Return Simming Slider to 1

Replies

  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Vendi1983 wrote: »
    Common sense practice would be to set the default to the safest possible option. In this case, safest possible option is 1 sim. There's no accident in simming once by muscle-memory clicking. Yeah it'll be frustrating that you have to do it again and then adjust the slider, but it's better than what they gave us. Particularly after years of it being the opposite.

    I had max cantina energy saved for the next Guild Activity and went to do one attempt to keep me under the 144. Instead I did 9 and all that potential guild currency awarded tomorrow is gone.

    Wouldnt common sense push a default to the most commonly used choice? From a UX perspective that would make the most sense. Just like leaving the last node used as the selected node when entering a table, even though the person may not always hit that piece of gear of toon first, it still makes more sense than to set it to a low energy node, which would be the "safest".

    I think Vendi is trying to say that although the bar is set to max attempts which saves time for a good amount of players, it’s unsafe, as we can see that people are accidentally hitting max when they don’t want to waste all their energy. Muscle memory exists, and we can see that this is happening. What would make sense is to set the slider to 1, as it was previously, which is the most protective of the players energy. If someone wanting max attempts accidentally hits sim 1, there is no reason to worry, it’s just a little extra work to do it again. As we’ve seen from multiple sources in this thread, the number of sims done at a time should not matter, rewards should be relatively the same. Others have shown that less sims at a time leads to more rewards. Either way, setting the slider to 1 guarantees the safest default for all players. I know that moving the slider every time can be annoying, I’m lazy too. But I’d rather have the option that protects my energy the most, so that I can’t destroy myself with muscle memory. An even better fix would be adding a “Max Sim” button.

    The statement was made in a general sense, which is why my response was also. When we develop a product for our customers, there is always a run through of what the defaults should be, and many of them are not what we think they should be, due to the feedback from what our customers will want to see or use more often. I know this is not safety related (safety related things in my work are not up for debate), but from a UX standpoint, the interface should either be setup or to some extent customizable to what they customer would normally want to do. In many cases there will be a majority, and you will not be able to please everyone, but customization options can help.

    So you’re saying that EA/CG prefers shortcuts over safety? I also think a customizable option is best, and I normally sim at max, but why not, from a reliable business standpoint, choose a safer option that protects player money? Just a question, I’m not trying to hate on EA/CG. I’m also a noob, so what is a UX standpoint?

    No, I am not saying anything about safety because this is not a safety issue.

    Because at no point does this become a dangerous option, and if it is, they are only now able to evaluate this data. This in no way effects a players money, they are not spending money when using a sim.

    UX, is user experience. (Sorry)
  • Nihion
    3340 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Vendi1983 wrote: »
    Common sense practice would be to set the default to the safest possible option. In this case, safest possible option is 1 sim. There's no accident in simming once by muscle-memory clicking. Yeah it'll be frustrating that you have to do it again and then adjust the slider, but it's better than what they gave us. Particularly after years of it being the opposite.

    I had max cantina energy saved for the next Guild Activity and went to do one attempt to keep me under the 144. Instead I did 9 and all that potential guild currency awarded tomorrow is gone.

    Wouldnt common sense push a default to the most commonly used choice? From a UX perspective that would make the most sense. Just like leaving the last node used as the selected node when entering a table, even though the person may not always hit that piece of gear of toon first, it still makes more sense than to set it to a low energy node, which would be the "safest".

    I think Vendi is trying to say that although the bar is set to max attempts which saves time for a good amount of players, it’s unsafe, as we can see that people are accidentally hitting max when they don’t want to waste all their energy. Muscle memory exists, and we can see that this is happening. What would make sense is to set the slider to 1, as it was previously, which is the most protective of the players energy. If someone wanting max attempts accidentally hits sim 1, there is no reason to worry, it’s just a little extra work to do it again. As we’ve seen from multiple sources in this thread, the number of sims done at a time should not matter, rewards should be relatively the same. Others have shown that less sims at a time leads to more rewards. Either way, setting the slider to 1 guarantees the safest default for all players. I know that moving the slider every time can be annoying, I’m lazy too. But I’d rather have the option that protects my energy the most, so that I can’t destroy myself with muscle memory. An even better fix would be adding a “Max Sim” button.

    The statement was made in a general sense, which is why my response was also. When we develop a product for our customers, there is always a run through of what the defaults should be, and many of them are not what we think they should be, due to the feedback from what our customers will want to see or use more often. I know this is not safety related (safety related things in my work are not up for debate), but from a UX standpoint, the interface should either be setup or to some extent customizable to what they customer would normally want to do. In many cases there will be a majority, and you will not be able to please everyone, but customization options can help.

    So you’re saying that EA/CG prefers shortcuts over safety? I also think a customizable option is best, and I normally sim at max, but why not, from a reliable business standpoint, choose a safer option that protects player money? Just a question, I’m not trying to hate on EA/CG. I’m also a noob, so what is a UX standpoint?

    No, I am not saying anything about safety because this is not a safety issue.

    Because at no point does this become a dangerous option, and if it is, they are only now able to evaluate this data. This in no way effects a players money, they are not spending money when using a sim.

    UX, is user experience. (Sorry)

    No need to apologize, I’ve just never been informed.

    If I accidentally lose all my energy with this fix, doesn’t that mean I have to spend crystals, which are most available through tangible money, to replenish it? Or are we not factoring in that effect? If so, wouldn’t that bring this argument to protecting the resources of the player base?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Vendi1983 wrote: »
    Common sense practice would be to set the default to the safest possible option. In this case, safest possible option is 1 sim. There's no accident in simming once by muscle-memory clicking. Yeah it'll be frustrating that you have to do it again and then adjust the slider, but it's better than what they gave us. Particularly after years of it being the opposite.

    I had max cantina energy saved for the next Guild Activity and went to do one attempt to keep me under the 144. Instead I did 9 and all that potential guild currency awarded tomorrow is gone.

    Wouldnt common sense push a default to the most commonly used choice? From a UX perspective that would make the most sense. Just like leaving the last node used as the selected node when entering a table, even though the person may not always hit that piece of gear of toon first, it still makes more sense than to set it to a low energy node, which would be the "safest".

    I think Vendi is trying to say that although the bar is set to max attempts which saves time for a good amount of players, it’s unsafe, as we can see that people are accidentally hitting max when they don’t want to waste all their energy. Muscle memory exists, and we can see that this is happening. What would make sense is to set the slider to 1, as it was previously, which is the most protective of the players energy. If someone wanting max attempts accidentally hits sim 1, there is no reason to worry, it’s just a little extra work to do it again. As we’ve seen from multiple sources in this thread, the number of sims done at a time should not matter, rewards should be relatively the same. Others have shown that less sims at a time leads to more rewards. Either way, setting the slider to 1 guarantees the safest default for all players. I know that moving the slider every time can be annoying, I’m lazy too. But I’d rather have the option that protects my energy the most, so that I can’t destroy myself with muscle memory. An even better fix would be adding a “Max Sim” button.

    The statement was made in a general sense, which is why my response was also. When we develop a product for our customers, there is always a run through of what the defaults should be, and many of them are not what we think they should be, due to the feedback from what our customers will want to see or use more often. I know this is not safety related (safety related things in my work are not up for debate), but from a UX standpoint, the interface should either be setup or to some extent customizable to what they customer would normally want to do. In many cases there will be a majority, and you will not be able to please everyone, but customization options can help.

    So you’re saying that EA/CG prefers shortcuts over safety? I also think a customizable option is best, and I normally sim at max, but why not, from a reliable business standpoint, choose a safer option that protects player money? Just a question, I’m not trying to hate on EA/CG. I’m also a noob, so what is a UX standpoint?

    No, I am not saying anything about safety because this is not a safety issue.

    Because at no point does this become a dangerous option, and if it is, they are only now able to evaluate this data. This in no way effects a players money, they are not spending money when using a sim.

    UX, is user experience. (Sorry)

    No need to apologize, I’ve just never been informed.

    If I accidentally lose all my energy with this fix, doesn’t that mean I have to spend crystals, which are most available through tangible money, to replenish it? Or are we not factoring in that effect? If so, wouldn’t that bring this argument to protecting the resources of the player base?

    No it doesnt mean you have to, it is still your choice, and for many players the source of those crystals is arena, which means free. (Many P2P players are not made of money throwing it down at the drop of a hat, some of us still managing things very closely in an effort to minimize spending. Arena is a source of crystals for everyone)

    I'm not trying to diminish the issue, but we have all had things in life and in games that change, and we just need to learn and adapt. Yes those first few mistakes sting, but that knee **** reaction of this is bad, doesnt always make that true.
  • Terzana
    19 posts Member
    edited March 2019
    Nihion wrote: »

    I think this fix shocked Terzana into reality, so they are just sharing their view of the devs before they came to the dark truth of the forums.

    I came in here because every couple of years the devs do something so out there, so blatantly greedy, that I just have to say something lol.

    I just hate that they are ruining this game with greed. I love this game, darn it, lol. I don't want to have to start over with a new game. I want them to stop being greedy. It's how every game gets ruined. Greed greed greed.

    I didn't complain when they made it an option to buy toons. Or every piece of gear lol. Or mods lol. I am not a ftp player. But when I spend, I want it to be my choice. Not a sneaky, underhanded, move, meant to cheat players out of even more money.



    Post edited by Terzana on
  • Nihion
    3340 posts Member
    Terzana wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »

    I think this fix shocked Terzana into reality, so they are just sharing their view of the devs before they came to the dark truth of the forums.

    I came in here because every couple of years the devs do something so out there, so blatantly greedy, that I just have to say something lol.

    I just hate that they are ruining this game with greed. I love this game, darn it, lol. I don't want to have to start over with a new game. I want them to stop being greedy. It's how every game gets ruined. Greed greed greed.

    I didn't complain when they made it an option to buy toons. Or every piece of gear lol. Or mods lol. I am not a ftp player. But when I spend, I want it to be my choice. Not a sneaky, underhanded, move, meant to cheat players out of even more money.

    Oh.. And never mind leef, lol. He's my new stalker, lol.

    You lol a lot. It’s intriguing.

    This game and most games (sadly) have been intertwined with corporate greed since the beginning. But I love this game too. I mean, where else can I satisfy my Star Wars needs, lol.
  • Nihion wrote: »
    Terzana wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »


    You lol a lot. It’s intriguing.

    This game and most games (sadly) have been intertwined with corporate greed since the beginning. But I love this game too. I mean, where else can I satisfy my Star Wars needs, lol.

    It's not real laughter. Sometimes it is, but not always. I'm told I have an abrupt way of writing that offends peeps when I'm trying to make them laugh or think. I love debate, but peeps can think I'm angry when I'm not. I add the lol to imply it's supposed to be humorous, or not serious.

    I just had to apologise on another thread. I have to a lot, lol. And I really did lol just then :)
  • Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    CazNeerg wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    CazNeerg wrote: »
    Common sense, if they won't give us a toggle, would dictate defaulting to the most popular option, whether it's safest or not.
    Yeah, you try telling that to the FDA or the FAA when you are trying to get safety-critical software cerfitifed. :D

    Really, you are going to compare QoL features in a mobile game to *actual* safety? You don't think different standards apply?
    Just using a counterpoint to illustrate the ridiculousness of your statement.

    Of course you don't ignore safety in favor of a QoL usability feature, particularly one as contentious as this.

    What's ridiculous is even using the word safety in relation to features in a game.

    As for the theory that this is about "tricking people" into spending crystals, that is completely absurd. The most likely explanation for this change is that their metrics tell them that max simming is what most players are doing most of the time, and they actually believed it would help most players enjoy the game more if they made this change. Do they care about our enjoyment for it's own sake? Of course not, but happy people are more likely to keep playing.
  • At least give a button so we can switch it back and forth between max and 1
  • I like this change, cuz I spend always SIM to the maximum.
    But players that hate this change got some point.
    When you SIM a battle by mistake, you lose more when default for SIM is at max. Also when you do only 3 battles for the daily missions, it’s easier to slide to 3 from 1 - only two taps needed - than 3 from max -number of tapping changes every time - so it’s more convenient.
    Maybe default at 1 SIM with Max SIM button would be better than default at max SIM. But if have to choose between default 1 SIM and default max SIM, I’d choose the latter one without a moment of hesitation.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Vendi1983 wrote: »
    Common sense practice would be to set the default to the safest possible option. In this case, safest possible option is 1 sim. There's no accident in simming once by muscle-memory clicking. Yeah it'll be frustrating that you have to do it again and then adjust the slider, but it's better than what they gave us. Particularly after years of it being the opposite.

    I had max cantina energy saved for the next Guild Activity and went to do one attempt to keep me under the 144. Instead I did 9 and all that potential guild currency awarded tomorrow is gone.

    Wouldnt common sense push a default to the most commonly used choice? From a UX perspective that would make the most sense. Just like leaving the last node used as the selected node when entering a table, even though the person may not always hit that piece of gear of toon first, it still makes more sense than to set it to a low energy node, which would be the "safest".

    Random is a concept. Once you write code to emulate a random event, it is no longer random. QED :)
  • Slide it backwards, you can do, I believe in you
  • It would be nice to have something like a "prefered setting".
    For example 1,2,3,.. & max
    Not sure how much work is needed to implement this but it would calm down a lot of players.
  • Guys. Why don't you just be careful before hitting the sim button? I prefer the slider at max.
  • ctyc123
    328 posts Member
    Yes return it... During daily reset I just wish to do a few battles so I can wake up the next day to complete my 600 after 6-7 hours of energy gain... I'm sure many people are like me.

    Whose bright idea was it to max out the slider???
  • not directly related perhaps, but most will find this of interest.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuRGzZAk7S4
  • I enjoy it going to maxinstead of 1 maxes it easier plus i almost never sim 1
  • It is an annoyance when they change something initially because we don't expect it, like when they moved bronziums to the front of the list. Making us change our automatic conditioned responses are frustrating, to say the least. lol
  • We should all be used to it by now. The only time this can be an issue is when somebody wants to sim a node exactly once; in every other situation the slider must be adjusted. If it starts at max, there are fewer taps for those that refresh for node farming.
    You might accidentally blow through your energy all at once a time or two while you adjust to the new scheme, but that's ok, it isn't the end of the world, and you are not entitled to compensation for lack of situational awareness. It's a cognitive check, pay attention!
  • B0baf3tt wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    I like it.

    I would like a slider for GW.

    Yes a thousand times yes for GW. A higher difficulty setting as well.

    Now thats not a bad idea, optional harder difficulty lvl for gaw

    "and i will show you ... where the iron crosses grow..."
  • Gifafi
    6017 posts Member
    Worst “Q”OL ever. Change it back or give the option at the very least.
    Maybe End Game isn't for you
  • I don't get the hate. One of my favorite qol updates
  • Personalize setting makes everyone happy. Something CG can rarely do.
  • DuneSeaFarmer
    3525 posts Member
    edited March 2019
    Is it true this change was made to mess with players running macros?
  • I can’t believe anyone cares about this.
  • Kirth
    50 posts Member
    Can we get an option to disable this please? Its making us waste energy we don't want to use at that moment when we accidently press sim. And when people say get use to it. That's over 2 years of reflex Ive been using so no.
  • CazNeerg wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    CazNeerg wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    CazNeerg wrote: »
    Common sense, if they won't give us a toggle, would dictate defaulting to the most popular option, whether it's safest or not.
    Yeah, you try telling that to the FDA or the FAA when you are trying to get safety-critical software cerfitifed. :D

    Really, you are going to compare QoL features in a mobile game to *actual* safety? You don't think different standards apply?
    Just using a counterpoint to illustrate the ridiculousness of your statement.

    Of course you don't ignore safety in favor of a QoL usability feature, particularly one as contentious as this.

    What's ridiculous is even using the word safety in relation to features in a game.
    Not at all. Safety is a general concept and as such can be applied to many things.

    If the slider is defaulted to 1, the worst that can happen is that you accidentally use 20 points of energy in an unintended way.

    If the slider defaults to max possible, the worst that can happen is that you use 144 points of energy in an unintended way. More if you pre-loaded your energy reserve for the start of an event like galactic chase.

    The first option is safer, the second is riskier.
    CazNeerg wrote: »
    As for the theory that this is about "tricking people" into spending crystals, that is completely absurd. The most likely explanation for this change is that their metrics tell them that max simming is what most players are doing most of the time, and they actually believed it would help most players enjoy the game more if they made this change. Do they care about our enjoyment for it's own sake? Of course not, but happy people are more likely to keep playing.
    Indeed. The idea that devs do such things with the intent to make their player base unhappy is just silly.
  • and yet.....

    IT HAS
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    and yet.....

    IT HAS

    I dont think we have seen any update that doesn't make some unhappy. The player base is huge, they will never make everyone happy.
  • kalidor
    2121 posts Member
    I like the max sim for farming shards, but it's a bit awkward when you need to only farm one or two gear, like the mk1 baccas or a mk2 holo to finish a bigger gear. If you were at 3/5 baccas and needed 2 more to finish a gear, it'd be nice set the slider to 2. Yeah, you probably won't get 2 right off the bat, but it's a better estimate that 1 or 20. At any rate, not a big deal, just rubs my UX sensibilities the wrong way.
    But I do wish you could just tap anywhere on the slider rather than having to drag the thumb to the desired location. That works for levelling mods, seems silly it doesn't work for sims. Fixing that is completely independent of a defaults discussion.
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
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