GA: The 3v3+fleet format punishes players who invest in fleet
You recently removed fleet GP from the matchmaking for GA events without fleet because it punished us players with a high fleet GP percentage. Matchmaking has been a lot fairer since then, with the exception of the current GA. If you allow players with weak fleets to wall in their ships, you're creating the same old situation where a player with low character GP is pitted against a much high character GP.
A player with 1.5 million char GP who faces someone with only 1 mio. char GP can effectively render his weak ships untouchable. I feel that GA with fleet should reward both investment in characters and fleet. That is only the case if both squads and fleets can be attacked without one being walled in by the other.
A player with 1.5 million char GP who faces someone with only 1 mio. char GP can effectively render his weak ships untouchable. I feel that GA with fleet should reward both investment in characters and fleet. That is only the case if both squads and fleets can be attacked without one being walled in by the other.
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I agree with this to an extent. I see no problem with the current GA layout as long as we eventually get a layout where you can use a strong fleet (or two, we almost have enough ships) to wall in squads. I don't recall ever seeing such a layout.
Might as well just remove the fleet zones from GA and make it all squad only.
This is very different since players are not matched by character GP alone, as I already pointed out in my opening post. Someone with a vastly higher char GP shouldn't get to use this advantage to render their ships untouchable. This is a fleet GA, after all. It should be possible to attack the opponent's fleet.
It's the same in squad though. Whoever has the most Revans wins.
Exactly. If we could put our defensive fleet in front of squads in 5v5 +fleet, it would be perfectly fair. I imagine many who defend the current layout would suddenly start complaining.
Why not? You can use whatever strategy suits you better. If you want to make sure, that you can punch through your opponent's defenses, then set a weaker defense, which would give you a stronger offense. It's quite simple, really.
If your opponent blocks his fleet zone with a team, for which you have no counter, then it's no longer af matter of having more character/ships GP, so I believe that's beside your point.
3 zones are for characters still.
Punch through that character zone, then.
I'm not opposed to trying a new map with the fleet zone in front, but I'm not sure it will have the effect you hope for. If your opponent can block your path to the fleet zone with the current layout, moving the fleet zone to the front will just make him able to block you from a character zone in the back instead. You will only clear two zones either way. Moving the fleet zone to the front will only be an advantage if your opponent can block two character zones. If this is the case, with the current map you won't clear a single zone, but with the fleet zone in the front you may clear one zone - the fleet zone. However, it would highly unlikely that this would give you the victory.
The alternative is the map with only 2 zones - 1 zone for your fleet and 1 for your character teams. That's the most boring map currently. There are no surprises and less strategy.
I think his point is that he wants to try this strategy. He feels his fleet is strong enough to block his opponents from a character zone in the back. And none of the GA maps have allowed him to try this strategy.
True. But still, the opponent will simply block a character zone containing weak characters instead, which leaves him more strong characters for offense to clear both of OP's character zones with ease, while OP clears one fleet zone and at most 1 character zone - and still looses.
But ok. It may feel different loosing this way.
rolling eyes...
strategic aspect, ah yes. this is simpliest math you learn in 1.class. no stategy needed here.
of course its greatly unfair against fleet heavy players. but i go along with it if there will be a fleet GA were i can hide my weak squads behind my fleet
By the way TW is different, cause you have a whole guild to even this out.
The other GA with fleet is nonsense too, because strong squad players will nearly always win, cause winning and defending fleet area give less points than squad area. Made a thread to this with the math behind.
As squad heavy player i would of course argument as you do ;-)
You're making a lot of assumptions here. And putting forth a large effort to build a false dichotomy. It makes me curious as to your motivations. How would you be negatively affected if the fleet zone was moved to the front?
However the ensuing howls of outrage from players who are not fleet-heavy would give the devs tinnitus for weeks.
Revan is just 2 squads though. In ships you can neutralize everything else your opponent has by keeping the Falcon, because it beats everything, there is no modding to deal with, and there is only 1 defensively slot. In squad battles you can keep your Darth Revan and maybe be guaranteed a win against any single squad your opponent throws up, but you still have 6-10 other squads to deal with.
Two OP squads versus one OP fleet. Which isn't really all that OP if you have either Cassian's U-Wing, the Ebon Hawk, or your own Falcon. And if you don't have any of these ships yet, why would you possibly think that you deserve to win in a fleet GA?
I'm perfectly fine with the other, 5v5 fleet GA map, where the map is split in two territories. I'd even be happy to put two fleets on defense and use two on offense. Or make half the map a single fleet territory and split the squad half in 3 or 4 territories for all I care. All I want is a fair chance to attack both my opponent's squads and fleet in a fleet GA.
Or always reserve half the map for ships in fleet GA events and split the squad half in multiple territories.
You're assuming that I can't put up a strong squad defense myself. I have a decent zzBossk team, CLS with Han and Chewie, and my Bastila arena team, which will soon be led by my recently unlocked JKR. I can wall off weak characters too, but I can't do that and hack my way through two Revan squads in order to actually use my fleet in a fleet GA.
Because I'm being matched with people who have been playing twice as long as myself while neglecting their fleets, courtesy of my high fleet GP. People who have half a year worth of raid gear and zetas on me.
As I've explained multiple times now, they're in a position to effectively turn this game mode into a squad-only GP, in which case their vastly higher squad GP plus better gear & more zetas constitutes an unfair advantage. The exact same type of advantage we've seen in early squad GA events when total GP instead of character GP was used for matchmaking.
If my opponent manages to put a fleet on defense that I can't beat, chances are we're pretty evenly matched in terms of character and fleet GP. In that case, I don't mind squads being the decisive factor.
I never claimed that there would be a negative impact. I simply stated that:
You misread my post.
Ok. Moving the fleet zone to the front will solve that, of course. However, I'm not sure you would win anyway under the conditions you outlined in your OP.
The scenario, you described in your OP was that you were up against a player with much stronger squads/characters than you and with at least one team for which you have no counter. My comments are based on this. I'm assuming such a player would break through any defense you set (unless he fails at strategy of course).
Advantage? So, what's your goal? To simply be able to fight the fleet battle or to have a chance at winning?
Edit / added:
And as I usually say:
If you have a strong ships and a fleet, that can hold on defense, you have the advantage. If your opponent has a squad for which you have no counter, your disadvantage is not that you played for shorter time or have less zetas, character GP and what not. Your disadvantage is, that you didn't acquire that counter.