Shard Economy Changes [MEGA]

Replies

  • Konju
    1142 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.
  • @Kyno

    If you feel a month for this issue isn't long enough, that's fine. But with any kind of data analytics tools, they have enough data to see how this affects players by now.

    But I'm assuming that with billions in revenue they have such things.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    I am fully aware that you or doja can't do anything or say anything more at this point and I get that. But expecting us to have infinite patience is also ridiculous.

    If for some reason they think that one month is too short on this particular issue, they could respond and say "we're working on it and we think we'll have a decision in x amount of time".

    I'm ok with them setting a deadline for themselves depending on the issue. But when weeks amor months go by and we don't even get that, it's just poor communication.

    And I understand that there is likely little you or doja can do about that. I have had bosses that did things I didn't always agree with as well. But I can at least provide my feedback that as a player, it seems like we should be getting a little more information by this point.

    I'm not sure why you feel the need to argue that we shouldn't expect answers in a timely manner.

    I'm in no way expecting infinite patience, I am trying to do 2 things
    1 - figure out why "this is the day", which I think if fair. each problem is going to affect the community different, and understanding why some issues get to the "deadline" faster than others is helpful. Because I am not saying "dont check in" or express frustration, I'm just wondering how everyone not working there, knows exactly how long each problem should take to get solved or have a decision made.

    2- keep perspective that this problem is not those problems and different things will have different timelines and solutions.

    I get that you want them to do that, but as Doja has said, he can't/won't put out "promises"/deadlines that can be seen as "missed". He wont do it until things are more concrete. There are also cases where they may have an official announcement coming, and he is not likely to comment when he knows something official is coming. As much as we would want him to, that just not really in the cards.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    I am fully aware that you or doja can't do anything or say anything more at this point and I get that. But expecting us to have infinite patience is also ridiculous.

    If for some reason they think that one month is too short on this particular issue, they could respond and say "we're working on it and we think we'll have a decision in x amount of time".

    I'm ok with them setting a deadline for themselves depending on the issue. But when weeks amor months go by and we don't even get that, it's just poor communication.

    And I understand that there is likely little you or doja can do about that. I have had bosses that did things I didn't always agree with as well. But I can at least provide my feedback that as a player, it seems like we should be getting a little more information by this point.

    I'm not sure why you feel the need to argue that we shouldn't expect answers in a timely manner.

    each problem is going to affect the community different, and understanding why some issues get to the "deadline" faster than others is helpful.

    Since you claim you understand the priorities in a teamwork we know nothing about the details of, care to tell us?

  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    Do you know anything we don't? You are talking as if it's -under construction- without knowing that either. We also got anakin-ns solo as -being looked into- as official announcement how long ago?

    you tend to ask this often, but I cannot say what I do or do not know. thats just part of the position and a call I have to make.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    Do you know anything we don't? You are talking as if it's -under construction- without knowing that either. We also got anakin-ns solo as -being looked into- as official announcement how long ago?

    you tend to ask this often, but I cannot say what I do or do not know. thats just part of the position and a call I have to make.

    Then maybe don't throw around speculations that you can't back.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    I am fully aware that you or doja can't do anything or say anything more at this point and I get that. But expecting us to have infinite patience is also ridiculous.

    If for some reason they think that one month is too short on this particular issue, they could respond and say "we're working on it and we think we'll have a decision in x amount of time".

    I'm ok with them setting a deadline for themselves depending on the issue. But when weeks amor months go by and we don't even get that, it's just poor communication.

    And I understand that there is likely little you or doja can do about that. I have had bosses that did things I didn't always agree with as well. But I can at least provide my feedback that as a player, it seems like we should be getting a little more information by this point.

    I'm not sure why you feel the need to argue that we shouldn't expect answers in a timely manner.

    I'm in no way expecting infinite patience, I am trying to do 2 things
    1 - figure out why "this is the day", which I think if fair. each problem is going to affect the community different, and understanding why some issues get to the "deadline" faster than others is helpful. Because I am not saying "dont check in" or express frustration, I'm just wondering how everyone not working there, knows exactly how long each problem should take to get solved or have a decision made.

    2- keep perspective that this problem is not those problems and different things will have different timelines and solutions.

    I get that you want them to do that, but as Doja has said, he can't/won't put out "promises"/deadlines that can be seen as "missed". He wont do it until things are more concrete. There are also cases where they may have an official announcement coming, and he is not likely to comment when he knows something official is coming. As much as we would want him to, that just not really in the cards.

    I'm not sure why I posted today rather than yesterday or tomorrow matters that much to you. How much time is too long without an answer will of course be up for debate. It will depend upon the person posting and the issue we haven't had communication on.

    If you feel they have a good reason for not giving us more information on thos issue, then we can agree to disagree. But I don't think I'm alone on this one in calling out their lack of communication.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    I am fully aware that you or doja can't do anything or say anything more at this point and I get that. But expecting us to have infinite patience is also ridiculous.

    If for some reason they think that one month is too short on this particular issue, they could respond and say "we're working on it and we think we'll have a decision in x amount of time".

    I'm ok with them setting a deadline for themselves depending on the issue. But when weeks amor months go by and we don't even get that, it's just poor communication.

    And I understand that there is likely little you or doja can do about that. I have had bosses that did things I didn't always agree with as well. But I can at least provide my feedback that as a player, it seems like we should be getting a little more information by this point.

    I'm not sure why you feel the need to argue that we shouldn't expect answers in a timely manner.

    I'm in no way expecting infinite patience, I am trying to do 2 things
    1 - figure out why "this is the day", which I think if fair. each problem is going to affect the community different, and understanding why some issues get to the "deadline" faster than others is helpful. Because I am not saying "dont check in" or express frustration, I'm just wondering how everyone not working there, knows exactly how long each problem should take to get solved or have a decision made.

    2- keep perspective that this problem is not those problems and different things will have different timelines and solutions.

    I get that you want them to do that, but as Doja has said, he can't/won't put out "promises"/deadlines that can be seen as "missed". He wont do it until things are more concrete. There are also cases where they may have an official announcement coming, and he is not likely to comment when he knows something official is coming. As much as we would want him to, that just not really in the cards.

    I'm not sure why I posted today rather than yesterday or tomorrow matters that much to you. How much time is too long without an answer will of course be up for debate. It will depend upon the person posting and the issue we haven't had communication on.

    If you feel they have a good reason for not giving us more information on thos issue, then we can agree to disagree. But I don't think I'm alone on this one in calling out their lack of communication.

    I absolutely feel that the reasons Doja has given as to why he may not be able to give more frequent or informative updates are very sound and reasonable.
  • Konju
    1142 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.

    we can agree to disagree on this point, you either have faith or you do not. them being more open is just more words for people to not believe or pick apart to make them say (or promise) things they didn't. Which is at least in part the reasoning Doja has expressed as to why he may not be able to comment as frequently or as informative as we would like.

    as I said in the other thread where you made the same broad, but specific statement " they could make", its just more words to say the same thing as "we are looking into it", but those more words means the whole process involves more people and approvals to get out. Time (that for the people working on the issues) is better spent working towards a resolution. (even if that resolution is "its too expensive" <<#tophatwordstoliveby)
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.

    we can agree to disagree on this point, you either have faith or you do not. them being more open is just more words for people to not believe or pick apart to make them say (or promise) things they didn't. Which is at least in part the reasoning Doja has expressed as to why he may not be able to comment as frequently or as informative as we would like.

    as I said in the other thread where you made the same broad, but specific statement " they could make", its just more words to say the same thing as "we are looking into it", but those more words means the whole process involves more people and approvals to get out. Time (that for the people working on the issues) is better spent working towards a resolution. (even if that resolution is "its too expensive" <<#tophatwordstoliveby)

    Similarly all that you say about more people and approvals are pure baseless speculation that is completely based on your subjective faith.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.

    we can agree to disagree on this point, you either have faith or you do not. them being more open is just more words for people to not believe or pick apart to make them say (or promise) things they didn't. Which is at least in part the reasoning Doja has expressed as to why he may not be able to comment as frequently or as informative as we would like.

    as I said in the other thread where you made the same broad, but specific statement " they could make", its just more words to say the same thing as "we are looking into it", but those more words means the whole process involves more people and approvals to get out. Time (that for the people working on the issues) is better spent working towards a resolution. (even if that resolution is "its too expensive" <<#tophatwordstoliveby)

    Similarly all that you say about more people and approvals are pure baseless speculation that is completely based on your subjective faith.

    is Doja the one making the changes? no. does he need to directly talk to anyone directly making the changes to know that the dev team is aware of an issue and are looking into it? no

    would getting details about the changes being looked at by the person doing the looking or examining changes involve a meeting with that person? yes.

    thats not faith.

    I have also at this point seen enough of their process around when a decision is made and communications are made about those changes to have some idea of the involvement in the process. So again not faith.

    Through conversations with Doja and Crumb, we have tried to establish a fairly good idea of what can be responded to and what cannot, without approvals. (but this is still a work in progress) Not faith.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.

    we can agree to disagree on this point, you either have faith or you do not. them being more open is just more words for people to not believe or pick apart to make them say (or promise) things they didn't. Which is at least in part the reasoning Doja has expressed as to why he may not be able to comment as frequently or as informative as we would like.

    as I said in the other thread where you made the same broad, but specific statement " they could make", its just more words to say the same thing as "we are looking into it", but those more words means the whole process involves more people and approvals to get out. Time (that for the people working on the issues) is better spent working towards a resolution. (even if that resolution is "its too expensive" <<#tophatwordstoliveby)

    Similarly all that you say about more people and approvals are pure baseless speculation that is completely based on your subjective faith.

    is Doja the one making the changes? no. does he need to directly talk to anyone directly making the changes to know that the dev team is aware of an issue and are looking into it? no

    would getting details about the changes being looked at by the person doing the looking or examining changes involve a meeting with that person? yes.

    thats not faith.

    I have also at this point seen enough of their process around when a decision is made and communications are made about those changes to have some idea of the involvement in the process. So again not faith.

    Through conversations with Doja and Crumb, we have tried to establish a fairly good idea of what can be responded to and what cannot, without approvals. (but this is still a work in progress) Not faith.

    Do you know specially pertaining to this issue that any of these processes took place, when and how? You really should stop speaking from a position of authority when you don't have that authority and restrict your contribution to forums to be a forum moderator/player of the game. You are speaking as if you know things we don't while that might not be the case at all with your vague euphorisms. This process is obscuring a clear line of communication between the players and -the developer team- which you are not a part of.
  • And if that's not the case and you are holding some type of authority that moderator position normally doesn't, we should be informed about that fact and what to expect out of your statements, how much responsibility they hold coming from someone from a position of authority such as @CG_Doja_Fett . Up till that point you are like a smoke screen that confuses everyone with your biased views (biased given that you have access to things we don't) including me, I can never say what you know or don't or where any of your statements are coming from.
  • Konju
    1142 posts Member
    Who approves or doesn’t approve posts on the forums? I’m pretty annoyed having to go through a filter when I have never cursed, bullied, threatened or engaged in any other nefarious activity on here.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Jakdnels wrote: »
    the last thing (on Nov19th) posted by CG Crumb was:

    First up is Bronzium packs, these originally were not going to be changed due a technical issue but seeing how important this was to you, the team dedicated some extra time to this and was able to find the issues that were preventing us from updating Bronzium Packs. Character shards dropped from Bronzium Packs will be doubled with the Anniversary Update. (This does not affect full character drops from Bronzium packs)

    There's no indication in that statement that they're continuing to look into the full drops at all. I believe CG DogaFett said he'd take the full drop concerns to the devs on Nov 17th, but that was before Crumb's post. Do we have any indications from the devs that they're looking into the full drop shard changes at this point or are they done making changes?

    They are looking at things, is the last message I got from Doja, but obviously this doesn't guarantee anything.

    It would be nice to get an official statement from CG. It's been several weeks. I assume everyone is back from Thanksgiving by now.

    I am just waiting for him to get "into the office" before I ping him for exactly that. but that doesn't guarantee anything.

    Hopefully we can get an answer then. I think the lack of an answer is worse at this point. If they aren't fixing the bronizum nerf, just say so.

    "at this point".....

    unfortunately, I am sorry to say, he will not be meeting your arbitrary deadline.

    may I ask why now is the time when they have to say something? Can't they be waiting to get a little more information on their end to see if they can get a fix in?

    It isn't an arbitrary deadline. But I actually do have patience and even advocate for it in the forums when people expect an immediate answer to an issue. But when weeks or months pass and the dev's refuse to tell us one way or the other what they plan to do (if anything) about the bronizum nerf or the concerns people have with see, it is worse than just saying "we looked at th ef issue and won't be making changes".

    It doesn't take a month to make a decision on whether they intend to fix the bronizum nerf or not. Making the decision doesn't even take a week. Implementing it may take until the next update but they can communicate their intentions before that.

    How do you know it doesnt take a month?

    How is that not arbitrary? Do you have knowledge of this issue that let's you know a month or any time is the correct amount?

    What if it's more than a decision and part of looking into it involves examining actual code and solution to see if they could work both code wise and any implication they might put out into the economy?


    I get that you want them to answer, as do I, but without knowledge or information from them, isnt this an arbitrary deadline?

    I think a month is more than enough time to get a "yes this will be fixed" or a "no this will not be fixed any time soon" answer.

    Call it arbitrary if you want. I like that doja has at least started responding to new issues quickly with the we're looking into it.

    But if all they do is respond with "we're looking into it" and we don't hear anything for months, it is little better than them just ignoring us in the first place.

    If not a month than how long should we have to wait for an answer. It's been over two months on the See needs a buff thread. Or is expecting something other than "we're looking into it" on that too arbitrary too.

    I think that we need to get some kind of timely response on many issues other than "we're looking into it". Without some kind of arbitrary deadline, then CG just ignores the issue altogether. So I just say it. Yes, they should have an arbitrary deadline as to when they give us something on issues like this. Otherwise they will ignore it indefinitely.

    yes it is arbitrary, a month is a timeline you pick without any knowledge of what is going on.

    expecting something is not arbitrary, the lines of "at this point they should have X" or other deadlines that somehow "it has been enough time" are arbitrary, because they are not based on information. I'm not sure what he can say if they are looking into it, that is what is going on at this point and time..... as he has said, he will not comment in any way that can lead to being inaccurate or construed as a promise that may be "broken or missed"

    That is one way to make a stand, but that doesn't seem like a likely one to help the situation, nor does it seem like something that will get you the information you want. I would suggest patience, but I'm sure you feel they have just used that up.

    You are right, it is arbitrary. However, with over a billion dollars in revenue one should expect to see fixes sooner than we do. This is especially true on issues, intentional or not, the devs create through a designed change.

    Yes we should expect to see fixes. but each problem is unique and "sooner than we do" is again an arbitrary timeline that will always be different for each issue, and the real world timeline will again be different from those.

    All deadlines are arbitrary. The shard economy change was an arbitrary deadline. Waiting for them to decide on a timeline for a fix to a problem they created should not be the solution. Pushing them to fix it is. Sooner the better. Very common solution.

    If your water heater goes out, you expect a fix. If you call someone about fixing it and they tell you we are looking into the problems and wait a full month to hear about a solution, you would be upset. Now a water heater may be more essential, but it also costs less than many have spent on this game.

    As I have now posted in different threads, this communication doesn’t have to be a conclusion, but an answer such as:

    “The dev team are looking into potential fixes on the bronzium full character drops and the relation it has to shard shop currency. A number of solutions have been looked into including adjusting drop rates, ally token acquisition, gear prices in shard shop etc etc. We have yet to determine the best fix, however we expect this to be resolved by “date”

    This is after all a problem they created. If they decide it isn’t a problem worth spending time on, then they should communicate why they made that decision and (without spoiling) what they are working on. Open communication goes a LONG way to restoring faith in the dev team since the time they lost it.

    we can agree to disagree on this point, you either have faith or you do not. them being more open is just more words for people to not believe or pick apart to make them say (or promise) things they didn't. Which is at least in part the reasoning Doja has expressed as to why he may not be able to comment as frequently or as informative as we would like.

    as I said in the other thread where you made the same broad, but specific statement " they could make", its just more words to say the same thing as "we are looking into it", but those more words means the whole process involves more people and approvals to get out. Time (that for the people working on the issues) is better spent working towards a resolution. (even if that resolution is "its too expensive" <<#tophatwordstoliveby)

    “More words” from my examples include further evidence for reasonable people. Unreasonable people will continue to be unreasonable, more words or less words do not come into play.

    CG’s self-created bureaucracy does not get them off the hook. I do not blame this on Doja, I understand he is an employee who follows company guidelines.

    We can agree to disagree. The argument has shifted to how a billion dollar company is or is not operating appropriately in regard to their customer service.
  • Seems like their priorities didn't lie elsewhere and all the processes in the team took place. Whoop dee doo.
  • Thanks for that fix, that really will resolve all the issues we have! When can we expect those changes?
  • Konju
    1142 posts Member
    There we go. A reasonable fix. Thank you CG!
  • StarSon
    7419 posts Member
    Great, now they made relic salvage worse. Can't they just give us something without taking something away?
  • Hail @DarkHelmet1138 the prophet with his arbitrary deadlines!
  • a nice elegant fix- thx!
  • They're actually trying. Kudos
  • Ultra
    11486 posts Moderator
    StarSon wrote: »
    Great, now they made relic salvage worse. Can't they just give us something without taking something away?

    giphy.gif
  • Ultra wrote: »
    StarSon wrote: »
    Great, now they made relic salvage worse. Can't they just give us something without taking something away?

    giphy.gif

    Only liking it cause I can't love it. :smile:

    Good fix.
  • TVF
    36559 posts Member
    Lol StarSon finding a way to complain about this one too.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • From a mathematical point of view and considering the infinite game to double the statistical chances of seeing a complete character in the brozium package, it resolves the amount of material to sacrifice in the long run. For me it is ok and as incredible as it may seem I will not complain, but in no way will I take away the reason of the person who finds the measure insufficient.
  • Gifafi
    6017 posts Member
    StarSon wrote: »
    Great, now they made relic salvage worse. Can't they just give us something without taking something away?

    looooooooooooooooooool
    Maybe End Game isn't for you
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