Please hide GAC scores!

Prev1
The fact that people that can wait and wait and wait to see what score the other person puts up before they attack is such a HUGE advantage. GAC ends at 4pm my time so I'm at work the last 9 hours of GAC so I'm always at a disadvantage. Why are the scores shown to allow this to happen? It just seems lousy game making to allow it. Please hide them til the round is over or both players have full cleared.

Replies

  • Or just post up the best score you can. Either it will win or it won’t.
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    How exactly is it an advantage?
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.
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  • Tiggus
    760 posts Member
    First player can pick to try a battle with Krennic and DT for lousy banners (or a loss) and risk the battle.

    Second player knows for sure he can or cannot afford to lose banners and do the feat.
    ☮ Consular ☮ - https://swgoh.gg/u/tiggus/
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.

    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.

    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?

    Because you don't have to take risks if the score is lower?
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • You also know the average amount of banners you need to earn per battle, so you also know when to undersize or not, and how careful you need to be. And if you are going below average for all the character battles, you know the amount of banners you need in ships to win.
  • Nikoms565
    12704 posts Member
    It absolutely is an advantage to have your opponent go first and know how they performed. For all of the reasons outlined above.

    Heck, on my last GAC, I had a GL-less opponent, so I took the opportunity to practice using some counters I don't usually even try. And accomplished a feat I normally writhe have ignored.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.

    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?

    Because you don't have to take risks if the score is lower?

    OK, so if your opponent scored low banners you can play your offense with less stress and have an easy win. We agree on this. However, you didn't answer my question:
    Waqui wrote: »
    [...]
    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?


  • TVF didn’t say it helped you score more than you could. Scoring your highest possible score involves risk, and the advantage that going last provides - if it ever does provide an advantage - is knowing how much risk you need to or don’t need to take.

  • That posted before I was done...

    Whenever you unveil your opponent’s defences, there is a maximum score that you can obtain with the best possible use of your counters and undersizing. Knowing your opponent’s score does not change what this maximum score is and does not make it any easier to obtain.

    But it’s the knowing that CAN provide an advantage, and more often than not it’s knowing that you DON’T need to take the risks that helps. Especially where feats are involved.

    If you know that you can take 2 battles to clear your opponent’s final team and you still haven’t achieved the feat for winning with 3 clone troopers, you can send something in to soften them up then send in the clones to finish it off and earn the feat and the win. If you don’t know your opponent’s score, then you would likely sacrifice the feat and make sure you clear first time.

    These are edge cases, but they will happen to some players every round of a GAC.
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    TVF didn’t say it helped you score more than you could.

    I know. But his reply to my question didn't answer the question. I'm sure he must have had a point with his reply (he always does with his posts) but it made no sense as a reply to my question.
    Scoring your highest possible score involves risk, and the advantage that going last provides - if it ever does provide an advantage - is knowing how much risk you need to or don’t need to take.

    So, you agree knowing your opponent's score doesn't actually help you score higher than you max possible without knowing the score?
  • Waqui wrote: »
    TVF didn’t say it helped you score more than you could.

    I know. But his reply to my question didn't answer the question. I'm sure he must have had a point with his reply (he always does with his posts) but it made no sense as a reply to my question.
    Scoring your highest possible score involves risk, and the advantage that going last provides - if it ever does provide an advantage - is knowing how much risk you need to or don’t need to take.

    So, you agree knowing your opponent's score doesn't actually help you score higher than you max possible without knowing the score?
    See my follow up post.
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Waqui this has been answered satisfactorily every time you've asked in the past.

    Have a nice Tuesday.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF didn’t say it helped you score more than you could.

    I know. But his reply to my question didn't answer the question. I'm sure he must have had a point with his reply (he always does with his posts) but it made no sense as a reply to my question.
    Scoring your highest possible score involves risk, and the advantage that going last provides - if it ever does provide an advantage - is knowing how much risk you need to or don’t need to take.

    So, you agree knowing your opponent's score doesn't actually help you score higher than you max possible without knowing the score?
    See my follow up post.

    Looks like we agree then :-). Knowing your opponent's score doesn't help you win the round but it could help you to a less stressfull offense, where you can slack, maybe do feats (for less banners) and still win the round.
  • Waqui
    7633 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui this has been answered satisfactorily every time you've asked in the past.

    Have a nice Tuesday.

    Well, your answer this time was nonsense - but @DarjeloSalas answered the question for you instead.
  • Nikoms565
    12704 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF didn’t say it helped you score more than you could.

    I know. But his reply to my question didn't answer the question. I'm sure he must have had a point with his reply (he always does with his posts) but it made no sense as a reply to my question.
    Scoring your highest possible score involves risk, and the advantage that going last provides - if it ever does provide an advantage - is knowing how much risk you need to or don’t need to take.

    So, you agree knowing your opponent's score doesn't actually help you score higher than you max possible without knowing the score?
    See my follow up post.

    Looks like we agree then :-). Knowing your opponent's score doesn't help you win the round but it could help you to a less stressfull offense, where you can slack, maybe do feats (for less banners) and still win the round.

    You didn't actually read his post did you? Or at least, if you did, you intentionally misinterpreted it to fit your narrative.

    Knowing your opponents score can help you win the round. It gives you a better idea where to adjust risk v. reward - and if your opponent scored lower (and you know this in advance) you can slide away from the risk side of the equation. If you did not know your opponent's score in advance, and instead went after your "maximum" score, with high risk attacks, you could lose more easily if things go bad for you in one of those battles.

    If you still insist that knowing your opponent's score in advance can't help you win the match after it now being explained in multiple ways, by multiple people, I can only presume you are posting in this thread then...05TDC9H.gif
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Rath_Tarr
    3491 posts Member
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png
  • Gifafi
    4907 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.

    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?

    Because you can take risks if the score is lower?
    Maybe End Game isn't for you
  • Kyno
    25104 posts Moderator
    Gifafi wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    How exactly is it an advantage?

    It's an advantage to know what score you need to win, obviously.

    You can debate how much of an advantage, and in some cases it's none (when an opponent scores very high), but it's obviously an advantage with everything else being equal.

    And it helps you score more than you could without knowing the score beforehand? How exactly?

    Because you can take risks if the score is lower?

    But then doesnt the advantage stem from the lower score?

    Because seeing the score and it not being low doesnt seem to help at all.....

    Knowing you need a high average score and a player taking more risk doesnt help them win the matches that actually effect the scoring.

    Also, any perceived advantage comes from a players sense of risk, which would also be related to their strategy (what they set on D and plan to use on O). Which wouldnt necessary change with a hidden score.
    Feats dont affect the match, so the ability to do them doesnt really sound like an advantage.

    I am not saying there is no advantage, as I'm sure players like to like they are taking less risk, but there are ways a player can achieve this on their own with a change to the strategy they use. The percieved advantage is about comfort and doesnt make the game play any easier, you can still lose that one point in the match by making a mistake, no matter how comfortable you are.
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Legend91
    1357 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.

    It's not like 2476 is an unbeatable score with what I see there on defense. Malak/Nest solo vs Shaak, JKR+GMY duo vs KRU, SLKR solo vs GG, Nest solo vs Palp (depending on potency vs tenacity)..but 2476 is a good score non the less.
    __________

    On topic:
    Going second is a significant advantage and I'm tired of this discussion. All relevant information (banners scored, number of battles and zones cleared) should be hidden but since CG is too lazy for everything or just doesn't care this won't happen.
    Legend#6873 | YouTube | swgoh.gg
  • Kyno
    25104 posts Moderator
    Legend91 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.

    It's not like 2476 is an unbeatable score with what I see there on defense. Malak/Nest solo vs Shaak, JKR+GMY duo vs KRU, SLKR solo vs GG, Nest solo vs Palp (depending on potency vs tenacity)..but 2476 is a good score non the less.
    __________

    On topic:
    Going second is a significant advantage and I'm tired of this discussion. All relevant information (banners scored, number of battles and zones cleared) should be hidden but since CG is too lazy for everything or just doesn't care this won't happen.

    Or the significance of this advantage is exaggerated and calling them lazy is just a lazy argument.
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    The significance of the advantage is completely dependent on the situation.

    And most often the argument is that there's "zero advantage ever" which is completely false.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Rath_Tarr
    3491 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.
    According to the OP, by going first I just handed my opponent a "HUGE advantage" ... or did I
    nghtmare wrote: »
    The fact that people that can wait and wait and wait to see what score the other person puts up before they attack is such a HUGE advantage.
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Fair enough, OP's statement is sometimes right and very often wrong.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Legend91
    1357 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Legend91 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.

    It's not like 2476 is an unbeatable score with what I see there on defense. Malak/Nest solo vs Shaak, JKR+GMY duo vs KRU, SLKR solo vs GG, Nest solo vs Palp (depending on potency vs tenacity)..but 2476 is a good score non the less.
    __________

    On topic:
    Going second is a significant advantage and I'm tired of this discussion. All relevant information (banners scored, number of battles and zones cleared) should be hidden but since CG is too lazy for everything or just doesn't care this won't happen.

    Or the significance of this advantage is exaggerated and calling them lazy is just a lazy argument.

    On the first part: That's probably why the majority of those high lifetime banner people (where it's safe to assume they get to Kyber every season and many of them having Kyber Contender titles) are desperately trying to attack second with some of those "standoffs" going so far that the first attacks are happening at the last 30 min of the match.
    On the second part: Sorry, I forgot that some UI work is too complicated and expensive for a billion dollar game.
    Legend#6873 | YouTube | swgoh.gg
  • TVF
    25062 posts Member
    Or maybe they just don't think it's enough of a problem to spend time and money on it.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • I would love to see a basketball game where the scores were hidden.
  • Rath_Tarr
    3491 posts Member
    Legend91 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Legend91 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Oh noes I went first so I will surely lose!!! :oh79wems0rai3.png

    Did someone say you can't win if you go first?

    That's not the point, and I know you know it's not the point.

    Congrats on the win though.

    It's not like 2476 is an unbeatable score with what I see there on defense. Malak/Nest solo vs Shaak, JKR+GMY duo vs KRU, SLKR solo vs GG, Nest solo vs Palp (depending on potency vs tenacity)..but 2476 is a good score non the less.
    __________

    On topic:
    Going second is a significant advantage and I'm tired of this discussion. All relevant information (banners scored, number of battles and zones cleared) should be hidden but since CG is too lazy for everything or just doesn't care this won't happen.

    Or the significance of this advantage is exaggerated and calling them lazy is just a lazy argument.

    On the first part: That's probably why the majority of those high lifetime banner people (where it's safe to assume they get to Kyber every season and many of them having Kyber Contender titles) are desperately trying to attack second with some of those "standoffs" going so far that the first attacks are happening at the last 30 min of the match.
    On the second part: Sorry, I forgot that some UI work is too complicated and expensive for a billion dollar game.
    I have 393k lifetime banners and I have made Kyber in every GAC so far. I frequently attack first - actually I attack when I am ready which often happens to be before my opponent - and I rarely have a problem unless I make a miscalculation / mistake which results in a lower score.

    Occasionally an opponent attacking second will beat my score but not very often. And I lose because my opponent out-matches me or I make a mistake.

    I would play this way whether scores were visible or not.
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