How is debuff resisting calculated?

jawa7778

I've been struggling a lot against Hound Tooth's in fleet arena recently(who hasn't) and I'm finally going to ask the question that I've had for awhile. How is landing a debuff calculated? I know potency and tenacity figure into the equation, but I can't figure out how. Sometimes, my TIE Silencer will not stun Hound's Tooth, and then next turn it will, so it seems like it's randomly calculated. Can someone explain?

Train

Chance for target to resist is the larger of (target tenacity - applier potency) or 15%.

Or in another way: Chance to Resist = MAX(Tenacity-Potency, 15%)

There is always a base 15% chance to resist any debuff (unless it is irresistible) regardless of potency. You could have a million % potency when trying to apply a debuff, and there would still be a 15% chance it is resisted.

CamaroAMF

Train wrote: »

Chance for target to resist is the larger of (target tenacity - applier potency) or 15%.

Or in another way: Chance to Resist = MAX(Tenacity-Potency, 15%)

There is always a base 15% chance to resist any debuff (unless it is irresistible) regardless of potency. You could have a million % potency when trying to apply a debuff, and there would still be a 15% chance it is resisted.

Good explanation here. One thing to note specifically for HT is that it has +50% tenacity when it isn’t taunting. Much easier to land debuffs on it after it gets taunt up.

mellamoroberto

And although you probably know this, that ship only stuns when the target has over 50% turn meter.

EmpressOrgana

So is this chance dependent on a positive outcome of the chance elements?
Eg. Vader's basic has 80% chance to do the equation explained above? As in:
0.8*MAX(tenacity-potency, 15%)

mellamoroberto

Correct

jawa7778

Train wrote: »

Chance for target to resist is the larger of (target tenacity - applier potency) or 15%.

Or in another way: Chance to Resist = MAX(Tenacity-Potency, 15%)

There is always a base 15% chance to resist any debuff (unless it is irresistible) regardless of potency. You could have a million % potency when trying to apply a debuff, and there would still be a 15% chance it is resisted.

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks. I was confused because my TIE Silencer had so much more potency than the Hound's Tooth tenacity, but he still resisted the debuff.

Train

EmpressOrgana wrote: »

So is this chance dependent on a positive outcome of the chance elements?
Eg. Vader's basic has 80% chance to do the equation explained above? As in:
0.8*MAX(tenacity-potency, 15%)

No, the 'chance to apply' is a separate check prior to the potency/tenacity check. It does not impact the tenacity or potency numbers themselves. If an ability fails the 'chance to apply' it does not even go through the potency/tenacity check.

Although some abilities have a unique order of operations, most abilities go through the following checks:
A] Is the ability evaded? (Influenced by Foresight, Accuracy, Dodge, etc.)
B] Is the ability applied? (Influenced by %Chance to apply in ability description; if none listed it's usually 100%)
C] Is the ability resisted? (Influenced by potency and tenacity)

If you see the text "can't be evaded", that means skip Check A.
If there is no "XX% chance to..." for the ability then that means skip Check B.
If you see the text "can't be resisted", that means skip Check C.

Sanderzas

Train wrote: »

EmpressOrgana wrote: »

So is this chance dependent on a positive outcome of the chance elements?
Eg. Vader's basic has 80% chance to do the equation explained above? As in:
0.8*MAX(tenacity-potency, 15%)

No, the 'chance to apply' is a separate check prior to the potency/tenacity check. It does not impact the tenacity or potency numbers themselves. If an ability fails the 'chance to apply' it does not even go through the potency/tenacity check.

Although some abilities have a unique order of operations, most abilities go through the following checks:
A] Is the ability evaded? (Influenced by Foresight, Accuracy, Dodge, etc.)
B] Is the ability applied? (Influenced by %Chance to apply in ability description; if none listed it's usually 100%)
C] Is the ability resisted? (Influenced by potency and tenacity)

If you see the text "can't be evaded", that means skip Check A.
If there is no "XX% chance to..." for the ability then that means skip Check B.
If you see the text "can't be resisted", that means skip Check C.

So you have to multiply the chances. So if you suppose vader landed the hit. He has 0.8*MAX(potency-tenacity,15%) chance to inflict ability block. And against rebels and jedi the chance is 0.8

So EmpressOrgana was correct.

BlackBart

Train is technically correct. The checks are sequential and are passed or failed in that sequence and if failed the next check is not reached.. So even if you assume Vader lands the hit the next check is 80% to advance to the next check. Not 80% * the next check result.

I believe the OP mentally understands it but has written their formula incorrectly.

Train

Sanderzas wrote: »

So you have to multiply the chances. So if you suppose vader landed the hit. He has 0.8*MAX(potency-tenacity,15%) chance to inflict ability block. And against rebels and jedi the chance is 0.8
So EmpressOrgana was correct.

Ah, okay. I read it differently, but yes, this is the right idea if you are trying to compute the overall 'chance that the debuff succeeds' since these are sequential events. The original equation is still a bit off because A is asking is it evaded (and we would want is it NOT evaded) and C is asking is it resisted (and we would want is it NOT resisted).

Assuming all these must be between 0 and 100%.
E = Chance to Evade (%)
A = Chance to Apply (%)
R = Chance to Resist (%) = MAX(tenacity-potency, 15%)

Chance Debuff Succeeds: (1 - E)*(A)*(1-R)

So given the Darth Vader example. His basic can't be evaded or resisted by Rebels and Jedi, so it would just be a flat 80% chance for success against these types of enemy. (Skip evasion and resist checks)

If he was attacking a non-rebel/jedi, then let's say there is a 2% chance to evade (standard dodge chance), 80% chance to apply, and his potency is most likely high enough it will default to the 15% chance to resist. So (1-.02)*(.80)*(1-.15) = 66.64% chance to apply the ability block.

EmpressOrgana

Thanks Train for clearing up. That was my thought process, but looking back my post was a little unintelligible. Also, my amateur formula doesn't take evasion into account.

Cheers all!