Basically, CG needs to do something about JML's Ult, because no one is going to bother placing it now that its a known quantity: That it's complete trash and not worth the energy.
CG does not read much ftom this forum. Only Kyno does.
But i fully agree. Do NOT invest, its a trap; usd it elsewhere or do it slowly ... but there is no need to gain the ultimate materials fast. What a drawback to Rey and SLKR....
Basically, CG needs to do something about JML's Ult, because no one is going to bother placing it now that its a known quantity: That it's complete trash and not worth the energy.
CG does not read much ftom this forum. Only Kyno does.
But i fully agree. Do NOT invest, its a trap; usd it elsewhere or do it slowly ... but there is no need to gain the ultimate materials fast. What a drawback to Rey and SLKR....
Well not the part about not investing and using it elsewhere. It literally adds nothing to any part of the game. And whatever 5% dmg it adds in raids is nullified by SLKR soloing it already.
They need to do something about his ult. It is useless and adding 7500 GP is useless unless you like fighting harder opponents in GAC.
JML is very good, but it's clear from people running JKR lead with Wat primarily that they don't even care about the ult.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all. The 2 best Arena defensive teams with him don't even use his lead. So really there's no point to getting it right now.
The real flaw is JML has the only ultimate that requires you to play stupid to get.
Open with Efflux or use teachings?
JKR mark or teachings?
HODA master’s training or teachings?
You need to put yourself at a disadvantage by playing terrible to get the ultimate. None of the other GLs require making mistakes to get their ultimate.
Add in the fact that his ultimate is the weakest doesn’t help.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
What comp vs what comp? Was he crushing you already when he got it?
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
What comp vs what comp? Was he crushing you already when he got it?
JML lead JKR GAS JKL Hoda
JKR lead Rey GAS JKL Hoda
I was going to lose anyway since his JKR marked mine. However I won the next battle because his marked someone else.
Just saw this at 1 after beating GL Luke lol.
This is the issue. Lots of simple to farm characters can stomp theses GL. The first 2 didn’t have anywhere close to this many counters.
New players are climbing to the top in arena and yes I know they fall right after but who cares, job done. And they save their hoard for more important characters like JKL or gas.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
Just saw this at 1 after beating GL Luke lol.
This is the issue. Lots of simple to farm characters can stomp theses GL. The first 2 didn’t have anywhere close to this many counters.
New players are climbing to the top in arena and yes I know they fall right after but who cares, job done. And they save their hoard for more important characters like JKL or gas.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
I thought it was 8% each time you gain teachings; so as the special gives you and target jedi teachings, it's 16% each time, so 7 ally turns only, if you don't have luke's zeta that prevent you to get Jedi teachings. Did i miss something ?
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
I thought it was 8% each time you gain teachings; so as the special gives you and target jedi teachings, it's 16% each time, so 7 ally turns only, if you don't have luke's zeta that prevent you to get Jedi teachings. Did i miss something ?
From my math, you can get away with it even with the Zeta because that last turn only needs less than 8%. So one of those 7 turns could be JML with legacy using the lead buff or They Grow Beyond.
The major flaw right now with the Ult is that it doesn't change anything. If you use him with strong Jedi on offense you're going to win against almost any comp. He never uses the ult on defense, so it doesn't help there at all.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
I thought it was 8% each time you gain teachings; so as the special gives you and target jedi teachings, it's 16% each time, so 7 ally turns only, if you don't have luke's zeta that prevent you to get Jedi teachings. Did i miss something ?
Just saw this at 1 after beating GL Luke lol.
This is the issue. Lots of simple to farm characters can stomp theses GL. The first 2 didn’t have anywhere close to this many counters.
New players are climbing to the top in arena and yes I know they fall right after but who cares, job done. And they save their hoard for more important characters like JKL or gas.
Which JML comp?
It beats all of them except JKR lead, you seen the Op Metaverse vid yet?
Offensively the best rule of thumb I’ve found with JML is to just ignore the ultimate. It would be nice if all Jedi started the battle with 1 stack of masters teachings, that way you don’t have to sacrifice as solid opener to build ult...
Offensively the best rule of thumb I’ve found with JML is to just ignore the ultimate. It would be nice if all Jedi started the battle with 1 stack of masters teachings, that way you don’t have to sacrifice as solid opener to build ult...
Offensively the best rule of thumb I’ve found with JML is to just ignore the ultimate. It would be nice if all Jedi started the battle with 1 stack of masters teachings, that way you don’t have to sacrifice as solid opener to build ult...
I don't get it. Could you please explain ?
The way his ult works is you have to spread masters teachings around first, in my experience doing this first can actually hinder you as you’re missing out on some much needed crowd control with GAS and JKL.
If they could start building Ult right at the beginning of battle, or if not, say if they could build a higher percentage of ultimate per turn, I think his kit would be better.
What I initially said in the first post- his ultimate is going to be worthless in most game modes. For arena: you’ll shoot yourself in the foot trying to get it . You simply cannot ignore your allies primary specials to use JML’s lead ability which is required to build his ultimate. I’m not sure why this isn’t obvious to some in the thread; whether they haven’t fought a JML yet, or used one; it’s painfully obvious the ultimate was very poorly designed. I’m sorry if you think it wasnt- there is simply no reason to skip JKR marked, Gas armor shred with an aoe daze (? Yea you can’t skip that and hope to win, oh and crit and you reduce th teams cooldowns lol) or JKL stunning the whole team? ( skip that and you’re dead too.) or even better hmy masters training (again you can’t skip these and prioritize building JML ultimate). Which if you chose to SKIP all these abilities and just build uktimate YOU WOULD STILL not get your ultimate before Rey.. Slkr.. or See. So you’re already dead. Awesome lol.
I agree he beats Slkr handily if you skip going for his ultimate (which really? You don’t build his ultimate and just use regular abilities to win) if you go for his ultimate you lose...
Rey? Doable - just can’t go for ultimate . Again a loss 100% of the time.
Please if you disagree give me scenarios, videos, walkthroughs where you see this different but I’ve fought every GL and tried every scenario to try and push his ultimate but it’s a loss Everytime.
What I initially said in the first post- his ultimate is going to be worthless in lost game modes. For arena: you’ll shoot yourself in the foot trying to get it . You simply cannot ignore your allies primary specials to use JML’s lead ability which is required to build his ultimate. I’m not sure why this isn’t obvious to some in the thread; whether they haven’t fought a JML yet, or used one; it’s painfully obvious the ultimate was very poorly designed. I’m sorry if you think it wasnt- there is simply no reason to skip JKR marked, Gas armor shred with an aoe daze (? Yea you can’t skip that and hope to win, oh and crit and you reduce th teams cooldowns lol) or JKL stunning the whole team? ( skip that and you’re dead too.) or even better hmy masters training (again you can’t skip these and prioritize building JML ultimate). Which if you chose to SKIP all these abilities and just build uktimate YOU WOULD STILL not get your ultimate before Rey.. Slkr.. or See. So you’re already dead. Awesome lol.
I agree he beats Slkr handily if you skip going for his ultimate (which really? You don’t build his ultimate and just use regular abilities to win) if you go for his ultimate you lose...
Rey? Doable - just can’t go for ultimate . Again a loss 100% of the time.
Please if you disagree give me scenarios, videos, walkthroughs where you see this different but I’ve fought every GL and tried every scenario to try and push his ultimate but it’s a loss Everytime.
I just unlocked ultimate today so time wise it is partially me figure out what to do.
But beat rey going for ultimate first
Didn't use jkr marked, or gas special or jkl specials until ultimate was activated
Not saying I wouldn't like to see it reworked a bit
What I initially said in the first post- his ultimate is going to be worthless in lost game modes. For arena: you’ll shoot yourself in the foot trying to get it . You simply cannot ignore your allies primary specials to use JML’s lead ability which is required to build his ultimate. I’m not sure why this isn’t obvious to some in the thread; whether they haven’t fought a JML yet, or used one; it’s painfully obvious the ultimate was very poorly designed. I’m sorry if you think it wasnt- there is simply no reason to skip JKR marked, Gas armor shred with an aoe daze (? Yea you can’t skip that and hope to win, oh and crit and you reduce th teams cooldowns lol) or JKL stunning the whole team? ( skip that and you’re dead too.) or even better hmy masters training (again you can’t skip these and prioritize building JML ultimate). Which if you chose to SKIP all these abilities and just build uktimate YOU WOULD STILL not get your ultimate before Rey.. Slkr.. or See. So you’re already dead. Awesome lol.
I agree he beats Slkr handily if you skip going for his ultimate (which really? You don’t build his ultimate and just use regular abilities to win) if you go for his ultimate you lose...
Rey? Doable - just can’t go for ultimate . Again a loss 100% of the time.
Please if you disagree give me scenarios, videos, walkthroughs where you see this different but I’ve fought every GL and tried every scenario to try and push his ultimate but it’s a loss Everytime.
I just unlocked ultimate today so time wise it is partially me figure out what to do.
But beat rey going for ultimate first
Didn't use jkr marked, or gas special or jkl specials until ultimate was activated
Not saying I wouldn't like to see it reworked a bit
Interesting. I'm on board on the "getting ultimate is faster than you think" boat, but I agree that so far, I struggle to se how it would be useful, as I can beat every team I faced without having ultimate.
However, I didn't face a SEE team yet, nor a ultimate Luke. Maybe it has some use there. Or, and it's what I would be very interested to see tbh, I still wonder if a team build for ultimate can beat Rey/Kylo/JML teams if I use non-meta jedis on my side (or at least not all of them), freeing them for other teams in GAC.
What I initially said in the first post- his ultimate is going to be worthless in lost game modes. For arena: you’ll shoot yourself in the foot trying to get it . You simply cannot ignore your allies primary specials to use JML’s lead ability which is required to build his ultimate. I’m not sure why this isn’t obvious to some in the thread; whether they haven’t fought a JML yet, or used one; it’s painfully obvious the ultimate was very poorly designed. I’m sorry if you think it wasnt- there is simply no reason to skip JKR marked, Gas armor shred with an aoe daze (? Yea you can’t skip that and hope to win, oh and crit and you reduce th teams cooldowns lol) or JKL stunning the whole team? ( skip that and you’re dead too.) or even better hmy masters training (again you can’t skip these and prioritize building JML ultimate). Which if you chose to SKIP all these abilities and just build uktimate YOU WOULD STILL not get your ultimate before Rey.. Slkr.. or See. So you’re already dead. Awesome lol.
I agree he beats Slkr handily if you skip going for his ultimate (which really? You don’t build his ultimate and just use regular abilities to win) if you go for his ultimate you lose...
Rey? Doable - just can’t go for ultimate . Again a loss 100% of the time.
Please if you disagree give me scenarios, videos, walkthroughs where you see this different but I’ve fought every GL and tried every scenario to try and push his ultimate but it’s a loss Everytime.
I just unlocked ultimate today so time wise it is partially me figure out what to do.
But beat rey going for ultimate first
Didn't use jkr marked, or gas special or jkl specials until ultimate was activated
Not saying I wouldn't like to see it reworked a bit
Interesting. I'm on board on the "getting ultimate is faster than you think" boat, but I agree that so far, I struggle to se how it would be useful, as I can beat every team I faced without having ultimate.
However, I didn't face a SEE team yet, nor a ultimate Luke. Maybe it has some use there. Or, and it's what I would be very interested to see tbh, I still wonder if a team build for ultimate can beat Rey/Kylo/JML teams if I use non-meta jedis on my side (or at least not all of them), freeing them for other teams in GAC.
I am definitely not saying the team is better with the ultimate or that right now you need it for arena. The jkr led team with Luke is really good.
I was simply showing that contrary to what was said, you can skip all those "important" specials and chase the ultimate and win vs Rey.
Did one of the "experts" here alrdy test him on offense with the "leftover" jedi against standard Rey (+Res) and SLKR (+FO) teams?
JML, GMY, KAM, Shaak, Jolee/Ezra (GMY and KAM are 2 chars that are able to quickly cycle through their abilities with bonus turns and could "spam" inherited teachings)
Because guess what, one could use him on offense with secondary jedi as another GL killer for efficiency.
Did one of the "experts" here alrdy test him on offense with the "leftover" jedi against standard Rey (+Res) and SLKR (+FO) teams?
JML, GMY, KAM, Shaak, Jolee/Ezra (GMY and KAM are 2 chars that are able to quickly cycle through their abilities with bonus turns and could "spam" inherited teachings)
Because guess what, one could use him on offense with secondary jedi as another GL killer for efficiency.
I have tried without a gas or JKL or JKR. It doesn’t work that well. You need heavy hitters - gmy can’t replace two attackers like them. In TW perhaps. Day4 LSTB? No way. He can’t carry a team by himself. In arena? Against a full Jedi Rey? Or See? Nope. He’ll be dead before you can do enough dmg with the two Luke’s to attack
I personally hate how restrictive JML's ultimate is to charge. It's a great ultimate, don't get me wrong. But the other 3 GLs have ways to charge their ultimate's when not in the leader slot (JML has an insane 52 turns until he can use his ultimate when he's not the leader, which can basically be ignored) so it FORCES you to use JML in the leader slot while the other 3 can be used in any composition and charge their ultimate reliably. It's not a huge deal since JML has amazing utility and I can understand that hey, you have to use JML in the lead to use his ultimate.
But what I can't understand is how much JML's ultimate relies on on a preventable buff that comes mainly from a leader only special ability that the AI doesn't even know how to prioritize properly (i.e. will use all other special abilities first before opting for the new special) So not only is it rare for the ability to be used, but the AI can totally screw it up and call an ally with buff immunity or shock to assist that can't gain the stupid buff.
Then the icing on the cake is that JML has the lowest mastery stats of all 4 GLs and the devs say it's that way to balance him since he gets 100% mastery from the start, but the other 3 GLs have ways of stacking their mastery to much higher than 100% and somehow that's not OP? If you are going to justify it that JML has that 100% mastery from the start and that's why he has lower base mastery than other GLs, then you should cap what the other GLs can reach in terms of mastery (i.e. Siphon x mastery, max of 100% total mastery can be gained this way, etc.) I know this isn't favorable, but come on guys, JML was seriously stabbed in the back in terms of kit compared to the other 3 GLs. If they are supposed to all be equally balanced, shouldn't they you know, be equally balanced?
Replies
Well not the part about not investing and using it elsewhere. It literally adds nothing to any part of the game. And whatever 5% dmg it adds in raids is nullified by SLKR soloing it already.
They need to do something about his ult. It is useless and adding 7500 GP is useless unless you like fighting harder opponents in GAC.
JML is very good, but it's clear from people running JKR lead with Wat primarily that they don't even care about the ult.
I will not recommend anyone spend to get his ultimate. Or people should not spend to get his ultimate.
Like Mr. Crabs, talk about money gets results.
Open with Efflux or use teachings?
JKR mark or teachings?
HODA master’s training or teachings?
You need to put yourself at a disadvantage by playing terrible to get the ultimate. None of the other GLs require making mistakes to get their ultimate.
Add in the fact that his ultimate is the weakest doesn’t help.
I faced one in arena today that got to ult in 60 seconds.
What comp vs what comp? Was he crushing you already when he got it?
JML lead JKR GAS JKL Hoda
JKR lead Rey GAS JKL Hoda
I was going to lose anyway since his JKR marked mine. However I won the next battle because his marked someone else.
Just saw this at 1 after beating GL Luke lol.
This is the issue. Lots of simple to farm characters can stomp theses GL. The first 2 didn’t have anywhere close to this many counters.
New players are climbing to the top in arena and yes I know they fall right after but who cares, job done. And they save their hoard for more important characters like JKL or gas.
The number of seconds don't really matter. It could be 60 or it could be 3 minutes.
It's 13 jedi ally turns (with him as lead) of using ONLY the inherited skill or his first special. That's 2.5 times through your entire team without using ANY other skills in order to use the ultimate.
Or of course, you could sprinkle useful skills in between and spread that time out even more....
Which JML comp?
It's the AI. Of course it matters.
I thought it was 8% each time you gain teachings; so as the special gives you and target jedi teachings, it's 16% each time, so 7 ally turns only, if you don't have luke's zeta that prevent you to get Jedi teachings. Did i miss something ?
From my math, you can get away with it even with the Zeta because that last turn only needs less than 8%. So one of those 7 turns could be JML with legacy using the lead buff or They Grow Beyond.
Buff Immunity is still a problem, though.
Hear hear
It beats all of them except JKR lead, you seen the Op Metaverse vid yet?
I don't get it. Could you please explain ?
The way his ult works is you have to spread masters teachings around first, in my experience doing this first can actually hinder you as you’re missing out on some much needed crowd control with GAS and JKL.
If they could start building Ult right at the beginning of battle, or if not, say if they could build a higher percentage of ultimate per turn, I think his kit would be better.
I agree he beats Slkr handily if you skip going for his ultimate (which really? You don’t build his ultimate and just use regular abilities to win) if you go for his ultimate you lose...
Rey? Doable - just can’t go for ultimate . Again a loss 100% of the time.
Please if you disagree give me scenarios, videos, walkthroughs where you see this different but I’ve fought every GL and tried every scenario to try and push his ultimate but it’s a loss Everytime.
I just unlocked ultimate today so time wise it is partially me figure out what to do.
But beat rey going for ultimate first
Didn't use jkr marked, or gas special or jkl specials until ultimate was activated
Not saying I wouldn't like to see it reworked a bit
Interesting. I'm on board on the "getting ultimate is faster than you think" boat, but I agree that so far, I struggle to se how it would be useful, as I can beat every team I faced without having ultimate.
However, I didn't face a SEE team yet, nor a ultimate Luke. Maybe it has some use there. Or, and it's what I would be very interested to see tbh, I still wonder if a team build for ultimate can beat Rey/Kylo/JML teams if I use non-meta jedis on my side (or at least not all of them), freeing them for other teams in GAC.
I am definitely not saying the team is better with the ultimate or that right now you need it for arena. The jkr led team with Luke is really good.
I was simply showing that contrary to what was said, you can skip all those "important" specials and chase the ultimate and win vs Rey.
JML, GMY, KAM, Shaak, Jolee/Ezra (GMY and KAM are 2 chars that are able to quickly cycle through their abilities with bonus turns and could "spam" inherited teachings)
Because guess what, one could use him on offense with secondary jedi as another GL killer for efficiency.
I have tried without a gas or JKL or JKR. It doesn’t work that well. You need heavy hitters - gmy can’t replace two attackers like them. In TW perhaps. Day4 LSTB? No way. He can’t carry a team by himself. In arena? Against a full Jedi Rey? Or See? Nope. He’ll be dead before you can do enough dmg with the two Luke’s to attack
But what I can't understand is how much JML's ultimate relies on on a preventable buff that comes mainly from a leader only special ability that the AI doesn't even know how to prioritize properly (i.e. will use all other special abilities first before opting for the new special) So not only is it rare for the ability to be used, but the AI can totally screw it up and call an ally with buff immunity or shock to assist that can't gain the stupid buff.
Then the icing on the cake is that JML has the lowest mastery stats of all 4 GLs and the devs say it's that way to balance him since he gets 100% mastery from the start, but the other 3 GLs have ways of stacking their mastery to much higher than 100% and somehow that's not OP? If you are going to justify it that JML has that 100% mastery from the start and that's why he has lower base mastery than other GLs, then you should cap what the other GLs can reach in terms of mastery (i.e. Siphon x mastery, max of 100% total mastery can be gained this way, etc.) I know this isn't favorable, but come on guys, JML was seriously stabbed in the back in terms of kit compared to the other 3 GLs. If they are supposed to all be equally balanced, shouldn't they you know, be equally balanced?