When do we have GL Rey buffed too?

Replies

  • Nihion
    3138 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    gflegui wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    gflegui wrote: »
    It has come to the point is extremly difficult win against SLKR with ultimate. The game is ruined for all Rey owners that dorsn’t have SLKR.

    Not all, just those who aren't willing to try some different things and would rather just get mad.

    Who asked for your opinion?

    Lol who asked for yours.

    This is a forum, we don’t work on requests. @YaeVizsla can I get your opinion on this?

    I can’t see this post now that you made it private.

    Did I ask if you could see it? That’s what I thought.
  • Dmitry_M81 wrote: »
    Rafini wrote: »
    Gas lead with Rey, fives , han and chewie. fives gets guard. easy wins against slkr.

    Even easier if GAS gets both Guard and Lifeblood - he never kneels and SLKR can't get his Ult ready

    Exactly. I lost only once when Chewie accidentally died and Kylo had several ultimates in a row (it happens, lol)
  • Mirkraag wrote: »
    I am 100% agree with you @Slaveen

    Good resume, exactly the main problem that kylo users dont want to hear with their so-called balance.

    We have been dupe

    Kylo users are simply happy that their GL is much better.
    However they use Kylo with SE or separatists, and GL Rey with her titan team can lose.
    Don't even listen to them.. Rey users didn't complain so much about counters. They just want a resistance team with Rey which will consistently defeat Kylo in offence.
  • Rafini
    299 posts Member
    I think all users of both rey and kylo want teams that can win on offence without needing to rely on rng (kylo has this) but hold on defence against non gl teams. seems fair
  • Slaveen
    478 posts Member
    Rafini wrote: »
    I think all users of both rey and kylo want teams that can win on offence without needing to rely on rng (kylo has this) but hold on defence against non gl teams. seems fair

    Also using their respective factions for TW and GAC purposes
  • Rafini wrote: »
    I think all users of both rey and kylo want teams that can win on offence without needing to rely on rng (kylo has this) but hold on defence against non gl teams. seems fair

    Or at least adding those SLKR's buffs (made weeks AFTER event launched and we got our respective GLs) for Rey too. Yes, additional +30 speed and Advantage and Crit.immunity
  • TVF
    27422 posts Member
    Rey side always had +30 speed.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Slaveen
    478 posts Member
    edited July 2020
    TVF wrote: »
    Rey side always had +30 speed.

    Think they’re saying to make it +60 speed since SLKR also got +30 speed.

    I think the better solution would be this: Rey and all light side allies have +30 speed in addition to whatever speed bonus their opponents have.

    So against SLKR, she’ll have +60 speed.
    When Bossk’s lead contract pays out, Rey would go from +30 speed to +80 speed. But when she fights a team like DR or GAS, she just has +30 speed.
  • YaeVizsla
    3448 posts Member
    edited July 2020
    Nihion wrote: »
    Lol who asked for yours.

    This is a forum, we don’t work on requests. YaeVizsla can I get your opinion on this?
    Strange that I'm pinged to a thread I haven't taken part in, but whatevs. Here we go.

    1) Even if Rey is definitively worse than Kylo, she is still an incredibly powerful unit, easily the second most powerful in the game and beats up pretty much everything quite soundly.

    2) "Rey is definitively worse than Kylo" is a dubious claim. According to the meta report, there are more Reys than Kylos leading number one in arena. There are more Reys than Kylos leading the top ten in arena. There are more Reys than Kylos leading the top 100 in arena. And in my shard there are two more Kylos than Reys in the top 50. If you get Rey, you can do much better in arena than you could without a GL.

    3) The importance of arena has been shrinking throughout the life of the game. It is a smaller portion of overall income than it has ever been and does not become the dominant portion of crystal income for a mature player until you get into the top 20 or so. That is less than one percent of players. Less than one percent of players will ever be part of less than one percent of players no matter what. If your play experience is "ruined" because you cannot manage to get into the top 20 with Rey, then the problem is not Rey. It is your standards. You can do just fine and advance well in the game without hitting the top of the leaderboards. Coming into a ranked system with thousands of players with a, "If you're not first, you're last," mentality is a player failure, not a game failure.
    Post edited by YaeVizsla on
    Still not a he.
  • Nihion
    3138 posts Member
    Boom. Thank you @YaeVizsla. Your logic and evidence is always appreciated.
  • Rey is not trash overall, Rey is trash compared to "SLKR after he was buffed". It is simple to buff her leadership ability equally, just add same text letter-by-letter and additional +30 speed advantage over SLKR as it was designed initially.
    That simple. Don't see any problem here if they could do it for SLKR - why not for Rey too?
  • YaeVizsla
    3448 posts Member
    Dmitry_M81 wrote: »
    1omwokr8zgfy.jpg
    And how might that be?

    Is Rey not the majority of the number one and top ten arena leads, and a larger share of the top 100 than Kylo? Is Rey not able to soundly defeat almost anything in the game? Can you somehow fit more than a fraction of a percent of the playerbase in the top fraction of a percent of the leaderboard?

    What is it that you disagree with?
    Still not a he.
  • YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Dmitry_M81 wrote: »
    1omwokr8zgfy.jpg
    And how might that be?

    Is Rey not the majority of the number one and top ten arena leads, and a larger share of the top 100 than Kylo? Is Rey not able to soundly defeat almost anything in the game? Can you somehow fit more than a fraction of a percent of the playerbase in the top fraction of a percent of the leaderboard?

    What is it that you disagree with?

    Just try to understand simple things
    1. Rey can't defeat SLKR without GAS, JKR, WAT/Hoda and GK. That toons are definitely not resistance. But SLKR is strong with FO team. However, Rey can lose in offence even with this toons.
    2. If SLKR is using separatists or SE, Rey almost can't beat this team at all. While SLKR easily wipes out all Reys.
    3. We all remember that both GLs were represented as equal at least on arena. They had pretty solid requirements, probably it was harder to get Rey than Kylo. So why is she only second?
    4. I don't know about your top 10, but I see more Kylos in mine. People who started farming GLs later, went for Kylo. So number or SLKR is growing day by day.
  • Nihion
    3138 posts Member
    NataPda wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Dmitry_M81 wrote: »
    1omwokr8zgfy.jpg
    And how might that be?

    Is Rey not the majority of the number one and top ten arena leads, and a larger share of the top 100 than Kylo? Is Rey not able to soundly defeat almost anything in the game? Can you somehow fit more than a fraction of a percent of the playerbase in the top fraction of a percent of the leaderboard?

    What is it that you disagree with?

    Just try to understand simple things
    1. Rey can't defeat SLKR without GAS, JKR, WAT/Hoda and GK. That toons are definitely not resistance. But SLKR is strong with FO team. However, Rey can lose in offence even with this toons.
    2. If SLKR is using separatists or SE, Rey almost can't beat this team at all. While SLKR easily wipes out all Reys.
    3. We all remember that both GLs were represented as equal at least on arena. They had pretty solid requirements, probably it was harder to get Rey than Kylo. So why is she only second?
    4. I don't know about your top 10, but I see more Kylos in mine. People who started farming GLs later, went for Kylo. So number or SLKR is growing day by day.

    Evidence that they were ever claimed by CG to be equals in arena?

    The story goes like this:
    The GL’s come out, and all the you tubers think Rey is god tier, Kylo... sub par. So the people waiting to spend put everything in Rey, who then, surprise surprise, was actually worse than Kylo. That’s the only reason this thread exists. YaeVizsla didn’t say that they could beat Rey or that Rey was top ten in their arena. Only that Rey is more popular than Kylo, and can beat almost every team comp in the game. Those are the facts, and your post didn’t refute them.
  • YaeVizsla
    3448 posts Member
    NataPda wrote: »
    Just try to understand simple things
    1. Rey can't defeat SLKR without GAS, JKR, WAT/Hoda and GK. That toons are definitely not resistance. But SLKR is strong with FO team. However, Rey can lose in offence even with this toons.
    2. If SLKR is using separatists or SE, Rey almost can't beat this team at all. While SLKR easily wipes out all Reys.
    3. We all remember that both GLs were represented as equal at least on arena. They had pretty solid requirements, probably it was harder to get Rey than Kylo. So why is she only second?
    4. I don't know about your top 10, but I see more Kylos in mine. People who started farming GLs later, went for Kylo. So number or SLKR is growing day by day.
    Do not condescend to me. I understand those "simple things."

    In this post, you are explicitly saying Rey can, in fact, beat SLKR. And she can, in fact, beat those harder lineups with separatists.

    You're talking about marginal performance. You're talking about the top of the game tilting one way or the other. You're talking about one unit possibly being slightly more useful than another, not about one unit being trash.

    The meta report is not ambiguous. Reys are performing well in arena. Right now. If this were a case where Kylo was definitively superior and Rey was simply more numerous, then the Kylos should have a pretty firm lock on the top one and the top ten of the meta report, while the Reys would hold a larger share of the top hundred due to numbers. They don't. That is not what the meta report shows. The meta report is slightly in favor of Rey, which doesn't mean Rey is better either; it means the two units are comparable in such a way that they can share competing portions of the top of the charts. If those Reys could not reliably beat and/or hold against Kylo, they would not have that majority at the top.

    Yes, the typical Rey arena lineup is a goodstuffs team rather than a faction team. So what? All of the units who go into a Rey team are high profile units and strong candidates for high investment anyways. Some units gel better with their prerequisites than others.

    You ask why Rey is only second best. The better question is... why isn't that good enough? When the dust settled, someone was going to come out on top. Being second by a narrow margin to a unit of the same type who dropped at the same time with basically the same requirements is not unreasonable.
    Still not a he.
  • str2019
    52 posts Member
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    You ask why Rey is only second best. The better question is... why isn't that good enough? When the dust settled, someone was going to come out on top. Being second by a narrow margin to a unit of the same type who dropped at the same time with basically the same requirements is not unreasonable.

    You went for Kylo, did not you?

    What everyone here is asking is that both of the GLs are treated equally, that the initial balance at the point of kit and stats release is kept and that there are no further adverse one-way changes (even if indirect!) after people have made their decisions. For example, if Kylo gets straight buffs to his kit Rey should get equal buffs to her kit as well. If Kylo gets an AI update Rey gets one. If an F2P counter from nowhere appears to Rey that Kylo gets the same treatment.

    Otherwise it starts to feel like there is some favoritism and goal-seeking going on.
  • Nihion
    3138 posts Member
    str2019 wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    You ask why Rey is only second best. The better question is... why isn't that good enough? When the dust settled, someone was going to come out on top. Being second by a narrow margin to a unit of the same type who dropped at the same time with basically the same requirements is not unreasonable.

    You went for Kylo, did not you?

    What everyone here is asking is that both of the GLs are treated equally, that the initial balance at the point of kit and stats release is kept and that there are no further adverse one-way changes (even if indirect!) after people have made their decisions. For example, if Kylo gets straight buffs to his kit Rey should get equal buffs to her kit as well. If Kylo gets an AI update Rey gets one. If an F2P counter from nowhere appears to Rey that Kylo gets the same treatment.

    Otherwise it starts to feel like there is some favoritism and goal-seeking going on.

    At what cost? Did all the Rey people quit? Will they stop paying? GL’s never had to be exactly the same, nor will they be. And that still doesn’t disprove that there are more Rey’s in the top ten and top one hundred. Rey is still useful.
  • Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.
  • TVF
    27422 posts Member
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Considering the PvE aspect of the GL, they managed to repliquate what Yoda explained us about the Dark Side of the Force: "Quicker, easier, more seductive" but not stronger.

    Let's take 2 guilds: Darkside Newbies and Lightside Gitgud.

    Darkside Newbies members follow the Dark Side and go for Kylo.

    The first ones getting him rule the Sith Raid and enjoy some juicy rewards. Then, when all members have their Kylo, they all rule the Sith Raid. So it's a coin flip to see who's top 10. Back to square one when no one had Kylos.

    Lightside Gitgud members follow the Light Side and go for Rey.

    The first ones getting Rey allow the guild to progress in TB Light, but don't receive better rewards than the others for it. Then, the more members unlock Rey, the better the rewards they all receive thanks to progress on TB Light.

    So, in this very theorical situation, those going for Kylos would received better rewards from PvE content at first. But on the long run, those going for Rey would receive better rewards from PvE content. At the end, Lightside Gitgud members will progress faster than Darkside Newbies.


    Dear holotable-gamers, don't be seduced by the call of the dark side, pleading you to go for Kylo to grab those HSR rewards all for yourself. Listen to your heart and embrace the power of love: go for Rey. And always remember the words of you new and shiny R5: "That's how we're gonna win. Not fighting what we hate ... saving what we love."



  • Gamorrean
    2733 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.
  • mikk207
    220 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.

    thats debatable and depending how your guild is doing. some more points in ls geo wouldnt get us another star, more points in ds geo on the other hand...
  • Liath wrote: »
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.

    And that means what exactly? And for a monthly event to boot. Meanwhile, the Kylos are getting all those juicy gear 12 pieces by consistently getting top 10 HSR every 3 days.
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.

    And that means what exactly? And for a monthly event to boot. Meanwhile, the Kylos are getting all those juicy gear 12 pieces by consistently getting top 10 HSR every 3 days.

    It means I disagree with the implication of what I quoted.
  • Daishi
    715 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.

    And that means what exactly? And for a monthly event to boot. Meanwhile, the Kylos are getting all those juicy gear 12 pieces by consistently getting top 10 HSR every 3 days.

    It means I disagree with the implication of what I quoted.

    While in the long run, yes if everyone had Kylo its a wash and doesn't increase rewards as everyone can solo HSTR. However that's not the reality we live in now.

    Only a small % of the player base has a GL at all, so chances are most players are in a guild with less than 10 SLKR. Going for SLKR in that situation means a top 10 HSTR finish and much faster progress towards getting GL Rey.

    Meanwhile going for GL Rey increases the whole guilds rewards by a small fraction in a monthly event, but doesn't make any meaningful progress for the player who owns the GL, and doesn't really speed their progress to the next GL.

    So no matter how you slice it, going for SLKR first is the better move. Thats not to say going for Rey is a waste because she will help your guild in LSTB. But until 25-50% of your players max her out, it won't make any meaningful difference in rewards. By that time we may have new characters released that give us the same leg up in LSTB without the huge investment that GLR costs (looking at you jedi luke)
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Daishi wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Gamorrean wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ejsteven wrote: »
    Looking at the arena meta report, Kylos will overtake Reys in a couple of weeks, an area where she's supposed to be stronger at, since Kylos completely dominates her in PvE space. If that doesn't say something, not sure what will.

    TB is PvE space.

    Yes, for both DS and LS

    The difference Rey makes in LSTB is much more significant than the difference Kylo makes in DSTB.

    And that means what exactly? And for a monthly event to boot. Meanwhile, the Kylos are getting all those juicy gear 12 pieces by consistently getting top 10 HSR every 3 days.

    It means I disagree with the implication of what I quoted.

    While in the long run, yes if everyone had Kylo its a wash and doesn't increase rewards as everyone can solo HSTR. However that's not the reality we live in now.

    Only a small % of the player base has a GL at all, so chances are most players are in a guild with less than 10 SLKR. Going for SLKR in that situation means a top 10 HSTR finish and much faster progress towards getting GL Rey.

    Meanwhile going for GL Rey increases the whole guilds rewards by a small fraction in a monthly event, but doesn't make any meaningful progress for the player who owns the GL, and doesn't really speed their progress to the next GL.

    So no matter how you slice it, going for SLKR first is the better move. Thats not to say going for Rey is a waste because she will help your guild in LSTB. But until 25-50% of your players max her out, it won't make any meaningful difference in rewards. By that time we may have new characters released that give us the same leg up in LSTB without the huge investment that GLR costs (looking at you jedi luke)

    Do you think you’re disagreeing with me and that’s why you quoted me? Or are you just talking and quoted me for no reason?

    To be clear: I disagree with the implication of what I quoted that they are equal in value with respect to TB. I believe that Rey has a distinct advantage in that particular segment of the game. That says nothing about the relative importance of TB vs raids with respect to the overall value of the two characters, which is highly dependent on individual circumstances.
  • Slaveen
    478 posts Member
    edited July 2020
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Lol who asked for yours.

    This is a forum, we don’t work on requests. YaeVizsla can I get your opinion on this?
    Strange that I'm pinged to a thread I haven't taken part in, but whatevs. Here we go.

    1) Even if Rey is definitively worse than Kylo, she is still an incredibly powerful unit, easily the second most powerful in the game and beats up pretty much everything quite soundly.

    2) "Rey is definitively worse than Kylo" is a dubious claim. According to the meta report, there are more Reys than Kylos leading number one in arena. There are more Reys than Kylos leading the top ten in arena. There are more Reys than Kylos leading the top 100 in arena. And in my shard there are two more Kylos than Reys in the top 50. If you get Rey, you can do much better in arena than you could without a GL.

    3) The importance of arena has been shrinking throughout the life of the game. It is a smaller portion of overall income than it has ever been and does not become the dominant portion of crystal income for a mature player until you get into the top 20 or so. That is less than one percent of players. Less than one percent of players will ever be part of less than one percent of players no matter what. If your play experience is "ruined" because you cannot manage to get into the top 20 with Rey, then the problem is not Rey. It is your standards. You can do just fine and advance well in the game without hitting the top of the leaderboards. Coming into a ranked system with thousands of players with a, "If you're not first, you're last," mentality is a player failure, not a game failure.

    It has been stated a thousand times in this thread that the main reason there are more Reys than SLKRs currently is because vastly more people went for her after their initial kit reveals. If you're F2P, GLs are like a 6 month or longer farm. SLKR got his second or third buff about 2 months ago. So all those guys who were 2-5 months along in their Rey farms didn't just abandon ship at that point. That's a huge gear commitment to just abandon.

    Come talk to me about the META report 4 months from now. I'm willing to bet it will VASTLY favor SLKR over Rey. Until then, it's just heresy.

    Also having been stated a thousand times in this thread is the fact that the biggest problem with Rey is NOT the arena problem. The biggest problem with Rey is the GAC and TW problem where you need GAS to lead your 501st team, GK to tank for your Padme team, etc. Meanwhile, SLKR gets to use his best team with full FO (and toons you had to gear to get him in the first place, no less).

    I realize you were tagged in this thread unprompted and against your will so you felt obligated to contribute your two cents. However, if you're not going to read the entire thread to ensure you can meaningfully contribute to the discussion, perhaps its best just not to post. Shame on whoever tagged you.
  • Slaveen
    478 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    NataPda wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Dmitry_M81 wrote: »
    1omwokr8zgfy.jpg
    And how might that be?

    Is Rey not the majority of the number one and top ten arena leads, and a larger share of the top 100 than Kylo? Is Rey not able to soundly defeat almost anything in the game? Can you somehow fit more than a fraction of a percent of the playerbase in the top fraction of a percent of the leaderboard?

    What is it that you disagree with?

    Just try to understand simple things
    1. Rey can't defeat SLKR without GAS, JKR, WAT/Hoda and GK. That toons are definitely not resistance. But SLKR is strong with FO team. However, Rey can lose in offence even with this toons.
    2. If SLKR is using separatists or SE, Rey almost can't beat this team at all. While SLKR easily wipes out all Reys.
    3. We all remember that both GLs were represented as equal at least on arena. They had pretty solid requirements, probably it was harder to get Rey than Kylo. So why is she only second?
    4. I don't know about your top 10, but I see more Kylos in mine. People who started farming GLs later, went for Kylo. So number or SLKR is growing day by day.

    Evidence that they were ever claimed by CG to be equals in arena?

    The story goes like this:
    The GL’s come out, and all the you tubers think Rey is god tier, Kylo... sub par. So the people waiting to spend put everything in Rey, who then, surprise surprise, was actually worse than Kylo. That’s the only reason this thread exists. YaeVizsla didn’t say that they could beat Rey or that Rey was top ten in their arena. Only that Rey is more popular than Kylo, and can beat almost every team comp in the game. Those are the facts, and your post didn’t refute them.

    You leave out some crucial details in your story:

    Initially, Rey WAS the better PvP toon. SLKR users accepted this because he was vastly better for PvE purposes and had greater long-term potential. SLKR wasn't too far behind Rey in PvP either - it was basically like how things are between the 2 GLs now, except Rey was the clearly superior PvP GL and SLKR was the one who it was somewhat RNG dependent to beat Rey.

    Then CG decided to buff SLKR - buffs primarily tailored towards his PvP utility - not once, not twice, but at least three times (maybe four?). It wasn't "surprise, surprise" like you describe it. It was a very intentional move on CG's part, AFTER a huge portion of the player base had committed to Rey, primarily because of her edge in PvP. That edge is now completely gone.

    Take your fake news elsewhere. Give us all the facts, not just the ones that support your narrative.
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