Suggested, Simple, Improvement to GA Matchmaking

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Replies

  • Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Your suggestion is "git gud" without acknowledging that to develop a roster "ideal" for GA is impossible because you can't actually do anything to reset character upgrades you made over a year ago to help your guild for territory battles.

    Nope. You are still completely ignoring what I actually said.

    Nah, I read it. You're ignoring that you can't downgrade those toons. The gap can't be worked on because it can't be undone.

    I’m not ignoring it because I specifically addressed it. My point is that in spite of the fact that you can’t downgrade those characters, you can nonetheless improve your chances in GA over time by improving your roster and making those fluff characters a smaller and less relevant percentage of your GP.

    Tell me this. You say that matchmaking should only count 70 characters because only 70 characters matter in GA. That’s *your* argument right? So if only 70 characters matter and everything else is irrelevant, then isn’t it the case that if you have the ideal 70 characters to use all completely maxed out, it makes no difference what else you have or don’t have? So if you compare two people, and one has 70 great characters maxed and then 20 less-great characters at g10-11 and the rest at g1; and the second has the same great 70 characters maxed and then every other character at g6-8; and they have the same GP. According to you, this would be a fair and even match right? So then isn’t it necessarily true that if you max out those 70 characters, you’ve made up for any fluff issue?

    But you are always carrying that 'fluff'.

    I agree you can improve your chances like you state. But you can't ever get rid of it.

    Yes, you can work to minimise it, and avoid investing in any more 'useless' toons like the plague.

    But it will always disadvantage you.

    They have created an element in the game that disadvantages investment of excess gear and currency, particularly past investment that you can't change. I highly doubt this is intentional and it actively discourages investment.

    It can and should be better than this.
  • Liath
    3880 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Your suggestion is "git gud" without acknowledging that to develop a roster "ideal" for GA is impossible because you can't actually do anything to reset character upgrades you made over a year ago to help your guild for territory battles.

    Nope. You are still completely ignoring what I actually said.

    Nah, I read it. You're ignoring that you can't downgrade those toons. The gap can't be worked on because it can't be undone.

    I’m not ignoring it because I specifically addressed it. My point is that in spite of the fact that you can’t downgrade those characters, you can nonetheless improve your chances in GA over time by improving your roster and making those fluff characters a smaller and less relevant percentage of your GP.

    Tell me this. You say that matchmaking should only count 70 characters because only 70 characters matter in GA. That’s *your* argument right? So if only 70 characters matter and everything else is irrelevant, then isn’t it the case that if you have the ideal 70 characters to use all completely maxed out, it makes no difference what else you have or don’t have? So if you compare two people, and one has 70 great characters maxed and then 20 less-great characters at g10-11 and the rest at g1; and the second has the same great 70 characters maxed and then every other character at g6-8; and they have the same GP. According to you, this would be a fair and even match right? So then isn’t it necessarily true that if you max out those 70 characters, you’ve made up for any fluff issue?

    But you are always carrying that 'fluff'.

    I agree you can improve your chances like you state. But you can't ever get rid of it.

    Yes, you can work to minimise it, and avoid investing in any more 'useless' toons like the plague.

    But it will always disadvantage you.

    They have created an element in the game that disadvantages investment of excess gear and currency, particularly past investment that you can't change. I highly doubt this is intentional and it actively discourages investment.

    It can and should be better than this.

    How does it disadvantage you in my example? After all you are the one that said only 70 characters matter. So please explain to me how the gear level of characters outside of the 70 could matter if it doesn’t change how good the 70 you’re using are?
  • Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Your suggestion is "git gud" without acknowledging that to develop a roster "ideal" for GA is impossible because you can't actually do anything to reset character upgrades you made over a year ago to help your guild for territory battles.

    Nope. You are still completely ignoring what I actually said.

    Nah, I read it. You're ignoring that you can't downgrade those toons. The gap can't be worked on because it can't be undone.

    I’m not ignoring it because I specifically addressed it. My point is that in spite of the fact that you can’t downgrade those characters, you can nonetheless improve your chances in GA over time by improving your roster and making those fluff characters a smaller and less relevant percentage of your GP.

    Tell me this. You say that matchmaking should only count 70 characters because only 70 characters matter in GA. That’s *your* argument right? So if only 70 characters matter and everything else is irrelevant, then isn’t it the case that if you have the ideal 70 characters to use all completely maxed out, it makes no difference what else you have or don’t have? So if you compare two people, and one has 70 great characters maxed and then 20 less-great characters at g10-11 and the rest at g1; and the second has the same great 70 characters maxed and then every other character at g6-8; and they have the same GP. According to you, this would be a fair and even match right? So then isn’t it necessarily true that if you max out those 70 characters, you’ve made up for any fluff issue?

    But you are always carrying that 'fluff'.

    I agree you can improve your chances like you state. But you can't ever get rid of it.

    Yes, you can work to minimise it, and avoid investing in any more 'useless' toons like the plague.

    But it will always disadvantage you.

    They have created an element in the game that disadvantages investment of excess gear and currency, particularly past investment that you can't change. I highly doubt this is intentional and it actively discourages investment.

    It can and should be better than this.

    How does it disadvantage you in my example? After all you are the one that said only 70 characters matter. So please explain to me how the gear level of characters outside of the 70 could matter if it doesn’t change how good the 70 you’re using are?

    I agreed with you. I can work purely on gearing up that end of my roster, like most people do already and did before. For the most part we all focus on the top end, some just neglected the bottom.

    Im still disadvantaged because the GP mismatch of the top 70 toons is in the magnitude of over 500k at times at present.

    Im still disadvantaged because its impossible to reduce a 50+ G12 gap overnight.

    I agree, eventually I can minimise it. But its still there. By the time I have caught up to 70 G12, they still have more, although yes, it will not be as much of an issue.
  • Liath
    3880 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Your suggestion is "git gud" without acknowledging that to develop a roster "ideal" for GA is impossible because you can't actually do anything to reset character upgrades you made over a year ago to help your guild for territory battles.

    Nope. You are still completely ignoring what I actually said.

    Nah, I read it. You're ignoring that you can't downgrade those toons. The gap can't be worked on because it can't be undone.

    I’m not ignoring it because I specifically addressed it. My point is that in spite of the fact that you can’t downgrade those characters, you can nonetheless improve your chances in GA over time by improving your roster and making those fluff characters a smaller and less relevant percentage of your GP.

    Tell me this. You say that matchmaking should only count 70 characters because only 70 characters matter in GA. That’s *your* argument right? So if only 70 characters matter and everything else is irrelevant, then isn’t it the case that if you have the ideal 70 characters to use all completely maxed out, it makes no difference what else you have or don’t have? So if you compare two people, and one has 70 great characters maxed and then 20 less-great characters at g10-11 and the rest at g1; and the second has the same great 70 characters maxed and then every other character at g6-8; and they have the same GP. According to you, this would be a fair and even match right? So then isn’t it necessarily true that if you max out those 70 characters, you’ve made up for any fluff issue?

    But you are always carrying that 'fluff'.

    I agree you can improve your chances like you state. But you can't ever get rid of it.

    Yes, you can work to minimise it, and avoid investing in any more 'useless' toons like the plague.

    But it will always disadvantage you.

    They have created an element in the game that disadvantages investment of excess gear and currency, particularly past investment that you can't change. I highly doubt this is intentional and it actively discourages investment.

    It can and should be better than this.

    How does it disadvantage you in my example? After all you are the one that said only 70 characters matter. So please explain to me how the gear level of characters outside of the 70 could matter if it doesn’t change how good the 70 you’re using are?

    I agreed with you. I can work purely on gearing up that end of my roster, like most people do already and did before. For the most part we all focus on the top end, some just neglected the bottom.

    Im still disadvantaged because the GP mismatch of the top 70 toons is in the magnitude of over 500k at times at present.

    Im still disadvantaged because its impossible to reduce a 50+ G12 gap overnight.

    I agree, eventually I can minimise it. But its still there. By the time I have caught up to 70 G12, they still have more, although yes, it will not be as much of an issue.

    Will it not be “as much of an issue” or will it not be an issue at all? Because if it will be an issue at all, then your proposal to match based only on the top 70 characters is a poor one.

    I think many more than 70 characters are relevant due to different teams having different potential counters and the reasonably likely possibility of needing more than one team to take a squad out at times. So I very much dislike the idea of matching on just the top 70.
  • Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Your suggestion is "git gud" without acknowledging that to develop a roster "ideal" for GA is impossible because you can't actually do anything to reset character upgrades you made over a year ago to help your guild for territory battles.

    Nope. You are still completely ignoring what I actually said.

    Nah, I read it. You're ignoring that you can't downgrade those toons. The gap can't be worked on because it can't be undone.

    I’m not ignoring it because I specifically addressed it. My point is that in spite of the fact that you can’t downgrade those characters, you can nonetheless improve your chances in GA over time by improving your roster and making those fluff characters a smaller and less relevant percentage of your GP.

    Tell me this. You say that matchmaking should only count 70 characters because only 70 characters matter in GA. That’s *your* argument right? So if only 70 characters matter and everything else is irrelevant, then isn’t it the case that if you have the ideal 70 characters to use all completely maxed out, it makes no difference what else you have or don’t have? So if you compare two people, and one has 70 great characters maxed and then 20 less-great characters at g10-11 and the rest at g1; and the second has the same great 70 characters maxed and then every other character at g6-8; and they have the same GP. According to you, this would be a fair and even match right? So then isn’t it necessarily true that if you max out those 70 characters, you’ve made up for any fluff issue?

    But you are always carrying that 'fluff'.

    I agree you can improve your chances like you state. But you can't ever get rid of it.

    Yes, you can work to minimise it, and avoid investing in any more 'useless' toons like the plague.

    But it will always disadvantage you.

    They have created an element in the game that disadvantages investment of excess gear and currency, particularly past investment that you can't change. I highly doubt this is intentional and it actively discourages investment.

    It can and should be better than this.

    How does it disadvantage you in my example? After all you are the one that said only 70 characters matter. So please explain to me how the gear level of characters outside of the 70 could matter if it doesn’t change how good the 70 you’re using are?

    I agreed with you. I can work purely on gearing up that end of my roster, like most people do already and did before. For the most part we all focus on the top end, some just neglected the bottom.

    Im still disadvantaged because the GP mismatch of the top 70 toons is in the magnitude of over 500k at times at present.

    Im still disadvantaged because its impossible to reduce a 50+ G12 gap overnight.

    I agree, eventually I can minimise it. But its still there. By the time I have caught up to 70 G12, they still have more, although yes, it will not be as much of an issue.

    Will it not be “as much of an issue” or will it not be an issue at all? Because if it will be an issue at all, then your proposal to match based only on the top 70 characters is a poor one.

    I think many more than 70 characters are relevant due to different teams having different potential counters and the reasonably likely possibility of needing more than one team to take a squad out at times. So I very much dislike the idea of matching on just the top 70.

    I didn't suggest that was how to match, i said only that number or so actually matter, but then we'd both be focusing on semantics.

    Of course, by shifting to "laser focus" mode I can start to lessen disadvantage. But that G6 ugnaught is still there.

    Matching based upon a proportional algorithm would make this fairer. Having more nodes would work too. The OP gave some great suggestions on ways to make this a fairer system.

    The fact remains. Total GP is generating far from equal match ups. This is a result of some having lean rosters vs those who 'fluffed' to assist their guilds in 2017.

    We can't all always win. there will always be, and always should be someone with an advantage. It's healthy for the game when that is by having the latest meta toons and gives you reward and incentive for investing.

    With GA, matching is rewarding not investing in your whole roster into the future, but more importantly penalising those who did months and years ago when you can't go back.
  • Top 70 is too low I posted near the beginning of this long thread that using the GP of the top 100 would be about right. They could always even things out by keeping the GP matching as is but every 2nd GA you can only use the bottom 100 of your roster. So the top heavy rosters would be at a disadvantage. It might actually make for an interesting GA my garbage is better than your garbage.
  • Liath
    3880 posts Member
    Top 70 is too low I posted near the beginning of this long thread that using the GP of the top 100 would be about right. They could always even things out by keeping the GP matching as is but every 2nd GA you can only use the bottom 100 of your roster. So the top heavy rosters would be at a disadvantage. It might actually make for an interesting GA my garbage is better than your garbage.

    Could be fun, although creating coherent teams could be an issue. After this debacle with TW they’d probably be gunshy about such a thing I imagine.
  • I agree about the GW if they wanted to limit a meta each war i think people would understand but voting for those choices was terrible. If they wanted to play with characters they should do it in GA and not GW where the rewards are much better. I know they are trying to change things up so not to be too stale but I think they are looking in the wrong places. I personally would like to see TB changed up. We have a Hoth TB how about a Clone Wars TB, Change ROLO for Padme and Probe Droid for Droideka. Rotate those for a year then maybe add a FO vs Resistance the following year and rotate them each month.
  • Liath
    3880 posts Member
    I agree about the GW if they wanted to limit a meta each war i think people would understand but voting for those choices was terrible. If they wanted to play with characters they should do it in GA and not GW where the rewards are much better. I know they are trying to change things up so not to be too stale but I think they are looking in the wrong places. I personally would like to see TB changed up. We have a Hoth TB how about a Clone Wars TB, Change ROLO for Padme and Probe Droid for Droideka. Rotate those for a year then maybe add a FO vs Resistance the following year and rotate them each month.

    I thought this was the idea when TB launched and I am disappointed that after a year we still don’t have a new TB map. Part of the issue would be how often each one runs to allow everyone an opportunity to finish the reward characters and to eventually get the max star achievements. When they added the tank raid the intial idea was that it would use the same tickets and guilds would have to pick which raid to run, which would have been a big mess. I’m not sure what the best way is to deal with that issue.

    (Sorry, we are getting pretty far off topic here.)
  • I want a GA where everyone has every character unlocked as an "event" unit with the same gear and mods and abilities. And it's up to you to choose what to put on defense. Imagine having literally every character maxed at your disposal and see which player has the best strategy with everyone having equal characters.

    Kinda like the game hanger accounts, but for everyone. At least once.
  • Waqui
    5359 posts Member
    The issue is we were encouraged to invest excess gear and currency into these toons in July 2017.

    Investing in your roster has never been a disadvantage. A waste of time maybe, but never a disadvantage until grand arena. And you cant go back.

    Already with the introduction of TW "fluff GP" could give your guild a stronger opponent. It was also a disadvantage (during match-making) in TW.

  • Waqui wrote: »
    The issue is we were encouraged to invest excess gear and currency into these toons in July 2017.

    Investing in your roster has never been a disadvantage. A waste of time maybe, but never a disadvantage until grand arena. And you cant go back.

    Already with the introduction of TW "fluff GP" could give your guild a stronger opponent. It was also a disadvantage (during match-making) in TW.

    Sort of. It doesn't have quite the same magnitude of impact spread across 50 rosters compared to 1v1 in grand arena.

    I'm still not clear why fine tuning a matching algorithm to create fairer, closer and more even matches is a bad thing
  • My roster was a bit all over the place. Since GA came out I have worked on my squads. In 100000 GP things have improved a lot. In all GA I came in 2nd - 4th. I am fine with that.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    But you want to lessen their advantage because you made different choices. We all had the same opportunity to develop, some had a more competitive focus, due to many factors, but nothing is stopping you now from developing to accomplish your goals.

    1) before GA there was no reason to focus your GP. if you were a good guy, you should have increase your GP to help in TB and make your guild get more zeta in TW.
    you can imagine that for the 1% better guild, now that they get all stars in TB and have max reward in TW it is better to focus, but you cant plan that too early without the guild loosing a lot during a year.
    Taking all your toons to 50, skill 3, gear 7 costs just nothing and is a great improvement to guild GP.

    2) "nothing is stopping you now from developing to accomplish your goals". well, i missed the button to ungear, unlevel unskil all my toons to suppress that useless GP. If he exists i will press it without even asking for refund. cos it cost nothing...so yes something really stop me from reach such a goal. and it s totally unfair.

    3) it is really not a question of how you spend your ressource because as i said gear/level/skill cost nothing , and for the shards i choose to farm to be ready for any event, i just have to not activate toon i dont use with 300/25 shards waiting for event, as i do know to be more competitive.
  • Waqui
    5359 posts Member
    Kazeb wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    But you want to lessen their advantage because you made different choices. We all had the same opportunity to develop, some had a more competitive focus, due to many factors, but nothing is stopping you now from developing to accomplish your goals.

    1) before GA there was no reason to focus your GP. if you were a good guy, you should have increase your GP to help in TB and make your guild get more zeta in TW.

    Having a lot of 'fluff GP' would also result in higher GP opponents in TW. If those opponents had little or no 'fluff GP", your guild would be at a disadvantage - just like you are as an individual player in GA.
    Fluff GP always has that effect in TW - just like it does in GA now.
  • Taejang wrote: »
    The arenas favor people with complete teams, yes. That doesn't mean the person with the fewest maxed out characters will win, it means people with the right characters who are maxed out will win. At your GP level, that's somewhat close to the same thing, but you're free to continue to develop additional characters once your arena teams are geared, without it somehow impacting your arena ranking. Your GP level is very low though, and that will change significantly.
    Funny thing about this game, 750k GP is considered "very low" by just about everyone, even though it has taken me three months of daily play to get here, often hours a day. Obviously in an absolute sense, 750k is waaay lower than 3-4 million, and three months much less than two years or whatnot. I get the feeling CG spends little to no time on content or testing for my "stage" in the game.

    Which to some degree makes sense. CG's revenue is likely coming from accounts with much higher GP than mine. Some pretty questionable design choices in the low-end content though. GA's matchmaking might be another one of those choices that simply wasn't thought out for folks at my stage.

    I suspect in a few months time, you'll be in the below 1.25million category and be pleased that the longer experience is what CG are thinking about?

    The difference in experience between someone whose advised by a friend, get Phoenix and someone determined to make Chewie/Talia/Farm Luke work is already huge. I think we're lucky that on the whole there's a lot of very organised line/discord guilds who do a great job of teaching.

    But without CG advertising IGNORE EVERYTHING, Don't level anything you don't need to, get phoenix.
    This problem is always going to be there. It's pretty balanced, TB, TW encourages high guild GP, GA encourages low. Choose your game mode.
    Keyboard Warrior on the side of the Moderates
    I play the game for fun, if you don't like content, don't like the game, then why are you here?
  • kdcoki5goasd.jpg

    I'm a perfect example of a "bloated" roster. I chose to play the game this way, and simply never cared about arenas or trying to be competitive.

    Point of fact, I'm not overly concerned about GA either, but had to say one thing; any suggestion that I could eventually 'fix' this roster for GA is completely a joke.

    Even if I did stop just gear up for GA, by the time I did, my GP is just that much higher still, and in the time it took, those hyper focused players have also increased theirs. The problem DOES NOT change.
    ObiShenobi
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  • Waqui wrote: »
    Kazeb wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    But you want to lessen their advantage because you made different choices. We all had the same opportunity to develop, some had a more competitive focus, due to many factors, but nothing is stopping you now from developing to accomplish your goals.

    1) before GA there was no reason to focus your GP. if you were a good guy, you should have increase your GP to help in TB and make your guild get more zeta in TW.

    Having a lot of 'fluff GP' would also result in higher GP opponents in TW. If those opponents had little or no 'fluff GP", your guild would be at a disadvantage - just like you are as an individual player in GA.
    Fluff GP always has that effect in TW - just like it does in GA now.

    When you are a medium guild under 120m you want fluff gp to get better reward. You get better reward by loosing with bad gp than winning with less gp. And as every guild in this range did the same you have quite the same win/loss ratio.
  • in fact you could say that the same matchmaking prob with TW was solved by the upscaling reward.
    the problem with GA may be more the reward than the matchmaking. if the rewards were better as your gp raise, nobody would try to lower his gp to have easier matchup and nobody will complain about the matchmaking.
    And nobody would explain that such sandbagging is "ressource management".
  • Kazeb wrote: »
    in fact you could say that the same matchmaking prob with TW was solved by the upscaling reward.
    the problem with GA may be more the reward than the matchmaking. if the rewards were better as your gp raise, nobody would try to lower his gp to have easier matchup and nobody will complain about the matchmaking.
    And nobody would explain that such sandbagging is "ressource management".

    I wholeheartedly agree with this. Therefore you feel less punished for having a fluffier roster because at least it bumps you up a reward tier.
  • DuneSeaFarmer
    2933 posts Member
    edited January 23
    wrong forum
    Post edited by DuneSeaFarmer on
    Leader: Grey Area 51 - My Squads: https://swgoh.gg/p/716522998/
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Vertigo wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    But why shouldnt people with a laser focus on being competitive get an advantage?

    People with a laser focus will still have an advantage, the standard g8 7* toon has around 12,000 power. Making the cutoff at like 10k power would hold out mostly gear 7 and below and wouldn't make people who used some characters to learn how to play the game early on get harder matchups because they took more toons to learn how to play the game. But would still cause people with excessively inflated GP rosters to have a disadvantage as those gear 8 toons would still be counted in.

    But you want to lessen their advantage because you made different choices. We all had the same opportunity to develop, some had a more competitive focus, due to many factors, but nothing is stopping you now from developing to accomplish your goals.
    The bolded is incorrect, as it presumes several things:

    1) It presumes that all players started playing at the same time, with the same events presented at the same intervals. That's far from true. Many launch players are carrying roster "bloat" from events and metas that have never even existed for newer players.

    2) It also presumes that they are matched up against people that just made different choices. But that's not true either. Since those players can't ungear or unlevel those now useless characters, they can't "undo" that bloat. As such, they have to be significantly better than the similar GP opponents they face to even have a chance.

    I've said it in another thread, but I think it bears repeating here:

    If the intention of GA is simply (like the poorly designed, top-heavy, HSith rewards) to handout more and better gear to whales, then fine. F2P players simply have to live with it and consider that when deciding how to rate the game in Apple/Google store and how long to keep playing.

    If, however, the purpose of GA is to be a fun and competitive game mode for similarly rostered players, the matchup algorithm is off. And I would be curious as to how many people defending the current model have Revan. But that's a different thread.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

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  • I agree about the GW if they wanted to limit a meta each war i think people would understand but voting for those choices was terrible. If they wanted to play with characters they should do it in GA and not GW where the rewards are much better. I know they are trying to change things up so not to be too stale but I think they are looking in the wrong places. I personally would like to see TB changed up. We have a Hoth TB how about a Clone Wars TB, Change ROLO for Padme and Probe Droid for Droideka. Rotate those for a year then maybe add a FO vs Resistance the following year and rotate them each month.

    Would this not encourage fluff for GA..now those mean lean roster will scream "unfair, I built for competition. You need to change this so as to be fair to all those in the community even for those with competitive roosters".

    I think this is a great idea..I say let's do it. I'm on board. Just be sure to make the rewards for them as valuable as they are in GA..with the lower scores having huge disparity vs higher rewards.
  • ObiShenobi wrote: »
    kdcoki5goasd.jpg


    Even if I did stop just gear up for GA, by the time I did, my GP is just that much higher still, and in the time it took, those hyper focused players have also increased theirs. The problem DOES NOT change.

    Exactly, you can not undo what has been done or is being done..but you can still make it fair within the classes of players each with thier own rewards. The guys on top will forever remain on top as they are getting the best rewards those on bottom will remain on bottom because they are not. Lumping them all together unless you constantly place in Top 4, demoralized all moral.
  • If you are looking for more ideas how about this... continue to make matches strictly on GP...then leave it up to both competitive players to split thier entire roster into 2... attack force and a defense force..set the defense. And then if a squad makes a successful defense stance remove both of them award the banners to the defender. If it is a successful attack award the banners to the attacker. Next match..same thing. Should some squads remain award banners for any remaining squad. And then at the end of Match tally up banners and decide the winner. All characters...1 chance. Win or lose..gp vs gp. Then we can discuss better strategy ..who built better teams and toons who is really worth thier GP. I'm betting this isn't going to be a popular idea with those who failed to properly fill out level up and gear all thier toons to 7*. But here in the present the reverse is happening in this way, it is fair but not the other way. Or would match making be changed quickly to make the matches fair..for those that didn't properly fill out there entire rosters.
  • The main issue as I see it is a paper zombie issue. For two years there was 0 reason not to gain as much as you could. GP was your "worth" to a guild to a degree. Then we needed all the toons for TB platoons (get 'em all starred up so your guild can compete!") as well as older players having to farm Jawas and such for mods. Now suddenly it's a min/max thing where if it's not a toon that's useful in a typical team, it's a detriment to your account and everybody is all, "Well you should have thought of that before you leveled up those useless toons...i mean, jawas? Really?!? Sheesh... have some dignity, man."
    Cogito ergo sum... Cogito. (I think, therefore I am... I think)
  • Kyno
    20760 posts Moderator
    The main issue as I see it is a paper zombie issue. For two years there was 0 reason not to gain as much as you could. GP was your "worth" to a guild to a degree. Then we needed all the toons for TB platoons (get 'em all starred up so your guild can compete!") as well as older players having to farm Jawas and such for mods. Now suddenly it's a min/max thing where if it's not a toon that's useful in a typical team, it's a detriment to your account and everybody is all, "Well you should have thought of that before you leveled up those useless toons...i mean, jawas? Really?!? Sheesh... have some dignity, man."

    That is not necessarily true. There were many reasons to not just go for max GP. Would you waste resources on a toon you dont use? TW was newer but also offered the same situation as GA, more GP didnt help you there unless it was focused.

    As it stands, the only reason to gain GP and spend those resources (without consideration for effectiveness) was TB, and that only helped to a certain extent, there is a point where GP wouldnt gain you another star, you just got into a no man's land of the in between stars. At that point it makes more sense to focus your resources to teams that offer the most benefit from an in game perspective, which means they have combat usefulness.
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