Low relic HT better than high relic

artusa

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

Damodamo

A maxed ht takes far longer to kill than one not maxed, as to the debuff landing, I’ve had it land against r7, r4, g12 and g11. I’ve also had it fail on the same ships. It’s more a case of the roll for it sticking didn’t come out.

DarjeloSalas

artusa wrote: »

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

You need to read the HT’s kit. It looks like you don’t understand that:

- it has +50% tenacity when it does not have taunt.
This means that faster HT that move before you will have used their special to gain taunt. So if r7 has found the sweet spot of being faster than your ship, it will look to you as though they get debuffed more regularly.

UdalCuain

Bear in mind the more highly geared the opposing Bossk is, the faster Hound's Tooth will be. The quicker it starts taunting, the quicker it's bonus tenacity goes. Otherwise, all RNG.

artusa

DarjeloSalas wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

You need to read the HT’s kit. It looks like you don’t understand that:

- it has +50% tenacity when it does not have taunt.
This means that faster HT that move before you will have used their special to gain taunt. So if r7 has found the sweet spot of being faster than your ship, it will look to you as though they get debuffed more regularly.

UdalCuain wrote: »

Bear in mind the more highly geared the opposing Bossk is, the faster Hound's Tooth will be. The quicker it starts taunting, the quicker it's bonus tenacity goes. Otherwise, all RNG.

ok, let me clarify this, I don't use HT. I use full Separatist or full Galactic Republic. I am talking about when my VD throw their little bombs or when GTA uses his AOE, both apply buff immunity, at any given point during the match, whether HT has more or less tenacity, I find that r1 and r4 HT have a better chance of BI not landing and stack more protection because of non critical hits than r2 r3 r5 r6 and r7 do. This is my experience and everyone in shard agrees with me too. We talk who's hardest to beat in arena and we've come to the conclusion that r1 and r4 HT have something different about them.

crzydroid

artusa wrote: »

DarjeloSalas wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

You need to read the HT’s kit. It looks like you don’t understand that:

- it has +50% tenacity when it does not have taunt.
This means that faster HT that move before you will have used their special to gain taunt. So if r7 has found the sweet spot of being faster than your ship, it will look to you as though they get debuffed more regularly.

UdalCuain wrote: »

Bear in mind the more highly geared the opposing Bossk is, the faster Hound's Tooth will be. The quicker it starts taunting, the quicker it's bonus tenacity goes. Otherwise, all RNG.

ok, let me clarify this, I don't use HT. I use full Separatist or full Galactic Republic. I am talking about when my VD throw their little bombs or when GTA uses his AOE, both apply buff immunity, at any given point during the match, whether HT has more or less tenacity, I find that r1 and r4 HT have a better chance of BI not landing and stack more protection because of non critical hits than r2 r3 r5 r6 and r7 do. This is my experience and everyone in shard agrees with me too. We talk who's hardest to beat in arena and we've come to the conclusion that r1 and r4 HT have something different about them.

That's heresay at this point. You need to record the matches and look at the actual proportions of things sticking or being resisted over a long term. Then you need to look at the actual stats of the ships...mod dots can affect them too. Then take into effect all abilities which affect potency and tenacity. Then you can start to determine whether things seem to be sticking according to reported tenacity.

DarjeloSalas

So, you want to know what’s really going on, even though you’re already convinced you know what’s going on?

artusa

crzydroid wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

DarjeloSalas wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

You need to read the HT’s kit. It looks like you don’t understand that:

- it has +50% tenacity when it does not have taunt.
This means that faster HT that move before you will have used their special to gain taunt. So if r7 has found the sweet spot of being faster than your ship, it will look to you as though they get debuffed more regularly.

UdalCuain wrote: »

Bear in mind the more highly geared the opposing Bossk is, the faster Hound's Tooth will be. The quicker it starts taunting, the quicker it's bonus tenacity goes. Otherwise, all RNG.

ok, let me clarify this, I don't use HT. I use full Separatist or full Galactic Republic. I am talking about when my VD throw their little bombs or when GTA uses his AOE, both apply buff immunity, at any given point during the match, whether HT has more or less tenacity, I find that r1 and r4 HT have a better chance of BI not landing and stack more protection because of non critical hits than r2 r3 r5 r6 and r7 do. This is my experience and everyone in shard agrees with me too. We talk who's hardest to beat in arena and we've come to the conclusion that r1 and r4 HT have something different about them.

That's heresay at this point. You need to record the matches and look at the actual proportions of things sticking or being resisted over a long term. Then you need to look at the actual stats of the ships...mod dots can affect them too. Then take into effect all abilities which affect potency and tenacity. Then you can start to determine whether things seem to be sticking according to reported tenacity.

Sure, I can compile data, but it may take a few days. Today I did 5 arena fights and had the exact same experience as ever.

crzydroid

artusa wrote: »

crzydroid wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

DarjeloSalas wrote: »

artusa wrote: »

I noticed that a relic 1 or relic 4 HT has better tenacity and survivability than a relic 7. I seen relic 7 go down fast and get debuffed easily, whilst r1 and r4 almost never get debuffed at all, especially the buff block debuff but the r7 gets them all the time. Is this a diminishing returns ? I am not asking if this is an example of diminishing returns. I want to really know what's going on.

You need to read the HT’s kit. It looks like you don’t understand that:

- it has +50% tenacity when it does not have taunt.
This means that faster HT that move before you will have used their special to gain taunt. So if r7 has found the sweet spot of being faster than your ship, it will look to you as though they get debuffed more regularly.

UdalCuain wrote: »

Bear in mind the more highly geared the opposing Bossk is, the faster Hound's Tooth will be. The quicker it starts taunting, the quicker it's bonus tenacity goes. Otherwise, all RNG.

ok, let me clarify this, I don't use HT. I use full Separatist or full Galactic Republic. I am talking about when my VD throw their little bombs or when GTA uses his AOE, both apply buff immunity, at any given point during the match, whether HT has more or less tenacity, I find that r1 and r4 HT have a better chance of BI not landing and stack more protection because of non critical hits than r2 r3 r5 r6 and r7 do. This is my experience and everyone in shard agrees with me too. We talk who's hardest to beat in arena and we've come to the conclusion that r1 and r4 HT have something different about them.

That's heresay at this point. You need to record the matches and look at the actual proportions of things sticking or being resisted over a long term. Then you need to look at the actual stats of the ships...mod dots can affect them too. Then take into effect all abilities which affect potency and tenacity. Then you can start to determine whether things seem to be sticking according to reported tenacity.

Sure, I can compile data, but it may take a few days. Today I did 5 arena fights and had the exact same experience as ever.

You are also playing the same arena opponents, probably, so the same mods on the Bossks. Everything has a percent chance to stick or resist, so some better HTs will fall prey to debuffs while others resist. And as someone said above, it depends if he's taunting or not taunting. So without the numbers and/or videos, it's impossible to say.

Schwartzring

I'd like to know if he IS or IS NOT taunting every time you attack.

As stated above, the HT-R1 is slower than HT-R7 & if he hasn't gone yet & doesn't have taunt up then he's going to have +50% Tenacity.

The whole +50% Tenacity when NOT Taunting yet is a huge thing w/ Bossk.

I don't ever try to debuff him if I can target someone else because he isn't taunting.

That's just asking for your buffs to get resisted.

Better to not AE him till after he's Taunted.

Waqui

@artusa Did you check and compare ship stats? What tenacities did you observe at which crew powers, and ship stars/levels?

artusa

Thanks everyone for the information. I will pass it on the chat and see what everyone comes up with.

Mephisto_style

I would say low

scuba

HT base tenacity has a crew contribution, which means the more developed the crew the higher the stat.
So HT base tenacity goes up with increase in bossk relic level.
That said tenacity is very easy to overcome and get to 50% chance