Which toons can we expect to see from rise of Skywalker?

Replies

  • Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    So you didn't like the movie, but you didn't dislike it enough to voice your opinion and try and influence the future of the Star Wars franchise by saying "this was bad, do something different". Seems logical.

    Disney doesn’t give a **** what fans think because they already have people’s money so you can try to influence the future of Star Wars but it’ll end up doing nothing and being a waste of time.

    This is false. The Last Jedi got a huge negative response from the audience, so Disney changed directions and ended with 9. You don’t have the evidence to say that people who disliked the movie didn’t care to review, so the Internet polls are the best we have.

    Disney changed nothing it was a different director for 8 and 9. Plus with J.J Abrams he definitely doesn’t care what people say

    It was Colin Trevorrow; then TLJ had a negative response, Disney renamed these trilogies the “Skywalker Saga” and suddenly announced that this is the last movie.

    Regardless if Internet reviews impact Disney or not, the only real evidence of the audiences opinion we have are these reviews, which show that the general audience like the movie.

    The only thing that will truly impact Disney is money. If they are happy with how much it makes even though it's on pace to make a few hundred million less than Last Jedi then that's all the opinion they need. Bob Iger loved Last Jedi and it was a critical and financial success. Rise of Skywalker was a critical failure, but could be a financial success. A review website that could be a 12 year old kid who didn't even see the movie or a misogynist who simply hates any movie that has multiple female stars could be writing the audience reviews isn't going to dictate what they do if it all makes money, which is why they stopped the standalone films because Solo was not financially successful. It's like CG saying they're not seeing the "death of the game" so many have claimed. It's a financial success so they're happy with it.
  • TVF wrote: »
    So, um, what toons can we expect to see from Rise of Skywalker?

    I need that little dude.

    Sith Trooper was an entirely inconsequential character that only briefly appeared and we got him, so pretty much anyone is fair game.
  • Nihion
    2437 posts Member
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    So you didn't like the movie, but you didn't dislike it enough to voice your opinion and try and influence the future of the Star Wars franchise by saying "this was bad, do something different". Seems logical.

    Disney doesn’t give a **** what fans think because they already have people’s money so you can try to influence the future of Star Wars but it’ll end up doing nothing and being a waste of time.

    This is false. The Last Jedi got a huge negative response from the audience, so Disney changed directions and ended with 9. You don’t have the evidence to say that people who disliked the movie didn’t care to review, so the Internet polls are the best we have.

    Disney changed nothing it was a different director for 8 and 9. Plus with J.J Abrams he definitely doesn’t care what people say

    It was Colin Trevorrow; then TLJ had a negative response, Disney renamed these trilogies the “Skywalker Saga” and suddenly announced that this is the last movie.

    Regardless if Internet reviews impact Disney or not, the only real evidence of the audiences opinion we have are these reviews, which show that the general audience like the movie.

    The only thing that will truly impact Disney is money. If they are happy with how much it makes even though it's on pace to make a few hundred million less than Last Jedi then that's all the opinion they need. Bob Iger loved Last Jedi and it was a critical and financial success. Rise of Skywalker was a critical failure, but could be a financial success. A review website that could be a 12 year old kid who didn't even see the movie or a misogynist who simply hates any movie that has multiple female stars could be writing the audience reviews isn't going to dictate what they do if it all makes money, which is why they stopped the standalone films because Solo was not financially successful. It's like CG saying they're not seeing the "death of the game" so many have claimed. It's a financial success so they're happy with it.

    Sure.

    But the biggest reason Solo flopped was because of the Last Jedi. That’s why they decided to end the Skywalker Saga.

    Disney does listen mostly to their money and I do wish they valued quality, but they are still somewhat impacted by the communities opinion. No matter who does those online reviews, they are still informative, and there are still many of them.
  • Nihion
    2437 posts Member
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    I assume that we will get Supreme Leader Kylo.
    It’s actually a yellow saber, but one of my friends was convinced that it was orange as well
  • ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    for rey i dont see her getting the yellow lightsaber, and for kylo i can see him having 2 characters, one for the supreme leader, and one as ben solo
  • Nauros
    3149 posts Member
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    for rey i dont see her getting the yellow lightsaber, and for kylo i can see him having 2 characters, one for the supreme leader, and one as ben solo

    Don't forget that more visually distinct characters are better. My guess is yellow lightsaber because it helps her stand out at first glance.
    As for Kylo, I think we'll get Supreme Leader to keep the balance between light and dark.
    Other than that, my guess is General Poe, Leia and Palpatine, with possibly Jannah and Zorii. Too bad the Knights of Ren were mostly reduced to standing menacingly and getting killed.
    Revive the stores, the game needs it.
  • Nihion wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    So you didn't like the movie, but you didn't dislike it enough to voice your opinion and try and influence the future of the Star Wars franchise by saying "this was bad, do something different". Seems logical.

    Disney doesn’t give a **** what fans think because they already have people’s money so you can try to influence the future of Star Wars but it’ll end up doing nothing and being a waste of time.

    This is false. The Last Jedi got a huge negative response from the audience, so Disney changed directions and ended with 9. You don’t have the evidence to say that people who disliked the movie didn’t care to review, so the Internet polls are the best we have.

    Disney changed nothing it was a different director for 8 and 9. Plus with J.J Abrams he definitely doesn’t care what people say

    It was Colin Trevorrow; then TLJ had a negative response, Disney renamed these trilogies the “Skywalker Saga” and suddenly announced that this is the last movie.

    Regardless if Internet reviews impact Disney or not, the only real evidence of the audiences opinion we have are these reviews, which show that the general audience like the movie.

    The only thing that will truly impact Disney is money. If they are happy with how much it makes even though it's on pace to make a few hundred million less than Last Jedi then that's all the opinion they need. Bob Iger loved Last Jedi and it was a critical and financial success. Rise of Skywalker was a critical failure, but could be a financial success. A review website that could be a 12 year old kid who didn't even see the movie or a misogynist who simply hates any movie that has multiple female stars could be writing the audience reviews isn't going to dictate what they do if it all makes money, which is why they stopped the standalone films because Solo was not financially successful. It's like CG saying they're not seeing the "death of the game" so many have claimed. It's a financial success so they're happy with it.

    Sure.

    But the biggest reason Solo flopped was because of the Last Jedi. That’s why they decided to end the Skywalker Saga.

    Disney does listen mostly to their money and I do wish they valued quality, but they are still somewhat impacted by the communities opinion. No matter who does those online reviews, they are still informative, and there are still many of them.

    Last Jedi may have been the reason some didn't see Solo even though that makes no sense whatsoever as they are completely independent of each other. The movie was a well-documented disaster from director issues, having to rewrite half of the movie and losing actors, terrible release date as there was heavy competition (which is why all Star Wars movies since and upcoming all have December release dates), atrocious marketing, ridiculous budget and general lack of interest in the story to begin with. A movie with that much negative buzz going into it's release is almost never successful.

    Disney never wanted to continue the Skywalker saga and were going to consider the prequels as EU as they did with all the books and comics, but George Lucas forced their hand as part of the purchase and included treatments for a sequel trilogy. It's all documented in Bob Iger's recent book. I'd recommend it to anyone interested in behind the scenes business. It was also revealed how JJ Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy made the decision to dump Lucas's versions of Episodes 7-9 because Abrams wouldn't make the movie if it wasn't his. Long story short, Episode 9 was always going to be the end of the Skywalker saga after the decision was made to agree to George's terms for the purchase. The only thing that would have changed that is if the movies all made Avatar-level payouts.
  • LordGrahck wrote: »
    We need a new Han Solo. So how about Hallucination Han?

    hahahaha! good one
  • TVF
    19840 posts Member
    Nauros wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    for rey i dont see her getting the yellow lightsaber, and for kylo i can see him having 2 characters, one for the supreme leader, and one as ben solo

    Don't forget that more visually distinct characters are better. My guess is yellow lightsaber because it helps her stand out at first glance.
    As for Kylo, I think we'll get Supreme Leader to keep the balance between light and dark.
    Other than that, my guess is General Poe, Leia and Palpatine, with possibly Jannah and Zorii. Too bad the Knights of Ren were mostly reduced to standing menacingly and getting killed.

    Knights of Ren could be exactly like B1 except they only start with 8 stacks.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    I know you are probably right but PLEASE dont let her desecrate that name.... She already desecrated everything else.
  • Nauros wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    for rey i dont see her getting the yellow lightsaber, and for kylo i can see him having 2 characters, one for the supreme leader, and one as ben solo

    Don't forget that more visually distinct characters are better. My guess is yellow lightsaber because it helps her stand out at first glance.
    As for Kylo, I think we'll get Supreme Leader to keep the balance between light and dark.
    Other than that, my guess is General Poe, Leia and Palpatine, with possibly Jannah and Zorii. Too bad the Knights of Ren were mostly reduced to standing menacingly and getting killed.

    but the yellow lightsaber was only seen for a second is my issue with they using that. if anything id rather them give her the dual lightsabers to stand out.

    plus there is always diffrenet stances they can be in to help them stand out.
  • Boo
    3942 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    Maybe it’s just that some people out there try to see a movie for what it gives us and not destroy it out of hatred.

    For me and many people I know it gives us nothing except maybe a bad copy paste of the originals

    See, but that’s where you’re absolutely wrong. You can dislike these movies, to each their own, but you have to admit that they have brought something to the world. I also believe that people who attempt to find the good and the meaning in everything are typically happier.

    Indeed - illogical disaster. What it brought was lore breaking and disrespect to the franchise.

    What people like is the adventure and effects - fair enough, people can enjoy that, but so far as this being a continuing story in a world with established lore and characters the sequel trilogy is nothing more than a wrecking ball.

    The entire ST is pointless and just disregards the prior 1-6.
  • Boo
    3942 posts Member
    edited January 8
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    So you didn't like the movie, but you didn't dislike it enough to voice your opinion and try and influence the future of the Star Wars franchise by saying "this was bad, do something different". Seems logical.

    Disney doesn’t give a **** what fans think because they already have people’s money so you can try to influence the future of Star Wars but it’ll end up doing nothing and being a waste of time.

    This is false. The Last Jedi got a huge negative response from the audience, so Disney changed directions and ended with 9. You don’t have the evidence to say that people who disliked the movie didn’t care to review, so the Internet polls are the best we have.

    Disney changed nothing it was a different director for 8 and 9. Plus with J.J Abrams he definitely doesn’t care what people say

    It was Colin Trevorrow; then TLJ had a negative response, Disney renamed these trilogies the “Skywalker Saga” and suddenly announced that this is the last movie.

    Regardless if Internet reviews impact Disney or not, the only real evidence of the audiences opinion we have are these reviews, which show that the general audience like the movie.

    The only thing that will truly impact Disney is money. If they are happy with how much it makes even though it's on pace to make a few hundred million less than Last Jedi then that's all the opinion they need. Bob Iger loved Last Jedi and it was a critical and financial success. Rise of Skywalker was a critical failure, but could be a financial success. A review website that could be a 12 year old kid who didn't even see the movie or a misogynist who simply hates any movie that has multiple female stars could be writing the audience reviews isn't going to dictate what they do if it all makes money, which is why they stopped the standalone films because Solo was not financially successful. It's like CG saying they're not seeing the "death of the game" so many have claimed. It's a financial success so they're happy with it.

    Sure.

    But the biggest reason Solo flopped was because of the Last Jedi. That’s why they decided to end the Skywalker Saga.

    Disney does listen mostly to their money and I do wish they valued quality, but they are still somewhat impacted by the communities opinion. No matter who does those online reviews, they are still informative, and there are still many of them.

    Last Jedi may have been the reason some didn't see Solo even though that makes no sense whatsoever as they are completely independent of each other. The movie was a well-documented disaster from director issues, having to rewrite half of the movie and losing actors, terrible release date as there was heavy competition (which is why all Star Wars movies since and upcoming all have December release dates), atrocious marketing, ridiculous budget and general lack of interest in the story to begin with. A movie with that much negative buzz going into it's release is almost never successful.

    Disney never wanted to continue the Skywalker saga and were going to consider the prequels as EU as they did with all the books and comics, but George Lucas forced their hand as part of the purchase and included treatments for a sequel trilogy. It's all documented in Bob Iger's recent book. I'd recommend it to anyone interested in behind the scenes business. It was also revealed how JJ Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy made the decision to dump Lucas's versions of Episodes 7-9 because Abrams wouldn't make the movie if it wasn't his. Long story short, Episode 9 was always going to be the end of the Skywalker saga after the decision was made to agree to George's terms for the purchase. The only thing that would have changed that is if the movies all made Avatar-level payouts.

    I'd argue TLJ was the lead point to Soo's disaster. The fanbase was fractured and anyone not liking TLJ was labelled horrific names by the Disney shill media - not exactly an audience who then want to open their wallets for the next movie.

    Star Wars fatigue doesn't exist, if done properly people are hungry for good star wars content, just like what can be seen with the MCU.

    Poor marketing is a poor excuse as well. Since when does the latest movie in one of the world's top franchises really need a lot of marketing? That's a joke.

    I would say the release time played a factor, but MCU fans and Star Wars fans are kinda the same. They would see both movies (Avengers and Star Wars) so that really didn't matter too much either.

    The re-writes etc - well TROS had re-writes and it seems to be doing ok. Rogue One was scattered with director issues as well as re-writes and deleted scenes and edited scenes etc. and many of the star wars fandom love R1 - so while I'd appreciate this being a factor, its nowhere near the biggest you have mentioned.

    The other big points were no one was particularly interested in the story Solo was telling, not to mention the taking away of the mystery behind the character as well.

    Additionally, we had already seen Han die in TFA, so a movie of a dead character showing his origins was a poor choice for Disney to make. Another issue was the recasting of Han - Harrison Ford is Han Solo, so as a young Han Solo required a different actor, it wasn't something the audience really wanted.

    Personally the only reason I did not see Solo was because of TLJ. And I did not pay to see TROS because of TLJ and what TROS is as a movie and does in it.
  • okay can we please stop arguing about how good/bad the movie was, or any other movie here. thats not the point if this thread
  • flux_rono wrote: »
    okay can we please stop arguing about how good/bad the movie was, or any other movie here. thats not the point if this thread

    Fine...

    You want to know what characters could be coming?

    Let me say first... The events for the mega characters will probably not be launched at the same time.

    The event to get the new Kylo will go first.

    And you will need the new Kylo to unlock the new Rey.

    The journey events mimic the events the hero has taken. Think about the movie.

    So who in the movie played a prominent role?

    Light side possibilities: Lando (vet smuggler Lando) - Hero of the Resistance Poe (General Poe)
    Zori Bliss. Droid programmer

    Dark side possibilities: Admiral or General Pride. New Emperor. And the new Kylo, if you have seen the movie, you will know which version I am thinking. And that version will be needed to get the new Rey.


  • Boo wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    So you didn't like the movie, but you didn't dislike it enough to voice your opinion and try and influence the future of the Star Wars franchise by saying "this was bad, do something different". Seems logical.

    Disney doesn’t give a **** what fans think because they already have people’s money so you can try to influence the future of Star Wars but it’ll end up doing nothing and being a waste of time.

    This is false. The Last Jedi got a huge negative response from the audience, so Disney changed directions and ended with 9. You don’t have the evidence to say that people who disliked the movie didn’t care to review, so the Internet polls are the best we have.

    Disney changed nothing it was a different director for 8 and 9. Plus with J.J Abrams he definitely doesn’t care what people say

    It was Colin Trevorrow; then TLJ had a negative response, Disney renamed these trilogies the “Skywalker Saga” and suddenly announced that this is the last movie.

    Regardless if Internet reviews impact Disney or not, the only real evidence of the audiences opinion we have are these reviews, which show that the general audience like the movie.

    The only thing that will truly impact Disney is money. If they are happy with how much it makes even though it's on pace to make a few hundred million less than Last Jedi then that's all the opinion they need. Bob Iger loved Last Jedi and it was a critical and financial success. Rise of Skywalker was a critical failure, but could be a financial success. A review website that could be a 12 year old kid who didn't even see the movie or a misogynist who simply hates any movie that has multiple female stars could be writing the audience reviews isn't going to dictate what they do if it all makes money, which is why they stopped the standalone films because Solo was not financially successful. It's like CG saying they're not seeing the "death of the game" so many have claimed. It's a financial success so they're happy with it.

    Sure.

    But the biggest reason Solo flopped was because of the Last Jedi. That’s why they decided to end the Skywalker Saga.

    Disney does listen mostly to their money and I do wish they valued quality, but they are still somewhat impacted by the communities opinion. No matter who does those online reviews, they are still informative, and there are still many of them.

    Last Jedi may have been the reason some didn't see Solo even though that makes no sense whatsoever as they are completely independent of each other. The movie was a well-documented disaster from director issues, having to rewrite half of the movie and losing actors, terrible release date as there was heavy competition (which is why all Star Wars movies since and upcoming all have December release dates), atrocious marketing, ridiculous budget and general lack of interest in the story to begin with. A movie with that much negative buzz going into it's release is almost never successful.

    Disney never wanted to continue the Skywalker saga and were going to consider the prequels as EU as they did with all the books and comics, but George Lucas forced their hand as part of the purchase and included treatments for a sequel trilogy. It's all documented in Bob Iger's recent book. I'd recommend it to anyone interested in behind the scenes business. It was also revealed how JJ Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy made the decision to dump Lucas's versions of Episodes 7-9 because Abrams wouldn't make the movie if it wasn't his. Long story short, Episode 9 was always going to be the end of the Skywalker saga after the decision was made to agree to George's terms for the purchase. The only thing that would have changed that is if the movies all made Avatar-level payouts.

    I'd argue TLJ was the lead point to Soo's disaster. The fanbase was fractured and anyone not liking TLJ was labelled horrific names by the Disney shill media - not exactly an audience who then want to open their wallets for the next movie.

    Star Wars fatigue doesn't exist, if done properly people are hungry for good star wars content, just like what can be seen with the MCU.

    Poor marketing is a poor excuse as well. Since when does the latest movie in one of the world's top franchises really need a lot of marketing? That's a joke.

    I would say the release time played a factor, but MCU fans and Star Wars fans are kinda the same. They would see both movies (Avengers and Star Wars) so that really didn't matter too much either.

    The re-writes etc - well TROS had re-writes and it seems to be doing ok. Rogue One was scattered with director issues as well as re-writes and deleted scenes and edited scenes etc. and many of the star wars fandom love R1 - so while I'd appreciate this being a factor, its nowhere near the biggest you have mentioned.

    The other big points were no one was particularly interested in the story Solo was telling, not to mention the taking away of the mystery behind the character as well.

    Additionally, we had already seen Han die in TFA, so a movie of a dead character showing his origins was a poor choice for Disney to make. Another issue was the recasting of Han - Harrison Ford is Han Solo, so as a young Han Solo required a different actor, it wasn't something the audience really wanted.

    Personally the only reason I did not see Solo was because of TLJ. And I did not pay to see TROS because of TLJ and what TROS is as a movie and does in it.

    Last Jedi could have been the main factor for you not seeing Solo, which I will never understand because they're entirely independent from each other, but that absolutely does not effect the general public. Rogue One had a massive marketing campaign that showed it as being a direct prequel to a New Hope with elements that even the most casual fans were able to recognize. That didn't happen with Solo at all. They did nothing to appeal to the casual fan, international audience or the general public who were spending their money on Jurassic World, Deadpool 2 and Infinity War. Justice League was a bomb, yet due to brilliant marketing strategies Warner Brothers turned Aquaman (a character that has been labelled a joke for decades) into a huge success. You have to be appealing to the 90+% who don't have this deep seeded connection to the franchise on top of your normal fanbase.

    Directorial issues didn't affect Rise of Skywalker nearly the way it did Solo because JJ Abrams was able to do the entire movie from start to finish. Lord and Miller had a mostly completed movie before they were canned and Ron Howard was brought in to finish it. They had to completely retool the story and film a large portion of the movie from scratch (including having to recast the main villain) in way too short of a time because Iger demanded the movie be released in May instead of December. Had he not been so stubborn, we may have gotten a complete Ron Howard version of Solo that would have been far more cohesive, who knows.

  • Nauros
    3149 posts Member
    flux_rono wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    for rey i dont see her getting the yellow lightsaber, and for kylo i can see him having 2 characters, one for the supreme leader, and one as ben solo

    Don't forget that more visually distinct characters are better. My guess is yellow lightsaber because it helps her stand out at first glance.
    As for Kylo, I think we'll get Supreme Leader to keep the balance between light and dark.
    Other than that, my guess is General Poe, Leia and Palpatine, with possibly Jannah and Zorii. Too bad the Knights of Ren were mostly reduced to standing menacingly and getting killed.

    but the yellow lightsaber was only seen for a second is my issue with they using that. if anything id rather them give her the dual lightsabers to stand out.

    plus there is always diffrenet stances they can be in to help them stand out.

    Yeah, dual sabers would work as well. Actually, up to three versions of her could be added based on TROS: near-darkside conflicted Rey, ghost-powered dual wielding Rey and "final form" yellow saber Rey (plus full-on dark Rey, but that was just a vision). Not that I would want such Rey-pocalypse, but it's possible.
    Revive the stores, the game needs it.
  • Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    Maybe it’s just that some people out there try to see a movie for what it gives us and not destroy it out of hatred.

    For me and many people I know it gives us nothing except maybe a bad copy paste of the originals

    See, but that’s where you’re absolutely wrong. You can dislike these movies, to each their own, but you have to admit that they have brought something to the world. I also believe that people who attempt to find the good and the meaning in everything are typically happier.

    Indeed - illogical disaster. What it brought was lore breaking and disrespect to the franchise.

    What people like is the adventure and effects - fair enough, people can enjoy that, but so far as this being a continuing story in a world with established lore and characters the sequel trilogy is nothing more than a wrecking ball.

    The entire ST is pointless and just disregards the prior 1-6.

    Can I ask specifically what lore did it break?
  • SerWulfgar wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    I kind of hope the galactic legends get "changed", it says the names will change after spoilers are free. These seem like they will be the best and final versions of each character so really Rey should be
    Rey Skywalker with the orange lightsaber
    and Kylo should be
    Ben Solo a light side toon with a blue lightsaber
    . After all this is the final movie so they will ought to be the final version of both.

    I know you are probably right but PLEASE dont let her desecrate that name.... She already desecrated everything else.

    Does she really desecrate it more than "coarse sand" or pod racing? I'll admit that jumping between directors didn't help as they each pulled in different directions for the movies but it wasn't as horrible as people are trying to make it out to be. We just are in a time in humanity where people complain about everything, nothing is good anymore and most people can't just sit back and enjoy something that isn't their own fanfiction. There were bad parts but there were good parts, I'd much rather watch Rey and gang track down a holocron that will help guide her to an ancient sith planet where she can confront a powerful sith than to watch a half hour of pod racing and talking about the science of midiclorions. To each their own though I suppose.
  • Eutus
    173 posts Member
    @ssj4tim Hyper space ramming and force ghosts. If hyper space ramming is/was a reliable thing why do any pilots get in star ships. Why not just slap dynamite and a hyper drive on a vulture droid and send in squads to kaboom anything ... like the death stars or the rebel fleet.

    And if force ghosts can interact with the physical reality how come qui gon and obi wan and yoda show up to help luke with vader and the empire.

    @ThisYeezy stop with the 12 year old and misogynist crap. Shockingly both are entitled to opinions and in my country are granted the right to express dissapointment in a movie. No one seems to be mad about any of the new females in rots. No one seemed to mind qira. People go on about kelly marie trans internet bullying, but lets talk about reylos? What kinda inflamitory labels you got for them? The majority of people dont get into political correctness in a setting that is not modern earth. Most people dont like being labled ist or ism, and after words they didnt wanna open their wallets anymore. So see hasbros loss of toy sales for tlj merch and solos general mess. Solo had other factors going against it, but the name calling narrative was the problem. What changed for people who liked leia, padme, hera, ahsoka, or any of the female star wars characters then suddenly became ists over rey holdo or rose? Could it just be they are underwhelming characters? Or maybe checklist characters dictated by a commity are detrimental to a solid narrative?
  • ssj4tim wrote: »

    Does she really desecrate it more than "coarse sand" or pod racing? I'll admit that jumping between directors didn't help as they each pulled in different directions for the movies but it wasn't as horrible as people are trying to make it out to be. We just are in a time in humanity where people complain about everything, nothing is good anymore and most people can't just sit back and enjoy something that isn't their own fanfiction. There were bad parts but there were good parts, I'd much rather watch Rey and gang track down a holocron that will help guide her to an ancient sith planet where she can confront a powerful sith than to watch a half hour of pod racing and talking about the science of midiclorions. To each their own though I suppose.

    Okay, so... As much as it hurts to even remember those trash movies I think i got called out enough to actually defend my point.

    First of, yes, she absolutely does desecrate it more. Much more.

    Portraying Vaders youth was a huge mistake: we were told that he was one of the greatest heroes before turning into one of the greatest villains. We saw the latter in the OT, and they gave us the first part in the PT and partially in the TCW show.

    While Anakin was a whiner who just needed a really hard b*tchslap throughout the whole trilogy it did not completely destory Darth Vader. It did destroy the sentence about being the hero, but the villain part remained intact and at the end of the day it was all that mattered.

    If you want to bash on the PT go with the direct contradictions regarding the OT, like Ben Kenobi not remembering r2 and such.

    The trash moves you cited were affecting Anakin and not Darth Vader. With the jedi knight's fall it was easy to separate those two (even Ben Kenobi hinted this) and while the damage was horrible, it essentially did not affect Darth Vader. And Vader is much more iconic than Anakin.

    There is the ST on the other hand...
    Gosh, where do I even start it? If Palpi is alive, than the battle of Endor is pointless. Vader's sacrifice is pointless. The prophecy about the balance is a lie. If Vader's sacrifice is pointless, his whole character arc gets damaged and it renders the whole PT completely irrelevant. One more jedi who died to Palpatine, lets move on.

    Even the pure existance of the First Order was an affront to everything the Rebellion stood for. The much desired peace never occured, and Luke was never happy. (This all, without an explanation)

    With a single act of resurrecting Palpatine you undermined 6 of the previous movies showing a gigantic middlefinger to whatever we can call Lore. This is not extending the Lore, this is overwriting it.

    This is a cheap move like waking up a character from sleeping and telling that everything in the past was but a dream, (Imo this is the only way to fix this trilogy: Ben wakes up in the morning, runs to mother with tears on his face: Mommy, i dreamed i was a sith lord! Mommy slaps him in the face HARD, and yells at him: get back to the school. The end, credits. There you go)

    Denying Luke's happiness, denying the peace of the Galaxy, invalidating the battle of Endor, invalidating the prophecy is MUCH worse than podracing. Like, they do not even compare. Oh and podracing was horrible indeed.

    And whereas you might say that I am not talking about Rey, i am exactly talking about Rey, because this is her story arc. The whole trilogy builds up to the point where she says that name. She is the "product" of the trilogy.

    They did the same to Han Solo: they decided that everything that makes him unique... he just got them by chance. Same goes to rey: she gets the saber, the ship, the Force, the name.

    If you think she actually deserved or put effort into any of this you will probably disagree with me.

    For me, Rey is the essence of the trilogy, her character arc is built upon the destruction of others, and I reject her as such.

    But the end of the day I just wish she wouldnt take the name at least.

  • Eutus wrote: »
    @ssj4tim Hyper space ramming and force ghosts. If hyper space ramming is/was a reliable thing why do any pilots get in star ships. Why not just slap dynamite and a hyper drive on a vulture droid and send in squads to kaboom anything ... like the death stars or the rebel fleet.

    And if force ghosts can interact with the physical reality how come qui gon and obi wan and yoda show up to help luke with vader and the empire.

    @ThisYeezy stop with the 12 year old and misogynist crap. Shockingly both are entitled to opinions and in my country are granted the right to express dissapointment in a movie. No one seems to be mad about any of the new females in rots. No one seemed to mind qira. People go on about kelly marie trans internet bullying, but lets talk about reylos? What kinda inflamitory labels you got for them? The majority of people dont get into political correctness in a setting that is not modern earth. Most people dont like being labled ist or ism, and after words they didnt wanna open their wallets anymore. So see hasbros loss of toy sales for tlj merch and solos general mess. Solo had other factors going against it, but the name calling narrative was the problem. What changed for people who liked leia, padme, hera, ahsoka, or any of the female star wars characters then suddenly became ists over rey holdo or rose? Could it just be they are underwhelming characters? Or maybe checklist characters dictated by a commity are detrimental to a solid narrative?

    Why can people get cut in half and thrown down a shaft and survive? They've been making it up as they go for quite awhile.

    Of course they have the right to express disappointment. Just like Disney has the right to ignore them and read the reviews with actual constructive criticism. At no point did anyone here or any sane person in the world label everybody who didn't like Last Jedi a misogynist, and if you're claiming that I did you apparently did not actually understand what I wrote. If there's no way to establish credibility for the people doing the reviews you have no idea what kind of agenda someone may have. That's why the only audience reviews that most people actually take into account on a site like Rotten Tomatoes are the super reviewers because you're able to look at a large sample size of what they've reviewed to see if they're actually giving an unbiased opinion. Have you read the audience review sections on these sites for any movie? You can throw away a good 90% of them whether they gave it a thumbs up or down. You seem hellbent on this idea that you're personally being called out by the world for not liking a movie.
  • Boo
    3942 posts Member
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    MADMAN3199 wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    flux_rono wrote: »
    ThisYeezy wrote: »
    Considering how bad of a movie Rise of Skywalker is, I'd be happy if CG just skipped to whatever they had planned next.

    i dont think many people found it bad, most enjoyed it from what ive seen so far

    "I don't think many people found it bad". I wish that were true. I wanted nothing more than for this movie to unite the fanbase like the Mandalorian has, but it's done the exact opposite.

    Well, it is 75% liked on Google (unknown number of reviews), 86% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes (70k reviews), 7/10 on IMDb (172k reviews), and then almost perfectly split on Metacritic (5.0 score, 1.5k positive and negative with 500 mixed). Seems like most viewers liked it based on the composite of 4 different review options.

    Rotten tomatoes always has stupid reviews so for me they have no credibility and google and IMDb aren’t the greatest either. Most who don’t like it(like me) won’t bother to put a review because we would rather forget about the sequels

    Maybe it’s just that some people out there try to see a movie for what it gives us and not destroy it out of hatred.

    For me and many people I know it gives us nothing except maybe a bad copy paste of the originals

    See, but that’s where you’re absolutely wrong. You can dislike these movies, to each their own, but you have to admit that they have brought something to the world. I also believe that people who attempt to find the good and the meaning in everything are typically happier.

    Indeed - illogical disaster. What it brought was lore breaking and disrespect to the franchise.

    What people like is the adventure and effects - fair enough, people can enjoy that, but so far as this being a continuing story in a world with established lore and characters the sequel trilogy is nothing more than a wrecking ball.

    The entire ST is pointless and just disregards the prior 1-6.

    Can I ask specifically what lore did it break?

    I wont derail this thread with my trash talk of the ST - check out some of the threads in the "Off ZTopic" section of the forums for those issues and detailed reasons in regard to those issues.

    However the highlights to me are:

    * Luke Skywalker's character
    * Holdo Maneuver
    * Rey - Mary Sue
    * Changes to the lore of the force
    * Snoke being nobody and his demise
    * Palpatine's return

    If you choose to ignore all of that or accept all of that without question and enjoy ST, then ok. I cant.
  • Empress Palpatine
  • Boo
    3942 posts Member
    However on point of the discussion of this thread, I don't think we need toons from TROS necessarily, but certainly toons from the ST era - we have loads of toons in-game from the OT and PT eras, including spin-offs like CLone Wars and Rebels (I'll be clear and say I will stop playing this game if Resistance characters come into it).

    Personally I'd like to see:

    Resistance:

    * Jedi Rey Skywalker (with Yellow/Orange saber - as this would be different and cool).
    * Ben Solo
    * General Leia
    * Master Skywalker
    * Resistance Hero Poe
    * Zori Bliss
    * Vet Lando
    I think Vet Chewie needs a re-work to get the "resistance" tag

    I would also like to see ships. Capital ship (either Holdo or Leia commanding) as well as new fighters, there are Y-Wings and A-Wings etc in TROS as well.

    First/Final Order

    * Resurrected Dark Lord Palpatine
    * Snoke
    * Supreme Leader Kylo Ren
    * Knight of Ren
    * Gen. Pride
    Again we need a FO fleet a capital ship controlled by Hux or Pride and more fighters.

    All 6 factions throughout the saga need fleet representation - Galactic Republic, Separatists; Rebels, Empire; and Resistance, First Order.
  • Eutus wrote: »
    @ssj4tim Hyper space ramming and force ghosts. If hyper space ramming is/was a reliable thing why do any pilots get in star ships. Why not just slap dynamite and a hyper drive on a vulture droid and send in squads to kaboom anything ... like the death stars or the rebel fleet.

    And if force ghosts can interact with the physical reality how come qui gon and obi wan and yoda show up to help luke with vader and the empire.

    The lightspeed skipping definitely seems like something people didn't think of before Poe as it seems very dangerous and not the smartest idea. As for filling a fighter ship up with dynamite and crashing them into things doesn't make sense. Have you seen the explosions when a tie or xwing gets shot down and explodes on the death star or even a star destroyer? Very minimal damage, adding dynamite won't make that much bigger. Not to mention it would be super expensive and inefficient, you only get one shot with that where as if you are on a star destroyer you can attack multiple times at multiple objects.

    As for the force ghosts, it does make sense. Yoda made it clear that when you die as a Jedi you become part of the living force, essentially force apparitions so it stands to reason small amounts of force can be used to affect the physical world. Especially on a Jedi planet that is very strong in the force. Also Yoda made it clear that the dark side of the force clouds and even hinders light side powers and the emperor was very strong in the dark side. So it stands to reason that they couldn't just walk onto the death star with force ghosts to fight the emperor.

    I dunno I guess I'm just open minded to then trying new/different things and it makes sense in the realm of star wars to me, I didn't mind most of the new things because it still felt like a star wars adventure to me.
  • ssj4tim
    67 posts Member
    edited January 10
    SerWulfgar wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »

    Does she really desecrate it more than "coarse sand" or pod racing? I'll admit that jumping between directors didn't help as they each pulled in different directions for the movies but it wasn't as horrible as people are trying to make it out to be. We just are in a time in humanity where people complain about everything, nothing is good anymore and most people can't just sit back and enjoy something that isn't their own fanfiction. There were bad parts but there were good parts, I'd much rather watch Rey and gang track down a holocron that will help guide her to an ancient sith planet where she can confront a powerful sith than to watch a half hour of pod racing and talking about the science of midiclorions. To each their own though I suppose.

    Okay, so... As much as it hurts to even remember those trash movies I think i got called out enough to actually defend my point.

    First of, yes, she absolutely does desecrate it more. Much more.

    Portraying Vaders youth was a huge mistake: we were told that he was one of the greatest heroes before turning into one of the greatest villains. We saw the latter in the OT, and they gave us the first part in the PT and partially in the TCW show.

    While Anakin was a whiner who just needed a really hard b*tchslap throughout the whole trilogy it did not completely destory Darth Vader. It did destroy the sentence about being the hero, but the villain part remained intact and at the end of the day it was all that mattered.

    If you want to bash on the PT go with the direct contradictions regarding the OT, like Ben Kenobi not remembering r2 and such.

    The trash moves you cited were affecting Anakin and not Darth Vader. With the jedi knight's fall it was easy to separate those two (even Ben Kenobi hinted this) and while the damage was horrible, it essentially did not affect Darth Vader. And Vader is much more iconic than Anakin.

    There is the ST on the other hand...
    Gosh, where do I even start it? If Palpi is alive, than the battle of Endor is pointless. Vader's sacrifice is pointless. The prophecy about the balance is a lie. If Vader's sacrifice is pointless, his whole character arc gets damaged and it renders the whole PT completely irrelevant. One more jedi who died to Palpatine, lets move on.

    Even the pure existance of the First Order was an affront to everything the Rebellion stood for. The much desired peace never occured, and Luke was never happy. (This all, without an explanation)

    With a single act of resurrecting Palpatine you undermined 6 of the previous movies showing a gigantic middlefinger to whatever we can call Lore. This is not extending the Lore, this is overwriting it.

    This is a cheap move like waking up a character from sleeping and telling that everything in the past was but a dream, (Imo this is the only way to fix this trilogy: Ben wakes up in the morning, runs to mother with tears on his face: Mommy, i dreamed i was a sith lord! Mommy slaps him in the face HARD, and yells at him: get back to the school. The end, credits. There you go)

    Denying Luke's happiness, denying the peace of the Galaxy, invalidating the battle of Endor, invalidating the prophecy is MUCH worse than podracing. Like, they do not even compare. Oh and podracing was horrible indeed.

    And whereas you might say that I am not talking about Rey, i am exactly talking about Rey, because this is her story arc. The whole trilogy builds up to the point where she says that name. She is the "product" of the trilogy.

    They did the same to Han Solo: they decided that everything that makes him unique... he just got them by chance. Same goes to rey: she gets the saber, the ship, the Force, the name.

    If you think she actually deserved or put effort into any of this you will probably disagree with me.

    For me, Rey is the essence of the trilogy, her character arc is built upon the destruction of others, and I reject her as such.

    But the end of the day I just wish she wouldnt take the name at least.

    I see your reasoning but I guess the invalidation doesn't bother me. Palpatine had hinted he found ways to survive and stop death, he was one of the most powerful sith that ever existed. And I suppose prophecy I've learned from many of fantasy stories is never to be taken literal. When was Luke ever promised happiness? The prophecy supposedly said there was someone who would bring balance to the force, but what is balance? Equal light and dark, but that can never really happen, there is always back and forth, someone always has to win.

    Let's say palpatine stayed dead, first order was never a thing and Luke lived happily ever after, how is that balance? At that point the light is way over loaded and the darkness is suppressed, they are all just skipping through Daisy's singing songs together. Honestly I'm kind of glad Snoke was a nobody, from the first time I saw him he seemed stupid to me, and I'm also glad Kylo wasn't the big bad of the series because he just couldn't pull it off. He seemed like a whiny baby to me.

    While more back story to why Palpatine survived would have been nice, it more than makes sense someone as intelligent and sly as him had a back up plan. He spent decades building up and infiltrating the Senate to get to the point where he could take over. Someone like that who has things like cloning at his finger tips, the knowledge that sith like to kill their masters, it only makes sense for him to have a back up plan in case something happened. It almost would be dumb if he didn't in some way have some sort of plan set up for if he lost or got struck down by one of his apprentices.

    I mean at the end of the day each person has their own opinions, do I think the new trilogy was the best? No not at all, I do however go into the theater with an open mind and am able to enjoy it because it still feels like star wars to me. I never once got the feeling that they were destroying my love for the older movies and am okay with them trying out things. Star wars has always been a vast universe and I am fully aware and like the fact that I don't know everything about the universe. I don't go in thinking I know everything and if they do one thing I don't agree with the whole thing is ruined, because in a universe that size there should be unexpected and unexplainable things. At least that is my opinion.
  • @ssj4tim wins the Internet for today. A reasonable reply that makes sense and doesn’t get too emotional. Kudos.
  • Boo
    3942 posts Member
    ssj4tim wrote: »
    SerWulfgar wrote: »
    ssj4tim wrote: »

    Does she really desecrate it more than "coarse sand" or pod racing? I'll admit that jumping between directors didn't help as they each pulled in different directions for the movies but it wasn't as horrible as people are trying to make it out to be. We just are in a time in humanity where people complain about everything, nothing is good anymore and most people can't just sit back and enjoy something that isn't their own fanfiction. There were bad parts but there were good parts, I'd much rather watch Rey and gang track down a holocron that will help guide her to an ancient sith planet where she can confront a powerful sith than to watch a half hour of pod racing and talking about the science of midiclorions. To each their own though I suppose.

    Okay, so... As much as it hurts to even remember those trash movies I think i got called out enough to actually defend my point.

    First of, yes, she absolutely does desecrate it more. Much more.

    Portraying Vaders youth was a huge mistake: we were told that he was one of the greatest heroes before turning into one of the greatest villains. We saw the latter in the OT, and they gave us the first part in the PT and partially in the TCW show.

    While Anakin was a whiner who just needed a really hard b*tchslap throughout the whole trilogy it did not completely destory Darth Vader. It did destroy the sentence about being the hero, but the villain part remained intact and at the end of the day it was all that mattered.

    If you want to bash on the PT go with the direct contradictions regarding the OT, like Ben Kenobi not remembering r2 and such.

    The trash moves you cited were affecting Anakin and not Darth Vader. With the jedi knight's fall it was easy to separate those two (even Ben Kenobi hinted this) and while the damage was horrible, it essentially did not affect Darth Vader. And Vader is much more iconic than Anakin.

    There is the ST on the other hand...
    Gosh, where do I even start it? If Palpi is alive, than the battle of Endor is pointless. Vader's sacrifice is pointless. The prophecy about the balance is a lie. If Vader's sacrifice is pointless, his whole character arc gets damaged and it renders the whole PT completely irrelevant. One more jedi who died to Palpatine, lets move on.

    Even the pure existance of the First Order was an affront to everything the Rebellion stood for. The much desired peace never occured, and Luke was never happy. (This all, without an explanation)

    With a single act of resurrecting Palpatine you undermined 6 of the previous movies showing a gigantic middlefinger to whatever we can call Lore. This is not extending the Lore, this is overwriting it.

    This is a cheap move like waking up a character from sleeping and telling that everything in the past was but a dream, (Imo this is the only way to fix this trilogy: Ben wakes up in the morning, runs to mother with tears on his face: Mommy, i dreamed i was a sith lord! Mommy slaps him in the face HARD, and yells at him: get back to the school. The end, credits. There you go)

    Denying Luke's happiness, denying the peace of the Galaxy, invalidating the battle of Endor, invalidating the prophecy is MUCH worse than podracing. Like, they do not even compare. Oh and podracing was horrible indeed.

    And whereas you might say that I am not talking about Rey, i am exactly talking about Rey, because this is her story arc. The whole trilogy builds up to the point where she says that name. She is the "product" of the trilogy.

    They did the same to Han Solo: they decided that everything that makes him unique... he just got them by chance. Same goes to rey: she gets the saber, the ship, the Force, the name.

    If you think she actually deserved or put effort into any of this you will probably disagree with me.

    For me, Rey is the essence of the trilogy, her character arc is built upon the destruction of others, and I reject her as such.

    But the end of the day I just wish she wouldnt take the name at least.

    I see your reasoning but I guess the invalidation doesn't bother me. Palpatine had hinted he found ways to survive and stop death, he was one of the most powerful sith that ever existed. And I suppose prophecy I've learned from many of fantasy stories is never to be taken literal. When was Luke ever promised happiness? The prophecy supposedly said there was someone who would bring balance to the force, but what is balance? Equal light and dark, but that can never really happen, there is always back and forth, someone always has to win.

    Let's say palpatine stayed dead, first order was never a thing and Luke lived happily ever after, how is that balance? At that point the light is way over loaded and the darkness is suppressed, they are all just skipping through Daisy's singing songs together. Honestly I'm kind of glad Snoke was a nobody, from the first time I saw him he seemed stupid to me, and I'm also glad Kylo wasn't the big bad of the series because he just couldn't pull it off. He seemed like a whiny baby to me.

    While more back story to why Palpatine survived would have been nice, it more than makes sense someone as intelligent and sly as him had a back up plan. He spent decades building up and infiltrating the Senate to get to the point where he could take over. Someone like that who has things like cloning at his finger tips, the knowledge that sith like to kill their masters, it only makes sense for him to have a back up plan in case something happened. It almost would be dumb if he didn't in some way have some sort of plan set up for if he lost or got struck down by one of his apprentices.

    I mean at the end of the day each person has their own opinions, do I think the new trilogy was the best? No not at all, I do however go into the theater with an open mind and am able to enjoy it because it still feels like star wars to me. I never once got the feeling that they were destroying my love for the older movies and am okay with them trying out things. Star wars has always been a vast universe and I am fully aware and like the fact that I don't know everything about the universe. I don't go in thinking I know everything and if they do one thing I don't agree with the whole thing is ruined, because in a universe that size there should be unexpected and unexplainable things. At least that is my opinion.

    Ok I have to chime in on this one, lol.

    Yes I'd agree that usually from other movies and stories etc. Prophecies are funny things and misleading.

    However the misleading part and the part that Yoda states "perhaps misread the prophecy was" was Anakin's fall to the Darkside. He had to as the Jedi had become corrupt in their teachings. But the prophecy was clear that the chosen one would balance the force - how he did that or how that would happen is the tricky part.

    Arrogance "a flaw more and more common among Jedi", as well as their entitlement being their view of the force was the true nature of the force and the dark was an abomination - in other words "the dogmatic narrow view of the Jedi", and Luke explains that in TLJ well. They most importantly held fear - they feared the darkside. Mace was going to kill an unarmed/defeated Sidious out of fear of him escaping justice, "fear is a path to the darkside".
    Above all, they also feared emotion:
    The Sith state: "through passion I gain strength" where the Jedi state "there is no emotion, there is peace" - emotion such as love, which inevitably causes attachment. Yoda and Obi Wan instructed Luke to kill Vader, because they could not fathom the possibility of redemption. They couldn't grasp it because it was Luke's passions that saved Anakin. Lukes love for a father, and Anakin's love for his son that redeemed Vader, where Vader destroyed Palpatine and the Sith - fulfilling the prophecy.

    It is fitting that Palpatine did not have a "back up plan" as he was arrogant and overconfident.
    Palpatine was also clear with Anakin that he did not know the power of creating life of cheating death and that he and Anakin would need to work together to discover that secret.

    The other aspect about the balancing of the force was that Luke learned that love and passion is a source for good and not to be feared. Yoda said to Luke "pass on what you have learned" not what he was taught - what he learned. Going forward their was balance in the force.

    This is what destroys Luke's character, his passion and risk to his own life to save a Princess scheduled for termination in the Death Star detention area; his passion and risk to own life for facing Vader to save his captured friends, his passion and risk of own life to surrender to save his friends and redeem his father and face the Emperor - was gone.
    His passion and love for his father was not shared with his nephew he was going to strike down - even if it was for a fleeting moment.

    There was more than no growth for Luke's character but absolute uncharacteristic regression.

    With Palpatine and the Sith defeated in ROTJ, that does not mean the darkside was defeated and never did the prophecy say that.

    The Sequel trilogy needed a compelling villain - a villain that would be as equally evil as Palpatine or more so. With Palpatine's character being fleshed out over 1-6 movies it was very necessary to properly explain the character of Snoke in order to make him be a believable, fitting and compelling villain - whether he was a surviving Plagueis who had faked his death and secretly manipulated Palpatine all this time, or an Ancient force user who followed the darkside which led to the creation of the Sith in the first place.

    Johnson was not only lazy in his approach to Snoke, he was a coward in that he couldn't write a compelling enough character. Instead he made Snoke out to be no one and killed him off as a nobody. This derailed the story of the sequel trilogy as it needed a strong and compelling villain to work, and Kylo wasn't it. Sadly Johnson failed to understand the need for Snoke - a compelling villain to overcome at the climax of this trilogy.

    Without Snoke, we got a weakly explained return of Palpatine - which undermines everything I mentioned above in regard to E1-6.





  • well we got a new poe confirmed
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