Maybe people need to find the right team with him. Not just classic trium or dr.
Like jml, lots of comp were easy defeated. But once you get the right one with proper modding. Not the same deal
Problem is Sith doesnt have as many viable characters as Jedi. I mean sure, youre free to try with Savage or Maul or Sidious, but then again you might as well use Ugnaught or Lobot.
@Mirkraag are u joking no?what best comp for gml. U just put best jedi legendary jkl gas jkr and the last choice wat or hermit. Yes in the first days there were guys that used bastilla or jk lead , but the most used ia gml lead jkl gas jkr hermit/wat. So there was not a big struggle to make a team for gml, just the best jedi legendarys. See in any team composition is weaker than carth onasi teams
Whats this now, like the 5th or 6th ultimate palp counter? ive honestly lost track there are so many popping up.
@VelvetDiamond_R6 any updates on bugs beating SEE, still yet to see that video?
While putting together the video's, many stated counters were only limited to 1 or 2 videos , and all were non ultimate, and possibly missing other upgrades.
Can you post any other videos of these counters working ??
Whats this now, like the 5th or 6th ultimate palp counter? ive honestly lost track there are so many popping up.
@VelvetDiamond_R6 any updates on bugs beating SEE, still yet to see that video?
While putting together the video's, many stated counters were only limited to 1 or 2 videos , and all were non ultimate, and possibly missing other upgrades.
Can you post any other videos of these counters working ??
Im not sure what one he saw but i have also seen this so it is out there some where if you care to search for it.
There were 2 videos going around of relic 7 geos beating a fully relic 7 upgraded SEE team from 2 different people.
Might be in someones stream, i remember it being over an hour long one of them.
i suggest if you are collecting videos that you look around youtube an just give it a good old search around. there are many different ones.
Also some one else on the forums was also complaining about geos beating his palp team, also saw that some where yesturday while looking around through all the posts about gls.
Rey kills ultimate SEE.
JML kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo can 1v5 ultimate SEE.
JTR leads kill ultimate SEE.
Imperial Troopers kill ultimate SEE.
Palpatine lead kills ultimate SEE.
Vader lead kills ultimate SEE.
Treya lead kills ultimate SEE.
Some DR lead teams can kill ultimate SEE.
Yeh, multiple videos with SLKR soloing Papl forced some people switch to farming somebody else, some players from my guild with SLKR just wait for the moment when Palp will be buffed appropriately. In case this doesn't happen, Palp will become the most unpopular GL among existing, I believe.
Whats this now, like the 5th or 6th ultimate palp counter? ive honestly lost track there are so many popping up.
@VelvetDiamond_R6 any updates on bugs beating SEE, still yet to see that video?
While putting together the video's, many stated counters were only limited to 1 or 2 videos , and all were non ultimate, and possibly missing other upgrades.
Can you post any other videos of these counters working ??
Im not sure what one he saw but i have also seen this so it is out there some where if you care to search for it.
There were 2 videos going around of relic 7 geos beating a fully relic 7 upgraded SEE team from 2 different people.
Might be in someones stream, i remember it being over an hour long one of them.
i suggest if you are collecting videos that you look around youtube an just give it a good old search around. there are many different ones.
Also some one else on the forums was also complaining about geos beating his palp team, also saw that some where yesturday while looking around through all the posts about gls.
If you are going to make these claims and want to make sure they make changes, providing the evidence to back up the listing of counters you find unacceptable goes a long way to help the cause.
I did look, and I am trying to help, but more people trying to help the better, at this point I am only seeing the few that are being talked about that as I said are not showing maxed and ultimate SEE.
Rey kills ultimate SEE.
JML kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo can 1v5 ultimate SEE.
JTR leads kill ultimate SEE.
Imperial Troopers kill ultimate SEE.
Palpatine lead kills ultimate SEE.
Vader lead kills ultimate SEE.
Treya lead kills ultimate SEE.
Some DR lead teams can kill ultimate SEE.
So, Kyno keeps asking why no one uses SEE with 4 tanks. I did that today with my Ultimate SEE and he still sucks. 10 battles, 5 vs Rey and 5 vs SLKR.
...
For the record: Rey could be taken down with 2 to 4 tanks depending on what else I used. SLKR I could bring down to yellow/red health bar but ultimately he beat my SEE.
Videos would be nice, but what was the win/loss ratio on these? Did you beat Rey all 5 times but lose to SLKR all 5 times?
Against SLKR in all 5 battles I got him down to 1vs 1 and lost. Against Rey the squad with 3-4 tanks performs worse than, for example, SEE, BSF, WAT, Malak, SiT. But against Rey I did not win all 5 battles (did 3 more in the meantime, won 2).
And about the videos: 10-15 full videos, upload them to Google Drive or Youtube, maybe edit them before I post 10-15 links here in the forum ... for what? Is anything getting better for me by doing this? A task that takes me an hour?
Huh. Can SEE get to his ult each time vs Rey? Or do the tanks just fall too quickly?
And for the videos, it can help us diagnose if the problem is in team composition, or gearing, or mods, or just SEE being inferior. That’s hard to determine from a single GAC record or from “SEE bad”.
It is not a problem to charge the ultimate against Rey. And going with the strategy guide of 3-4 tanks ... how could there be a problem in team composition? I won’t post any videos. Currently SEE performance against standard arena GL meta teams is not in line with the investment.
Because there’s no consensus on what the best SEE lineup is, or the best tanks to use with him, or the best strategies, or anything. There’s also a great deal of variation in Rey teams. If you post a video, or even just a summary of key characters and events, I can make suggestions that will maybe up your win rate. Otherwise, I can’t tell whether this is SEE being bad or unintended, or user error, or something else.
You don’t want to devote your time to documenting your battles in video or in text, fine. But I’ve yet to see a video of many of the “counters” or bad battles that people have brought up that don’t have some way to swing the favor towards SEE again.
And you think that in the absence of consensus your advice is the next best thing to go with? For many of the problems people have with SEE there is a solution that has its upsides and downsides. There are ways to handle the debuff issues, increase survivability, speed up charging the Ultimate. I tested a lot of squad compositions and I know how to win against JML and Rey. Even with low relic characters.
Neither of us can change the flaws in kit of SEE and the mediocre damage output. And this is what this thread is about. My main points of criticism:
- SEE is the only GL that wastes a full turn only to transform
- Damage is too low
- anti-Rebel and anti-Jedi limitations make no sense
- synergy with Sith is weak
See could have an ability that is called the “rule of 2”.
The ability can be that you choose a chat the beginning that is your “apprentice” they can’t be killed until Palp is dead. That character can take damage until a sliver of red health is left but then can’t die until after SEE is dead. Since the others die off so quickly it wouldn’t take long to be a 2v5.
See could have an ability that is called the “rule of 2”.
The ability can be that you choose a chat the beginning that is your “apprentice” they can’t be killed until Palp is dead. That character can take damage until a sliver of red health is left but then can’t die until after SEE is dead. Since the others die off so quickly it wouldn’t take long to be a 2v5.
That would make you practically unbeatable though, since SEE cant be targeted by deceived enemies while there is another sith. Still, like the concept.
See could have an ability that is called the “rule of 2”.
The ability can be that you choose a chat the beginning that is your “apprentice” they can’t be killed until Palp is dead. That character can take damage until a sliver of red health is left but then can’t die until after SEE is dead. Since the others die off so quickly it wouldn’t take long to be a 2v5.
Yes, a lot of Sith fans discussed this a while back too. The "rule of 2" would allow for Empire synergy as well as Sith synergy limited to one Sith--stat sharing, maybe even bringing in a leadership or something. But total reworks feel unlikely, as much as that would fit a GL Palpatine.
So, Kyno keeps asking why no one uses SEE with 4 tanks. I did that today with my Ultimate SEE and he still sucks. 10 battles, 5 vs Rey and 5 vs SLKR.
...
For the record: Rey could be taken down with 2 to 4 tanks depending on what else I used. SLKR I could bring down to yellow/red health bar but ultimately he beat my SEE.
Videos would be nice, but what was the win/loss ratio on these? Did you beat Rey all 5 times but lose to SLKR all 5 times?
Against SLKR in all 5 battles I got him down to 1vs 1 and lost. Against Rey the squad with 3-4 tanks performs worse than, for example, SEE, BSF, WAT, Malak, SiT. But against Rey I did not win all 5 battles (did 3 more in the meantime, won 2).
And about the videos: 10-15 full videos, upload them to Google Drive or Youtube, maybe edit them before I post 10-15 links here in the forum ... for what? Is anything getting better for me by doing this? A task that takes me an hour?
Huh. Can SEE get to his ult each time vs Rey? Or do the tanks just fall too quickly?
And for the videos, it can help us diagnose if the problem is in team composition, or gearing, or mods, or just SEE being inferior. That’s hard to determine from a single GAC record or from “SEE bad”.
It is not a problem to charge the ultimate against Rey. And going with the strategy guide of 3-4 tanks ... how could there be a problem in team composition? I won’t post any videos. Currently SEE performance against standard arena GL meta teams is not in line with the investment.
Because there’s no consensus on what the best SEE lineup is, or the best tanks to use with him, or the best strategies, or anything. There’s also a great deal of variation in Rey teams. If you post a video, or even just a summary of key characters and events, I can make suggestions that will maybe up your win rate. Otherwise, I can’t tell whether this is SEE being bad or unintended, or user error, or something else.
You don’t want to devote your time to documenting your battles in video or in text, fine. But I’ve yet to see a video of many of the “counters” or bad battles that people have brought up that don’t have some way to swing the favor towards SEE again.
Neither of us can change the flaws in kit of SEE and the mediocre damage output. And this is what this thread is about. My main points of criticism:
- SEE is the only GL that wastes a full turn only to transform
- Damage is too low
- anti-Rebel and anti-Jedi limitations make no sense
- synergy with Sith is weak
Bingo.
SEE's concept, as-is, was (according to CG) designed to have him hide behind a bunch of tanks while the enemies fuel his ultimate, then he goes into ultimate form and melts faces.
But:
he doesn't support his squad enough or mitigate meta threats like SLKR enough to survive that long
there are some major issues with link (solo enemy, or forced to link then kill a tank) that could prevent him from reaching his ultimate
and he doesn't do enough base damage with his attacks when he hits his ultimate (mastery scaling and multipliers)
@Mirkraag are u joking no?what best comp for gml. U just put best jedi legendary jkl gas jkr and the last choice wat or hermit. Yes in the first days there were guys that used bastilla or jk lead , but the most used ia gml lead jkl gas jkr hermit/wat. So there was not a big struggle to make a team for gml, just the best jedi legendarys. See in any team composition is weaker than carth onasi teams
And this is where you show your ignorance toward jml. The teams you proposed are simply not the best ones and are defeated by Rey or SLKR (not mentioning Vader and JTR counter).
So not that simple. For SEE, I dont know, I was just sayin .There are many good dark side toons (not especially sith) that could match and make the team stronger. Think about Wat, Thrawn, Alpha etc...
Maybe he needs a buff, I am just sayin their might be a good hard comp somewhere outside of the recommended ones (like Rey and resistance LOL)
See could have an ability that is called the “rule of 2”.
The ability can be that you choose a chat the beginning that is your “apprentice” they can’t be killed until Palp is dead. That character can take damage until a sliver of red health is left but then can’t die until after SEE is dead. Since the others die off so quickly it wouldn’t take long to be a 2v5.
That would make you practically unbeatable though, since SEE cant be targeted by deceived enemies while there is another sith. Still, like the concept.
Could be that once it’s 2v1 then you are able to link your own team character so once you use ultimate they both die
So, Kyno keeps asking why no one uses SEE with 4 tanks. I did that today with my Ultimate SEE and he still sucks. 10 battles, 5 vs Rey and 5 vs SLKR.
...
For the record: Rey could be taken down with 2 to 4 tanks depending on what else I used. SLKR I could bring down to yellow/red health bar but ultimately he beat my SEE.
Videos would be nice, but what was the win/loss ratio on these? Did you beat Rey all 5 times but lose to SLKR all 5 times?
Against SLKR in all 5 battles I got him down to 1vs 1 and lost. Against Rey the squad with 3-4 tanks performs worse than, for example, SEE, BSF, WAT, Malak, SiT. But against Rey I did not win all 5 battles (did 3 more in the meantime, won 2).
And about the videos: 10-15 full videos, upload them to Google Drive or Youtube, maybe edit them before I post 10-15 links here in the forum ... for what? Is anything getting better for me by doing this? A task that takes me an hour?
Huh. Can SEE get to his ult each time vs Rey? Or do the tanks just fall too quickly?
And for the videos, it can help us diagnose if the problem is in team composition, or gearing, or mods, or just SEE being inferior. That’s hard to determine from a single GAC record or from “SEE bad”.
It is not a problem to charge the ultimate against Rey. And going with the strategy guide of 3-4 tanks ... how could there be a problem in team composition? I won’t post any videos. Currently SEE performance against standard arena GL meta teams is not in line with the investment.
Because there’s no consensus on what the best SEE lineup is, or the best tanks to use with him, or the best strategies, or anything. There’s also a great deal of variation in Rey teams. If you post a video, or even just a summary of key characters and events, I can make suggestions that will maybe up your win rate. Otherwise, I can’t tell whether this is SEE being bad or unintended, or user error, or something else.
You don’t want to devote your time to documenting your battles in video or in text, fine. But I’ve yet to see a video of many of the “counters” or bad battles that people have brought up that don’t have some way to swing the favor towards SEE again.
And you think that in the absence of consensus your advice is the next best thing to go with? For many of the problems people have with SEE there is a solution that has its upsides and downsides. There are ways to handle the debuff issues, increase survivability, speed up charging the Ultimate. I tested a lot of squad compositions and I know how to win against JML and Rey. Even with low relic characters.
I don’t know if my advice will help, because I still have no idea what you’re doing in your battles with SEE. And if you know how to solve these problems, why not share them?
Rey kills ultimate SEE.
JML kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo kills ultimate SEE.
Kylo can 1v5 ultimate SEE.
JTR leads kill ultimate SEE.
Imperial Troopers kill ultimate SEE.
Palpatine lead kills ultimate SEE.
Vader lead kills ultimate SEE.
Treya lead kills ultimate SEE.
Some DR lead teams can kill ultimate SEE.
CG where are you, we want to know your current position on this matter!
@DreamCatcherKylo their current position has not changed from the last statement we received.
This is in part why I have been asking a lot of players who are declaring trash, and too many counters to post pictures and videos for discussion. This is what can help get this information together for them to consider.
CG where are you, we want to know your current position on this matter!
@DreamCatcherKylo their current position has not changed from the last statement we received.
This is in part why I have been asking a lot of players who are declaring trash, and too many counters to post pictures and videos for discussion. This is what can help get this information together for them to consider.
I must’ve missed the first comment, and don’t see it. I’m assuming it basically says see is fine and l2p?
Their last statement was that he was under observation. Then again, that’s what they said about JML when the forums were ranting about how terrible he was, and all they needed to do was fix a little piece of his AI.
CG where are you, we want to know your current position on this matter!
@DreamCatcherKylo their current position has not changed from the last statement we received.
This is in part why I have been asking a lot of players who are declaring trash, and too many counters to post pictures and videos for discussion. This is what can help get this information together for them to consider.
I must’ve missed the first comment, and don’t see it. I’m assuming it basically says see is fine and l2p?
Their last statement was that he was under observation. Then again, that’s what they said about JML when the forums were ranting about how terrible he was, and all they needed to do was fix a little piece of his AI.
He was not WAI, so they were fixing a bug, not making changes to him due to people not thinking he was good. Just to be clear.
So GL Luke teams are good, SLKR teams are good and now Kuiil will help GL Rey teams, where is the love for SEE and his squad? Dark side needs more strong characters to help out. No balance to the force here. Why do they keep getting left out?
Why wasn't Cobb Vanth shards a reward for the Krayt Dragon raid? Why wasn't Endor Gear Luke shards a reward for the Speeder Bike raid?
True. But it was still a very minor part of what JML was, and look where we are now...
Ok, and if there was a bug with SEE he would have gotten the same treatment.
There is a pretty severe lack of information to really judge on and examine.
Just so I am clear, you aren’t saying that the lack of videos posted on this forum is a reason for them to not have a very good idea how he is doing. The fact that he does 30k crits with a crit damage set on dark side enemies when he hits his ultimate is surely something they know from actual player data (not videos for Pete’s sake). I am sure there are thousands upon thousands of data points they can glean from their own databases by now.
You know what else really sucks, getting to ultimate, not doing enough damage or even being killed in the time between activating his ultimate and the ability to actually attack. And 20 turn cool down for an ability that does less damage than Rey’s ultimate or kylo’s aoe (that he does multiple times per battle. You can realistically only use the move once in a pvp environment, it should be much lower cooldown. Maybe reduce the cooldown by 3 for every enemy you kill or something.
☮ Consular ☮American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor)JedhaYavin IV
Replies
Problem is Sith doesnt have as many viable characters as Jedi. I mean sure, youre free to try with Savage or Maul or Sidious, but then again you might as well use Ugnaught or Lobot.
@VelvetDiamond_R6 any updates on bugs beating SEE, still yet to see that video?
While putting together the video's, many stated counters were only limited to 1 or 2 videos , and all were non ultimate, and possibly missing other upgrades.
Can you post any other videos of these counters working ??
Im not sure what one he saw but i have also seen this so it is out there some where if you care to search for it.
There were 2 videos going around of relic 7 geos beating a fully relic 7 upgraded SEE team from 2 different people.
Might be in someones stream, i remember it being over an hour long one of them.
i suggest if you are collecting videos that you look around youtube an just give it a good old search around. there are many different ones.
Also some one else on the forums was also complaining about geos beating his palp team, also saw that some where yesturday while looking around through all the posts about gls.
Its almost like you dont want the issues being seen.
Shouldnt be going around doing this out of the blue randomly when it serves you.
If you want to merge posts ask the person first. Its common curtesy.
Keep wanting to try but keep forgetting...
North Korea, South Korea, Marilyn Monroe!
@DreamCatcherKylo
If you are going to make these claims and want to make sure they make changes, providing the evidence to back up the listing of counters you find unacceptable goes a long way to help the cause.
I did look, and I am trying to help, but more people trying to help the better, at this point I am only seeing the few that are being talked about that as I said are not showing maxed and ultimate SEE.
SEE certainly didn't start any fire...
And you think that in the absence of consensus your advice is the next best thing to go with? For many of the problems people have with SEE there is a solution that has its upsides and downsides. There are ways to handle the debuff issues, increase survivability, speed up charging the Ultimate. I tested a lot of squad compositions and I know how to win against JML and Rey. Even with low relic characters.
Neither of us can change the flaws in kit of SEE and the mediocre damage output. And this is what this thread is about. My main points of criticism:
- SEE is the only GL that wastes a full turn only to transform
- Damage is too low
- anti-Rebel and anti-Jedi limitations make no sense
- synergy with Sith is weak
No comments, just no comments, This massacre submitted by Kylo, this atrocity, Unresisting Siths just die one by one not able to do anything.
The ability can be that you choose a chat the beginning that is your “apprentice” they can’t be killed until Palp is dead. That character can take damage until a sliver of red health is left but then can’t die until after SEE is dead. Since the others die off so quickly it wouldn’t take long to be a 2v5.
That would make you practically unbeatable though, since SEE cant be targeted by deceived enemies while there is another sith. Still, like the concept.
Bingo.
SEE's concept, as-is, was (according to CG) designed to have him hide behind a bunch of tanks while the enemies fuel his ultimate, then he goes into ultimate form and melts faces.
But:
And this is where you show your ignorance toward jml. The teams you proposed are simply not the best ones and are defeated by Rey or SLKR (not mentioning Vader and JTR counter).
So not that simple. For SEE, I dont know, I was just sayin .There are many good dark side toons (not especially sith) that could match and make the team stronger. Think about Wat, Thrawn, Alpha etc...
Maybe he needs a buff, I am just sayin their might be a good hard comp somewhere outside of the recommended ones (like Rey and resistance LOL)
Could be that once it’s 2v1 then you are able to link your own team character so once you use ultimate they both die
I don’t know if my advice will help, because I still have no idea what you’re doing in your battles with SEE. And if you know how to solve these problems, why not share them?
Ha!!
@DreamCatcherKylo their current position has not changed from the last statement we received.
This is in part why I have been asking a lot of players who are declaring trash, and too many counters to post pictures and videos for discussion. This is what can help get this information together for them to consider.
Their last statement was that he was under observation. Then again, that’s what they said about JML when the forums were ranting about how terrible he was, and all they needed to do was fix a little piece of his AI.
He was not WAI, so they were fixing a bug, not making changes to him due to people not thinking he was good. Just to be clear.
Ok, and if there was a bug with SEE he would have gotten the same treatment.
There is a pretty severe lack of information to really judge on and examine.
Just so I am clear, you aren’t saying that the lack of videos posted on this forum is a reason for them to not have a very good idea how he is doing. The fact that he does 30k crits with a crit damage set on dark side enemies when he hits his ultimate is surely something they know from actual player data (not videos for Pete’s sake). I am sure there are thousands upon thousands of data points they can glean from their own databases by now.
You know what else really sucks, getting to ultimate, not doing enough damage or even being killed in the time between activating his ultimate and the ability to actually attack. And 20 turn cool down for an ability that does less damage than Rey’s ultimate or kylo’s aoe (that he does multiple times per battle. You can realistically only use the move once in a pvp environment, it should be much lower cooldown. Maybe reduce the cooldown by 3 for every enemy you kill or something.