Grand Arena Championships – GP Divisions [MEGA]

Replies

  • Since GA was a thing, people have been stating that they feel punished for having inflated or high GP.

    CG have responded in a fair way.

    If you increase your GP, you will be facing other powerful accounts with all the toys.

    If you have low GP you will face other players with less toys.

    We now have a reason to have a super large GP and have responded in a fair way to all the forums complaints.

    Whilst I understand the point they want to tailor the reward experience, I think its easier to say at a lower GP you get X as a max prize and at higher you get the golden stun gun. That's not saying that a lower GP account doesn't want or have a use for a golden stun gun, but actually they want to save the best rewards for the players who have built their accounts up.

    I am a 2mil GP player, and whilst I won't be levelling all toons to 85, I won't look at disgust at fallen projects and their liability GP in my roster.





    Keyboard Warrior on the side of the Moderates
    I play the game for fun, if you don't like content, don't like the game, then why are you here?
  • Kantouch
    54 posts Member
    edited June 12
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    Really scared of y’all determining rewards based on “what you think is needed at X GP bracket”. I may only be 1.2m GP but that doesn’t mean I don’t need g12+ gear rewards less than someone at 4-5m. Sure, I may still need holoprojectors but you bet I don’t want them when I win kyber league GAC. I can pay the 300 crystals for then from shipments. Give the little guys the big rewards, too. @CG_Carrie @CG_SBCrumb

    I don’t know exactly what it’ll break down to but them giving you those makes it so you can spend more crystals on refreshes and g12 pieces 300 is 300 crystals after all. Hopefully by the next season of gac you’ll be at a higher division or get to the top of your current division. I don’t see people in the 1 mil gp that play consistently staying at that division for more than a few months with all the new stuff coming into game.

    I get first in both arenas daily. I do all my refreshes every day anyway. I can still afford the 300 crystals for holos when I need them. Please do not give me holoprojectors. I want g12+ [Edit: or whatever everyone else is getting] like everyone else gets for being “the best of the best” and that’s what’s fair.
    evoluza wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    Really scared of y’all determining rewards based on “what you think is needed at X GP bracket”. I may only be 1.2m GP but that doesn’t mean I don’t need g12+ gear rewards less than someone at 4-5m. Sure, I may still need holoprojectors but you bet I don’t want them when I win kyber league GAC. I can pay the 300 crystals for then from shipments. Give the little guys the big rewards, too. @CG_Carrie @CG_SBCrumb

    I get you, but you do have to realize there is no way to tailor rewards to suit every single player. With so many players, they have to look at averages, and if you're an outlier, you're going to have to accept that you may not get exactly what you need.

    I get that but why give reduced rewards for winning the same event at all? We all have to win the same number of rounds. We all should get the same rewards.

    If they insist upon giving lesser rewards for lower tiers, can we have the tiers scale closer together for each higher league reward you earn? Like if you get kyber at 4-5m you get 50 of the g12 finisher but at 1-2m you might only get 40. Not holoprojectors.

    Lower rewards, because lower challenge.
    Fighting in 1mil brackets is way easier then 5mil.
    And having 1 mil is as hard and/or expensive as 5mil.
    You should feel accomplished, when you get more and more GP. Thats why rewards scale up

    Any division was easy before this change if you had a well focused roster for your GP. Getting the same rewards for the same amount of wins not a bad thing. I should feel just as accomplished for getting wins at my GP as anyone else. Lesser rewards is going to feel like a slap in the face.
  • Gorem
    1152 posts Member
    Interesting design choices, lets see if it costs them more players or if they have some player retention from this, GA was handled poorly, so interesting to see how they handle GAC.
  • kieltrx
    127 posts Member
    Wow, GAC is so close now! And we still have a chance to get 48* in dstb before geotb kicks in. Nice.
  • Pour one out for our pilots. I get it, and accept it, but as someone who enjoys fleets and has invested heavily in ships (and their pilots) I'm bummed I won't get to use them.
    Hope they return in future GA formats!
  • Tiering rewards is terrible. At 2.7m gp I'm looking for the same exact rewards as someone in the 4m gp bracket.
    If anything, this is the exact opposite of what this game needs- a slingshot mechanic. I already can't recommend this game to friends because of how slow this game starts.
    I
  • SamoBudo
    221 posts Member
    edited June 13
    Tiering rewards is terrible. At 2.7m gp I'm looking for the same exact rewards as someone in the 4m gp bracket.
    If anything, this is the exact opposite of what this game needs- a slingshot mechanic. I already can't recommend this game to friends because of how slow this game starts.
    I

    I don't understand the reasoning ( I hope a did not misread the comment). A 4 Mill GP player has been playing longer and has put significant effort into the account. Why should they get the same rewards as you at a higher tier? You need to move to 4 Mill to get the same rewards just as a 4 mill is aiming to move to 5+ mill to get possible easier entry into Kyber. There is no financial incentive for a player to move tiers if the rewards are the same.

    They do state

    Most importantly, Divisions should create a long-term goal for players and their collections, so that we can reward elite GAC players regardless of the size of your collection, while still encouraging the newer players to build out more and more teams, chase PvE content, and master more characters/ships/squads. We don’t want the only players hitting Kyber League to be the ones with the biggest collections - younger players who consistently beat their opponents, complete Feats and optimize their play should have a shot at glory too.

    The game has to change and cater for everyone.
    This game mode absolutely does. Looking forward to it.
  • Pentagon wrote: »
    CG have responded in a fair way.

    If you increase your GP, you will be facing other powerful accounts with all the toys.

    If you have low GP you will face other players with less toys.

    This argument is so completely wrong, it is very depressing. I have high GP because all of my toons are modded, usually at least GVII or GVIII, leveled to 85, with abilities at 7. Lobot. Not a GA toon. JKG. Not a GA toon. Tusken Raider. Not a GA toon etc. These are broken toys. Sandbaggers keep GP low by not leveling/gearing these characters or by hitting a minimum power level so they are counted but skew their average.

    GP IS A BRAIN-DEAD WAY TO COMPARE ROSTERS. You could do anything slightly more complicated - weigh meta toons more highly, weigh higher gear levels more highly, weigh meta toon speed deltas (for a really fair match), weigh zeta'd toons more highly - and come up with a better matching metric. "Oh, but GP takes those into account!" - nope, not enough for a comparable competitive metric.
  • SamoBudo wrote: »
    Divisions should create a long-term goal for players and their collections, so that we can reward elite GAC players regardless of the size of your collection...We don’t want the only players hitting Kyber League to be the ones with the biggest collections - younger players who consistently beat their opponents, complete Feats and optimize their play should have a shot at glory too.

    The game has to change and cater for everyone.
    I am going to put a big question mark on "elite" here. What you are describing is a game that caters to sandbaggers who do not play the game as intended. Sure, younger players as well but let's be real - a lot of these accounts are sandbagged or else new alt accounts which are intentionally sandbagged from the start. Feats are a different matter and may add some balance but that remains to be seen.

    Like Nothingface, I have warned friends off starting this game in the past year and a half because of how frustrating that process would be.

  • No_Try
    3386 posts Member
    Pentagon wrote: »
    CG have responded in a fair way.

    If you increase your GP, you will be facing other powerful accounts with all the toys.

    If you have low GP you will face other players with less toys.

    This argument is so completely wrong, it is very depressing. I have high GP because all of my toons are modded, usually at least GVII or GVIII, leveled to 85, with abilities at 7. Lobot. Not a GA toon. JKG. Not a GA toon. Tusken Raider. Not a GA toon etc. These are broken toys. Sandbaggers keep GP low by not leveling/gearing these characters or by hitting a minimum power level so they are counted but skew their average.

    GP IS A BRAIN-DEAD WAY TO COMPARE ROSTERS. You could do anything slightly more complicated - weigh meta toons more highly, weigh higher gear levels more highly, weigh meta toon speed deltas (for a really fair match), weigh zeta'd toons more highly - and come up with a better matching metric. "Oh, but GP takes those into account!" - nope, not enough for a comparable competitive metric.

    That's exactly the intention with new matchmaking system, whether it'll achieve it somewhat or really fall short of it is another question though. Read the new announcement posts?
  • Liath
    4171 posts Member
    SamoBudo wrote: »
    Divisions should create a long-term goal for players and their collections, so that we can reward elite GAC players regardless of the size of your collection...We don’t want the only players hitting Kyber League to be the ones with the biggest collections - younger players who consistently beat their opponents, complete Feats and optimize their play should have a shot at glory too.

    The game has to change and cater for everyone.
    I am going to put a big question mark on "elite" here. What you are describing is a game that caters to sandbaggers who do not play the game as intended. Sure, younger players as well but let's be real - a lot of these accounts are sandbagged or else new alt accounts which are intentionally sandbagged from the start. Feats are a different matter and may add some balance but that remains to be seen.

    Like Nothingface, I have warned friends off starting this game in the past year and a half because of how frustrating that process would be.

    Who are you to decide how the game is intended to be played?
  • Cool. So now I'll have to inflate my roster over 3m just to get a better tier rewards. Basically, what you guys want is fluffy cannon fodder so the vets that were able to take time on their gp can smack us around. Genius.
    I swear y'all will applaud CG for anything that gives you easier opponents.
  • Kantouch wrote: »
    Really scared of y’all determining rewards based on “what you think is needed at X GP bracket”. I may only be 1.2m GP but that doesn’t mean I don’t need g12+ gear rewards less than someone at 4-5m. Sure, I may still need holoprojectors but you bet I don’t want them when I win kyber league GAC. I can pay the 300 crystals for then from shipments. Give the little guys the big rewards, too. @CG_Carrie @CG_SBCrumb

    I agree GA has been one of the best methods of catching up with less competitive players who have been playing longer. However I will aknowledge that the amount of free GA wins I got from throwing just down a well modded NS on D in the 1 millionish bracket and swapping it to a JKR team on D in the 1.5 bracket was kind of ridiculous.
  • SamoBudo wrote: »
    Divisions should create a long-term goal for players and their collections, so that we can reward elite GAC players regardless of the size of your collection...We don’t want the only players hitting Kyber League to be the ones with the biggest collections - younger players who consistently beat their opponents, complete Feats and optimize their play should have a shot at glory too.

    The game has to change and cater for everyone.
    I am going to put a big question mark on "elite" here. What you are describing is a game that caters to sandbaggers who do not play the game as intended. Sure, younger players as well but let's be real - a lot of these accounts are sandbagged or else new alt accounts which are intentionally sandbagged from the start. Feats are a different matter and may add some balance but that remains to be seen.

    Like Nothingface, I have warned friends off starting this game in the past year and a half because of how frustrating that process would be.

    I told my friends to download the game and who to farm so they have a lean competitive roster. the process hasn't been frustrating 😤
  • No_Try
    3386 posts Member
    I wonder if anyone has read this post. It seems that it's getting discussed without that crucial half of the equation:

    https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/204353/improvements-to-grand-arena-matchmaking
  • No_Try
    3386 posts Member
    edited June 13
    This is the most important bit:
    "Starting with the first Grand Arena Championship, we are going to slightly reduce the weighting of pure GP in the matchmaking system for GA, in favor of a larger set of variables intended to make players feel less like Grand Arena is punishing players for going broad. If you are working on newer or lower-powered squads, the matchmaking system will be much less likely to count those efforts towards matching you with an ideal opponent, and you will be less likely to be paired up with a player who a) looks just like you GP-wise, but b) has instead spent all of their efforts optimizing a smaller handful of squads. (Those players will still be rewarded for their strategy in Grand Arena, but they’ll be matched up against someone who looks more like them.)"

    As far as I understand it if the algo aligns with the stated intention (regardless of your division) you'll now get matched with peeps that are similarly lean/broad as your roster. Assume there's no such thing as purely lean or purely broad. An almost purely lean roster player can keep that way and can get matched with others that are also almost purely lean...or can bump their gp with fluff a bit, become -less lean- and can get matched with similarly -less lean- players.

    And developing your roster regardless of usability or your aims with it is rewarded through divisions. Let's not forget what's pure fluff for me at 4M+ GP range (i.e. g8-g9 stuffz) is pretty usable and has to be used in matches along 2M gp. It's a player concern what to consider fluff almost at all times, an ideal matchmaking algo needs to be blind to that, only finesse the similarity of rosters overall to be fair(-er- than it was).

    We know nothing about how small or large GP intervals division system will bring along yet.
  • leef
    12588 posts Member
    No_Try wrote: »
    This is the most important bit:
    "Starting with the first Grand Arena Championship, we are going to slightly reduce the weighting of pure GP in the matchmaking system for GA, in favor of a larger set of variables intended to make players feel less like Grand Arena is punishing players for going broad. If you are working on newer or lower-powered squads, the matchmaking system will be much less likely to count those efforts towards matching you with an ideal opponent, and you will be less likely to be paired up with a player who a) looks just like you GP-wise, but b) has instead spent all of their efforts optimizing a smaller handful of squads. (Those players will still be rewarded for their strategy in Grand Arena, but they’ll be matched up against someone who looks more like them.)"

    As far as I understand it if the algo aligns with the stated intention (regardless of your division) you'll now get matched with peeps that are similarly lean/broad as your roster. Assume there's no such thing as purely lean or purely broad. An almost purely lean roster player can keep that way and can get matched with others that are also almost purely lean...or can bump their gp with fluff a bit, become -less lean- and can get matched with similarly -less lean- players.

    And developing your roster regardless of usability or your aims with it is rewarded through divisions. Let's not forget what's pure fluff for me at 4M+ GP range (i.e. g8-g9 stuffz) is pretty usable and has to be used in matches along 2M gp. It's a player concern what to consider fluff almost at all times, an ideal matchmaking algo needs to be blind to that, only finesse the similarity of rosters overall to be fair(-er- than it was).

    We know nothing about how small or large GP intervals division system will bring along yet.

    How though? how would they match us more closely than by just using GP while also dividing us into divisions based on GP.
    I don't see it working as well as one might think it would work.
    Regardless, matchmaking is always going to suck no matter how much it's tweaked. It will benefit some more than others.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • No_Try
    3386 posts Member
    leef wrote: »
    No_Try wrote: »
    This is the most important bit:
    "Starting with the first Grand Arena Championship, we are going to slightly reduce the weighting of pure GP in the matchmaking system for GA, in favor of a larger set of variables intended to make players feel less like Grand Arena is punishing players for going broad. If you are working on newer or lower-powered squads, the matchmaking system will be much less likely to count those efforts towards matching you with an ideal opponent, and you will be less likely to be paired up with a player who a) looks just like you GP-wise, but b) has instead spent all of their efforts optimizing a smaller handful of squads. (Those players will still be rewarded for their strategy in Grand Arena, but they’ll be matched up against someone who looks more like them.)"

    As far as I understand it if the algo aligns with the stated intention (regardless of your division) you'll now get matched with peeps that are similarly lean/broad as your roster. Assume there's no such thing as purely lean or purely broad. An almost purely lean roster player can keep that way and can get matched with others that are also almost purely lean...or can bump their gp with fluff a bit, become -less lean- and can get matched with similarly -less lean- players.

    And developing your roster regardless of usability or your aims with it is rewarded through divisions. Let's not forget what's pure fluff for me at 4M+ GP range (i.e. g8-g9 stuffz) is pretty usable and has to be used in matches along 2M gp. It's a player concern what to consider fluff almost at all times, an ideal matchmaking algo needs to be blind to that, only finesse the similarity of rosters overall to be fair(-er- than it was).

    We know nothing about how small or large GP intervals division system will bring along yet.

    How though? how would they match us more closely than by just using GP while also dividing us into divisions based on GP.
    I don't see it working as well as one might think it would work.
    Regardless, matchmaking is always going to suck no matter how much it's tweaked. It will benefit some more than others.

    I dunno, they are outright saying there's now a new algo which has nothing to do with divisions, no? I have no idea into the specifics of the new algo, just what they are saying about what it intends to do. Will it consider a GP cutoff? Will it considere amount of zetas? Mods? Simply dunno.
  • No_Try
    3386 posts Member
    This is how I would try to program it if it were me and that announcement was my motivation:

    - First get a pool of players with as little gp diff. as posssible, say 50k ranges.
    - Assign some weight to 12+ pieces
    - Assign less weight to total amount of g12 in a players roster
    - Assign less and less weight to each gear tier after that and higher thresholds
    - Assign some weight to amount of total zetas
    - Assign some weight to total amount of mods and their tier distributions

    I would try to then try to match the players in the pool where this full picture looks as similar as possible. I already got to the accuracy of previous -probably GP only- matchmaking we had before these considerations.

    So each of these weightings would have threshold values. i.e. the amount of g12s are +-%20 different players in comparison, they won't get matched.

    Any weights can be picked for these various parameters. i.e. maybe g12 has a 0.20 multiplier while mods have a 0.10 one. Depends on what matchmaking wants to prioritise.


    *Note that I would completely ignore metas, which metas the players would have or which toons they chose to develop. That's player advantage and strategy how they operated within all the avaliable toon options.

    *I would also fully ignore the amount of speeds on mods, only consider how developed the mods are and compare the amounts players has. Naturally stat distributions would be different between players with similar amounts of 6E, golds, purples etc. That's both luck and player strategy of mod developmental paths.


    I think whatever weighting CG is going with, they will completely ignore mods there and that's also what will make the difference in the outcome of higher leagues like Kyber.
  • BobcatSkywalker
    478 posts Member
    edited June 14
    Devs:
    Coming 8/18 GAC not available on Android < 6.0, but don't worry it will only effect a very small # of people. You have time to plan.

    Devs later on the same day:
    Oops we got the month wrong, and didn't list all the devices, turns out this goes live in 5 days, but YES WE ARE SURE IT WILL ONLY EFFECT A SMALL # OF PLAYERS.

    Devs now:
    *crosses fingers, holds breath*
  • Chewy88
    124 posts Member
    Kantouch wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    Really scared of y’all determining rewards based on “what you think is needed at X GP bracket”. I may only be 1.2m GP but that doesn’t mean I don’t need g12+ gear rewards less than someone at 4-5m. Sure, I may still need holoprojectors but you bet I don’t want them when I win kyber league GAC. I can pay the 300 crystals for then from shipments. Give the little guys the big rewards, too. @CG_Carrie @CG_SBCrumb

    I don’t know exactly what it’ll break down to but them giving you those makes it so you can spend more crystals on refreshes and g12 pieces 300 is 300 crystals after all. Hopefully by the next season of gac you’ll be at a higher division or get to the top of your current division. I don’t see people in the 1 mil gp that play consistently staying at that division for more than a few months with all the new stuff coming into game.

    I get first in both arenas daily. I do all my refreshes every day anyway. I can still afford the 300 crystals for holos when I need them. Please do not give me holoprojectors. I want g12+ [Edit: or whatever everyone else is getting] like everyone else gets for being “the best of the best” and that’s what’s fair.
    evoluza wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    Kantouch wrote: »
    Really scared of y’all determining rewards based on “what you think is needed at X GP bracket”. I may only be 1.2m GP but that doesn’t mean I don’t need g12+ gear rewards less than someone at 4-5m. Sure, I may still need holoprojectors but you bet I don’t want them when I win kyber league GAC. I can pay the 300 crystals for then from shipments. Give the little guys the big rewards, too. @CG_Carrie @CG_SBCrumb

    I get you, but you do have to realize there is no way to tailor rewards to suit every single player. With so many players, they have to look at averages, and if you're an outlier, you're going to have to accept that you may not get exactly what you need.

    I get that but why give reduced rewards for winning the same event at all? We all have to win the same number of rounds. We all should get the same rewards.

    If they insist upon giving lesser rewards for lower tiers, can we have the tiers scale closer together for each higher league reward you earn? Like if you get kyber at 4-5m you get 50 of the g12 finisher but at 1-2m you might only get 40. Not holoprojectors.

    Lower rewards, because lower challenge.
    Fighting in 1mil brackets is way easier then 5mil.
    And having 1 mil is as hard and/or expensive as 5mil.
    You should feel accomplished, when you get more and more GP. Thats why rewards scale up

    Any division was easy before this change if you had a well focused roster for your GP. Getting the same rewards for the same amount of wins not a bad thing. I should feel just as accomplished for getting wins at my GP as anyone else. Lesser rewards is going to feel like a slap in the face.

    This makes no sense. Why would you get the same rewards as someone with a 5 mill gp account you haven’t put as much of any resource into the game as them. You don’t get to be ceo at a Fortune 500 right out of high school so you don’t get top level rewards without the experience and roster to deserve them.
  • EPRC
    1 posts Member
    Great to see that the rewards that are supposed to be replacing our missing GA rewards are super rigged. Zero zetas during bonus days, no bonuses on carbanti challenge days. Great promotion guys.
  • Liath wrote: »
    SamoBudo wrote: »
    Divisions should create a long-term goal for players and their collections, so that we can reward elite GAC players regardless of the size of your collection...We don’t want the only players hitting Kyber League to be the ones with the biggest collections - younger players who consistently beat their opponents, complete Feats and optimize their play should have a shot at glory too.

    The game has to change and cater for everyone.
    I am going to put a big question mark on "elite" here. What you are describing is a game that caters to sandbaggers who do not play the game as intended. Sure, younger players as well but let's be real - a lot of these accounts are sandbagged or else new alt accounts which are intentionally sandbagged from the start. Feats are a different matter and may add some balance but that remains to be seen.

    Like Nothingface, I have warned friends off starting this game in the past year and a half because of how frustrating that process would be.

    Who are you to decide how the game is intended to be played?

    Noodlehead Jones. It says it at the top of his post.
  • Darth__Revan
    6 posts Member
    edited June 19
    Will Divisions be divided along the same GP thresholds as are used to determine the number of defensive squads? There's a pretty big difference between 1.75 Million and 2.7 Million GP- the same is true for 2.75-3.99 Million...
  • Is there any information on the different character gp brackets and league tier prizes?
  • How does one sign up for the gac. It was mentioned if you are level 85 you would be automatically entered. But they said to sign up aswell for it. Yet no link or any sign of where to sign up. Also only putting this in here as the post it was is not commentable. Pls help im very confused. I understand all what the gac is gonna be just not understanding how to be a part of it when they say i have to sign up. Im level 85 so no one says you have to be level 85. I want real answers. Please and thank you for the help.
  • TVF
    14279 posts Member
    How does one sign up for the gac. It was mentioned if you are level 85 you would be automatically entered. But they said to sign up aswell for it. Yet no link or any sign of where to sign up. Also only putting this in here as the post it was is not commentable. Pls help im very confused. I understand all what the gac is gonna be just not understanding how to be a part of it when they say i have to sign up. Im level 85 so no one says you have to be level 85. I want real answers. Please and thank you for the help.

    It says you are automatically signed up for the Championship, which is a series of GA events. You still have to sign up for each GA event separately. Sign up starts later today.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • AceCV
    550 posts Member
    Anyone knows how will work the tie break (when 2 or more players have the same points) in the overall classification ?
  • NicWester
    6595 posts Member
    I'm in Division 2. I have a dumb question--Am I in the second highest division, or am I in the second lowest? It seems like Division 1 would be the highest, but you never can quite tell since the round rewards are the same for each division and since 11 is a higher number than 1. Aaaanyway….
    Cool. So now I'll have to inflate my roster over 3m just to get a better tier rewards. Basically, what you guys want is fluffy cannon fodder so the vets that were able to take time on their gp can smack us around. Genius.
    I swear y'all will applaud CG for anything that gives you easier opponents.
    ….Yeah, go figure, you're going to have to actually improve your roster if you want better rewards. How brutally unfair.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
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