SEE definitely needs a buff!

Replies

  • My troopers hit harder than SEE does.
  • My troopers hit harder than SEE does.

    Its sad but rather true. His damage is more on par with characters from years back
  • dgree
    382 posts Member
    SEE has poor damage scaling for a GL -- including post-ultimate, when he's supposed to be amazing but is about as good as other GL attackers pre-ultimate (or worse). And his damage multipliers are low. With the information that is available from battles and from looking at SEE's programmed mechanics, people saying SEE does amazing damage are in denial.

    The main niche for SEE's "damage" is damage to prot pools--but only if the tank he's forced to link is strong. If the tank is weak, SEE is forced to kill him and linked is removed immediately. JML is the strongest tank so, ironically, that's where we see basically the one battle where SEE does something useful.
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    dgree wrote: »
    SEE has poor damage scaling for a GL -- including post-ultimate, when he's supposed to be amazing but is about as good as other GL attackers pre-ultimate (or worse). And his damage multipliers are low. With the information that is available from battles and from looking at SEE's programmed mechanics, people saying SEE does amazing damage are in denial.

    The main niche for SEE's "damage" is damage to prot pools--but only if the tank he's forced to link is strong. If the tank is weak, SEE is forced to kill him and linked is removed immediately. JML is the strongest tank so, ironically, that's where we see basically the one battle where SEE does something useful.

    I think one turn damage immunity or full heal with protection up when activating the ultimate could help a little. That and give the team some defensive buffs. He is closer than it seems. Some crit immunity or something!
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    Shiryu wrote: »
    SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash

    I agree that he needs some work but his ultimate does a bit more than that, if modded for offense. https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • RAYRAY wrote: »
    Shiryu wrote: »
    SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash

    I agree that he needs some work but his ultimate does a bit more than that, if modded for offense. https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
    Thus seems to show that ultimate SEE after stacking damage throughout the battle does less damage than SLKR at the beginning of battle...
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    edited October 2020
    dgree wrote: »
    RAYRAY wrote: »
    Shiryu wrote: »
    SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash

    I agree that he needs some work but his ultimate does a bit more than that, if modded for offense. https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
    Thus seems to show that ultimate SEE after stacking damage throughout the battle does less damage than SLKR at the beginning of battle...

    Yes, that is because kylo does too much damage and needs to be hit with a big nerf bat. He’s way overtuned and would still be one of the best teams if he did half his damage. But a win is a win...
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • dgree wrote: »
    RAYRAY wrote: »
    Shiryu wrote: »
    SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash

    I agree that he needs some work but his ultimate does a bit more than that, if modded for offense. https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
    Thus seems to show that ultimate SEE after stacking damage throughout the battle does less damage than SLKR at the beginning of battle...

    This. It feels like SEE needs his ultimate to even resemble a GL, and not a very strong one at that.
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    dgree wrote: »
    RAYRAY wrote: »
    Shiryu wrote: »
    SEE is weak until he gets ultimate, then he is amazing.

    JML’s ultimate does nothing.

    SEE doesn’t need a buff, just more time for people to unlock ultimates.

    And thats where your wrong. even with ult he kills 2 at most, normally 1 since another gl is linked.. and everyone else gets half lifed.

    I have his ult and hes still trash

    I agree that he needs some work but his ultimate does a bit more than that, if modded for offense. https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
    Thus seems to show that ultimate SEE after stacking damage throughout the battle does less damage than SLKR at the beginning of battle...

    This. It feels like SEE needs his ultimate to even resemble a GL, and not a very strong one at that.
    I’m with you guys. I really am. That said, I think removal of light side restrictions would go a long way, he did deceive everyone. That could help damage wise. What see needs is better defensive abilities for his team and perhaps a defensive boost when he goes into ultimate.
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • RAYRAY wrote: »
    I think SEE does need a boost. I specifically think he needs to protect his team some. Perhaps a mass resurrection on ultimate or as allies die, the remaining allies inherit 50% of that dead character’s max protection. That said, since I have gotten the ultimate, I have consistently beaten all GL’s including kylo except double tank kylo teams. It’s all due th thrawn though. Without him, it becomes impossible to beat any form of kylo and much more difficult to defeat Rey. Here is a video though showing the tactics I use to beat a single tank kylo team.
    ETA: don’t take this video as proof as all is well with see, it’s most definitely not all well. He needs some boosts to make him better on defense against non GL teams, specifically.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/jim5ik/see_vs_single_tank_kylo/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

    You don't need Thrawn to beat single tank SLKR with SEE. Vader in Thrawn's spot works just fine.

    He absolutely cannot beat 2 tank SLKR teams. Which is annoying. lol
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    edited October 2020
    Xagen wrote: »
    Hello everybody, it's my first review on this forum, so please don't be strict. So the topic is related to notorious GL Palpatine, as many people in discord channels are totally frustrated after videos where SEE is just annihilated by Kylo, and reasons for frustration are obvious. while 3 other GL can counter each other, Palp seems to be on roadside. Having a look at his kit and recommended toons i was a bit confused, 'cause didn't see any protection/defense bonuses for teammates that should protect Palp till his Ulta activation.
    First point, if we have a look at recommended toons for other GLs, we will observe mostly tanks, as the whole concept of Palp is to wait in shadows till his Ulta activation.
    If game devs' recommendations are the usage of 3-4 tanks, and we know that damage of Rey and Kylo is immense, so it's logical that increase of protection and defense is required. So the fact that Kylo and Rey can take several your toons for one shot makes the system of retrieving protection and health after death of sith ally a bit hilarious, maybe that's why all toons as a rule are already dead or almost dead when Palp gets his Ultimate,
    In fact, other Gl are mostly used with recommended toons, but for Palp we have to make incredible mixed teams to somehow counter other GLs, especially Kylo.
    The second point, after getting Ultimate, Palp’s damage output is low, moreover Palp loses protection bonuses and become quite thin.
    Just my suggestion and I think it fits within the Sith Theory and Legends, that Palp should get some percentage of bonuses from fallen teammates, like Health, Protection, Offense etc.
    Some kind of 5s sacrifice, when allies get bonuses from his death.
    Palp could get bonuses from death of his allies. And by the time he activates his Ultimate, it can make him quite strong. Thank you


    I love this idea of a 5's like sacrifice from his team. Maybe he could steal a percentage of damage, Health and protection, then when the rest of the team dies, SEE is super stout and could be able to tank Kylo and team long enough to get the ultimate out and then the ultimate would hit hard enough to be a threat to Kylo and friends.

    ETA: make this only work for sith tanks and it could be balanced. The team to beat would be SEE, Sion, SET, Malak and Traya for utility.
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • Sewpot
    1556 posts Member
    Unless the devs are setting us up for a jedi onslaught then SEE is goingo to shine.
    Otherwise he’s really useless in most aspect of the game.
    Raids,TW,GAC
    Banners people!!!
    I’m reluctant to use a team on defence because he is killed by everyone and their cousins and offence i know that at the end only he will be possibly standing.
    In GAC,TW he becomes a liability.
    Rey and Luke will be more valuable in these terms
    Without his kit getting some serious love he will be the bottom of people’s farming lists.
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    Sewpot wrote: »
    Unless the devs are setting us up for a jedi onslaught then SEE is goingo to shine.
    Otherwise he’s really useless in most aspect of the game.
    Raids,TW,GAC
    Banners people!!!
    I’m reluctant to use a team on defence because he is killed by everyone and their cousins and offence i know that at the end only he will be possibly standing.
    In GAC,TW he becomes a liability.
    Rey and Luke will be more valuable in these terms
    Without his kit getting some serious love he will be the bottom of people’s farming lists.

    I don't know. I placed my Rey team in TW and used See to beat Rey for 19 banners yesterday. He needs some work but hes not THAT bad...
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • VelvetDiamond_R6
    72 posts Member
    edited October 2020
    He really is that bad if you put him on defense, he cant do anything. Most teams can kill him completely off before he gets any remote chance of pulling out his Ultimate.

    Defense = terrible.
    Offense = better but not good. - does barely any damage.

    Both Gas and JKL can hit harder than SEE lmao. Not to mention the other GL's. Infact, DR can hit harder than SEE can.

    They seriously need to go take a look at his damage numbers.

    But he 100% needs some defensive buffs for his team.
  • Eweff
    370 posts Member
    Give SEE a Snoke summon that tanks even more for SEE.
  • Just curious: is RG kinda useful in a SEE team ?
  • Eweff
    370 posts Member
    Starslayer wrote: »
    Just curious: is RG kinda useful in a SEE team ?

    No
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    Eweff wrote: »
    Give SEE a Snoke summon that tanks even more for SEE.

    Summon snoke on ultimate and make him have a forced locked taunt. Add an ability to SEE that sacrifices Snoke and lowers the cooldown of his massive damage AOE by 20 turns so he can use his big damage move 2 times in a fight.
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    Lot of good ideas about how to make SEE a GL and not just a L.. I think the easiest would be to boost his damage both pre and post ultimate. Remove the faction and light side restrictions on his damage so he does normal damage to everyone. Make Linked do damage that can't be countered or make it dispel all buffs and prevent buffs. Those two simple changes would bring SEE up to Rey level and make it possible to beat Kylo double tank on offense.
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • RAYRAY
    2761 posts Member
    I am sure by now that everyone knows who I am referring to. Why, when at the end of the match, SEE will crit Kylo with an offense set with his basic for 25k but Kylo can crit SEE for 115k. See should be doing MORE damage than kylo at this stage of the fight considering Kylo can do 3x + See's max basic at the BEGINNING of the fight. Is this disparity really intended? My see 15.5k Special damage... For a GL that is supposed to be so focused on damage and output, is the weak basic really intended? Is there something wrong that isn't working in his kit? Removing the +150% damage to light side decieved enemies and making that base damage could help. Then there should be bonus damage to decieved enemies on top of the current max damage for Deceived Light side enemies. That would put the max damage less than Kylo's but could make the end of battles interesting. There are too many trade offs for a galactic legend.

    That said, I am going to give CG the benefit of the doubt and say that there MUST be a bug that is causing such horrendous damage from his basic, with nearly 16k special damage. Even vs. LS Deceived enemies it crits for only 60-70K..That should be baseline.
    ☮ Consular ☮ American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor) JedhaYavin IV
  • CG: but but but he's an "attacker" and mastery is great for him!!!


    But yeah... his damage is so bad and he provides low utility. Rey does about as much if not more damage then SEE AND has a instant kill on a 0 turn cooldown.

    CG has been quiet about this whole situation and dispite all the concerns hasn't said anything.
  • Everything is working as intended
  • Idk why people say SEE is f2p friendly, I worked for over a month and spent probably $4k in crystals trying to get him because I thought he looked like the coolest GL. But he's trash. Maybe he's f2p friendly for long time players that invested in empire and sith but i never did. Anyway ill probably uninstall the game after this if he's not buffed
  • vincentlondon
    4422 posts Member
    edited October 2020
    The worst is that more and more people are unlocking SLKR. We could have some nice diversity in arena with SEE but no, we ll continue to see SLKR more and more, cause noone is gonna use SEE
  • Kyno
    27456 posts Moderator
    LordDunbar wrote: »
    Idk why people say SEE is f2p friendly, I worked for over a month and spent probably $4k in crystals trying to get him because I thought he looked like the coolest GL. But he's trash. Maybe he's f2p friendly for long time players that invested in empire and sith but i never did. Anyway ill probably uninstall the game after this if he's not buffed

    yes F2P friendly has many meanings. but basically it implies that they are easy to get or that the requirements/character have a high level of usefulness, as F2P cannot waster resources on something that will be very unique.

    in the case of SEE, yes older players were basically "handed" both SEE and JML, there are a bunch of farms and gear needed, but the toons required have been out for a while (besides the last few farms) and had uses earlier so they are likely to be in a good place already.

    under this idea, i find it hard to say things like IMP troopers are a F2P counter, as they are an ok team, but not many would recommend relic-ing them before they were listed as a possible GL counter. IMO
  • Eleslalegenda
    304 posts Member
    edited October 2020
    You do know that Kylo gains stat increases as he attacks and he siphons (drains) them from his opponents right?

    GLs are not stated to be immune to this from his basic, so yes Wai...
  • kalidor
    1988 posts Member
    I'm sure once ships are allowed as part of an arena squad, SEE will do a lot more damage to them than SLKR. /s
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
  • It’s WAI as of the coding. But I’ve been seeing a LOT of variation in SEE’s reported damage capabilities, so who knows.
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