Not as funny people who, when presented with unequivocal data (as per the above - which isn't subject to opinion) just carry on the same line of argument.
I'm out. It's like talking to a brick.
I think it's just a big misunderstanding with a slight layer of name calling, internet style.
Your data is fine and solid, imo. Even if it can be discussed, it won't change the core of your numbers. Rey and Kylo dominate arena hand in hand. Slight advantage to Rey.
However, I highly doubt (but I can be wrong) that Rey teams at the top of the arena are exclusively Res teams. They most likely use other meta toons, like GAS, GK, JKR or Wat. It is important if you consider the question tOP asked, "Why go for Rey (instead of Kylo) ?'. Considering only arena, if you already have meta characters, Rey is a valid option. about 2% better than Kylo considering the numbers you showed.
However, if you don't have meta characters yet, it's not a good option to go for Rey for Arena purposes. Kylo will use the characters you geared to unlock him to carry you at the top of the arena. Rey won't (still looking for a way to beat Kylo consistently with Res, still failing at this time). If your account is young and you choose Rey, you could very well end up after a year of farming with a very high level character and still be unable to take 1st place to those who took the Kylo route. I guess that will be extremely frustrating.
And Arena is not the only thing to consider in the "why go for Rey ?' question. But there are 17 pages about that already It doesn't change the fact that your numbers are solid. It's just that arena is not the only argument behind the "why go for Rey" question, and some people defending that Kylo is the better choice don't find these 2% in favor of Rey in Arena enough to tip the scale in her favor.
I'm actually on Kyno's side here. It's more a "BuffRes" than a "BuffRey" problem imo. And "BuffRes" might solve this "Why go for Rey ?" issue that some people have without endangering the fragile balance of the Arena. Maybe.
So why do some guys in my shard run Rey, Heros, Hyoda (only toon not required for Rey but been around for a long time) and Holdo and still climb to first everyday? This argument that Rey doesn't work with res toons is a joke. Also some of the top Kylo squads aren't also full FO either. Lots are using Wat, Malak and others in their squads. Honestly this has become a mountain out of a mole hill. Both are perfectly fine for arena and for some its what's best for their guild also directed them one way or the other. Other than soloing HSTR Kylo doesn't help alot for our guild as we are GP locked in DSTB however improving LSTB CMs can still gain more stars for our guild.
This arguments a joke if you spent money on Rey or Kylo I'm sorry but that was YOUR CHOICE! CG did not show up at your door and physically force you to. Eventually you will have both and there be a new shiny toon soon enough so move on its a game at the end of the day.
Interesting points and was not expecting that response, thank you for taking the time to respond.
Lot's of items could talk about, but my main point:
Really there's just a collective feeling among Rey owners that we made a bad decision going for her unless you were able to get JKL on top of it to allow her to not struggle against Kylo (this is real).
I love this game and have played for years, but this sequence of events and my investment of ~40k crystals to get Rey (most of it was saved from arena, etc) has just left me with a totally negative feeling about the game as a result of it. And i don't want to feel that way about the game.
And it was my fault, I chose to pick her and made the wrong decision apparently. I would gladly trade Rey for Kylo in a heartbeat...even if it wasn't a straight up trade and i had to refarm 25%. And i've seen many other Rey owners state the same.
So...just trying to communicate the level of disappointment of some (but certainly not all) of us Rey owners, and why you guys keep seeing these related messages/threads.
I’ll communicate it in less words: Rey owners got ****
Other than a truck load of crystals that they can use farming Kylo or hoard for the next meta. I'm just under 60,000 crystals, btw - and FTP.
You, Rey-is-crap people make me laugh. She's a cash machine but that still isn't good enough for you. SMH.
Interesting points and was not expecting that response, thank you for taking the time to respond.
Lot's of items could talk about, but my main point:
Really there's just a collective feeling among Rey owners that we made a bad decision going for her unless you were able to get JKL on top of it to allow her to not struggle against Kylo (this is real).
I love this game and have played for years, but this sequence of events and my investment of ~40k crystals to get Rey (most of it was saved from arena, etc) has just left me with a totally negative feeling about the game as a result of it. And i don't want to feel that way about the game.
And it was my fault, I chose to pick her and made the wrong decision apparently. I would gladly trade Rey for Kylo in a heartbeat...even if it wasn't a straight up trade and i had to refarm 25%. And i've seen many other Rey owners state the same.
So...just trying to communicate the level of disappointment of some (but certainly not all) of us Rey owners, and why you guys keep seeing these related messages/threads.
I’ll communicate it in less words: Rey owners got ****
How many times do people have to say this. Rey is still a pretty good character even though Kylo might be better. She is the 2ND BEST CHARACTER in the game. Now she might not be the best SQUAD in the game but she is still a really good character that can beat almost every other squad (other than maybe Kylo and Vader sometimes) in the game. Even though you might think that farming Rey was a terrible idea you still got one of the best characters in the game.
On my April 2016 shard, I know of at least one person who has both GLs. He got SLKR first, then got Rey. Both are maxed with their ultimates. I know he has both because when he got Rey second, he switched to running her. With al the changes, he continues to run the Rey/GK/GAS/JKR/Wat team, and continues to take 1st every day. He never used the 5s cheese, never seemed to have an issue. But it's definitely impossible for Rey to win on offense.
I am curious if the meta report will shift over time, especially with the Fives cheese removed. There would still be flaws with that data, as several have pointed out.
Something that might be interesting is to check all the owners of both GLs and see what they're climbing with and what they're leaving overnight. Based on my very limited sample size of my shard chat and my guild, no one with both GLs is using GLR to climb or on defense overnight.
JKL with GLR team is what i would call the common team for the climb when both are owned.
the one thing the meta report does show is that Rey has been consistant in her taking of 1 even with all the changes we have seen. so while the buff resistance has a good point about the team makeup, the Rey can't win doesnt seem to hold water.
Yeah, now you have to spend money to get JK Luke to make your Rey function in arena according to the forum moderator. Nice!
So Rey owners have to relic 21 toons to get a still second-best Galactic Legend who is hot garbage in PvE. Meanwhile, SLKR owners relic 12 toons for a toon that is the best in every area of the game.
“Balanced.”
Didn't spend a cent on Rey or bother spending to go for JKL and yet still climb to first through Kylos and Reys. And can you count? I didn't relic 21 toons for Rey? I only reliced 12 toons the same amount of toons as a Kylo owner.
Can you read? I was saying that to have a functional Rey arena squad, you need both Rey and JKLS. You have to relic 12 toons for Rey and 8 (I think) for JKLS. That was the point of what I was trying to say. Reading comprehension, bro, come on.
I am curious if the meta report will shift over time, especially with the Fives cheese removed. There would still be flaws with that data, as several have pointed out.
Something that might be interesting is to check all the owners of both GLs and see what they're climbing with and what they're leaving overnight. Based on my very limited sample size of my shard chat and my guild, no one with both GLs is using GLR to climb or on defense overnight.
JKL with GLR team is what i would call the common team for the climb when both are owned.
the one thing the meta report does show is that Rey has been consistant in her taking of 1 even with all the changes we have seen. so while the buff resistance has a good point about the team makeup, the Rey can't win doesnt seem to hold water.
Yeah, now you have to spend money to get JK Luke to make your Rey function in arena according to the forum moderator. Nice!
So Rey owners have to relic 21 toons to get a still second-best Galactic Legend who is hot garbage in PvE. Meanwhile, SLKR owners relic 12 toons for a toon that is the best in every area of the game.
“Balanced.”
Didn't spend a cent on Rey or bother spending to go for JKL and yet still climb to first through Kylos and Reys. And can you count? I didn't relic 21 toons for Rey? I only reliced 12 toons the same amount of toons as a Kylo owner.
Can you read? I was saying that to have a functional Rey arena squad, you need both Rey and JKLS. You have to relic 12 toons for Rey and 8 (I think) for JKLS. That was the point of what I was trying to say. Reading comprehension, bro, come on.
Well your point is wrong, just read the post above yours. Or look at the most popular rey comps in arena.
I am curious if the meta report will shift over time, especially with the Fives cheese removed. There would still be flaws with that data, as several have pointed out.
Something that might be interesting is to check all the owners of both GLs and see what they're climbing with and what they're leaving overnight. Based on my very limited sample size of my shard chat and my guild, no one with both GLs is using GLR to climb or on defense overnight.
JKL with GLR team is what i would call the common team for the climb when both are owned.
the one thing the meta report does show is that Rey has been consistant in her taking of 1 even with all the changes we have seen. so while the buff resistance has a good point about the team makeup, the Rey can't win doesnt seem to hold water.
Yeah, now you have to spend money to get JK Luke to make your Rey function in arena according to the forum moderator. Nice!
So Rey owners have to relic 21 toons to get a still second-best Galactic Legend who is hot garbage in PvE. Meanwhile, SLKR owners relic 12 toons for a toon that is the best in every area of the game.
“Balanced.”
Didn't spend a cent on Rey or bother spending to go for JKL and yet still climb to first through Kylos and Reys. And can you count? I didn't relic 21 toons for Rey? I only reliced 12 toons the same amount of toons as a Kylo owner.
Can you read? I was saying that to have a functional Rey arena squad, you need both Rey and JKLS. You have to relic 12 toons for Rey and 8 (I think) for JKLS. That was the point of what I was trying to say. Reading comprehension, bro, come on.
Well your point is wrong, just read the post above yours. Or look at the most popular rey comps in arena.
Or the fact that I won two in a row testing a pure Res team tonight.
its not likely that the meta report is going to reflect any of the "new information" that may have influenced anyones choices.
but it does show that up to now, none of the changes have really pushed one or the other out of the race to 1st in arena.
it takes a long time to get a 2nd GL.Like 4 months + just for the gear and relic requirements. If someone has both GL's, it's entirely possible that someone who went Rey first (as most did) don't have their SLKR to r7 yet or have it but not with ultimate, etc.
It's going to take a while to see which toon someone really prefers.
In the meantime, I'm happy to stipulate that Rey is awesome. She can even be better than SLKR at PvP by a little bit. I don't think that's true, but let's say that Rey squads edge out SLKR squads in PvP.
SLKR completely dominates PvE content.
COMPLETELY. DOMINATES.
Ramble, ramble:
GL Rey doesn't come close. this isn't a case of waiting for more data. This isn't a case of being 5% or 10% better as you might find (but I don't think you will find) with GL R vs. SLKR in PvP. SLKR completely dominates the single most important event in the game for roster improvement: HSTR. And in other PvP SLKR smokes GL Rey by just as much.
Now, a lot of people like PvP. And if being the best at PvP is your thing and you think that GL R is better than SLKR at PvP, I can understand why you like Rey.
But the advantage, if any, of GL R over SLKR in PvP doesn't come close to the advantage in PvE that SLKR holds.
Moreover, while, again, I'm in ticket farming for GL R and I don't have her unlocked and have no practical experience with her, everyone here appears to agree that for Rey to get good enough to have any PvP advantage at all, she has to draw from toons from other factions.
Now, I like theory crafting and I like unexpected combinations. I think it's fun to do that stuff, and I'm sure I'll throw some weird combos together with Rey.
But there can't be any debate that removing GA$ and JKL from their squads to make them available for GL Rey squads hurts 501st & Jedi more than, say, removing Malak from a DR squad.
This isn't to say that removing Malak from DR doesn't hurt that squad, but not as much as 501st is hurt by removing GA$.
A full FO SLKR squad is simply more viable than a full Resistance GL Rey squad. And when you do break up other squads for optimal performance, SLKR removes toons like Malak, who, as great as they are, aren't leaders that make or break an entire faction's ability to work as intended. GL Rey removes crucial leaders from other factions.
As a result, in every PvP mode **other than** squad arena, GL Rey owners are at a disadvantage. They either make a disadvantageous all-Resistance team, or they destroy other squads so GL Rey can live up to her potential.
This is why the Arena meta report is worthless. In Arena you can put all your meta toons in one squad and it costs you nothing. In TB and GAC putting all your meta LS leaders in one squad destroys your competitiveness.
So, again, assuming you have an advantage for Rey in Arena, which as Kyno points out is not proven, you have:
Squad Arena: GL Rey gains small advantage
HSTR: Monstrously huge SLKR advantage
HAAT: No advantage to either side
TW: SLKR gains a small advantage - it would be more, but this is a group effort allowing Rey owners to destroy multiple meta teams while other guild members pick up some slack in order to have a few Rey super-teams..
GAC: SLKR gains a large advantage, but not overwhelming, much less monstrously huge the way he does in HSTR.
TB: No advantage to either side (Rey is not as reliable as SLKR, but DS Geonosis doesn't have the difficulty of LS, so you're not as desperate for good teams on the DS missions.)
Fleet Arena: Neither GL has a ship, but the FO ships do better at taking down the current meta so there's a small side benefit to your upgrade of FO pilots vs. upgrade of Resistance pilots. Since this isn't going to come into play until one or the other - or both - gets a real tank + 1 or 2 more ships for a fully viable faction, I'd say in fleet arena there's no advantage either direction.
Again, assuming that Rey has the advantage in PvP when placed with her best allies,
Rey gets a small advantage in one game mode
SLKR gets advantages ranging from small to overwhelming in 3 game modes.
So the question then is, does Rey perform so well in Arena that she makes up the difference in all those other areas..
Incredibly long and tedious thing that I can't believe I typed out follows:
it's true that the crystal payout from Arena is much more important than the GAC rewards.
But if you have only one GL and it's Rey, assuming you are average for your guild, which means 24-25 other players have a GL, and half of those are Rey and Half SLKR. That means about 12 SLKRs.
If even 50% of them participate in HSTR, you're locked out of the top 6 reward spots. Only the top 3 spots have a decent chance of awarding a full RightSide G12 piece.
But you're also not that likely to be in the Top 10, because you only get an advantage in p1, and don't have a lot of opportunities to join in other phases since the SLKRs will quickly solo the raid without you getting a chance to jump into different phases with different teams, and certainly won't allow you to try multiple starts for the best initial RNG for your Shaak Ti or Deathstorm squad.
instead of being guaranteed a spot in the next 6 (again, assuming only half the GLR owners participate), you're fighting with other people who might not have any GLs, but do have a good DeathStorm squad and got better initial RNG than you. There are also only 4 spots left in the top 10 anyway.
If 50% of the next 6 slots after the first 6 Kylos are GL Reys, then only 1-2 of them are in the top 10.
So your odds of being top10 with GL Rey if you are an average player in your guild are 1-in-6 to 1-in-12, or 8.5 to 17%.
HSTR is available once every 5.7 days with essentially perfect tickets, so 5 raids every 28.5 days. Let's call it 10 raids in 60 days or 2 months. This is to the advantage of GL Rey, because it gives her an extra couple days of Arena rewards.
The SLKRs are only attacking half the time, but getting top6 every time when they do. You get a spot in the 7-10 range. about 1 time in 8.
To make the math work out easier, let's multiply the time frame by 4 to get a number of raids divisible by 8. In 8 months, you get only 5 top 10 finishes even if you participate in every single raid.
meanwhile, the SLKR's participate in only 50% of the raids (thus 20 raids total) and get 10 top 3 finishes and 10 finishes in 4th to 6th place.
About half the time you get a top10 finish outside of the top 3 you get a single full piece, usually left side. On rare occasions you might get 2 full pieces, in this case one is always Left and one is always Right.
Over your 8 months, you won't finish top 10 enough to be likely to get a single raid with 2 x completed pieces, so we'll say you get 4 Left and 1 Right from those, and in your other 35 finishes you get at most 5 left.
Total haul of completed pieces? 7 left and 1 right completed pieces. 2 Left, 1 right from your top 10 finishes (and that's generous) plus maybe 5 left from your 11th place+ finishes, even playing every single raid perfectly, to the best of your ability, and never missing an opportunity to raid.
Total haul from playing only 50% of the time with SLKR? 13-14 full Left Side pieces and 8 Right - about 9 Left and 5 right from your top 3 finishes and 4-5 left and 2 right from your 4th to 6th place finishes.
So over 8 months you're down 6 Left Side pieces and 7 Right Side, and that's assuming you raid twice as often as anyone else.
Okay, what's the crystal advantage needed to buy those pieces? Well, Right Side gear pieces sell for 6,500 crystals. Just to catch up in LS pieces you would need 7 times 6,500 = 45,500 crystals.
Divided by 240 days, that means you need to out-earn SLKR by 189 crystals per day in Arena. This means that if you take 1st place every day, you have to assume that your guild mate would finish 5th place or worse.
And that's just to make up for the Right Side deficit. But of course you need about 4 LeftSide pieces to catch up as well.
How many crystals for that? Well at 2100 per full gear x 6 = 12,600 crystals.. Divided by 240 days, we get another 51 crystals per day. Now you need to out-earn your guild mate by 240 crystals per day. To get that kind of advantage, you have to assume that your GL Rey would finish #1 every day and that your SLKR guild mate finishes no better than 6th place 80% of the time, and no better than 5th place the remaining 20% of the time.
But hang on! This is all still comparing you to your flaky guild mate who only raids half the time. What if you're comparing your GL Rey performance to yourself, to what you would do if you had gone SLKR?
Well, then you're talking about TWICE as many raid rewards while your GL Rey reward estimate stays stable. This means the advantage for SLKR more than doubles, since the raw rewards double and the double rewards minus your fixed GL Rewards leaves a greater percentage of those rewards as the net advantage.
Now you're down 15 Right Side pieces and 20 Left Side. The only way you can make up that deficit is if you finish first in Arena every day with SLKR, but couldn't possibly get a single crystal in Arena with SLKR.
Not. One. Single. Crystal.
Ooops! And wait, that's still doesn't make up the difference. You need 139,500 more crystals than an SLKR player over that 8 months to make up the difference.
How many crystals is that per day? 581. What is the max number of crystals you can earn through arena? 500.
So there you go, the SLKR advantage is worth something close to 580 crystals per day based on HSTR alone vs any hypothetical Arena advantage Rey might have. Since there is literally no possible way to get a 500 crystal advantage in Arena over SLKR players, and since I can't imagine an SLKR player falling out of the top100 Arena Rankings anytime in the foreseeable future, SLKR is much better - to the tune of at least 180 crystals/day - even without considering marginal advantages in TW or significant advantages in the low-payout GAC.
Not sure rick, seems fake.
Why cg goes against the film? Because they cannot program the game with rey jedi, will break the game and they dont know how to manage it.
I am curious if the meta report will shift over time, especially with the Fives cheese removed. There would still be flaws with that data, as several have pointed out.
Something that might be interesting is to check all the owners of both GLs and see what they're climbing with and what they're leaving overnight. Based on my very limited sample size of my shard chat and my guild, no one with both GLs is using GLR to climb or on defense overnight.
JKL with GLR team is what i would call the common team for the climb when both are owned.
the one thing the meta report does show is that Rey has been consistant in her taking of 1 even with all the changes we have seen. so while the buff resistance has a good point about the team makeup, the Rey can't win doesnt seem to hold water.
Yeah, now you have to spend money to get JK Luke to make your Rey function in arena according to the forum moderator. Nice!
So Rey owners have to relic 21 toons to get a still second-best Galactic Legend who is hot garbage in PvE. Meanwhile, SLKR owners relic 12 toons for a toon that is the best in every area of the game.
“Balanced.”
Didn't spend a cent on Rey or bother spending to go for JKL and yet still climb to first through Kylos and Reys. And can you count? I didn't relic 21 toons for Rey? I only reliced 12 toons the same amount of toons as a Kylo owner.
Can you read? I was saying that to have a functional Rey arena squad, you need both Rey and JKLS. You have to relic 12 toons for Rey and 8 (I think) for JKLS. That was the point of what I was trying to say. Reading comprehension, bro, come on.
Yes I can read as I said I didn't go for JKL and have had no issues climbing so your statement of needing 21 toons and JKL is incorrect. Only need to do 12 toons for Rey and you'll be fine without JKL no need to do the other 9 toons if you don't want to. My Rey is quite functional WITHOUT JKL so your statement still doesn't stand.
Get this - a Rey WW doesn’t even take a quarter of the ATSTs health in Endor Escalation.
Rey users, you’ve been duped. If you don’t realize that, you’re just a simp.
Just checked my arena top 10.. 7 are Rey teams. Yep, those players must hate the thousands of crystals they earn every week. "Simps" indeed.
Check meta report. Even though first month ppl unlocked Rey massively and invested in her coz she was arena-viable, and comparison in unlocking Kylo was 4:1 - 3:1, now it's nearly 1:1. And Kylo is better in every aspect of the game so with how things are in another month it's gonna be 1:1,5 - 1:2 (count how many ppl have Rey and can't switch and how many invested in her already and still unlocking her). So if they would be at least equal, or dominant in different areas of the game it would still be 3:1 - 2:1.
People have said this same thing with every kylo buff, yet rey is still holding the same relative arena dominance in the meta report as when the last counter nerf happened. My suggestion to you is to take your own advice and actually look at the meta report
I checked it due, nearly 1:1. You do not, judging from your words.
And where will those people leave their rey? =D
Are you seriously believing that anyone will leave DR or Vader on defence over night if they have rey? They'll climb any other team and leave Rey, just so GAS won't beat them
So there you go, the SLKR advantage is worth something close to 580 crystals per day based on HSTR alone vs any hypothetical Arena advantage Rey might have. Since there is literally no possible way to get a 500 crystal advantage in Arena over SLKR players, and since I can't imagine an SLKR player falling out of the top100 Arena Rankings anytime in the foreseeable future, SLKR is much better - to the tune of at least 180 crystals/day - even without considering marginal advantages in TW or significant advantages in the low-payout GAC.
And that is all that maters. Remove the ability for SLKR to chain ultimates by gaining charge during his ultimate stance and this goes away and we’re back to Rey being on par with SLKR in all modes.
So there you go, the SLKR advantage is worth something close to 580 crystals per day based on HSTR alone vs any hypothetical Arena advantage Rey might have. Since there is literally no possible way to get a 500 crystal advantage in Arena over SLKR players, and since I can't imagine an SLKR player falling out of the top100 Arena Rankings anytime in the foreseeable future, SLKR is much better - to the tune of at least 180 crystals/day - even without considering marginal advantages in TW or significant advantages in the low-payout GAC.
And that is all that maters. Remove the ability for SLKR to chain ultimates by gaining charge during his ultimate stance and this goes away and we’re back to Rey being on par with SLKR in all modes.
Remove it yourself. Kylo can't chain ultimates if there's no one else to help him charge it.
Kylo even gains ultimate meter not JUST while in ultimate stance but also just simply activating his ultimate! It fills it up around 30%. So effectively he never really dips below 30% ultimate meter.
Remove it yourself. Kylo can't chain ultimates if there's no one else to help him charge it.
What part of the conversation about HSTR rewards did you miss?
Oh that’s right...
It seemed pretty obvious from the kit reveals that Kylo was always gonna be way better in the raid, shrug. The buffs to his kit after release have nothing to do with hSTR, people are mad because of arena and TW/GAC.
Other than the raids, there really isn't one today. Rey and Kylo share similar counters from Vader. Kylo still has AI issues with Fives so GAS is still a counter there. Both can basically beat any other team including each other. One can even argue that Rey is better because of LS TB.
The biggest advantage to Kylo is that he is more future proof since his kit is more flexible and works in the lead as well non-lead. However, the right light side character under Rey can flip this conversation around.
Trying to view the GLs as objectively as possible:
SLKR advantages over Rey:
-Raid king. Miles ahead of Rey here.
-More consistent PvP win rate over Rey, even if it is marginal... (I don’t think it’s simply “marginal,” but more like “substantial,” but I’ll go with “marginal” here for argument’s sake).
-Functions at the level described in the previous bullet with all FO toons, including ones you have to gear to get him in the first place.
-Holds on defense at least as well as Rey.
-Don’t have to break apart 4 teams to get the best results out of him for GAC and TW.
-Still wins reliably over Rey Titans squad with full FO lineup.
-Will make your subsequent Rey and JKLS farms easier since you’ll consistently top of the leaderboard of the most consistent, reliable, easiest, and cheapest way to earn end-game gear (HSTR)
Rey advantages over SLKR:
-Better for Geo TB purposes
-Better kit for incorporating out of faction toons into her team including JKLS.
Trying to view the GLs as objectively as possible:
SLKR advantages over Rey:
-Raid king. Miles ahead of Rey here.
-More consistent PvP win rate over Rey, even if it is marginal... (I don’t think it’s simply “marginal,” but more like “substantial,” but I’ll go with “marginal” here for argument’s sake).
-Functions at the level described in the previous bullet with all FO toons, including ones you have to gear to get him in the first place.
-Holds on defense at least as well as Rey.
-Don’t have to break apart 4 teams to get the best results out of him for GAC and TW.
-Still wins reliably over Rey Titans squad with full FO lineup.
-Will make your subsequent Rey and JKLS farms easier since you’ll consistently top of the leaderboard of the most consistent, reliable, easiest, and cheapest way to earn end-game gear (HSTR)
Rey advantages over SLKR:
-Better for Geo TB purposes
-Better kit for incorporating out of faction toons into her team including JKLS.
I think that's a fair assessment. Other than the titans thing, which I can't speak to since I don't have SLKR.
Replies
So why do some guys in my shard run Rey, Heros, Hyoda (only toon not required for Rey but been around for a long time) and Holdo and still climb to first everyday? This argument that Rey doesn't work with res toons is a joke. Also some of the top Kylo squads aren't also full FO either. Lots are using Wat, Malak and others in their squads. Honestly this has become a mountain out of a mole hill. Both are perfectly fine for arena and for some its what's best for their guild also directed them one way or the other. Other than soloing HSTR Kylo doesn't help alot for our guild as we are GP locked in DSTB however improving LSTB CMs can still gain more stars for our guild.
This arguments a joke if you spent money on Rey or Kylo I'm sorry but that was YOUR CHOICE! CG did not show up at your door and physically force you to. Eventually you will have both and there be a new shiny toon soon enough so move on its a game at the end of the day.
Other than a truck load of crystals that they can use farming Kylo or hoard for the next meta. I'm just under 60,000 crystals, btw - and FTP.
You, Rey-is-crap people make me laugh. She's a cash machine but that still isn't good enough for you. SMH.
How many times do people have to say this. Rey is still a pretty good character even though Kylo might be better. She is the 2ND BEST CHARACTER in the game. Now she might not be the best SQUAD in the game but she is still a really good character that can beat almost every other squad (other than maybe Kylo and Vader sometimes) in the game. Even though you might think that farming Rey was a terrible idea you still got one of the best characters in the game.
Can you read? I was saying that to have a functional Rey arena squad, you need both Rey and JKLS. You have to relic 12 toons for Rey and 8 (I think) for JKLS. That was the point of what I was trying to say. Reading comprehension, bro, come on.
Well your point is wrong, just read the post above yours. Or look at the most popular rey comps in arena.
Or the fact that I won two in a row testing a pure Res team tonight.
it takes a long time to get a 2nd GL.Like 4 months + just for the gear and relic requirements. If someone has both GL's, it's entirely possible that someone who went Rey first (as most did) don't have their SLKR to r7 yet or have it but not with ultimate, etc.
It's going to take a while to see which toon someone really prefers.
In the meantime, I'm happy to stipulate that Rey is awesome. She can even be better than SLKR at PvP by a little bit. I don't think that's true, but let's say that Rey squads edge out SLKR squads in PvP.
SLKR completely dominates PvE content.
COMPLETELY. DOMINATES.
Ramble, ramble:
Now, a lot of people like PvP. And if being the best at PvP is your thing and you think that GL R is better than SLKR at PvP, I can understand why you like Rey.
But the advantage, if any, of GL R over SLKR in PvP doesn't come close to the advantage in PvE that SLKR holds.
Moreover, while, again, I'm in ticket farming for GL R and I don't have her unlocked and have no practical experience with her, everyone here appears to agree that for Rey to get good enough to have any PvP advantage at all, she has to draw from toons from other factions.
Now, I like theory crafting and I like unexpected combinations. I think it's fun to do that stuff, and I'm sure I'll throw some weird combos together with Rey.
But there can't be any debate that removing GA$ and JKL from their squads to make them available for GL Rey squads hurts 501st & Jedi more than, say, removing Malak from a DR squad.
This isn't to say that removing Malak from DR doesn't hurt that squad, but not as much as 501st is hurt by removing GA$.
A full FO SLKR squad is simply more viable than a full Resistance GL Rey squad. And when you do break up other squads for optimal performance, SLKR removes toons like Malak, who, as great as they are, aren't leaders that make or break an entire faction's ability to work as intended. GL Rey removes crucial leaders from other factions.
As a result, in every PvP mode **other than** squad arena, GL Rey owners are at a disadvantage. They either make a disadvantageous all-Resistance team, or they destroy other squads so GL Rey can live up to her potential.
This is why the Arena meta report is worthless. In Arena you can put all your meta toons in one squad and it costs you nothing. In TB and GAC putting all your meta LS leaders in one squad destroys your competitiveness.
So, again, assuming you have an advantage for Rey in Arena, which as Kyno points out is not proven, you have:
Again, assuming that Rey has the advantage in PvP when placed with her best allies,
Rey gets a small advantage in one game mode
SLKR gets advantages ranging from small to overwhelming in 3 game modes.
So the question then is, does Rey perform so well in Arena that she makes up the difference in all those other areas..
Incredibly long and tedious thing that I can't believe I typed out follows:
But if you have only one GL and it's Rey, assuming you are average for your guild, which means 24-25 other players have a GL, and half of those are Rey and Half SLKR. That means about 12 SLKRs.
If even 50% of them participate in HSTR, you're locked out of the top 6 reward spots. Only the top 3 spots have a decent chance of awarding a full RightSide G12 piece.
But you're also not that likely to be in the Top 10, because you only get an advantage in p1, and don't have a lot of opportunities to join in other phases since the SLKRs will quickly solo the raid without you getting a chance to jump into different phases with different teams, and certainly won't allow you to try multiple starts for the best initial RNG for your Shaak Ti or Deathstorm squad.
instead of being guaranteed a spot in the next 6 (again, assuming only half the GLR owners participate), you're fighting with other people who might not have any GLs, but do have a good DeathStorm squad and got better initial RNG than you. There are also only 4 spots left in the top 10 anyway.
If 50% of the next 6 slots after the first 6 Kylos are GL Reys, then only 1-2 of them are in the top 10.
So your odds of being top10 with GL Rey if you are an average player in your guild are 1-in-6 to 1-in-12, or 8.5 to 17%.
HSTR is available once every 5.7 days with essentially perfect tickets, so 5 raids every 28.5 days. Let's call it 10 raids in 60 days or 2 months. This is to the advantage of GL Rey, because it gives her an extra couple days of Arena rewards.
The SLKRs are only attacking half the time, but getting top6 every time when they do. You get a spot in the 7-10 range. about 1 time in 8.
To make the math work out easier, let's multiply the time frame by 4 to get a number of raids divisible by 8. In 8 months, you get only 5 top 10 finishes even if you participate in every single raid.
meanwhile, the SLKR's participate in only 50% of the raids (thus 20 raids total) and get 10 top 3 finishes and 10 finishes in 4th to 6th place.
About half the time you get a top10 finish outside of the top 3 you get a single full piece, usually left side. On rare occasions you might get 2 full pieces, in this case one is always Left and one is always Right.
Over your 8 months, you won't finish top 10 enough to be likely to get a single raid with 2 x completed pieces, so we'll say you get 4 Left and 1 Right from those, and in your other 35 finishes you get at most 5 left.
Total haul of completed pieces? 7 left and 1 right completed pieces. 2 Left, 1 right from your top 10 finishes (and that's generous) plus maybe 5 left from your 11th place+ finishes, even playing every single raid perfectly, to the best of your ability, and never missing an opportunity to raid.
Total haul from playing only 50% of the time with SLKR? 13-14 full Left Side pieces and 8 Right - about 9 Left and 5 right from your top 3 finishes and 4-5 left and 2 right from your 4th to 6th place finishes.
So over 8 months you're down 6 Left Side pieces and 7 Right Side, and that's assuming you raid twice as often as anyone else.
Okay, what's the crystal advantage needed to buy those pieces? Well, Right Side gear pieces sell for 6,500 crystals. Just to catch up in LS pieces you would need 7 times 6,500 = 45,500 crystals.
Divided by 240 days, that means you need to out-earn SLKR by 189 crystals per day in Arena. This means that if you take 1st place every day, you have to assume that your guild mate would finish 5th place or worse.
And that's just to make up for the Right Side deficit. But of course you need about 4 LeftSide pieces to catch up as well.
How many crystals for that? Well at 2100 per full gear x 6 = 12,600 crystals.. Divided by 240 days, we get another 51 crystals per day. Now you need to out-earn your guild mate by 240 crystals per day. To get that kind of advantage, you have to assume that your GL Rey would finish #1 every day and that your SLKR guild mate finishes no better than 6th place 80% of the time, and no better than 5th place the remaining 20% of the time.
But hang on! This is all still comparing you to your flaky guild mate who only raids half the time. What if you're comparing your GL Rey performance to yourself, to what you would do if you had gone SLKR?
Well, then you're talking about TWICE as many raid rewards while your GL Rey reward estimate stays stable. This means the advantage for SLKR more than doubles, since the raw rewards double and the double rewards minus your fixed GL Rewards leaves a greater percentage of those rewards as the net advantage.
Now you're down 15 Right Side pieces and 20 Left Side. The only way you can make up that deficit is if you finish first in Arena every day with SLKR, but couldn't possibly get a single crystal in Arena with SLKR.
Not. One. Single. Crystal.
Ooops! And wait, that's still doesn't make up the difference. You need 139,500 more crystals than an SLKR player over that 8 months to make up the difference.
How many crystals is that per day? 581. What is the max number of crystals you can earn through arena? 500.
So there you go, the SLKR advantage is worth something close to 580 crystals per day based on HSTR alone vs any hypothetical Arena advantage Rey might have. Since there is literally no possible way to get a 500 crystal advantage in Arena over SLKR players, and since I can't imagine an SLKR player falling out of the top100 Arena Rankings anytime in the foreseeable future, SLKR is much better - to the tune of at least 180 crystals/day - even without considering marginal advantages in TW or significant advantages in the low-payout GAC.
What comp/mods did you use please ? After a strong start, I'm on a losing streak and need to git gud.
Most people went for rey? Nice, let's improve only kylo.
If you went for rey, ************* you and spend money to get SLKR.
SLKR: usefull for sith raid, best character for arena, tw and gac, improves if something is not working perfectly
Rey: good.
Not sure rick, seems fake.
Why cg goes against the film? Because they cannot program the game with rey jedi, will break the game and they dont know how to manage it.
Thanks cg for breaking the game a bit more
Yes I can read as I said I didn't go for JKL and have had no issues climbing so your statement of needing 21 toons and JKL is incorrect. Only need to do 12 toons for Rey and you'll be fine without JKL no need to do the other 9 toons if you don't want to. My Rey is quite functional WITHOUT JKL so your statement still doesn't stand.
Sure, after 5 months of using Rey the disappointment
They should be balanced, which I currently do not believe they are.
kylo seems to hold better at least in my shard.
I have rey and no problem beating ult kylo with rey and jedis, but if I could reverse everything I would go for kylo and then for jkl.
I would skip rey or or prepare for her slowly, she does not seem worth the resources atm for me.
beating kylo with a full res team is possible, but I dont think it is consistent if mods are equal
And where will those people leave their rey? =D
Are you seriously believing that anyone will leave DR or Vader on defence over night if they have rey? They'll climb any other team and leave Rey, just so GAS won't beat them
And that is all that maters. Remove the ability for SLKR to chain ultimates by gaining charge during his ultimate stance and this goes away and we’re back to Rey being on par with SLKR in all modes.
Remove it yourself. Kylo can't chain ultimates if there's no one else to help him charge it.
What part of the conversation about HSTR rewards did you miss?
Oh that’s right...
It seemed pretty obvious from the kit reveals that Kylo was always gonna be way better in the raid, shrug. The buffs to his kit after release have nothing to do with hSTR, people are mad because of arena and TW/GAC.
Why go for Rey over SLKR? Or even JKLS for that matter.
The biggest advantage to Kylo is that he is more future proof since his kit is more flexible and works in the lead as well non-lead. However, the right light side character under Rey can flip this conversation around.
SLKR advantages over Rey:
-Raid king. Miles ahead of Rey here.
-More consistent PvP win rate over Rey, even if it is marginal... (I don’t think it’s simply “marginal,” but more like “substantial,” but I’ll go with “marginal” here for argument’s sake).
-Functions at the level described in the previous bullet with all FO toons, including ones you have to gear to get him in the first place.
-Holds on defense at least as well as Rey.
-Don’t have to break apart 4 teams to get the best results out of him for GAC and TW.
-Still wins reliably over Rey Titans squad with full FO lineup.
-Will make your subsequent Rey and JKLS farms easier since you’ll consistently top of the leaderboard of the most consistent, reliable, easiest, and cheapest way to earn end-game gear (HSTR)
Rey advantages over SLKR:
-Better for Geo TB purposes
-Better kit for incorporating out of faction toons into her team including JKLS.
I think that's a fair assessment. Other than the titans thing, which I can't speak to since I don't have SLKR.
How's the Ahnald thread going?
TB thread says hi too.
The Ahnald thread has 96 pages with only one comment since the 14th.