Acting In Star Wars

Replies

  • Other
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.
  • Adam Driver (Kylo/Ben)
    GL should have introduced the romance element in AotC as fresh plot development rather than Anakin summarizing he's fantasized about her for the intervening years between the movies. Have them meet up after years apart and let it basically develop from scratch.

    The way it was portrayed was essentially stalker/predatory behavior from Anakin.
  • TVF
    21268 posts Member
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    They could have started TPM with an older kid, or even an adult.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    It’s clear the ST has the best acting, that’s for sure.
  • Adam Driver (Kylo/Ben)
    Boo wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    AntiFunn wrote: »
    Palpatine is the most beloved villain in Star Wars no doubt. But as many have said, I think it is almost a tie between Ewan and Ian. Ewan personally just loves Obi-Wan and we are all super thrilled to be seeing him in the new series!

    We know Hayden Christensen is hated and downvoted by many fans but he also did a Super good job in my opinion. Obviously plot errors and jamming too much content into Episode 2 and 3 did not make a good development visible. He has always appreciated his role in SW and has said in an interview that he just begged to play Lord Vader in Ep3 (instead of a different actor with a taller figure). Shows his overall love and enthusiasm. If we say favorite character, I would say Anakin all the way.

    Yeah, have to agree that Hayden did a good job. One cannot simply out act the script. If you have a garbage script to work with, you're not going to perform better.

    Don't forgot to pile on horrific direction.

    Yeah, then there is the directing... Whenever I hear people complain about the character of Anakin, I can't help but think of Jake Lloyd. Kid got verbally abused by adults. It's kinda wrong to blame only the actor for a bad performance.

    While this is true, I'll never forget the TPM doc where they show the screen tests for three kids and they picked the worst one.

    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    But sadly Lucas wanted to him to be a child that children in the audience could relate to - reel in the next gen of star wars fans and sell as many toys as possible.

    Sadly TPM was full of politics, so outside of Qui-Gon, Obi Wan and Darth Maul - there was very little toys for kids to get excited about and the entire TPM toy line underperformed - so whenever the Star Wars franchise starts to fail, they fall back on the safety net of the OT. Hasbro, having taken over from Kenner, went back to the drawing board, released a whole line of OT toys and made a killing.

    Don’t forget podracing! Woo!
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.
  • TVF wrote: »
    AntiFunn wrote: »
    Palpatine is the most beloved villain in Star Wars no doubt. But as many have said, I think it is almost a tie between Ewan and Ian. Ewan personally just loves Obi-Wan and we are all super thrilled to be seeing him in the new series!

    We know Hayden Christensen is hated and downvoted by many fans but he also did a Super good job in my opinion. Obviously plot errors and jamming too much content into Episode 2 and 3 did not make a good development visible. He has always appreciated his role in SW and has said in an interview that he just begged to play Lord Vader in Ep3 (instead of a different actor with a taller figure). Shows his overall love and enthusiasm. If we say favorite character, I would say Anakin all the way.

    Yeah, have to agree that Hayden did a good job. One cannot simply out act the script. If you have a garbage script to work with, you're not going to perform better.

    Don't forgot to pile on horrific direction.

    Yeah, then there is the directing... Whenever I hear people complain about the character of Anakin, I can't help but think of Jake Lloyd. Kid got verbally abused by adults. It's kinda wrong to blame only the actor for a bad performance.

    While this is true, I'll never forget the TPM doc where they show the screen tests for three kids and they picked the worst one.

    I didn't see those, but it still doesn't justify grown adults mocking the kid.
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    It’s clear the ST has the best acting, that’s for sure.

    I'd say some characters are better - Kylo for one and I think Rey was better than she had been in TROS.

    But the OT had great actors - Alec Guinness, Peter Cushing, Harrison Ford, Frank Oz - sorry, but the ST actors are what MC Hammer would say "Can't touch this"
  • TVF
    21268 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    AntiFunn wrote: »
    Palpatine is the most beloved villain in Star Wars no doubt. But as many have said, I think it is almost a tie between Ewan and Ian. Ewan personally just loves Obi-Wan and we are all super thrilled to be seeing him in the new series!

    We know Hayden Christensen is hated and downvoted by many fans but he also did a Super good job in my opinion. Obviously plot errors and jamming too much content into Episode 2 and 3 did not make a good development visible. He has always appreciated his role in SW and has said in an interview that he just begged to play Lord Vader in Ep3 (instead of a different actor with a taller figure). Shows his overall love and enthusiasm. If we say favorite character, I would say Anakin all the way.

    Yeah, have to agree that Hayden did a good job. One cannot simply out act the script. If you have a garbage script to work with, you're not going to perform better.

    Don't forgot to pile on horrific direction.

    Yeah, then there is the directing... Whenever I hear people complain about the character of Anakin, I can't help but think of Jake Lloyd. Kid got verbally abused by adults. It's kinda wrong to blame only the actor for a bad performance.

    While this is true, I'll never forget the TPM doc where they show the screen tests for three kids and they picked the worst one.

    I didn't see those, but it still doesn't justify grown adults mocking the kid.

    Of course not.

    But it also doesn't justify him ever being in the movie. He never should have been. And it's not his fault, it's the casting director and Lucas that are to blame.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    Boo wrote: »
    Gifafi wrote: »
    It’s clear the ST has the best acting, that’s for sure.

    I'd say some characters are better - Kylo for one and I think Rey was better than she had been in TROS.

    But the OT had great actors - Alec Guinness, Peter Cushing, Harrison Ford, Frank Oz - sorry, but the ST actors are what MC Hammer would say "Can't touch this"

    op asked about acting, not actors
  • Other
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.
  • Ian McDiarmid (Palps)
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    He had experience with podracing, so he should at least kind of maybe know what the buttons might do.
  • Other
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Gifafi wrote: »
    It’s clear the ST has the best acting, that’s for sure.

    I'd say some characters are better - Kylo for one and I think Rey was better than she had been in TROS.

    But the OT had great actors - Alec Guinness, Peter Cushing, Harrison Ford, Frank Oz - sorry, but the ST actors are what MC Hammer would say "Can't touch this"

    op asked about acting, not actors

  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    His podracer he custom built - but how the heck did he reach the pedals etc. in the Naboo Starfighter?

    Even if there are no pedals in the starfighter, I am sure it is not designed for an 8 year old or whatever to fly it. I mean, he may not be tall enough to have seen out of the cockpit or something, lol
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    edited January 28
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.

    Sarcasm aside, you are correct. Anakin is the Chosen One and Rey IS a Mary Sue. Glad you straightened that out.

  • Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.

    Sarcasm aside, you are correct. Anakin is the Chosen One and Rey IS a Mary Sue. Glad you straightened that out.


    Anakin may be the Chosen One, but that doesn't make Rey a Mary Sue, or even more of a Mary Sue. Do you not see the irony in a made up prophecy that says "this character is the most powerful being ever" as "proof" of not being a Mary Sue is almost the definition of a Mary Sue? Anakin was literally made super powerful to fit a storyline, and was given a bunch of abilities without training to make the movie plot go.
    Looking for a new guild? Come check out the Underworld Alliance on Discord:https://discord.gg/wvrYb4Q
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    edited January 28
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.

    Sarcasm aside, you are correct. Anakin is the Chosen One and Rey IS a Mary Sue. Glad you straightened that out.


    Anakin may be the Chosen One, but that doesn't make Rey a Mary Sue, or even more of a Mary Sue. Do you not see the irony in a made up prophecy that says "this character is the most powerful being ever" as "proof" of not being a Mary Sue is almost the definition of a Mary Sue? Anakin was literally made super powerful to fit a storyline, and was given a bunch of abilities without training to make the movie plot go.

    Then you fail to see what a Mary Sue is mate.

    His power is explained, he is the force personified (like Jesus) - Rey's is not, just a regular force user, albeit from a powerful lineage.

    Anakin struggles to find power and particular use of the force, despite over 10 years of training (before the start of the clone wars), so more years of experience and training at the time of ROTS - Rey does every power whenever she wants, including stopping death and healing, which are powers that pushed Anakin to fall to the darkside.

    Anakin struggles with emotion and loses limbs in battle - Rey does not struggle (other than merely wondering who her parents were) and wins every lightsaber fight, despite having no training.

    People hate Anakin. It is clear people such as Mace strongly dislike him - Everyone loves Rey


    I could go on and on and on. Perhaps you need to understand the definition of a Mary Sue before you advocate for Rey and claim Anakin as a Gary Stu.

    Besides - where was Anakin ever shown to be super powerful as you claim?

  • Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.

    Sarcasm aside, you are correct. Anakin is the Chosen One and Rey IS a Mary Sue. Glad you straightened that out.


    Anakin may be the Chosen One, but that doesn't make Rey a Mary Sue, or even more of a Mary Sue. Do you not see the irony in a made up prophecy that says "this character is the most powerful being ever" as "proof" of not being a Mary Sue is almost the definition of a Mary Sue? Anakin was literally made super powerful to fit a storyline, and was given a bunch of abilities without training to make the movie plot go.

    Then you fail to see what a Mary Sue is mate.

    His power is explained, he is the force personified (like Jesus) - Rey's is not, just a regular force user, albeit from a powerful lineage.

    Anakin struggles to find power and particular use of the force, despite over 10 years of training (before the start of the clone wars), so more years of experience and training at the time of ROTS - Rey does every power whenever she wants, including stopping death and healing, which are powers that pushed Anakin to fall to the darkside.

    Anakin struggles with emotion and loses limbs in battle - Rey does not struggle (other than merely wondering who her parents were) and wins every lightsaber fight, despite having no training.

    People hate Anakin. It is clear people such as Mace strongly dislike him - Everyone loves Rey


    I could go on and on and on. Perhaps you need to understand the definition of a Mary Sue before you advocate for Rey and claim Anakin as a Gary Stu.

    Besides - where was Anakin ever shown to be super powerful as you claim?

    I am not claiming Anakin is a Mary Sue, just as much of a Mary Sue as any hero in Star Wars. Anakin, Luke, and Rey are all extremely powerful force users because the story needs them to be. Being a Mary Sue is just being a perfectly idealized character. None of the three are perfect, all of them struggle in different ways with different demons. Anakin struggles with his love/attachment, Luke struggles with his family's past, Rey struggles with the unknown and her fear of being the bad guy.

    You want Rey to be a Mary Sue because it would be a convenient way to write off the new movies, yet you ignore that the Force itself allows you to do this. The Force is an "I win" button for any main character in Star Wars and is used by every writer in every movie to explain anything they want. Why is Anakin a great pilot despite only ever driving a pod racer (which is like comparing a motorcycle to a jet fighter)? The force. Why did luke perfectly pilot a ship and blow up the greatest weapon ever? The force. How did Rey escape the First Order? The force.
    Looking for a new guild? Come check out the Underworld Alliance on Discord:https://discord.gg/wvrYb4Q
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    Hayden should have played Anakin from the get go. It looks weird that Portman was always the same, yet Anakin changes so much. It felt and looked weird this "love" between them in TPM, creepy really.

    Jake Lloyd was 8 when TPM started filming, Hayden Christensen was 16. Not sure how they could have made that work.

    And yeah, the relationship between them was always really strange. In an awkward, eww, kinda way.

    My point is that they shouldn't have made Anakin so young - he was already deemed "too old" by the counsel anyways, so what difference would it have made?

    The answer is what I already posted - Lucas wanted to sell Star Wars to the new generation (children) to sell as many toys as possible.

    It also made no sense that he was 8 and could fly fighter planes better than trained pilots. I don't care how strong he is with th e force, he's still a little kid and going to want to push random buttons to see what happens.

    I can understand anakin having a crush on padme at that young age, but she at most would look at him like this imaginative, perhaps slightly obnoxious, little kid.

    He should have been older just to make the time line work out better.

    As for him being so young to sell toys, George Lucas put all his "reeling in" eggs in the jar jar basket... And that was a flop.

    Anakin absolutely was the best star fighter pilot in the galaxy when he was still just a force sensitive fetus, because he was the chosen one and as the chosen one he can do anything and everything that he's ever needed to do, and he's totally NOT a Mary Sue for that. Rey, on the other hand, as a force sensitive late teen who's been surviving on her own for a decade has NO business being able to fly the Millennium Falcon like that - COMPLETE Mary Sue. /sarcasm.

    Sarcasm aside, you are correct. Anakin is the Chosen One and Rey IS a Mary Sue. Glad you straightened that out.


    Anakin may be the Chosen One, but that doesn't make Rey a Mary Sue, or even more of a Mary Sue. Do you not see the irony in a made up prophecy that says "this character is the most powerful being ever" as "proof" of not being a Mary Sue is almost the definition of a Mary Sue? Anakin was literally made super powerful to fit a storyline, and was given a bunch of abilities without training to make the movie plot go.

    Then you fail to see what a Mary Sue is mate.

    His power is explained, he is the force personified (like Jesus) - Rey's is not, just a regular force user, albeit from a powerful lineage.

    Anakin struggles to find power and particular use of the force, despite over 10 years of training (before the start of the clone wars), so more years of experience and training at the time of ROTS - Rey does every power whenever she wants, including stopping death and healing, which are powers that pushed Anakin to fall to the darkside.

    Anakin struggles with emotion and loses limbs in battle - Rey does not struggle (other than merely wondering who her parents were) and wins every lightsaber fight, despite having no training.

    People hate Anakin. It is clear people such as Mace strongly dislike him - Everyone loves Rey


    I could go on and on and on. Perhaps you need to understand the definition of a Mary Sue before you advocate for Rey and claim Anakin as a Gary Stu.

    Besides - where was Anakin ever shown to be super powerful as you claim?

    I am not claiming Anakin is a Mary Sue, just as much of a Mary Sue as any hero in Star Wars. Anakin, Luke, and Rey are all extremely powerful force users because the story needs them to be. Being a Mary Sue is just being a perfectly idealized character. None of the three are perfect, all of them struggle in different ways with different demons. Anakin struggles with his love/attachment, Luke struggles with his family's past, Rey struggles with the unknown and her fear of being the bad guy.

    You want Rey to be a Mary Sue because it would be a convenient way to write off the new movies, yet you ignore that the Force itself allows you to do this. The Force is an "I win" button for any main character in Star Wars and is used by every writer in every movie to explain anything they want. Why is Anakin a great pilot despite only ever driving a pod racer (which is like comparing a motorcycle to a jet fighter)? The force. Why did luke perfectly pilot a ship and blow up the greatest weapon ever? The force. How did Rey escape the First Order? The force.

    No, Rey's "struggles" only come into play in TROS because JJ was trying to retcon everything, including Rey being a Mary Sue - however, Rey still pulled off extremely powerful force techniques regardless.

    * Beats Kylo in force mind probe and then even uses it against him
    * Rey beats Kylo in a "tug of war" with the lightsaber
    * Rey beats Kylo in lightsaber combat
    * Rey pulls off complicated force techniques such as mind trick
    * Rey pilots the Falcon as an expert - despite having no piloting experience at all
    * Rey takes on Snoke's guards without any lightsaber training
    * Rey moves mountains
    * Rey heals and stops death


    Luke struggled in his training to lift rocks and R2, let alone his x-wing
    Anakin even had years of training and could not demonstrate anywhere near the power Rey has in the force - and he is the force personified.

    I am not saying Rey is a Mary Sue to simply put down the ST, the terrible writing of the ST has made Rey the Mary Sue she is, which puts down the ST by its own doing.
  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    lol anakin isn't a mary sue bc he's "the force personified" oh ok at least there's a good reason that explains it
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    lol anakin isn't a mary sue bc he's "the force personified" oh ok at least there's a good reason that explains it

    No, that explains his potential for greatness and a strong connection to the force.

    Despite that Anakin:

    * Struggles with emotion and attachments;
    * Struggles about his destiny and power;
    * is arrogant and struggles with the temptations toward the Darkside and ultimately falls becoming a mass murdering Sith Lord - he even kills children;
    * People don't all like him - it is clear that people such as Mace Windu do not like Anakin, nor the counsel generally;
    * Anakin lost an arm in lightsaber combat against count Dooku, despite 10 years of solid training and being the "Chosen One";
    * Anakin loses in lightsaber combat against Obi Wan, despite being the chosen on and now a Sith Lord strong in the darkside - he loses multiple limbs and is burned so badly he spends the rest of his life in a respirator suite.

    And this is just the stuff that happens in the movie - not to mention everything that happens in the Clone Wars series etc.

    All of the above are traits that Anakin is by far not a Gary Stu.
  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    oh, anakin isn't a mary sue bc of his entire character arc? and same with luke? ok then
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    edited January 28
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    oh, anakin isn't a mary sue bc of his entire character arc? and same with luke? ok then

    Correct Luke is not a Gary Stu either, if you really want me to I'll explain that for you as well.

    By the way the male term is a "Gary Stu" while the female term is a "Mary Sue".

    Again if you knew what the definition was of a Mary Sue or Gary Stu we wouldn't be having this conversation.
  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    of course luke is a mary sue if rey is (which she isn't)
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    edited January 28
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    of course luke is a mary sue if rey is (which she isn't)

    He's not - flawed logic mate.

    I am posting videos, because I am so tired of explaining it over and over...

  • Gifafi
    3527 posts Member
    tl;dw. luke is a soft desert dweller who all of a sudden after 5min of "training" outflies the best pilot in the galaxy and (SPOILERS) blows up the death star. Rey is a hardened desert dweller who fights off a guy who doesn't want her dead. but super different!...
  • TVF
    21268 posts Member
    Gifafi wrote: »
    tl;dw. luke is a soft desert dweller who all of a sudden after 5min of "training" outflies the best pilot in the galaxy and (SPOILERS) blows up the death star. Rey is a hardened desert dweller who fights off a guy who doesn't want her dead. but super different!...

    Well yeah, one's a woman.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Boo
    3980 posts Member
    edited January 28
    Ewan McGreggor (Obi-Wan)
    Gifafi wrote: »
    tl;dw. luke is a soft desert dweller who all of a sudden after 5min of "training" outflies the best pilot in the galaxy and (SPOILERS) blows up the death star. Rey is a hardened desert dweller who fights off a guy who doesn't want her dead. but super different!...

    Luke is the son of Vader - so his power and connection to the force is right up there, right off the get go.

    Luke is also an experienced pilot who flew his T-16 skyhopper, which is a similar control system and same manufacturer as the X-wing.

    Luke also flew through Beggar's Canyon regularly, similar to the Death Star trench run.

    Luke also "bull's eyed" womprats from his T-16, same size as the 2 meter exhaust port on the Death Star.

    Kenobi congratulates how Luke has become an exceptional pilot. Biggs also stated that in his opinion Luke was the "best pilot in the Outer Rim Territories". So already Luke has a background for being a good pilot.

    Luke also had assistance with "out flying" Vader - he had help from his wingmen initially as well as Han Solo, who literally saved his life before Vader was going to kill him - so he really didn't out fly Vader at all - he was helped and saved.

    I never said that Rey wasn't capable of defending herself with a staff - we have no idea how long she carried that thing and likely trained with it etc. Besides what does a staff have to do with being a pilot - totally different skills.

    So keep trying to argue, your points just look incredibly silly.
  • Boo wrote: »
    Gifafi wrote: »
    of course luke is a mary sue if rey is (which she isn't)

    He's not - flawed logic mate.

    I am posting videos, because I am so tired of explaining it over and over...


    From dictionary.com article about the term Mary Sue

    "Mary Sue has also expanded outside fanfiction to label canonical fictional characters. The main heroine of Star Wars: The Force Awakens, Rey, was derided by many as a Mary Sue. Here, Mary Sue is used as a derogatory synonym for any protagonist who is hated or dismissed for their talents and virtues. Harry Potter, Luke Skywalker, and Katniss Everdeen are among other famous characters who’ve been called Mary Sues."





    Looking for a new guild? Come check out the Underworld Alliance on Discord:https://discord.gg/wvrYb4Q
Sign In or Register to comment.