Hey buddy, I get you completely. This is the most disappointing moment for me in the game. It should be fun and strategic and yes, I also spent on gear after unlocking a 7 star Malak. This game has become super hard and only way to feel competitive is spend lots of money. The sad reality is that they probably looked at their data and saw more people with 7 star Malak before this event than those of us who unlocked a 7 star Malak during the 3rd roll out of Showdown. Easy choice @CG_TopHat . I happen to work in Insights and the truth is, CG is not listening to their base. Big, big, big mistake. CG could have done a survey (given you've done these before) to determine how GET Malak 7 star vs Glitch in system Malak 7 star players felt about a few decisions that were probably brainstormed. A business decision was taken as opposed to doing the dollars and cents checks together with a client input survey. This is collaboration, aka fundamentals of agile, aka what ever the way of work you should be adopting. Which business case after business case has shown will lead to growth. So CG and their messengers @CG_TopHat and @CG_SBCrumb have limited their opportunity to make more money... As in case and point above.
I am sour and disappointed... I own that. Will I keep playing the game and get over this, maybe. But given how CG makes decisions, I have learned one thing, to never spend a cent again on this game. I have boycotted stores for years for making lesser client centric decisions in the past, so no behavioural, dopamine induced special is going to entice me again.
Hey buddy, I get you completely. This is the most disappointing moment for me in the game. It should be fun and strategic and yes, I also spent on gear after unlocking a 7 star Malak. This game has become super hard and only way to feel competitive is spend lots of money. The sad reality is that they probably looked at their data and saw more people with 7 star Malak before this event than those of us who unlocked a 7 star Malak during the 3rd roll out of Showdown. Easy choice @CG_TopHat . I happen to work in Insights and the truth is, CG is not listening to their base. Big, big, big mistake. CG could have done a survey (given you've done these before) to determine how GET Malak 7 star vs Glitch in system Malak 7 star players felt about a few decisions that were probably brainstormed. A business decision was taken as opposed to doing the dollars and cents checks together with a client input survey. This is collaboration, aka fundamentals of agile, aka what ever the way of work you should be adopting. Which business case after business case has shown will lead to growth. So CG and their messengers @CG_TopHat and @CG_SBCrumb have limited their opportunity to make more money... As in case and point above.
I am sour and disappointed... I own that. Will I keep playing the game and get over this, maybe. But given how CG makes decisions, I have learned one thing, to never spend a cent again on this game. I have boycotted stores for years for making lesser client centric decisions in the past, so no behavioural, dopamine induced special is going to entice me again.
What can you do with 100$ in swgoh... Nothing...
Pay in f2p must lead to win a lot of time.
Today all I can do 100$ is reach gk and padme from g8 to g11 or only padme from g8 to g12+
I have still to lead her or them to relic 7
There more than 160 characters and with 100$ i can't gear 1 toon gear1 to max (r7)
EA/CG totally loss the value of money in this game...
Do you know that 100$ is 1/2 of price a switch lite... It's above two video game... It's the price of some smart phone....
It's more than a day of work for a lot of people.
With more than 1 day of work in money value, you don't offer the possibility to reach 1 of 160 toon from g1 to gear max (relic7)...
And when you make a mistake that help a little your player you only offer 250 crystals to us... Above 2 dollar... What can we do with that? Nothing...
I only just got Malak unlocked, so this whole thing doesn't really affect me at all. But I can ABSOLUTELY understand how OP is angry, and I would be too in his shoes! It is entirely reasonable that people assumed CG was on the level and making a change to correct a severe paywall that was the source of much complaining.
If I, in good faith, spent a fair chunk of money on upgrades I would be livid to hear that that was not being addressed in the "fix".
Say what you want, but CG is wrong on this. All of you arguing a position that hinges on every single person who took this on face value is:
1) blaming the victim, and
2) arguing in bad faith yourself, because if it were you out of pocket on this, you would be calling foul just as loud.
I understand being frustrated OP- CG was in a tight spot after this slip up though.
Whether you think it’s working or not they go to great lengths to pace the economy and gear scaling. Handing everyone 57000 GET completely flushes that and makes all the GAS owners completely dominant instantly.
It burns to have spent money answering time to get Malak for last week- but theoretically all will use all of that gear as soon as you get him again when they reset the event. It will cost you some more time and and I know we don’t have extra if that laying around.
I think they would have preferred to take back the shard shop currency as well but there wasn’t a clean way to do that. I pondered solutions for awhile leading up to the make good message and I feel like it’s not flawless but a reasonably justified response to a messy situation.
After a weeks time everyone will be 250 crystals up and some of us would have spent twice as much time, but the ledger should be generally even otherwise (ill will aside).
Thank you everyone for this discussion. Just to clarify, my primary concern is that this rollback isn't rolling back all things effected. My main concern is GET used for Malak shards, the money used for crystals, and to a lesser extent crystals used for gear/shop refresh.
Making sure that previous Malak 7* feel valued is also important, because that group of players is CG's primary market. I am not sure what the best course of action is here, but the current proposed solution doesn't solve my issues, which is why I do not agree with it, and urge the dev's to think tactfully.
Everyone Who can read knew this was a bug. if You took advantage. Be grateful you were Not punished for exploit it.
Many people on the forums, reddit, discord servers thought that it was an intentional thing done by CG as either a make good, or just as an evolution of that style of event. Good luck to them punishing people for their own mistakes.
So if my bank mistakenly credits my account $125k, that should be mine to keep? That happened to a Pennsylvania couple who spent the money and are now facing theft and fraud charges.
"Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen...mostly"
Everyone Who can read knew this was a bug. if You took advantage. Be grateful you were Not punished for exploit it.
Many people on the forums, reddit, discord servers thought that it was an intentional thing done by CG as either a make good, or just as an evolution of that style of event. Good luck to them punishing people for their own mistakes.
So if my bank mistakenly credits my account $125k, that should be mine to keep? That happened to a Pennsylvania couple who spent the money and are now facing theft and fraud charges.
I do take your point, however, it's not fully proper as an analogy here:
The Pennsylvania couple were wrongly given money, and knowingly (for sake of argument) spent it. Compared with the OP unknowingly spending their money on something that was later found to be a mistake by CG.
In both cases you could compare whether the persons knew a mistake had been made or not.
A more accurate analogy would be if an airline offered a discounted flight, say, 10 euros to Barbados. You buy the ticket, and then you purchase extras like extra luggage, an in-flight massage (whatever else etc.).
Then, the airline says that they made a mistake and there are no flights to Barbados. They refund you the 10 euros (reset Malak) but refuse to refund the extras that you purchased for the flight.
You've been refunded, but you're still out money because of their mistake. I see the OP's point: compensation offered is not in line with the loss suffered.
Certainly, you could argue that the OP knowingly tried to take advantage of a flaw, but that would require evidence that I don't think any of us have (and so are unjustified claiming it), or that the OP ought to have known there was a problem. The flights were too cheap: too good to be true. That's the claim that seems to have a possibility to build on, but as it stands, I don't think even that's strong enough here.
Another problem is how people are thinking of the mistake. It wasn't: a mistake was made, and OP spent money. It was: OP spent money while a mistake was being made.
In short, the money was spent while the mistake was happening, so return the money as well as fix the mistake.
Everyone Who can read knew this was a bug. if You took advantage. Be grateful you were Not punished for exploit it.
Many people on the forums, reddit, discord servers thought that it was an intentional thing done by CG as either a make good, or just as an evolution of that style of event. Good luck to them punishing people for their own mistakes.
So if my bank mistakenly credits my account $125k, that should be mine to keep? That happened to a Pennsylvania couple who spent the money and are now facing theft and fraud charges.
Yeah... that's absolutely the same situation. Nice job.
Someone else used the hypothetical that the bank mistakenly credits a person $10,000,000.
People are bending over backwards to try to compare this situation to other situations that are not remotely like this one.
For starters, if the bank gives you $120,000, then they lose $120,000. What about with Malak shards? Nope. No one loses Malak shards because someone else gained them. There is no theft or even appropriation.
As for real world effects, what are those to CG? Do the servers cost more to run if the database says I have a 6 or 7 star Malak instead of my 5* Malak? Nope.
The only real-world effects are the effects on spending by customers/players in the game, and right now they've set it up so that they're not refunding any of that money. You can go to your credit card company, or iTunes, or GooglePlay, but it's all on you to do the work to get back that money that you spent to gear toons necessary to complete the event, or to gear Malak or whatever. They have announced that they're keeping money that they only received because of something roughly analogous to false advertising (you don't need the g12 gear for your Malak until your Malak is 7*. If they tell you that you have a 7* Malak when you don't, then any spending was done under false pretenses). You can work your a$$ off to get your $$, but they ain't helping.
So how will that affect spending going forward? Will people really continue to spend at the same levels as before, much less increase their spending, when CG operates this way? I can only guess, but the official word from my Magic 8 Ball is
Someone else used the hypothetical that the bank mistakenly credits a person $10,000,000.
People are bending over backwards to try to compare this situation to other situations that are not remotely like this one.
For starters, if the bank gives you $120,000, then they lose $120,000. What about with Malak shards? Nope. No one loses Malak shards because someone else gained them. There is no theft or even appropriation.
The problem comes with the result causing people to spend real money along with it. It can also result in a lot of wasted time and energy as well so people feel that is stolen from them.
Replies
I am sour and disappointed... I own that. Will I keep playing the game and get over this, maybe. But given how CG makes decisions, I have learned one thing, to never spend a cent again on this game. I have boycotted stores for years for making lesser client centric decisions in the past, so no behavioural, dopamine induced special is going to entice me again.
[Removed - CM]
What can you do with 100$ in swgoh... Nothing...
Pay in f2p must lead to win a lot of time.
Today all I can do 100$ is reach gk and padme from g8 to g11 or only padme from g8 to g12+
I have still to lead her or them to relic 7
There more than 160 characters and with 100$ i can't gear 1 toon gear1 to max (r7)
EA/CG totally loss the value of money in this game...
Do you know that 100$ is 1/2 of price a switch lite... It's above two video game... It's the price of some smart phone....
It's more than a day of work for a lot of people.
With more than 1 day of work in money value, you don't offer the possibility to reach 1 of 160 toon from g1 to gear max (relic7)...
And when you make a mistake that help a little your player you only offer 250 crystals to us... Above 2 dollar... What can we do with that? Nothing...
If I, in good faith, spent a fair chunk of money on upgrades I would be livid to hear that that was not being addressed in the "fix".
Say what you want, but CG is wrong on this. All of you arguing a position that hinges on every single person who took this on face value is:
1) blaming the victim, and
2) arguing in bad faith yourself, because if it were you out of pocket on this, you would be calling foul just as loud.
OP is right.
Whether you think it’s working or not they go to great lengths to pace the economy and gear scaling. Handing everyone 57000 GET completely flushes that and makes all the GAS owners completely dominant instantly.
It burns to have spent money answering time to get Malak for last week- but theoretically all will use all of that gear as soon as you get him again when they reset the event. It will cost you some more time and and I know we don’t have extra if that laying around.
I think they would have preferred to take back the shard shop currency as well but there wasn’t a clean way to do that. I pondered solutions for awhile leading up to the make good message and I feel like it’s not flawless but a reasonably justified response to a messy situation.
After a weeks time everyone will be 250 crystals up and some of us would have spent twice as much time, but the ledger should be generally even otherwise (ill will aside).
Making sure that previous Malak 7* feel valued is also important, because that group of players is CG's primary market. I am not sure what the best course of action is here, but the current proposed solution doesn't solve my issues, which is why I do not agree with it, and urge the dev's to think tactfully.
FWIW:
1. CG made a mistake.
2. Mistake cost OP money.
3. The refund does not restore the money.
You can stick a 'the OP should have known / read / realised x. But, they didn't. The cause of the problem was CG's.
I'm pretty sure Google Play and iTunes will refund any money spent.
Anyway, the real villain here is Malak, and I don't even remember him being that powerful in the game (KOTOR). He had no jaw.
He always seemed to be trying too hard.
So if my bank mistakenly credits my account $125k, that should be mine to keep? That happened to a Pennsylvania couple who spent the money and are now facing theft and fraud charges.
I do take your point, however, it's not fully proper as an analogy here:
The Pennsylvania couple were wrongly given money, and knowingly (for sake of argument) spent it. Compared with the OP unknowingly spending their money on something that was later found to be a mistake by CG.
In both cases you could compare whether the persons knew a mistake had been made or not.
A more accurate analogy would be if an airline offered a discounted flight, say, 10 euros to Barbados. You buy the ticket, and then you purchase extras like extra luggage, an in-flight massage (whatever else etc.).
Then, the airline says that they made a mistake and there are no flights to Barbados. They refund you the 10 euros (reset Malak) but refuse to refund the extras that you purchased for the flight.
You've been refunded, but you're still out money because of their mistake. I see the OP's point: compensation offered is not in line with the loss suffered.
Certainly, you could argue that the OP knowingly tried to take advantage of a flaw, but that would require evidence that I don't think any of us have (and so are unjustified claiming it), or that the OP ought to have known there was a problem. The flights were too cheap: too good to be true. That's the claim that seems to have a possibility to build on, but as it stands, I don't think even that's strong enough here.
Another problem is how people are thinking of the mistake. It wasn't: a mistake was made, and OP spent money. It was: OP spent money while a mistake was being made.
In short, the money was spent while the mistake was happening, so return the money as well as fix the mistake.
Yeah... that's absolutely the same situation. Nice job.
People are bending over backwards to try to compare this situation to other situations that are not remotely like this one.
For starters, if the bank gives you $120,000, then they lose $120,000. What about with Malak shards? Nope. No one loses Malak shards because someone else gained them. There is no theft or even appropriation.
As for real world effects, what are those to CG? Do the servers cost more to run if the database says I have a 6 or 7 star Malak instead of my 5* Malak? Nope.
The only real-world effects are the effects on spending by customers/players in the game, and right now they've set it up so that they're not refunding any of that money. You can go to your credit card company, or iTunes, or GooglePlay, but it's all on you to do the work to get back that money that you spent to gear toons necessary to complete the event, or to gear Malak or whatever. They have announced that they're keeping money that they only received because of something roughly analogous to false advertising (you don't need the g12 gear for your Malak until your Malak is 7*. If they tell you that you have a 7* Malak when you don't, then any spending was done under false pretenses). You can work your a$$ off to get your $$, but they ain't helping.
So how will that affect spending going forward? Will people really continue to spend at the same levels as before, much less increase their spending, when CG operates this way? I can only guess, but the official word from my Magic 8 Ball is
The problem comes with the result causing people to spend real money along with it. It can also result in a lot of wasted time and energy as well so people feel that is stolen from them.