Running out of Salvage?

Replies

  • Tier distribution if you wonder. I try to manage it to some degree, but not to the extreme (=top 80)

    xg1dkc25tjd5.png
  • Treeburner
    770 posts Member
    edited September 2020
    Jppc wrote: »
    Treeburner wrote: »
    Jppc wrote: »
    Treeburner wrote: »
    Ultra wrote: »
    Treeburner wrote: »
    Feel like even of someone had 100 R7 toons unless they had both GL as well ,their opinion is worthless, that's what some of the post seem like .
    There is definitely some kind of toon snobbery here .
    you're right

    we should all congratulate him for solving the relic scrap problem by buying the first 4 gear salvages for credit every 6 hours

    Glad someone finally thought of that!

    Sarcasm aside, Kisakee wasn't really humble enough to the idea that this is a problem that some players are facing. He just straight up dismissed everyone else with his solution, and after everyone explained why they have a shortage he was still acting ignorant, making comments like "don't go after GLs; problem solved" etc

    I don't think people are being hostile towards him, but a lot of players piling up on him to explain why they are having an issue and his situation doesn't correspond is self-inflicted

    Did I mention you in my post or is this one of those if the boot fits situations ;) I'm not here to clear your conscious so you don't have to explain yourself to me .
    @Ultra please use quotation marks for quotes , I don't think I read anything close to "don't go after GLs problem solved " from kisakee but I may have missed something.

    DarjeloSalas seems to be doing alright he's got both GLs and JKL and more than enough salvage at this moment. He did say that he might have a problem if he goes for SEE but he could acquire more scrap by then ,so if the metric is GLs and not the amount of total relics you have then the people who only relics toons needed for GLs will be in the best position salvage wise and be in a position to comment.

    He said “don’t care about JML” like if it solved anything (it didn’t)

    Also said he was going for SEE in the same sentence far from "don't go for GLs problem solved" . He said that he's going for one himself .
    I don't know how anyone could confuse someone picking which Galactic legend they are going for for don't go for GLs problem solved it's a mad interpretation of you ask me .

    He continues to be far from the bottleneck, he will reach. What is your point? I kind of lost it. To you carbonite isn’t a problem and wont be? Or other thing?

    That's quote of mine is referring to people crazy interpretation of someone choosing one GL over another as " don't go for the GLs problem solved"

    my other point was that it should be the amount of relics you have that should determine your bottle neck not what relics you have is that a difficult concept or am I mad

    The real question is, is marumaru an anomaly or just good at resource management ? Seems to have it under a certain amount of control
  • I just made a rough calculation and saw where the real horror show lays for me. After I'm done with luke+palpy, my chromium stock will be fully gone. If I wanted to do kylo after that, I would need 1k chromiums. Besides super slow accumulation to account for some of it, that costs 40k crystals. 2000 carbonites costs 10k crystals even if peeps run out of it.

    We are still waiting on the crafitibility problem btw. I need this to be made craftable without using toons as I have no toons to craft them on.

    vgkttknuegxi.png
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    The larger concern is that relics are still relatively new and some of us have already burned through 4 years of hoarded gear. The rate at which we earn it compared to the ever-increasing need for it is not just going to be A bottleneck. For endgame players it will become THE bottleneck.

    Due to the extreme ratio of converting gear to relic mats, you will earn kyros faster than low-level relic materials.

    Yeah. Also no matter how much people keep ranting on old bottlenecks like stun guns/carbantis, mine has been shifting to fleet table needs for a while. We don't have these on guild store, so the accumulation speed is much lower.
  • This is all part of the 5 year plan
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    The larger concern is that relics are still relatively new and some of us have already burned through 4 years of hoarded gear. The rate at which we earn it compared to the ever-increasing need for it is not just going to be A bottleneck. For endgame players it will become THE bottleneck.

    Due to the extreme ratio of converting gear to relic mats, you will earn kyros faster than low-level relic materials.

    Couldn't have said it better. It's not the end of the world though, carbonite wiring isn't THAT expensive (500 crystals for 100 is it?) but on the long run it will be a crystal drain
  • Kisakee
    1508 posts Member
    edited September 2020
    The real problems are not any 'bottlenecks of whatever' or introducing new gear like Kyrotech but how fast people try to advance. The resource income doesn't fit their speed and then they tend to ask for a solution for their self made material shortcomings.
    There are three things to happen on this point: 1 - CG gives us more opportunities to get things faster but that's unlikely. 2 - Folks need to spend money to keep pace, possible but unwanted for most of them. 3 - Slowing down the process and finding a balance of income and usage for almost everything, again possible but unwanted in most cases.
    For me i go with #3 as i have a patience beyond the galaxy, if i can't afford it today i just wait for tomorrow. Others may be faster than me at the start but in the long run i always catch up on some point. The game is so much easier if you don't stress yourself everyday, give it a try.
    And for #1 it won't help much as this will become true for everyone so nobody will have a real advantage.
    Never make the mistake of believing forbearance equates to acceptance, or that all positions are equally valid.
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    The larger concern is that relics are still relatively new and some of us have already burned through 4 years of hoarded gear. The rate at which we earn it compared to the ever-increasing need for it is not just going to be A bottleneck. For endgame players it will become THE bottleneck.

    Due to the extreme ratio of converting gear to relic mats, you will earn kyros faster than low-level relic materials.

    Yeah. Also no matter how much people keep ranting on old bottlenecks like stun guns/carbantis, mine has been shifting to fleet table needs for a while. We don't have these on guild store, so the accumulation speed is much lower.

    I have 3 characters for jml that need 1 piece of gear for g13 but it is all stuff that is only on fleet nodes. It is so annoying how much that slows everything down.
  • That first round of GC’s was a little misleading.
    First we needed 5 reliced characters per faction per event. Yes the rewards **** but they immediately stated they’d adjust them.
    So one could be lead to believe that relicing those characters will pay off once rewards are made better.
    Then they take that relic requirement away.
    I believe I reliced 6 characters to level 5 between all the required factions to get those feats. Now they are not needed and I’m not happy at all about that previous relic requirement. But that’s in me.
    Now my roster has 110 relic characters and gear crunch is more challenging then ever before. Feel like I’m farming gear at double the need as before.
    Feel like I just put a twinkle in a Devs eye with that last statement lol
  • TVF
    30981 posts Member
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    I'm a day 1 f2p with 6.4m gp and 59 toons at relics. I may have put a leash on it and kept at 6.0m gp, but lower than that would be roster stagnation just to not get bottlenecked with these. I'm not bottlenecked yet either, but going there for sure. Naturally you can guess r3 jkls don't cut it at this gp.

    How so?
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    It seems the "average player" may be relicing some characters further than needed because they have the material. Now that the salvage is becoming more scarce to them, they may need to decide which characters need the relics the most.

    Jkl may be an example. Maybe TFV can beat anything he needs JKL for with R3. Assuming you have a GL for arena and can get through the ls tb with jedi Luke at R3, then there isn't a lot of other benefit other than a GAC counter (which may work fine at R3 or R5 I don't know). And if you are relicing just for GAC, you are getting a poor return on investment. Assuming you are in DIV 1 and can get kyber (which doesn't require a lot of reliced toons or any GLs), you get pretty close to the maximum rewards. Anything above that threshold is simply bragging rights.

    And even for TB, an arguement can be made that putting lower relics on multiple teams will give more benefit than R7 on a few meta characters.

    And having all 4 GLs may be good for bragging rights but doesn't provide much else. You can crush it in arena with only one. Or run a counter team and still do just fine.

    They work in tb but 13 to 15 relics for one tb team is pretty steep for the added rewards.

    I generally try to make sure that anything I relic will make a difference in some aspect of the game. I'm going for papa palps because I'm closer and it will cement a good arena ranking for awhile and give me most of an imp trooper team to beat assault battles and ds tb.

    I'll probably do jml after that for some better ls teams since my ls needs work. But I will be choosy at first on which toons I do since at that point I won't likely need to worry about arena.

    After that. I may go after Rey or Kylo but it's doubtful at that point. Getting jml and papa palps puts you in pretty good shape with both tbs and assuming one of them can solo hstr as well (which is likely since most new characters are better) there really isn't enough benefit to go back and get them. Not enough to be worth relicing 30 characters at least.

    I'm a day 1 f2p with 6.4m gp and 59 toons at relics. I may have put a leash on it and kept at 6.0m gp, but lower than that would be roster stagnation just to not get bottlenecked with these. I'm not bottlenecked yet either, but going there for sure. Naturally you can guess r3 jkls don't cut it at this gp.

    pwymzib1jpus.png
    4ule86fcvcln.png

    I'm not arguing that you have to go nuts to hit the bottleneck. But it does make it where you hit it sooner.

    I'm not a day one player. The game was about a year along when I started and I took an 8 mo break recently after the malak fiasco (the reason I don't have any GLs). And my GP is almost 5 mil.

    So I don't doubt that 6 mil for day one ftp is a fairly low gp as things go. Though, the first year I missed likely didn't affect gp that much since max gear at the time was relatively low.

    Anyway, I was just pointing out that some with the issue may have reliced some toons a bit too eagerly for GAC. What seems vital today is only ok a year from now and trash 2 years from now.

    For example, anyone that has reliced Phoenix has no one to blame but themselves. There are other teams as well that are questionable but Phoenix is the example. When relics came out, many were still using Phoenix for gac but they had little use elsewhere. So relicing them was probably solely for gac at the time. Now they are pretty much useless.

    I'd even argue that relicing some meta teams isn't necessary. I only recently unlocked GAS and mine will probably sit at five stars for awhile due to GLs. I don't need him for arena. I will probably star and relic him when I'm done with papa palps but only him. The rest of the 501st probably not. I can relic one character and put him in as a GL counter or I can relic 5 and have him as a GL counter and a decent GAC team under shak to.

    But in six months that team will only be ok. So I'm going to skip it. And I know they are needed for ls tb but I haven't seen anything in Ki Amundi's kit that justifies 5 high relic characters to unlock.

  • TVF
    30981 posts Member
    Treeburner wrote: »
    Feel like even of someone had 100 R7 toons unless they had both GL as well ,their opinion is worthless, that's what some of the post seem like .
    There is definitely some kind of toon snobbery here .
    It’s an issue that becomes more apparent the more toons you have applied relics to.

    I personally wouldn’t belittle Kisakee’s roster or his ability to contribute, but to a certain extent, this is similar to when people claim there’s no such thing as the mk8 biotech implant salvage crunch because they still have 1000+ left, but <50 toons above g11.

    @DarjeloSalas I won't belittle @Kisakee 's roster or his ability to contribute, but I will question it quite heavily.

    One Padme team.

    No GAS, no Clones, no Rey, no Luke, no Shaak Ti.

    That's not doing much in LSTB.

    And the reason it's similar to when people claim the mk8 biotech implant salvage crunch doesn't exist is because Kisakee did exactly that. And yeah, if you hamstring your roster and don't contribute in LSTB, you can avoid both of these crunches.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of conquest. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    I just made a rough calculation and saw where the real horror show lays for me. After I'm done with luke+palpy, my chromium stock will be fully gone. If I wanted to do kylo after that, I would need 1k chromiums. Besides super slow accumulation to account for some of it, that costs 40k crystals. 2000 carbonites costs 10k crystals even if peeps run out of it.

    We are still waiting on the crafitibility problem btw. I need this to be made craftable without using toons as I have no toons to craft them on.

    vgkttknuegxi.png

    I think assuming that you'll do 3 more GLs of you have one or none at this point is unrealistic. I have no GLs and I'm going after Papa palps first.

    After that I'll probably do Luke since his requirements aren't that bad and I have many of them at g12 and they are currently still useful.

    However after I'm done with that, Rey and Kylo will be over a year old and likely have enough counters that it is difficult to justify that heavy of investment. There are no events that you specifically need resistance or first order for so no stuff from that. Kylo can solo hstr but I'd bet that either palps or jml will as well. Or another team will soon enough.

    So I'll probably stock up for the next GL after my first two. I'd be nice to have everything but CG puts the bottleneck in so that to have everything you have to spend. Wise resource management can help but at this point ftp will probably have to skip relicing some teams.

    Some consolation for those that already have GLs but are facing the bottleneck on the last one. You have time. The GLs you have will likely still hold in arena and the next pair will likely be 8 months down the road. You can stock up in the mean time.

    That may mean skipping a toon or two that you'd like to relic. Or even skipping a GL if it isn't really needed for much.

    Or you can become a kracken and get everything now.

    But bottlenecks are part of CGs business model and it isn't going to change. You may not like this one. Personally, I hate the stun gun one worse at the moment but I understand that this one can also be frustrating.

    But the best advice I have if you're facing this crunch is to focus on what you can control. Worrying about what CG will do is a waste of effort.

    The things you can do to mitigate thos issue.

    1. Don't pass up the cheap gear for credits. It's a minor amount but it adds up

    2. Make sure you can beat the challenge tiers 2 and 3 of the assault battles. I think you get like 10 carbonite salvage for each of those so that's 120 a month. Long term that adds up.

    3. Focus on the GL that over has requirements that help beat the assualt battles first. That's palp and Luke. Palp gives you most of an imp trooper team that can auto rebel roundup and enough empire and sith to probably beat those easily as well. Luke gives you enough rebels to beat that one and with jkl enough jedi to easily finish that one. That leaves only ns for the last. It may or may not be worth putting high relics on them for just one event. Assuming the event stays as is for a few years it probably is in the long run.

    4. Skip relicing stuff that has limited value in the game. This may also include some teams that are meta right now. I'll probably skip GL Rey simply because by the time I get to her, she likely won't be useful enough to justify the investment. Same probably goes for Kylo. I'd rather get the new GLs and be set for the next ones than go back and get the old ones and miss the next meta.
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    The larger concern is that relics are still relatively new and some of us have already burned through 4 years of hoarded gear. The rate at which we earn it compared to the ever-increasing need for it is not just going to be A bottleneck. For endgame players it will become THE bottleneck.

    Due to the extreme ratio of converting gear to relic mats, you will earn kyros faster than low-level relic materials.

    Couldn't have said it better. It's not the end of the world though, carbonite wiring isn't THAT expensive (500 crystals for 100 is it?) but on the long run it will be a crystal drain

    Isn't it better for the bottleneck to be at the relic level rather than the g12 level with kyros othe g8 level for newer characters.

    The consequence of alleviating one bottleneck is that another will take it's place.

    They aren't ever going to remove all bottlenecks. Personally I prefer this one to the stungun or the kyro crunch.
  • Kisakee wrote: »
    The real problems are not any 'bottlenecks of whatever' or introducing new gear like Kyrotech but how fast people try to advance. The resource income doesn't fit their speed and then they tend to ask for a solution for their self made material shortcomings.
    There are three things to happen on this point: 1 - CG gives us more opportunities to get things faster but that's unlikely. 2 - Folks need to spend money to keep pace, possible but unwanted for most of them. 3 - Slowing down the process and finding a balance of income and usage for almost everything, again possible but unwanted in most cases.
    For me i go with #3 as i have a patience beyond the galaxy, if i can't afford it today i just wait for tomorrow. Others may be faster than me at the start but in the long run i always catch up on some point. The game is so much easier if you don't stress yourself everyday, give it a try.
    And for #1 it won't help much as this will become true for everyone so nobody will have a real advantage.

    Well said
  • Sewpot wrote: »
    That first round of GC’s was a little misleading.
    First we needed 5 reliced characters per faction per event. Yes the rewards **** but they immediately stated they’d adjust them.
    So one could be lead to believe that relicing those characters will pay off once rewards are made better.
    Then they take that relic requirement away.
    I believe I reliced 6 characters to level 5 between all the required factions to get those feats. Now they are not needed and I’m not happy at all about that previous relic requirement. But that’s in me.
    Now my roster has 110 relic characters and gear crunch is more challenging then ever before. Feel like I’m farming gear at double the need as before.
    Feel like I just put a twinkle in a Devs eye with that last statement lol

    They clearly said it was an exhibition. If you reliced characters that had no other use then that's on you.

    But most of the factions in GC so far have been the ones needed for assualt battles too so if you can beat challenge tiers 2 or 3 with your new toons then it wasn't a waste.

    Either way it's not CGs fault
  • kello_511 wrote: »
    The math here is pretty simple.

    Since relics were introduced, I’ve done nothing differently in regards to my acquiring of low level gear - I still farm the same ways I did before, I still buy those 4x credit items from the shops, I still complete low level events as always.

    However, since I started relicing, by hoard of low level gears has gone down. That means that they are being used faster than they are acquired.

    The obvious conclusion is that at some point, they will run out unless my spending of them decreases or my income of them increases.

    If you are in the same boat, then the crunch is definitely coming for you too.
    If you are applying relics at a slow enough rate that your hoard remains steady, you might not ever feel the crunch.

    For me personally, I can see it imminently. I should be able to complete JML and his requirements (my third GL toon) but after that I’ll pretty much be out.

    Not really. They recently added the challenge tier 3 to all the assualt battles which gives you relic materials. So unless you are beating all of those every time, you haven't maximized your relic income.

    So there may be room to grow that income for some to prevent a shortage before they run out. Even if they are currently burning through a stash.
  • kello_511 wrote: »
    The math here is pretty simple.

    Since relics were introduced, I’ve done nothing differently in regards to my acquiring of low level gear - I still farm the same ways I did before, I still buy those 4x credit items from the shops, I still complete low level events as always.

    However, since I started relicing, by hoard of low level gears has gone down. That means that they are being used faster than they are acquired.

    The obvious conclusion is that at some point, they will run out unless my spending of them decreases or my income of them increases.

    If you are in the same boat, then the crunch is definitely coming for you too.
    If you are applying relics at a slow enough rate that your hoard remains steady, you might not ever feel the crunch.

    For me personally, I can see it imminently. I should be able to complete JML and his requirements (my third GL toon) but after that I’ll pretty much be out.

    Not really. They recently added the challenge tier 3 to all the assualt battles which gives you relic materials. So unless you are beating all of those every time, you haven't maximized your relic income.

    So there may be room to grow that income for some to prevent a shortage before they run out. Even if they are currently burning through a stash.

    Do you really believe that the extra relic materials from t3 challenges will alleviate this crunch?

    It’s a budget question of income vs. expenses. I guess if the few extra materials from those challenges are enough that your hoard stops depleting, then that has solved it for you.

    For myself (and I think most people commenting here), my gearing is happening at a Much faster rate than the acquisition of this low level gear supports. And I don’t feel that my gearing rate is excessive given that I’m not spending money to supplement it. Even spending 500-600 crystals a day on energy refreshes is enough to far exceed the rate that those low level gears come in.

    Relicing already provides enough additional gates as it is, in my opinion the lowest levels of relic materials should not be yet another gate.
  • kello_511 wrote: »
    kello_511 wrote: »
    The math here is pretty simple.

    Since relics were introduced, I’ve done nothing differently in regards to my acquiring of low level gear - I still farm the same ways I did before, I still buy those 4x credit items from the shops, I still complete low level events as always.

    However, since I started relicing, by hoard of low level gears has gone down. That means that they are being used faster than they are acquired.

    The obvious conclusion is that at some point, they will run out unless my spending of them decreases or my income of them increases.

    If you are in the same boat, then the crunch is definitely coming for you too.
    If you are applying relics at a slow enough rate that your hoard remains steady, you might not ever feel the crunch.

    For me personally, I can see it imminently. I should be able to complete JML and his requirements (my third GL toon) but after that I’ll pretty much be out.

    Not really. They recently added the challenge tier 3 to all the assualt battles which gives you relic materials. So unless you are beating all of those every time, you haven't maximized your relic income.

    So there may be room to grow that income for some to prevent a shortage before they run out. Even if they are currently burning through a stash.

    Do you really believe that the extra relic materials from t3 challenges will alleviate this crunch?

    It’s a budget question of income vs. expenses. I guess if the few extra materials from those challenges are enough that your hoard stops depleting, then that has solved it for you.

    For myself (and I think most people commenting here), my gearing is happening at a Much faster rate than the acquisition of this low level gear supports. And I don’t feel that my gearing rate is excessive given that I’m not spending money to supplement it. Even spending 500-600 crystals a day on energy refreshes is enough to far exceed the rate that those low level gears come in.

    Relicing already provides enough additional gates as it is, in my opinion the lowest levels of relic materials should not be yet another gate.

    Yes to an extent. You get 120 kudos from challenge tier one a month and 120 carbonite boards if you do tiers 2 and 3. You get 90 kyros a month from dailies.

    So you have enough to g13 two characters a month at that rate (assuming no farming) it takes 200 carb boards to R7 so the you have enough for half a character a month with no use of the gear for crafting.

    But you also need kyros for lower level gear for many new characters and you don't necessarily need to r7 every g13. So you probably only g13 one character a month from free materials and on average they only need r4 or r5. So it's actually pretty close.

    Now obviously, you farm materials so you can get kyros faster with crystals. But you can do the same for carbonite boards so the comparison of how many you get each month from events is probably more meaningful than to add in all the possible farming choices.
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    It seems the "average player" may be relicing some characters further than needed because they have the material. Now that the salvage is becoming more scarce to them, they may need to decide which characters need the relics the most.

    Jkl may be an example. Maybe TFV can beat anything he needs JKL for with R3. Assuming you have a GL for arena and can get through the ls tb with jedi Luke at R3, then there isn't a lot of other benefit other than a GAC counter (which may work fine at R3 or R5 I don't know). And if you are relicing just for GAC, you are getting a poor return on investment. Assuming you are in DIV 1 and can get kyber (which doesn't require a lot of reliced toons or any GLs), you get pretty close to the maximum rewards. Anything above that threshold is simply bragging rights.

    And even for TB, an arguement can be made that putting lower relics on multiple teams will give more benefit than R7 on a few meta characters.

    And having all 4 GLs may be good for bragging rights but doesn't provide much else. You can crush it in arena with only one. Or run a counter team and still do just fine.

    They work in tb but 13 to 15 relics for one tb team is pretty steep for the added rewards.

    I generally try to make sure that anything I relic will make a difference in some aspect of the game. I'm going for papa palps because I'm closer and it will cement a good arena ranking for awhile and give me most of an imp trooper team to beat assault battles and ds tb.

    I'll probably do jml after that for some better ls teams since my ls needs work. But I will be choosy at first on which toons I do since at that point I won't likely need to worry about arena.

    After that. I may go after Rey or Kylo but it's doubtful at that point. Getting jml and papa palps puts you in pretty good shape with both tbs and assuming one of them can solo hstr as well (which is likely since most new characters are better) there really isn't enough benefit to go back and get them. Not enough to be worth relicing 30 characters at least.

    I'm a day 1 f2p with 6.4m gp and 59 toons at relics. I may have put a leash on it and kept at 6.0m gp, but lower than that would be roster stagnation just to not get bottlenecked with these. I'm not bottlenecked yet either, but going there for sure. Naturally you can guess r3 jkls don't cut it at this gp.

    pwymzib1jpus.png
    4ule86fcvcln.png

    I'm not arguing that you have to go nuts to hit the bottleneck. But it does make it where you hit it sooner.

    I'm not a day one player. The game was about a year along when I started and I took an 8 mo break recently after the malak fiasco (the reason I don't have any GLs). And my GP is almost 5 mil.

    So I don't doubt that 6 mil for day one ftp is a fairly low gp as things go. Though, the first year I missed likely didn't affect gp that much since max gear at the time was relatively low.

    Anyway, I was just pointing out that some with the issue may have reliced some toons a bit too eagerly for GAC. What seems vital today is only ok a year from now and trash 2 years from now.

    For example, anyone that has reliced Phoenix has no one to blame but themselves. There are other teams as well that are questionable but Phoenix is the example. When relics came out, many were still using Phoenix for gac but they had little use elsewhere. So relicing them was probably solely for gac at the time. Now they are pretty much useless.

    I'd even argue that relicing some meta teams isn't necessary. I only recently unlocked GAS and mine will probably sit at five stars for awhile due to GLs. I don't need him for arena. I will probably star and relic him when I'm done with papa palps but only him. The rest of the 501st probably not. I can relic one character and put him in as a GL counter or I can relic 5 and have him as a GL counter and a decent GAC team under shak to.

    But in six months that team will only be ok. So I'm going to skip it. And I know they are needed for ls tb but I haven't seen anything in Ki Amundi's kit that justifies 5 high relic characters to unlock.

    I wasn't talking about whether any gp is ok for any terms of playing&spending. It's just about individual developing speed. My philosophy is the game shouldn't be pushing you to hoard too much. For the examples you gave, I had them at the time they were necessary for arena and arena is the thing that makes me develop so fast.

    Naturally anything drops down a tier of quality as time passes and even metas falls to obscurity in 2 year intervals. It's logical for a player coming from behind these tides to skip some of those and try to foresee what will hold longer. And just as naturally you can't expect older accounts start skipping what's good at any moment.
  • kello_511 wrote: »
    kello_511 wrote: »
    The math here is pretty simple.

    Since relics were introduced, I’ve done nothing differently in regards to my acquiring of low level gear - I still farm the same ways I did before, I still buy those 4x credit items from the shops, I still complete low level events as always.

    However, since I started relicing, by hoard of low level gears has gone down. That means that they are being used faster than they are acquired.

    The obvious conclusion is that at some point, they will run out unless my spending of them decreases or my income of them increases.

    If you are in the same boat, then the crunch is definitely coming for you too.
    If you are applying relics at a slow enough rate that your hoard remains steady, you might not ever feel the crunch.

    For me personally, I can see it imminently. I should be able to complete JML and his requirements (my third GL toon) but after that I’ll pretty much be out.

    Not really. They recently added the challenge tier 3 to all the assualt battles which gives you relic materials. So unless you are beating all of those every time, you haven't maximized your relic income.

    So there may be room to grow that income for some to prevent a shortage before they run out. Even if they are currently burning through a stash.

    Do you really believe that the extra relic materials from t3 challenges will alleviate this crunch?

    It’s a budget question of income vs. expenses. I guess if the few extra materials from those challenges are enough that your hoard stops depleting, then that has solved it for you.

    For myself (and I think most people commenting here), my gearing is happening at a Much faster rate than the acquisition of this low level gear supports. And I don’t feel that my gearing rate is excessive given that I’m not spending money to supplement it. Even spending 500-600 crystals a day on energy refreshes is enough to far exceed the rate that those low level gears come in.

    Relicing already provides enough additional gates as it is, in my opinion the lowest levels of relic materials should not be yet another gate.

    Yes to an extent. You get 120 kudos from challenge tier one a month and 120 carbonite boards if you do tiers 2 and 3. You get 90 kyros a month from dailies.

    So you have enough to g13 two characters a month at that rate (assuming no farming) it takes 200 carb boards to R7 so the you have enough for half a character a month with no use of the gear for crafting.

    But you also need kyros for lower level gear for many new characters and you don't necessarily need to r7 every g13. So you probably only g13 one character a month from free materials and on average they only need r4 or r5. So it's actually pretty close.

    Now obviously, you farm materials so you can get kyros faster with crystals. But you can do the same for carbonite boards so the comparison of how many you get each month from events is probably more meaningful than to add in all the possible farming choices.

    Ok, but what you are really saying then is that even the lowest level of relic materials are meant to be as rare as Kyros?

    Maybe you’re correct about this. If so, I think it’s an even poorer design that I did before.

    To get a toon from G13 to a meaningful relic level takes already introduces enough additional bottlenecks as it is. You need the higher level salvage (eating up more valuable gear) as well as the different relic materials.

    Adding an additional crunch at the lower level Of relics seems wrong (to me).
    It feels like adding a green ability mat crunch for zetas or needing to farm tier1 training droids for the next level cap increase.

    As annoying as it may be to be stuck behind a stun gun wall, a kyro crunch or to be farming gold gear for the high end relic salvage is, those bottlenecks are at least consistent with the level of development for the character.

    Having to go farm level 1 battles for relic salvage material feels like a big step backwards.
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    It seems the "average player" may be relicing some characters further than needed because they have the material. Now that the salvage is becoming more scarce to them, they may need to decide which characters need the relics the most.

    Jkl may be an example. Maybe TFV can beat anything he needs JKL for with R3. Assuming you have a GL for arena and can get through the ls tb with jedi Luke at R3, then there isn't a lot of other benefit other than a GAC counter (which may work fine at R3 or R5 I don't know). And if you are relicing just for GAC, you are getting a poor return on investment. Assuming you are in DIV 1 and can get kyber (which doesn't require a lot of reliced toons or any GLs), you get pretty close to the maximum rewards. Anything above that threshold is simply bragging rights.

    And even for TB, an arguement can be made that putting lower relics on multiple teams will give more benefit than R7 on a few meta characters.

    And having all 4 GLs may be good for bragging rights but doesn't provide much else. You can crush it in arena with only one. Or run a counter team and still do just fine.

    They work in tb but 13 to 15 relics for one tb team is pretty steep for the added rewards.

    I generally try to make sure that anything I relic will make a difference in some aspect of the game. I'm going for papa palps because I'm closer and it will cement a good arena ranking for awhile and give me most of an imp trooper team to beat assault battles and ds tb.

    I'll probably do jml after that for some better ls teams since my ls needs work. But I will be choosy at first on which toons I do since at that point I won't likely need to worry about arena.

    After that. I may go after Rey or Kylo but it's doubtful at that point. Getting jml and papa palps puts you in pretty good shape with both tbs and assuming one of them can solo hstr as well (which is likely since most new characters are better) there really isn't enough benefit to go back and get them. Not enough to be worth relicing 30 characters at least.

    I'm a day 1 f2p with 6.4m gp and 59 toons at relics. I may have put a leash on it and kept at 6.0m gp, but lower than that would be roster stagnation just to not get bottlenecked with these. I'm not bottlenecked yet either, but going there for sure. Naturally you can guess r3 jkls don't cut it at this gp.

    pwymzib1jpus.png
    4ule86fcvcln.png

    I'm not arguing that you have to go nuts to hit the bottleneck. But it does make it where you hit it sooner.

    I'm not a day one player. The game was about a year along when I started and I took an 8 mo break recently after the malak fiasco (the reason I don't have any GLs). And my GP is almost 5 mil.

    So I don't doubt that 6 mil for day one ftp is a fairly low gp as things go. Though, the first year I missed likely didn't affect gp that much since max gear at the time was relatively low.

    Anyway, I was just pointing out that some with the issue may have reliced some toons a bit too eagerly for GAC. What seems vital today is only ok a year from now and trash 2 years from now.

    For example, anyone that has reliced Phoenix has no one to blame but themselves. There are other teams as well that are questionable but Phoenix is the example. When relics came out, many were still using Phoenix for gac but they had little use elsewhere. So relicing them was probably solely for gac at the time. Now they are pretty much useless.

    I'd even argue that relicing some meta teams isn't necessary. I only recently unlocked GAS and mine will probably sit at five stars for awhile due to GLs. I don't need him for arena. I will probably star and relic him when I'm done with papa palps but only him. The rest of the 501st probably not. I can relic one character and put him in as a GL counter or I can relic 5 and have him as a GL counter and a decent GAC team under shak to.

    But in six months that team will only be ok. So I'm going to skip it. And I know they are needed for ls tb but I haven't seen anything in Ki Amundi's kit that justifies 5 high relic characters to unlock.

    I wasn't talking about whether any gp is ok for any terms of playing&spending. It's just about individual developing speed. My philosophy is the game shouldn't be pushing you to hoard too much. For the examples you gave, I had them at the time they were necessary for arena and arena is the thing that makes me develop so fast.

    Naturally anything drops down a tier of quality as time passes and even metas falls to obscurity in 2 year intervals. It's logical for a player coming from behind these tides to skip some of those and try to foresee what will hold longer. And just as naturally you can't expect older accounts start skipping what's good at any moment.

    To an extent. You can't have every marque instantly at 7 stars and reliced and be ftp even with a launch account. So you still have to choose to either skip certain teams or whale.

    And you can stay competitive in arena by skipping about every other meta or so. So it isn't necessary to chase every meta.

    For example, you could have skipped GAS and hoarded for Rey with little immediate consequence. Assuming you have Darth revan, you can throw raid han in there at g12 and counter most GAS teams. Yeah your climb is more difficult for awhile but it is manageable.

    And if you have Rey or Kylo, you can skip the other with no consequence in arena. You can probably skip the new ones if you have Rey or Kylo and still do ok.

    Now I'm not saying endgame ftp players should skip every other meta. But with the ever growing requirements for a new meta, it may be needed from time to time.
  • kello_511 wrote: »
    kello_511 wrote: »
    kello_511 wrote: »
    The math here is pretty simple.

    Since relics were introduced, I’ve done nothing differently in regards to my acquiring of low level gear - I still farm the same ways I did before, I still buy those 4x credit items from the shops, I still complete low level events as always.

    However, since I started relicing, by hoard of low level gears has gone down. That means that they are being used faster than they are acquired.

    The obvious conclusion is that at some point, they will run out unless my spending of them decreases or my income of them increases.

    If you are in the same boat, then the crunch is definitely coming for you too.
    If you are applying relics at a slow enough rate that your hoard remains steady, you might not ever feel the crunch.

    For me personally, I can see it imminently. I should be able to complete JML and his requirements (my third GL toon) but after that I’ll pretty much be out.

    Not really. They recently added the challenge tier 3 to all the assualt battles which gives you relic materials. So unless you are beating all of those every time, you haven't maximized your relic income.

    So there may be room to grow that income for some to prevent a shortage before they run out. Even if they are currently burning through a stash.

    Do you really believe that the extra relic materials from t3 challenges will alleviate this crunch?

    It’s a budget question of income vs. expenses. I guess if the few extra materials from those challenges are enough that your hoard stops depleting, then that has solved it for you.

    For myself (and I think most people commenting here), my gearing is happening at a Much faster rate than the acquisition of this low level gear supports. And I don’t feel that my gearing rate is excessive given that I’m not spending money to supplement it. Even spending 500-600 crystals a day on energy refreshes is enough to far exceed the rate that those low level gears come in.

    Relicing already provides enough additional gates as it is, in my opinion the lowest levels of relic materials should not be yet another gate.

    Yes to an extent. You get 120 kudos from challenge tier one a month and 120 carbonite boards if you do tiers 2 and 3. You get 90 kyros a month from dailies.

    So you have enough to g13 two characters a month at that rate (assuming no farming) it takes 200 carb boards to R7 so the you have enough for half a character a month with no use of the gear for crafting.

    But you also need kyros for lower level gear for many new characters and you don't necessarily need to r7 every g13. So you probably only g13 one character a month from free materials and on average they only need r4 or r5. So it's actually pretty close.

    Now obviously, you farm materials so you can get kyros faster with crystals. But you can do the same for carbonite boards so the comparison of how many you get each month from events is probably more meaningful than to add in all the possible farming choices.

    Ok, but what you are really saying then is that even the lowest level of relic materials are meant to be as rare as Kyros?

    Maybe you’re correct about this. If so, I think it’s an even poorer design that I did before.

    To get a toon from G13 to a meaningful relic level takes already introduces enough additional bottlenecks as it is. You need the higher level salvage (eating up more valuable gear) as well as the different relic materials.

    Adding an additional crunch at the lower level Of relics seems wrong (to me).
    It feels like adding a green ability mat crunch for zetas or needing to farm tier1 training droids for the next level cap increase.

    As annoying as it may be to be stuck behind a stun gun wall, a kyro crunch or to be farming gold gear for the high end relic salvage is, those bottlenecks are at least consistent with the level of development for the character.

    Having to go farm level 1 battles for relic salvage material feels like a big step backwards.

    I don't think the unlimited nature of the salvage was meant to last forever. They set the burn rate high enough to eventually burn through the old gear (which is what people wanted). After that they have the cards available for Crystal's and they added events where you can get some without having to use the salvage.

    Eventually, when the salvage is all used up, you can treat it like a gear piece by itself. You either get it through events or you get it with crystals. It just has the bonus of if you happen to have old useless gear you can use it for that.

Sign In or Register to comment.