Level 1 GAC

seriously why is level 1 GAC so stupid? Me=5.1 million GP. My opponent=6.2 million GP. CG=seams fair

Replies

  • TheJEFFtm
    651 posts Member
    I’m 5.8, just lost to a 4.7. They had a leaner and meaner roster.
  • Rath_Tarr
    3044 posts Member
    You get matched on top {x} GP, not total GP. This is not new.

    You relic'd a lot of First Order characters pursuing Supreme Leader Kylo Ren, bloating your top {x} GP in the process.

    You have Supreme Leader Kylo. Congratulations! Now you need to learn to live with your choices in GAC.
  • Akenno
    430 posts Member
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.
  • Waqui
    7127 posts Member
    edited May 23
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

  • ZAP
    2538 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

  • ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

    Waqui is a pretty smart player that analyzes situations pretty accurately.
  • Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    You get matched on top {x} GP, not total GP. This is not new.

    You relic'd a lot of First Order characters pursuing Supreme Leader Kylo Ren, bloating your top {x} GP in the process.

    You have Supreme Leader Kylo. Congratulations! Now you need to learn to live with your choices in GAC.

    Do we know if it is top 60 or 80? I've seen both numbers floated but can't tell.
  • seriously why is level 1 GAC so stupid? Me=5.1 million GP. My opponent=6.2 million GP. CG=seams fair

    Can you post both of your ally codes?
  • ZAP
    2538 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

    Waqui is a pretty smart player that analyzes situations pretty accurately.

    I know Waqui is a smart player, but I stand by my point that there’s a lot more matches won without one shot full clearing, especially in div 3 and below.

  • avihas
    68 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

    Waqui is a pretty smart player that analyzes situations pretty accurately.

    I know Waqui is a smart player, but I stand by my point that there’s a lot more matches won without one shot full clearing, especially in div 3 and below.

    I can't generelize anything, but I'm on devision 3 and just won the current match with only clearing 2 territories including 2 squad that took me 2 tries to take down...
    Befor that I had a small strike of a "one shot full clearing"
  • Bulldog1205
    3227 posts Member
    edited May 23
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    Correct, but I would say that catering matchmaking towards the round winners is probably not ideal. I’d wager that your average player needs more characters to get a complete clear

    And I’d also argue that the reason they use characters outside the top X is because they are playing matchmaking. The game has actually developed a pretty deep arsenal of GAC useable characters. Having more depth gives the advantage of being able to have more options for developing counter teams to whatever defense you come across.
  • Waqui
    7127 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    Did you check the average as well? I'm talking averages - not outliers on either end.
    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

    Check the title of this discussion. It's about division 1.

  • ZAP
    2538 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    The real myth is you thinking you know what all round winners use to win. I’ve had lots of battles that weren’t won on either side by one shot full clearing and did require more than a couple chars outside top X.

    Did you check the average as well? I'm talking averages - not outliers on either end.
    At the top of divisions, maybe it’s more often about one shot full clearing on efficiency, but don’t claim to know how all rounds are won.

    Check the title of this discussion. It's about division 1.

    Oops 🤦‍♂️

  • Waqui
    7127 posts Member
    edited May 23
    @ZAP

    https://swgoh.gg/p/314895914/

    I'm not sure, this is your profile, but out of curiosity I checked the GAC history of this profile for GAs 14 through 17 (7 defensive slots - division 2 - 12 rounds total). No data available for GA 18.

    The round winners actually used less than 70 characters on average to win (I only checked squad battles). They all used 35 characters on defense and 33 on average on offense. That at least fits well with one of my claims. I didn't check how many different teams were used.
  • ZAP
    2538 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    @ZAP

    https://swgoh.gg/p/314895914/

    I'm not sure, this is your profile, but out of curiosity I checked the GAC history of this profile for GAs 14 through 17 (7 defensive slots - division 2 - 12 rounds total). No data available for GA 18.

    The round winners actually used less than 70 characters on average to win (I only checked squad battles). They all used 35 characters on defense and 33 on average on offense. That at least fits well with one of my claims. I didn't check how many different teams were used.

    Well I did say especially div 3 and below, but then you pointed out this thread and what you were speaking about was div 1 and then I said, “oops”

    I guess you’re right in relation to div 2 as well.

    I’m definitely finding 3v3 matches are requiring even more teams/characters than top 66, but you were specific about 5v5, so I didn’t mention it.

    At div 1&2 we’re used to the matches a lot more than lower divs and there are only so many viable teams/chars at those levels.

    Anyway, I bet the further you go down in divs, you’d see a lot more matches going outside the top x.



  • TaTaKaS
    69 posts Member
    Wrong... The lower the division the more important your top x becomes. My alt account is at div 9 and if my top x cannot do the job then the outside of top x cannot even try!!
  • Waqui
    7127 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    @ZAP

    https://swgoh.gg/p/314895914/

    I'm not sure, this is your profile, but out of curiosity I checked the GAC history of this profile for GAs 14 through 17 (7 defensive slots - division 2 - 12 rounds total). No data available for GA 18.

    The round winners actually used less than 70 characters on average to win (I only checked squad battles). They all used 35 characters on defense and 33 on average on offense. That at least fits well with one of my claims. I didn't check how many different teams were used.

    Well I did say especially div 3 and below, but then you pointed out this thread and what you were speaking about was div 1 and then I said, “oops”

    I guess you’re right in relation to div 2 as well.

    I’m definitely finding 3v3 matches are requiring even more teams/characters than top 66, but you were specific about 5v5, so I didn’t mention it.

    At div 1&2 we’re used to the matches a lot more than lower divs and there are only so many viable teams/chars at those levels.

    Anyway, I bet the further you go down in divs, you’d see a lot more matches going outside the top x.

    Regarding 3v3:
    I believe, you're right. I also believe, that in general a few more extra characters are used to win a round, but I didn't check.

    And yes, things may be different in lower divisions. I guess that your ability to clear depends on which farming route you and your opponent chose (the order in which you chose to farm various teams and unlock legendaries). At higher divisions most players have most viable teams and legendaries available, so rosters are more alike.
  • ZAP
    2538 posts Member
    TaTaKaS wrote: »
    Wrong... The lower the division the more important your top x becomes. My alt account is at div 9 and if my top x cannot do the job then the outside of top x cannot even try!!

    Is it any different in 3v3? I’ve had a few matches that required a few extra teams to win on either side.

  • TaTaKaS
    69 posts Member
    Even worse in 3v3...3 characters at g7 cannot do anything to a g10 or more character left behind... Unless the mechanics favor them a lot but in that case you would have probably used them earlier.
  • Waqui
    7127 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    As mentioned in other posts... Top GP matchmaking will run in issues once you have maxed out the top toons. Because of this reason, the matchmaking will always be unfair.

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Yes, they may use characters outside that top-X, but that's only to leave some of that top-X unused. Top-X GP matching is as close to matching the GP of the X (+ only a couple more ) characters actually used as you can realistically get.

    Correct, but I would say that catering matchmaking towards the round winners is probably not ideal. I’d wager that your average player needs more characters to get a complete clear

    And I’d also argue that the reason they use characters outside the top X is because they are playing matchmaking. The game has actually developed a pretty deep arsenal of GAC useable characters. Having more depth gives the advantage of being able to have more options for developing counter teams to whatever defense you come across.

    But do round winners really use all those more options their deeper rosters give them? In my experience they don't:
    Waqui wrote: »
    Akenno wrote: »
    [...]

    As mentioned in other posts in 5v5 round winners use only a couple more than those X characters (number of defensive slots x 10 if 5v5) on average. They don't use many more teams than (number of defensive slots x 2) teams to win. Those are myths.

    Earlier this week I've had another poster argue strongly that those extra options are an advantage but when checking that poster's GAC history I saw that he always used more or less the same teams to win. It may feel like it's an advantage. It may give you some self confidence, but what I see is, that those extra options are not what wins the rounds.

    Regarding your first point:
    I don't believe matchmaking caters towards round winners. It matches the GP of the number of characters needed to win. That's not the same thing.

    When I lose a round I can always point to where I made a mistake (either when setting defense or playing offense) or to where my weakness was in my roster. I can't really blame matchmaking. It didn't cater to the winner. I can only blame myself for my losses.
  • The point about div3 and below isn’t really relevant here, because it’s only in div1 where we find the large differences in total GP, and I don’t remember reading a total GP mismatch thread that was from anywhere other than div1.

    But matchmaking complaint threads will never go away. Too many forumers are quick to praise their own skill when they win but blame unfair matchmaking when they lose - never realising that their opponents may be in another thread on the forums posting the exact opposite.
  • Jarvind
    3544 posts Member
    If you get a match with this huge of a discrepancy, the other guy has a super fluffy roster and is probably not very good. Immediately balking at matchmaking due purely to GP is the call of the scrub.
    u58t4vkrvnrz.png



Sign In or Register to comment.