Changing the meta will be alot more challenging than you think!

Prev1
Most players are unhappy with the current situation in arena and that's a fact. Revan has ruined diversity and mirror matches are long, unpredictable and tedious. You clearly have to update arena pretty soon but this will be a much more challenging task than most people recognize.

The fact is that even if you come up with a squad that beats Revan 100% of the time and Revan cannot easily beat on offense, what ever this squad may be it will have a p2p element into it.

Most players won't have access to that squad for 3-5 months so they will simply keep using Revan. Diversity may occur in the top 20-30 but all the way up from 30s to 100 it's going to be just Revan because he still remains the number 2 best squad in this scenario and number 3 is long ways from matching him.

A big part of the community will be stuck with Revan mirror matches for months to come and that is certainly going to raise alot of frustration.

With this in mind you will eventually end up having to release additional support to help tier 3 teams like Traya and CLS, beat Revan who will be tier 2 at the time. You really got yourselves in a rough spot because of how much you overloaded Revan's kit to have an answer to everything. You have a very difficult road ahead of you.

Replies

  • Options
    Maybe they can just nerf Revan
  • Options
    Maybe they can just nerf Revan

    I think this will be the only way, I just hope that when they nerf him they will find a way to make it so that it only affects pvp and not raids. My personal suggestion is to start with Jolee and not Revan. His ability to revive all fallen Jedi with pretty much max HP and crit avoidance is incredibly broken, of it wasn't for Jolee, CLS would definitely be more popular in arena
  • Options
    It could be as simple as some kind of positive effect for an opponent gaining buffs or attacking out of turn or a negative effect for the opponent like tm gain/loss
  • Options
    Offense penalty for Out-of-Turn attacks(penalty larger for Jedi preferably), and a big damage hits with Heal Immune that reappear when cleansed(like OB Taunt) can be enough IMO.
  • Dk_rek
    3299 posts Member
    edited February 2019
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    Prob will see every opponent takes 5% max health damage every time a buff is applied kills revan teams and a few others but still totally beatable by teams not relying on 35 buffs to win a match

    But much like the overkill cg rolls with that same team will get aoe deathmark cannot be evaded and +200 speed to open match so 2 clicks its over but hey its fast right lol
  • Options
    Offense penalty for Out-of-Turn attacks(penalty larger for Jedi preferably), and a big damage hits with Heal Immune that reappear when cleansed(like OB Taunt) can be enough IMO.

    Traya already has a significant out of turn penalty, it's not doing anything
  • Options
    Simple solution: deathmark that can’t be cleansed.

    That neutralizes Jolee
  • HK666
    1263 posts Member
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    I agree that Bindo is what makes Revan so dominant. Why not build a team that punishes revives?

    Something like- every time a unit is revived (or hits 1% health, maybe), the team gets 30% tm, health, protection, offense up

    While it's anti-Revan and might struggle with teams like Traya and CLS, they did release NS, who were anti-single target team
  • RandomSithLord
    2325 posts Member
    edited February 2019
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    The problem is not changing the meta in the near future. There are several suggestions above that could put Revan in the corner with a simple line, without using a small novel to describe each ability.
    The fact that we are in this situation after three years and there's a plan for another five seems a more severe problem to me. That's a lot of meta teams, and each of them should topple the previous one, not just beat it by a slight edge.
  • Options
    I'm intrigued by your first sentence. How have you proven this fact?
  • Options
    CHFC22 wrote: »
    I'm intrigued by your first sentence. How have you proven this fact?

    Because I speak to my guildmates and my shard mates about this, alot of complains not much support of the current meta. Everyone seems to be annoyed by the Revan mirror matches
  • Options
    CHFC22 wrote: »
    I'm intrigued by your first sentence. How have you proven this fact?

    Because I speak to my guildmates and my shard mates about this, alot of complains not much support of the current meta. Everyone seems to be annoyed by the Revan mirror matches

    I suspected as much but that absolutely does not make it a fact. Don't be one of those who turns anecdotal evidence into objective fact - this place is plagued by it.
  • Options
    CHFC22 wrote: »
    I'm intrigued by your first sentence. How have you proven this fact?

    Because I speak to my guildmates and my shard mates about this, alot of complains not much support of the current meta. Everyone seems to be annoyed by the Revan mirror matches

    As an aside, have you also checked how many are running Revan despite complaining? There's no better way of supporting a character than by using it. Revan can de demonstrably proven to be popular at the top end of the arena, and so if people really hate him that much they'd stop using him as @Crazygone510 and others have done. Enough people do it and rankings may even be relatively protected. If not, it just means they care about their arena ranking more than diversity. You get plenty of diversity at lower ranks, so it's there depending on your priorities. What you're unlikely ever to get is a meta not being overridingly popular in the top 20/50/100. Revan may be more so, but in my 2 years of bothering the top 100 and latterly top 50, there's always been a sea of something. Personally, I'll never get over the original CLS meta (who I didn't use) and Bastilla (who I did).
  • Options
    Yeah they can always reveal fixes to bugs no one suspected.....
  • Options
    This was very much foreseeable the day Revan was released. When I voiced that opinion people lynched me as if I was asking for a nerf (I wasn't and still am not). This is not a sustainable way to release meta characters. GG provided them with a good chance to mitigate the situation a bit by providing a middle road (it still may be against Darth Gammorean meta that's about to drop).
  • Options
    It's all power creep, they went nuts with Traya, then they went even more nuts with Chewbacca and 3PO to beat Traya, then they went even more nuts to beat both with Revan. Everyone knew Revan wasn't healthy for the game but you gotta understand the whales didn't care, the whales wanted Revan badly to beat any f2p who would dare compete for the top, Revan was the best thing for them. And when they go further nuts to come up with a character to beat Revan, we will know again that it's going to be unhealthy but the whales will love and defend it like their life depends on it, because it's going to secure their payouts once more. It's just how it works and you must accept it and move on.

    They said they have a 5 year plan for the game, the game could go on for 15 if they had the mentality of monthly nerfing and buffing and balancing, monthly patching, different squads constantly rotating in the meta, but they know 5 is too many because of how the power creep is growing. It's all mathematically calculated.
  • Options
    It's all power creep, they went nuts with Traya, then they went even more nuts with Chewbacca and 3PO to beat Traya, then they went even more nuts to beat both with Revan. Everyone knew Revan wasn't healthy for the game but you gotta understand the whales didn't care, the whales wanted Revan badly to beat any f2p who would dare compete for the top, Revan was the best thing for them. And when they go further nuts to come up with a character to beat Revan, we will know again that it's going to be unhealthy but the whales will love and defend it like their life depends on it, because it's going to secure their payouts once more. It's just how it works and you must accept it and move on.

    They said they have a 5 year plan for the game, the game could go on for 15 if they had the mentality of monthly nerfing and buffing and balancing, monthly patching, different squads constantly rotating in the meta, but they know 5 is too many because of how the power creep is growing. It's all mathematically calculated.

    Throughout these metas, very little changed in my shard. Noone had to forego their top 3 capability. Have-nots dropped further and climbed harder, but everyone are still getting their payouts. And similarly only very few of those who bought Revan in hopes of getting high spots got there. So I don't see your thesis in action.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    Options
    It's all power creep, they went nuts with Traya, then they went even more nuts with Chewbacca and 3PO to beat Traya, then they went even more nuts to beat both with Revan. Everyone knew Revan wasn't healthy for the game but you gotta understand the whales didn't care, the whales wanted Revan badly to beat any f2p who would dare compete for the top, Revan was the best thing for them. And when they go further nuts to come up with a character to beat Revan, we will know again that it's going to be unhealthy but the whales will love and defend it like their life depends on it, because it's going to secure their payouts once more. It's just how it works and you must accept it and move on.

    They said they have a 5 year plan for the game, the game could go on for 15 if they had the mentality of monthly nerfing and buffing and balancing, monthly patching, different squads constantly rotating in the meta, but they know 5 is too many because of how the power creep is growing. It's all mathematically calculated.

    You seem to think whales are your enemy, they're not. They pay top dollar for temporary advantages that can easily be overcome by non-paying players. If anything they deserve a bigger advantage imo.
    I'd also like to point out that revan is making f2p players way more competative now than to p2p players at the time. People love to complain about only seeying revans, but they love using him even more.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • casper1jr
    175 posts Member
    edited February 2019
    Options
    You hardly see an Raven past rank 200, use another squad lol. When you chase ranks, you'll always be unhappy. Try playing for fun and sit around rank 200 and win 5/5 each day. Stress free solution.

    Disclaimer, if you get offended by my post, please go outside and get some vitamin d as there's more to life then a game lol
  • Juzz
    366 posts Member
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    What I do not get is the obsession with arena that most ppl have.

    This game is much more than just Arena

    The difference in crystal revenues between a 500-1000 rank and a 51-100 rank is 50 crystals but the investment needed to get to 51-100 is much bigger than that small crystal payment as 50 crystals is just 1 refresh of energy.

    I really don't get why Arena seems to be the one and only important thing.

    Raids, TB, TW and overall improvement of my account gets me much more satisfaction than 5 arena matches a day.
    Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain
  • Options
    50*365= 18250 which is kind of significant
  • Juzz
    366 posts Member
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    50*365= 18250 which is kind of significant

    Oh yes, the same amount you can get from fleet arena on 21-50 which is far easier to obtain and maintain because ppl are obsessed with character arena and neglect ships cause it makes you put resources on character-arena useless chars.

    I never got on 51-100 character arena rank, but I've been more than a year on 20 and, lately, 21-50 ship arena.

    Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain
  • Options
    Juzz wrote: »
    50*365= 18250 which is kind of significant

    Oh yes, the same amount you can get from fleet arena on 21-50 which is far easier to obtain and maintain because ppl are obsessed with character arena and neglect ships cause it makes you put resources on character-arena useless chars.

    I never got on 51-100 character arena rank, but I've been more than a year on 20 and, lately, 21-50 ship arena.

    Ideally you get to do both
  • Options
    If you are bored with Revan mirror matches, choose a different team to attack with! There are teams out there that can reliably beat Revan on offense, so build one of those!
  • Options
    If you are bored with Revan mirror matches, choose a different team to attack with! There are teams out there that can reliably beat Revan on offense, so build one of those!

    Well a couple issues with that, I've already been doing this, I some times use Traya to battle him but that is annoying because I need to remod all the time. Also I must swap them out to put Revan on defense overnight, otherwise I'll drop too many ranks which isn't efficient
  • Options
    I finally moved my mods off my CLS team to my g12 Revan (and yes, I feel dirty) just to see what all the fuss was about. So now I fight mirror matches with my 300+ speed Revan and I can put it on auto with 2 minutes lefts and still time out. Great work CG!

    I thought they didn't like time out teams (hence the Barris 2nd nerf). Oh well, maybe after 4+ years, they'll hire someone on the development team that actually plays this game. lol.

    What a joke.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
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