focus, but it is really tiresome hearing all the complaining because they don't ALSO get this as well.
But the thing is, in the past you always were able to have your cake and eat it. The game was set up such that you could be successful in all game modes. Now some people can't. You say "tactical decision" as if people chose to fluff their rosters while knowingly sacrificing GA performance as a trade-off, but GA didn't exist when TB was introduced and people were fluffing.
If you could remove the fluff, then that would be totally fine, but that fluff is now a permanent disadvantage. If we had known that GA was coming and that fluff would be a disadvantage in the future, then that would also be fine. If we could use the fluff in GA, i.e. double the number of squads needed, then that would also be fine.
And I think I've used the word fluff enough for today!
If we had always had a choice between cake and pie I wouldn't have a problem with your argument. That said, when everyone is already bellied up to the table and eating cake because it's the only thing available, and then suddenly a nice pie comes along, it's too late for those who are already filled on cake.
And if we like pie better, tough cookies, the choice was taken out of our hands.
Lol. Totally agree on the fluff overload.
Padding toons to increase your GP is still a tactical decision made to get extra rewards.
The best way to actually help your guild is to farm those toons / squads to complete the missions and get the GP boost that way. Padding is generally easy and lazy.
People who put all the junk in their trunk and then don't improve those characters or pad more are at a disadvantage but they have the advantage of extra rewards for a considerable length of time.
So if CG said to players you can unpick / not activate certain toons but then because these toons gained you these zetas, omegas, crystals, etc you need to pay them back first - would anyone take them up on it? Probably not many but some people seem to think that they should be able to gain TB extra rewards but then be able to pick and choose their GP so they have an advantage in this mode as well.
The TB land of padding, milk and honey is still there but its just in GA land a leaner roster is better
Sure, and I would completely agree with you...if we had known about GA all along. I think you're missing the point here. People who padded their rosters did get a marginal advantage in TB, and maybe helped their guild get in a higher TW bracket a bit earlier. And back before we knew about GA, that was the smart thing to do! Or at least, a very reasonable thing to do. Since we didn't know GA was coming, they didn't have the "tactical" option of choosing a leaner roster to do better in GA. And now many of those people are stuck in a long term losing situation in GA. You see?
Though it would be impossible to calculate what (guild-wide) benefits people got from fluffing their rosters (maybe one or two zetas/omegas, a little extra currency and gear), I bet most would indeed give it up to have a leaner roster and get significantly better rewards from every GA moving forward.
Your response is typical of someone who is either not at end game level or has not been there very long.
What you miss is there are long term end game players who have ~500k in GP fluff who have not had to make any sacrifices in any stage of the game. You assert there was a tactical decision when for many of us there was none. We already had the squads to complete every combat mission in TB. We already had one in arena. Fluffing had 0 opportunity cost at the time that we did it.
Not sure I am missing the point tbh. Games change, meta's change, things that were important at one time are not now (I am looking at you Jawa's).
GA is tailored towards a leaner, PVP style roster, simple as that.
I still will maintain that actually farming toons and squads to help you complete missions in TW is the best way to help your guild, padding has been very widespread because it is easy and lazy
I do see your point that there was no heads up that you might need a leaner roster to be uber competitive in GA but also they don't give heads up on other things you might need (which characters you need for the next legendary), etc.
I am well aware that GA is tailored towards a leaner roster. And of course completing TB missions is still important to help your guild. No one is arguing these points. I'm also not sure what you mean by "easy and lazy". How it is "lazy" to build GP to help your guild? I would argue that those leaving their toons at g1 lvl1 are the "lazy" ones. But all of this is besides the point.
This game change is different from all previous legendary events, meta changes, etc because in all those situations, you just had to farm the appropriate toons/teams and you could catch up. In this situation, you have a permanent, unchangeable disadvantage in the form of excess GP, that will never go away. Obviously you can mitigate the disadvantage by maxing out your mods and top teams, but that doesn't change the GP problem you will always have.
I call using your resources (credits / training droids) given to you in game to level 'junk' toons to level 50, gear 6 and then not go back and improve them easy and lazy.
Actually farming the toons and then using your resources to level them to 7* level 85 G10/11/12 is more difficult and time consuming, so less appealing
Lol. Got any bigger brushes to tar that assumption with?
What do you have against undead orphans? Are you anti-undead orphan? Do you not want them to play the game? Were you knocked out of your place in arena by an undead orphan? They have as much right to play the game as anyone else!
I like how you respond to the part that is besides the point while ignoring the meat of the argument.
But if you want to debate this, ok. You're making a false comparison. The choice isn't between taking them to level 50 gear 6 and taking them to level 85 gear 11. The choice is between leaving them at level 1 gear 1 versus taking them to level 50 gear 6 (with excess resources only). For example, if someone chose to use some extra blue/green gear to make their ugnaught gear 6, would you call them lazy for not bringing him up to g12? Of course not, because we're not talking about a useful toon. Even a g12 ugnaught would have no place in grand arena.
Go ahead and take a look at my roster if you like. I have many important GA teams ready at g12, working on others. I also have a bunch of toons at lower gear levels that I threw extra resources on, to improve my GP and help the guild. These two actions are not mutually exclusive. I am not sacrificing high end toons by putting some low level gear on useless toons.
And like I said, I'm undefeated in GA so not whining. I just don't think the system is fair on principle.
https://swgoh.gg/p/875696655/
A single squad can top the scale in a competitive mode like this one. That's 100k so it doesn't have to be 500 or 400 or any of that. I love this mode but this doesn't mean that we should keep work it to come as close to perfection as we can. Don't be lazy or arrogant, small improvements can be made until wr achieve the best result, I don't get the negativity
I agree, I've had an advantage too because I was too lazy to bump up my GP for TB. It's not I don't wanna help my guild out but at the same time I don't want to waste some of that grey, green and blue gear because legendary events come and then you find yourself wasting crystals to farm grey and green pieces