@str2019 interesting observations. One more, too, for JML as a counter: an initial taunt to soak Kylo's initial stab, which usually disables a toon before anyone moves, turning it into 4v5.
It seems like you really need 2 GLs (or 1 plus another counter team) to climb in arena now. At least this is the case in more developed shards. I really like this.
I think that even with the new GLs being of equal power, there is still plenty of reasons for krackens to bite.
1. More GLs means more options to climb easier. Mirror matches can be annoying. If you have all 4 GLs, you can switch them out.
2. More options in GAC. If you have all 4 GLs, you can have more defensive and offensive counters.
3. Bragging rights.
As to why to go for papa palps when he
can be beaten by SLKR
1. You get piett and 3 members of an amazing imperial troopers squad as part of the deal. Only two to go to make it beat rebel roundup tier 3 easily.
2. Vader and thrawn are requirements and you only need a low star low gear wat to make an easy Rey counter.
3. Even assuming that your shard is full of kylos to start (my shard has more Rey teams anyway), more people went for jml who counters kylo. So kylo isn't a great choice to leave on defense in an environment where there are a lot of jmls to drop them. So at worse, there will be a mix of jml, slkr, and Rey. Papa can climb through the jmls easily. Even if if you see the kylo team with sith that counter jml, you have thrawn lead with a pretaunt, vader, and wat to clear them. And you get two of the needed characters as part of the requirements.
4. Your empire team will be good enough to beat tier 3 of the military might assault battle. Ep, vader, thrawn, tarkin, and piett. All required and that team should crush military might.
5. Papa will likely crush the sith assualt battle.
6. You probably get 3 ds tb teams or close to it just from the requirements.
You get similar benefits for jml but for the ls assualt battles and tb.
Slkr is great but you really only get the benefits of his team in areas where it is good. (Arena, hstr, gac, tw, tb, assault balttles, ect) there just aren't that many areas that first order are required. But soloing the sith raid is a huge plus for many so definitely a viable choice.
Rey is really the one where I don't see a lot of value. Sure you get one great team in arena, tw, gac, tb, ect. But resistance is not used anywhere and you really don't get many other teams (maybe 1) and they aren't required anywhere in pve content.
So it looks like they went away from the GL being an arena only benefit to giving an overall benefit from the GL and their requirements.
I think that even with the new GLs being of equal power, there is still plenty of reasons for krackens to bite.
1. More GLs means more options to climb easier. Mirror matches can be annoying. If you have all 4 GLs, you can switch them out.
2. More options in GAC. If you have all 4 GLs, you can have more defensive and offensive counters.
3. Bragging rights.
As to why to go for papa palps when he
can be beaten by SLKR
1. You get piett and 3 members of an amazing imperial troopers squad as part of the deal. Only two to go to make it beat rebel roundup tier 3 easily.
2. Vader and thrawn are requirements and you only need a low star low gear wat to make an easy Rey counter.
3. Even assuming that your shard is full of kylos to start (my shard has more Rey teams anyway), more people went for jml who counters kylo. So kylo isn't a great choice to leave on defense in an environment where there are a lot of jmls to drop them. So at worse, there will be a mix of jml, slkr, and Rey. Papa can climb through the jmls easily. Even if if you see the kylo team with sith that counter jml, you have thrawn lead with a pretaunt, vader, and wat to clear them. And you get two of the needed characters as part of the requirements.
4. Your empire team will be good enough to beat tier 3 of the military might assault battle. Ep, vader, thrawn, tarkin, and piett. All required and that team should crush military might.
5. Papa will likely crush the sith assualt battle.
6. You probably get 3 ds tb teams or close to it just from the requirements.
You get similar benefits for jml but for the ls assualt battles and tb.
Slkr is great but you really only get the benefits of his team in areas where it is good. (Arena, hstr, gac, tw, tb, assault balttles, ect) there just aren't that many areas that first order are required. But soloing the sith raid is a huge plus for many so definitely a viable choice.
Rey is really the one where I don't see a lot of value. Sure you get one great team in arena, tw, gac, tb, ect. But resistance is not used anywhere and you really don't get many other teams (maybe 1) and they aren't required anywhere in pve content.
So it looks like they went away from the GL being an arena only benefit to giving an overall benefit from the GL and their requirements.
The most valuable events for each player: Arena, Heroic Sith Raid. SLKR covers both, TB and TW mostly depends on your guild, some events actually can be covered with some toons, more valuable in comparison with Sidious, Krennic, Royal Guard, Maul etc. True that having many Gls is very good for you as a player, but in this queue SEE takes 3/4 place after SLKR, JML even after REY due to benefits from toon and resources spent for his farming.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
I think that even with the new GLs being of equal power, there is still plenty of reasons for krackens to bite.
1. More GLs means more options to climb easier. Mirror matches can be annoying. If you have all 4 GLs, you can switch them out.
2. More options in GAC. If you have all 4 GLs, you can have more defensive and offensive counters.
3. Bragging rights.
As to why to go for papa palps when he
can be beaten by SLKR
1. You get piett and 3 members of an amazing imperial troopers squad as part of the deal. Only two to go to make it beat rebel roundup tier 3 easily.
2. Vader and thrawn are requirements and you only need a low star low gear wat to make an easy Rey counter.
3. Even assuming that your shard is full of kylos to start (my shard has more Rey teams anyway), more people went for jml who counters kylo. So kylo isn't a great choice to leave on defense in an environment where there are a lot of jmls to drop them. So at worse, there will be a mix of jml, slkr, and Rey. Papa can climb through the jmls easily. Even if if you see the kylo team with sith that counter jml, you have thrawn lead with a pretaunt, vader, and wat to clear them. And you get two of the needed characters as part of the requirements.
4. Your empire team will be good enough to beat tier 3 of the military might assault battle. Ep, vader, thrawn, tarkin, and piett. All required and that team should crush military might.
5. Papa will likely crush the sith assualt battle.
6. You probably get 3 ds tb teams or close to it just from the requirements.
You get similar benefits for jml but for the ls assualt battles and tb.
Slkr is great but you really only get the benefits of his team in areas where it is good. (Arena, hstr, gac, tw, tb, assault balttles, ect) there just aren't that many areas that first order are required. But soloing the sith raid is a huge plus for many so definitely a viable choice.
Rey is really the one where I don't see a lot of value. Sure you get one great team in arena, tw, gac, tb, ect. But resistance is not used anywhere and you really don't get many other teams (maybe 1) and they aren't required anywhere in pve content.
So it looks like they went away from the GL being an arena only benefit to giving an overall benefit from the GL and their requirements.
The most valuable events for each player: Arena, Heroic Sith Raid. SLKR covers both, TB and TW mostly depends on your guild, some events actually can be covered with some toons, more valuable in comparison with Sidious, Krennic, Royal Guard, Maul etc. True that having many Gls is very good for you as a player, but in this queue SEE takes 3/4 place after SLKR, JML even after REY due to benefits from toon and resources spent for his farming.
I'm not arguing that hstr isn't important. Just laying out the reasons some may go for other gls. Obviously, it'll vary based on where your roster is at.
I went for papa palps first because I was closest to that. My fo and resistance are trash so SLKR is a much longer farm. Probably has to do with the 8 mo break I took shortly before GLs. I may do kylo next but probably jml since there are a lot of toons for him that I would like to relic anyway.
A disagreement is not necessarily a statement that what you said was factually incorrect. There are such things as matters of opinion.
But as for the difference of opinion, it's here:
Arena crystals are the best reward in the game
What percentage of people can finish top10 in squad arena?
What percentage of players can finish top 10 in HSTR?
Sure, the Arena crystals aren't random, but I've never once in my whole time playing this game hit top5 in Arena while I've scored top3 in HSTR quite a number of times. Is a guaranteed 100 crystals/day better than a 20% chance of getting top 10 HSTR rewards every 4 days?
In my opinion, that's a decided, "No". But again, you're talking to someone who usually hovers around 20th to 35th place in squad arena. Someone who hovers around 500th is going to have a different opinion, as will someone who hovers in the top5.
The big benefit to crystals is that they can become anything you need them to be, but they're relatively inefficient in exchange for that flexibility. And your rewards in squad Arena are going to be paltry without a lot of investment - investment that can't be maintained because of meta turnover.
But anyone can join a guild that's farming HSTR, and even people placing #1300-ish in squad arena, with the pitiful rewards that entails, can be in the top 20% of their own guild given relatively little time & investment so long as they're willing to jump to the right guild.
Nah, Arena crystals aren't the best prize one can get, due to a combination of poor efficiency and poor availability.
But of course that's just my opinion, man. Your analysis depends on the predictability of the reward having value in itself. I don't care much about that because even the g12 & g12+ gear I don't need quickly becomes fuel for r6 & r7 upgrades. And since I'm constantly upgrading toons to relics these days, that never stops being true. So for me, with no intrinsic value on predictability separate from the content of what, precisely, is being predicted, I find Arena crystals pale beside other rewards.
Try your analysis again, only this time assume you get rank #300 every day. Is it still the best? When there are a thousand active players on a shard, and an absolute hard max of 24 (and usually many fewer) players who can ever take first on a given shard on a given day, you can see that the value of those predictable crystals declines as the number of crystals received declines.
There's no reason to think that Arena crystals are special, and you will not soon convince me that they're better than other rewards from other game modes.
I tend to skim your long posts (which is entirely on me) but if your position is that it depends on the person, that's fair. If you aren't finishing high in arena then I can see your pov.
A disagreement is not necessarily a statement that what you said was factually incorrect. There are such things as matters of opinion.
But as for the difference of opinion, it's here:
Arena crystals are the best reward in the game
What percentage of people can finish top10 in squad arena?
What percentage of players can finish top 10 in HSTR?
Sure, the Arena crystals aren't random, but I've never once in my whole time playing this game hit top5 in Arena while I've scored top3 in HSTR quite a number of times. Is a guaranteed 100 crystals/day better than a 20% chance of getting top 10 HSTR rewards every 4 days?
In my opinion, that's a decided, "No". But again, you're talking to someone who usually hovers around 20th to 35th place in squad arena. Someone who hovers around 500th is going to have a different opinion, as will someone who hovers in the top5.
The big benefit to crystals is that they can become anything you need them to be, but they're relatively inefficient in exchange for that flexibility. And your rewards in squad Arena are going to be paltry without a lot of investment - investment that can't be maintained because of meta turnover.
But anyone can join a guild that's farming HSTR, and even people placing #1300-ish in squad arena, with the pitiful rewards that entails, can be in the top 20% of their own guild given relatively little time & investment so long as they're willing to jump to the right guild.
Nah, Arena crystals aren't the best prize one can get, due to a combination of poor efficiency and poor availability.
But of course that's just my opinion, man. Your analysis depends on the predictability of the reward having value in itself. I don't care much about that because even the g12 & g12+ gear I don't need quickly becomes fuel for r6 & r7 upgrades. And since I'm constantly upgrading toons to relics these days, that never stops being true. So for me, with no intrinsic value on predictability separate from the content of what, precisely, is being predicted, I find Arena crystals pale beside other rewards.
Try your analysis again, only this time assume you get rank #300 every day. Is it still the best? When there are a thousand active players on a shard, and an absolute hard max of 24 (and usually many fewer) players who can ever take first on a given shard on a given day, you can see that the value of those predictable crystals declines as the number of crystals received declines.
There's no reason to think that Arena crystals are special, and you will not soon convince me that they're better than other rewards from other game modes.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
You may have to choose between high tb rewards and top 10 in hstr because the two correlate to the point that those with high stars in tb also have more SLKR owners so it may be more difficult to get top ten consistently.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
Maybe both of us should follow your advice? I’m not the only one discussing others things than the post subject.
I think making the new GLs not better than the previous is good and bad at the same time. Good because the meta isn’t only one character/team but bad for the future. If I can skip the next new thing and still be with a meta team why would I gear up trash characters (darth sidious/krennic/royal guard/CHOLO/ROLO//lando/leia)? So in the future I don’t need to get the new GL, be with a “low” 80 characters GP(so GAC isn’t a problem), get 1st in arena, get 31 stars in DS TB, etc. If they introduced the 4 GLs together O think it would’ve been better
It does give choices. I didn't get the previous GLs so I can get the new ones and not level up their set of trash characters.
And if you look at all of them they all have about 5 trash characters required. So that part is pretty even.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
Maybe both of us should follow your advice? I’m not the only one discussing others things than the post subject.
I think making the new GLs not better than the previous is good and bad at the same time. Good because the meta isn’t only one character/team but bad for the future. If I can skip the next new thing and still be with a meta team why would I gear up trash characters (darth sidious/krennic/royal guard/CHOLO/ROLO//lando/leia)? So in the future I don’t need to get the new GL, be with a “low” 80 characters GP(so GAC isn’t a problem), get 1st in arena, get 31 stars in DS TB, etc. If they introduced the 4 GLs together O think it would’ve been better
You can of course skip this batch. But it won't turn out like you imagine with low 80 characters, everyone is heading for a future where top 80 is covered with only relics and it's more than possible to push junk out of it...at different pace. Or you can just sit at your gp forever.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
10,000th is a bit of an extreme example. I don't think I could drop that far if I tried.
Anyone with teams that can get top 10 in hstr will likely be in the top 500 with minimal effort.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
10,000th is a bit of an extreme example. I don't think I could drop that far if I tried.
Anyone with teams that can get top 10 in hstr will likely be in the top 500 with minimal effort.
In my experience, in most shards you can't even fall beyond 1000 if you wanted to.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
10,000th is a bit of an extreme example. I don't think I could drop that far if I tried.
Anyone with teams that can get top 10 in hstr will likely be in the top 500 with minimal effort.
In my experience, in most shards you can't even fall beyond 1000 if you wanted to.
I quit the game for 8 months shortly after gas came out. I left Darth revan with a 6 star g11 malak on defense and only fell to 208 in 8 months.
So like I said you can probably get top 500 with very little effort.
If every new GL is on par power level than the current ones, then just keep SLKR.
Stop playing and come back in 10 years, you will still have the best squad in the game and there will be 10.000 players with 10.000 SLKR squads
That would be true if the current GLs were:
1- going to be the last GLs released
2- going to be the last toons released
At any point down the line they could release a non GL that supports or raises one up just enough to be ahead of the others, or at least a few.
I mean we already see JML giving SLKR trouble.
Why would anyone ever get future GLs when these new ones are worse than the old ones? Get SLKR, get your arena crystals, and call it a day. There is no way in spending for future GLs again when they underperform to the old ones.
So what about JML putting a hurting on SLKR in arena? Not unbeatable, but seems to be putting up more of a fight than Rey. I'm pretty sure JML is new, and not underperforming the old ones.
We also have a time between now and then, other toons will come out, some.might be useful in one or more teams that allow someone to hold better here or there......
SLKR is far from the end all be all.
Sorry, just to clarify, we should stop farming SEE, go for JML, whom SLKR can definitely beat with help of DRevan or other Siths. I think that Canadafett's post is related SEE too, we don't speak that both GLs are trash, current conversation is related mainly to SEE's frustrating performance. The fact that Jml can be beaten by top siths characters differs from the fact that SEE's current state is not satisfactory for people who spent much resources and get what? Heroic Sith Reid -- no, excellent for arena to hold top positions-no, Sorry but not very good working rock scissor paper theory can hardly justify resources people spend for farming SEE.
His post is about future GLs and he said the current onea are trash, he was talking about both.
I have said multiple times that they should keep an eye on what's going on with SEE, so we agree.
Honestly we are close to a decent setup for multiple teams being viabl(or having use) for arena, now we just need to see how this plays out to bring in that final bit of balance between them.
I never said they were trash, I said they underperform and using SLKR gets beat by JML doesn't change the fact that they underperform compared to the other GLs.
They aren't trash, but they aren't worth going for if you don't have SLKR. I've said it before, get SLKR, get your arena crystals, press auto in HSTR, and don't invest in the new GLs, as they don't add anything that the previous ones do.
You can say changes are coming or more toons to be releases down the road but it doesn't change the fact that both new GLs are mainly broken and underperform because they have ults tied to abilities like IT and Deceived, they will always be beat by more FTP teams because you can work around these. You can't work around Ults that say, "when your team gets hit or when a toon takes a turn"
I'm not even going to get in to if they should be slightly better or anything, I am just saying get SLKR and ignore these two unless you really like Luke or Palp and wait for the next GLs or changes and buffs.
There are going to be more and more FTP counters as time goes on and you figure out the mechanics because these two new GLs have horribley charged ults.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
10,000th is a bit of an extreme example. I don't think I could drop that far if I tried.
Anyone with teams that can get top 10 in hstr will likely be in the top 500 with minimal effort.
In my experience, in most shards you can't even fall beyond 1000 if you wanted to.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
Maybe both of us should follow your advice? I’m not the only one discussing others things than the post subject.
I think making the new GLs not better than the previous is good and bad at the same time. Good because the meta isn’t only one character/team but bad for the future. If I can skip the next new thing and still be with a meta team why would I gear up trash characters (darth sidious/krennic/royal guard/CHOLO/ROLO//lando/leia)? So in the future I don’t need to get the new GL, be with a “low” 80 characters GP(so GAC isn’t a problem), get 1st in arena, get 31 stars in DS TB, etc. If they introduced the 4 GLs together O think it would’ve been better
It does give choices. I didn't get the previous GLs so I can get the new ones and not level up their set of trash characters.
And if you look at all of them they all have about 5 trash characters required. So that part is pretty even.
Yes, it’s good to have choices. However it isn’t only good, in my opinion if we can stay if one team for almost one year in top arena can make the game stale. If they shift the meta from the GLs now or soon JML and SEE will loose lot of their value.
It is very doughtful that they will be switching away from GLs, if anything they may release a toon that gives a boost to 1 or 2, but GLs are going to be here to stay for a long time.
Also with GAC and TW, very few toons lose their value right away.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
Maybe both of us should follow your advice? I’m not the only one discussing others things than the post subject.
I think making the new GLs not better than the previous is good and bad at the same time. Good because the meta isn’t only one character/team but bad for the future. If I can skip the next new thing and still be with a meta team why would I gear up trash characters (darth sidious/krennic/royal guard/CHOLO/ROLO//lando/leia)? So in the future I don’t need to get the new GL, be with a “low” 80 characters GP(so GAC isn’t a problem), get 1st in arena, get 31 stars in DS TB, etc. If they introduced the 4 GLs together O think it would’ve been better
It does give choices. I didn't get the previous GLs so I can get the new ones and not level up their set of trash characters.
And if you look at all of them they all have about 5 trash characters required. So that part is pretty even.
Yes, it’s good to have choices. However it isn’t only good, in my opinion if we can stay if one team for almost one year in top arena can make the game stale. If they shift the meta from the GLs now or soon JML and SEE will loose lot of their value.
It is very doughtful that they will be switching away from GLs, if anything they may release a toon that gives a boost to 1 or 2, but GLs are going to be here to stay for a long time.
Also with GAC and TW, very few toons lose their value right away.
I agree, probably they won’t change the meta soon. That’s, to me, makes the game stale.
GAC and TW are good but be a meta in arena make the team much more valuable than be good at GAC and TW.
The meta is shifting right now, GLs have a longer cycle than previous metas due to the release and ultimate taking time.
When/if they release more toons that push the meta (if they are not GLs) it will happen at a different pace.
I much prefer a rolling meta shift than a stark change.
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
You just like to disagree. It doesn’t make anything that you said untrue.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
Maybe both of us should follow your advice? I’m not the only one discussing others things than the post subject.
I think making the new GLs not better than the previous is good and bad at the same time. Good because the meta isn’t only one character/team but bad for the future. If I can skip the next new thing and still be with a meta team why would I gear up trash characters (darth sidious/krennic/royal guard/CHOLO/ROLO//lando/leia)? So in the future I don’t need to get the new GL, be with a “low” 80 characters GP(so GAC isn’t a problem), get 1st in arena, get 31 stars in DS TB, etc. If they introduced the 4 GLs together O think it would’ve been better
It does give choices. I didn't get the previous GLs so I can get the new ones and not level up their set of trash characters.
And if you look at all of them they all have about 5 trash characters required. So that part is pretty even.
Yes, it’s good to have choices. However it isn’t only good, in my opinion if we can stay if one team for almost one year in top arena can make the game stale. If they shift the meta from the GLs now or soon JML and SEE will loose lot of their value.
It is very doughtful that they will be switching away from GLs, if anything they may release a toon that gives a boost to 1 or 2, but GLs are going to be here to stay for a long time.
Also with GAC and TW, very few toons lose their value right away.
I agree, probably they won’t change the meta soon. That’s, to me, makes the game stale.
GAC and TW are good but be a meta in arena make the team much more valuable than be good at GAC and TW.
The meta is shifting right now, GLs have a longer cycle than previous metas due to the release and ultimate taking time.
When/if they release more toons that push the meta (if they are not GLs) it will happen at a different pace.
I much prefer a rolling meta shift than a stark change.
Sorry? A slkr still get 1st and still meta, they introduced 2 more teams to the meta but Rey and SLKR still in meta and if they don’t release new characters that push SEE and JML to be the only two in the meta we will be with slkr and rey for a year. They included teams they didn’t shift the olds
JMLs numbers are coming up, SEE is still TBD on a few fronts at this point.
The meta report numbers will shift, it may not be what you want to see as the shift, but they are shifting.
GAS and JKR are still getting to first are they also still meta?
You want a full shift, I get it, but that doesnt seem to be the plan right now.
Replies
1. More GLs means more options to climb easier. Mirror matches can be annoying. If you have all 4 GLs, you can switch them out.
2. More options in GAC. If you have all 4 GLs, you can have more defensive and offensive counters.
3. Bragging rights.
As to why to go for papa palps when he
can be beaten by SLKR
1. You get piett and 3 members of an amazing imperial troopers squad as part of the deal. Only two to go to make it beat rebel roundup tier 3 easily.
2. Vader and thrawn are requirements and you only need a low star low gear wat to make an easy Rey counter.
3. Even assuming that your shard is full of kylos to start (my shard has more Rey teams anyway), more people went for jml who counters kylo. So kylo isn't a great choice to leave on defense in an environment where there are a lot of jmls to drop them. So at worse, there will be a mix of jml, slkr, and Rey. Papa can climb through the jmls easily. Even if if you see the kylo team with sith that counter jml, you have thrawn lead with a pretaunt, vader, and wat to clear them. And you get two of the needed characters as part of the requirements.
4. Your empire team will be good enough to beat tier 3 of the military might assault battle. Ep, vader, thrawn, tarkin, and piett. All required and that team should crush military might.
5. Papa will likely crush the sith assualt battle.
6. You probably get 3 ds tb teams or close to it just from the requirements.
You get similar benefits for jml but for the ls assualt battles and tb.
Slkr is great but you really only get the benefits of his team in areas where it is good. (Arena, hstr, gac, tw, tb, assault balttles, ect) there just aren't that many areas that first order are required. But soloing the sith raid is a huge plus for many so definitely a viable choice.
Rey is really the one where I don't see a lot of value. Sure you get one great team in arena, tw, gac, tb, ect. But resistance is not used anywhere and you really don't get many other teams (maybe 1) and they aren't required anywhere in pve content.
So it looks like they went away from the GL being an arena only benefit to giving an overall benefit from the GL and their requirements.
Arena crystals are the best reward in the game because there's no RNG involved with them.
Furthermore, you can't buy them from a shop (unless you're a spender) or farm them from a table.
Disagree.
Which part of what I said was untrue?
It's a fact that you can get bad rewards at any position because of RNG, and it's also a fact that you can farm gear but you can't farm crystals if you don't spend money.
So that's a reason for a third person to come in and say they disagree with me????
Maybe try not making this about me and discuss the substance of the posts.
I'm not arguing that hstr isn't important. Just laying out the reasons some may go for other gls. Obviously, it'll vary based on where your roster is at.
I went for papa palps first because I was closest to that. My fo and resistance are trash so SLKR is a much longer farm. Probably has to do with the 8 mo break I took shortly before GLs. I may do kylo next but probably jml since there are a lot of toons for him that I would like to relic anyway.
A disagreement is not necessarily a statement that what you said was factually incorrect. There are such things as matters of opinion.
But as for the difference of opinion, it's here:
What percentage of people can finish top10 in squad arena?
What percentage of players can finish top 10 in HSTR?
Sure, the Arena crystals aren't random, but I've never once in my whole time playing this game hit top5 in Arena while I've scored top3 in HSTR quite a number of times. Is a guaranteed 100 crystals/day better than a 20% chance of getting top 10 HSTR rewards every 4 days?
In my opinion, that's a decided, "No". But again, you're talking to someone who usually hovers around 20th to 35th place in squad arena. Someone who hovers around 500th is going to have a different opinion, as will someone who hovers in the top5.
The big benefit to crystals is that they can become anything you need them to be, but they're relatively inefficient in exchange for that flexibility. And your rewards in squad Arena are going to be paltry without a lot of investment - investment that can't be maintained because of meta turnover.
But anyone can join a guild that's farming HSTR, and even people placing #1300-ish in squad arena, with the pitiful rewards that entails, can be in the top 20% of their own guild given relatively little time & investment so long as they're willing to jump to the right guild.
Nah, Arena crystals aren't the best prize one can get, due to a combination of poor efficiency and poor availability.
But of course that's just my opinion, man. Your analysis depends on the predictability of the reward having value in itself. I don't care much about that because even the g12 & g12+ gear I don't need quickly becomes fuel for r6 & r7 upgrades. And since I'm constantly upgrading toons to relics these days, that never stops being true. So for me, with no intrinsic value on predictability separate from the content of what, precisely, is being predicted, I find Arena crystals pale beside other rewards.
Try your analysis again, only this time assume you get rank #300 every day. Is it still the best? When there are a thousand active players on a shard, and an absolute hard max of 24 (and usually many fewer) players who can ever take first on a given shard on a given day, you can see that the value of those predictable crystals declines as the number of crystals received declines.
There's no reason to think that Arena crystals are special, and you will not soon convince me that they're better than other rewards from other game modes.
I'll just point out that it is not a binary choice. You can finish high in arena and get top 10 hstr.
You may have to choose between high tb rewards and top 10 in hstr because the two correlate to the point that those with high stars in tb also have more SLKR owners so it may be more difficult to get top ten consistently.
Comparing arena rewards to hstr rewards is pointless since a player trying to maximize rewards will pursue both.
Of course. That's trivially true and is part of what I was saying above. But you can finish badly in Arena or wonderfully in arena & still have a 20% chance of getting top10 rewards in HSTR because 10 out of every 50 get top 10 so long as their guild can do the raid at all. Since anyone can finish top10 HSTR, and "anyone" includes people who do well in Arena, we kinda had this ground covered.
The fact that it's pointless was already established in the earlier conversation, though for other reasons.
When people can finish 10,000th in Arena every day & still finish top10 in HSTR, that should make it plain that it's not as easy or as simple as TVF initially asserted when saying that Arena crystals were the best reward. My position, with which TVF came to agree, is that it depends on the person (and their particular circumstance, such as whether or not their arena shard is particularly brutal).
It does give choices. I didn't get the previous GLs so I can get the new ones and not level up their set of trash characters.
And if you look at all of them they all have about 5 trash characters required. So that part is pretty even.
You can of course skip this batch. But it won't turn out like you imagine with low 80 characters, everyone is heading for a future where top 80 is covered with only relics and it's more than possible to push junk out of it...at different pace. Or you can just sit at your gp forever.
10,000th is a bit of an extreme example. I don't think I could drop that far if I tried.
Anyone with teams that can get top 10 in hstr will likely be in the top 500 with minimal effort.
In my experience, in most shards you can't even fall beyond 1000 if you wanted to.
I quit the game for 8 months shortly after gas came out. I left Darth revan with a 6 star g11 malak on defense and only fell to 208 in 8 months.
So like I said you can probably get top 500 with very little effort.
I never said they were trash, I said they underperform and using SLKR gets beat by JML doesn't change the fact that they underperform compared to the other GLs.
They aren't trash, but they aren't worth going for if you don't have SLKR. I've said it before, get SLKR, get your arena crystals, press auto in HSTR, and don't invest in the new GLs, as they don't add anything that the previous ones do.
You can say changes are coming or more toons to be releases down the road but it doesn't change the fact that both new GLs are mainly broken and underperform because they have ults tied to abilities like IT and Deceived, they will always be beat by more FTP teams because you can work around these. You can't work around Ults that say, "when your team gets hit or when a toon takes a turn"
I'm not even going to get in to if they should be slightly better or anything, I am just saying get SLKR and ignore these two unless you really like Luke or Palp and wait for the next GLs or changes and buffs.
There are going to be more and more FTP counters as time goes on and you figure out the mechanics because these two new GLs have horribley charged ults.
I'd be amazed if I could fall past 300 in mine...
It is very doughtful that they will be switching away from GLs, if anything they may release a toon that gives a boost to 1 or 2, but GLs are going to be here to stay for a long time.
Also with GAC and TW, very few toons lose their value right away.
The meta is shifting right now, GLs have a longer cycle than previous metas due to the release and ultimate taking time.
When/if they release more toons that push the meta (if they are not GLs) it will happen at a different pace.
I much prefer a rolling meta shift than a stark change.
JMLs numbers are coming up, SEE is still TBD on a few fronts at this point.
The meta report numbers will shift, it may not be what you want to see as the shift, but they are shifting.
GAS and JKR are still getting to first are they also still meta?
You want a full shift, I get it, but that doesnt seem to be the plan right now.