Upcoming Changes To The Pit Challenge Tier [MEGA]

Replies

  • MaruMaru
    2131 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Endgame content should award endgame gear...end of story. If it doesn’t, make it easier for all to complete. This is another one of those headscratchers...when CG says it is end game content but awards early game gear. Looks like they also did this with Conquest. It really is a kick in the pants.

    Yeah, this is where Kyno 's -what if those gear are still needed by some- scenario falls apart.

    No it doesnt, because the event does award end game rewards.

    Not really. It also has -rewards- no endgame player needs to dilute the pool and lessen the real endgame rewards. Prove otherwise if you can.

    So you meant it should only offer end game rewards. (That was not what was stated)

    Prove that if other rewards were not included we would get more endgame rewards....

    So...you're admitting that they're there to dilute the reward pool then? Because if they weren't, then obviously we'd get more endgame rewards without the early-game gear there. Because earlier you were arguing that that might not be the reason, so which is it?

    No I'm actually very sure if they changed anything about the other rewards, we would not get more of the Aeros.

    But in the end. As I said they need to let changes settle before they make more.

    If those pieces are just there to fluff those particular boxes, then it's still a conversation they need to have to balance those boxes the way they want.

    All I was saying is they need to talk about it, and other said they dont need to....

    In the end they will make the changes they feel are right for the content we have. I know it's a conversation they are having, but nothing will happen at this time, as they are focused on the mechanics changes right now.

    They made up the drop tables. Did they put the fluff gear accidentally in there and without talking and deliberately deciding that to be the case?
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Endgame content should award endgame gear...end of story. If it doesn’t, make it easier for all to complete. This is another one of those headscratchers...when CG says it is end game content but awards early game gear. Looks like they also did this with Conquest. It really is a kick in the pants.

    Yeah, this is where Kyno 's -what if those gear are still needed by some- scenario falls apart.

    No it doesnt, because the event does award end game rewards.

    Not really. It also has -rewards- no endgame player needs to dilute the pool and lessen the real endgame rewards. Prove otherwise if you can.

    So you meant it should only offer end game rewards. (That was not what was stated)

    Prove that if other rewards were not included we would get more endgame rewards....

    So...you're admitting that they're there to dilute the reward pool then? Because if they weren't, then obviously we'd get more endgame rewards without the early-game gear there. Because earlier you were arguing that that might not be the reason, so which is it?

    No I'm actually very sure if they changed anything about the other rewards, we would not get more of the Aeros.

    But in the end. As I said they need to let changes settle before they make more.

    If those pieces are just there to fluff those particular boxes, then it's still a conversation they need to have to balance those boxes the way they want.

    All I was saying is they need to talk about it, and other said they dont need to....

    In the end they will make the changes they feel are right for the content we have. I know it's a conversation they are having, but nothing will happen at this time, as they are focused on the mechanics changes right now.

    I don't know why you're talking about Aeromagnifiers when that's not even part of the discussion right now. I don't think anyone who has chimed in during the last page or so of this thread is under any illusion that taking away the earlier game gear would mean that we get more Aeromagnifiers. We're talking about the gear reward crate, which includes much-needed gear like g12 pieces, mk3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, kyrotechs etc, but also gear that most people have thousands of and will never run out of.

    If the earlier game gear were taken out of the reward crate, then obviously we'd get more of the meaningful rewards. Unless CG decides to also lower the quantity of the gear that we actually need, in which case it would become obvious that the earlier game gear is currently only in the crate to dilute the rewards and lessen our chances of getting good rewards. Which is the purpose most of us believe it currently serves, yet you seem to be arguing otherwise. So do you have a good argument for why that gear is in the reward pool then, if not just to dilute the rewards?
  • Kyno
    28732 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Endgame content should award endgame gear...end of story. If it doesn’t, make it easier for all to complete. This is another one of those headscratchers...when CG says it is end game content but awards early game gear. Looks like they also did this with Conquest. It really is a kick in the pants.

    Yeah, this is where Kyno 's -what if those gear are still needed by some- scenario falls apart.

    No it doesnt, because the event does award end game rewards.

    Not really. It also has -rewards- no endgame player needs to dilute the pool and lessen the real endgame rewards. Prove otherwise if you can.

    So you meant it should only offer end game rewards. (That was not what was stated)

    Prove that if other rewards were not included we would get more endgame rewards....

    So...you're admitting that they're there to dilute the reward pool then? Because if they weren't, then obviously we'd get more endgame rewards without the early-game gear there. Because earlier you were arguing that that might not be the reason, so which is it?

    No I'm actually very sure if they changed anything about the other rewards, we would not get more of the Aeros.

    But in the end. As I said they need to let changes settle before they make more.

    If those pieces are just there to fluff those particular boxes, then it's still a conversation they need to have to balance those boxes the way they want.

    All I was saying is they need to talk about it, and other said they dont need to....

    In the end they will make the changes they feel are right for the content we have. I know it's a conversation they are having, but nothing will happen at this time, as they are focused on the mechanics changes right now.

    I don't know why you're talking about Aeromagnifiers when that's not even part of the discussion right now. I don't think anyone who has chimed in during the last page or so of this thread is under any illusion that taking away the earlier game gear would mean that we get more Aeromagnifiers. We're talking about the gear reward crate, which includes much-needed gear like g12 pieces, mk3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, kyrotechs etc, but also gear that most people have thousands of and will never run out of.

    If the earlier game gear were taken out of the reward crate, then obviously we'd get more of the meaningful rewards. Unless CG decides to also lower the quantity of the gear that we actually need, in which case it would become obvious that the earlier game gear is currently only in the crate to dilute the rewards and lessen our chances of getting good rewards. Which is the purpose most of us believe it currently serves, yet you seem to be arguing otherwise. So do you have a good argument for why that gear is in the reward pool then, if not just to dilute the rewards?

    What other thing would you call end game rewards in there? I was responding to end game content should have end game rewards.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Endgame content should award endgame gear...end of story. If it doesn’t, make it easier for all to complete. This is another one of those headscratchers...when CG says it is end game content but awards early game gear. Looks like they also did this with Conquest. It really is a kick in the pants.

    Yeah, this is where Kyno 's -what if those gear are still needed by some- scenario falls apart.

    No it doesnt, because the event does award end game rewards.

    Not really. It also has -rewards- no endgame player needs to dilute the pool and lessen the real endgame rewards. Prove otherwise if you can.

    So you meant it should only offer end game rewards. (That was not what was stated)

    Prove that if other rewards were not included we would get more endgame rewards....

    So...you're admitting that they're there to dilute the reward pool then? Because if they weren't, then obviously we'd get more endgame rewards without the early-game gear there. Because earlier you were arguing that that might not be the reason, so which is it?

    No I'm actually very sure if they changed anything about the other rewards, we would not get more of the Aeros.

    But in the end. As I said they need to let changes settle before they make more.

    If those pieces are just there to fluff those particular boxes, then it's still a conversation they need to have to balance those boxes the way they want.

    All I was saying is they need to talk about it, and other said they dont need to....

    In the end they will make the changes they feel are right for the content we have. I know it's a conversation they are having, but nothing will happen at this time, as they are focused on the mechanics changes right now.

    I don't know why you're talking about Aeromagnifiers when that's not even part of the discussion right now. I don't think anyone who has chimed in during the last page or so of this thread is under any illusion that taking away the earlier game gear would mean that we get more Aeromagnifiers. We're talking about the gear reward crate, which includes much-needed gear like g12 pieces, mk3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, kyrotechs etc, but also gear that most people have thousands of and will never run out of.

    If the earlier game gear were taken out of the reward crate, then obviously we'd get more of the meaningful rewards. Unless CG decides to also lower the quantity of the gear that we actually need, in which case it would become obvious that the earlier game gear is currently only in the crate to dilute the rewards and lessen our chances of getting good rewards. Which is the purpose most of us believe it currently serves, yet you seem to be arguing otherwise. So do you have a good argument for why that gear is in the reward pool then, if not just to dilute the rewards?

    What other thing would you call end game rewards in there? I was responding to end game content should have end game rewards.

    I dunno, maybe the g12 gear in the reward pool? Maybe the mk 3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, mk 3 stun cuffs, mk 5 droid callers, golden eyeballs, kyrotechs that are all needed not only from g8-g11 but also for g12 to get to relics? Unless you have nearly every character at relic levels, there's still a need for these pieces at the end game. You have an absurdly narrow definition of end game rewards if you think that Aeromagnifiers are the only things that qualify
  • Kyno
    28732 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Endgame content should award endgame gear...end of story. If it doesn’t, make it easier for all to complete. This is another one of those headscratchers...when CG says it is end game content but awards early game gear. Looks like they also did this with Conquest. It really is a kick in the pants.

    Yeah, this is where Kyno 's -what if those gear are still needed by some- scenario falls apart.

    No it doesnt, because the event does award end game rewards.

    Not really. It also has -rewards- no endgame player needs to dilute the pool and lessen the real endgame rewards. Prove otherwise if you can.

    So you meant it should only offer end game rewards. (That was not what was stated)

    Prove that if other rewards were not included we would get more endgame rewards....

    So...you're admitting that they're there to dilute the reward pool then? Because if they weren't, then obviously we'd get more endgame rewards without the early-game gear there. Because earlier you were arguing that that might not be the reason, so which is it?

    No I'm actually very sure if they changed anything about the other rewards, we would not get more of the Aeros.

    But in the end. As I said they need to let changes settle before they make more.

    If those pieces are just there to fluff those particular boxes, then it's still a conversation they need to have to balance those boxes the way they want.

    All I was saying is they need to talk about it, and other said they dont need to....

    In the end they will make the changes they feel are right for the content we have. I know it's a conversation they are having, but nothing will happen at this time, as they are focused on the mechanics changes right now.

    I don't know why you're talking about Aeromagnifiers when that's not even part of the discussion right now. I don't think anyone who has chimed in during the last page or so of this thread is under any illusion that taking away the earlier game gear would mean that we get more Aeromagnifiers. We're talking about the gear reward crate, which includes much-needed gear like g12 pieces, mk3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, kyrotechs etc, but also gear that most people have thousands of and will never run out of.

    If the earlier game gear were taken out of the reward crate, then obviously we'd get more of the meaningful rewards. Unless CG decides to also lower the quantity of the gear that we actually need, in which case it would become obvious that the earlier game gear is currently only in the crate to dilute the rewards and lessen our chances of getting good rewards. Which is the purpose most of us believe it currently serves, yet you seem to be arguing otherwise. So do you have a good argument for why that gear is in the reward pool then, if not just to dilute the rewards?

    What other thing would you call end game rewards in there? I was responding to end game content should have end game rewards.

    I dunno, maybe the g12 gear in the reward pool? Maybe the mk 3 carbantis, mk 5 stun guns, mk 3 stun cuffs, mk 5 droid callers, golden eyeballs, kyrotechs that are all needed not only from g8-g11 but also for g12 to get to relics? Unless you have nearly every character at relic levels, there's still a need for these pieces at the end game. You have an absurdly narrow definition of end game rewards if you think that Aeromagnifiers are the only things that qualify

    So by that definition everything is end game mats.... each time they release a new toon we all need low level gear, that doesnt make it end game materials.

    Yes, I would define end game materials as the ones that are needed for the current end of the progression path, and also accented by its exclusivity.
  • Nikoms565
    13806 posts Member
    Just to clarify - are current HPit raids in progress affected by the changes?
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Kyno
    28732 posts Moderator
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Just to clarify - are current HPit raids in progress affected by the changes?

    @Nikoms565 yes.
  • Kyno
    28732 posts Moderator
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    Let me get this straight as now you are making a point on aero’s when much earlier in the thread you said the overall rewards are flatter when you also factor in the gear...as aero’s reward structure obviously not flat. I also kind of figure you didn’t account for the garbage gear you could receive. Then you go back to pointing out aero’s are the endgame reward for the content...not the gear. You are making me dizzy and nauseous. Wouldn’t the endgame exclusive reward then be flatter thus make more sense for the stated experience of a guild working together to defeat the raid especially after this change? The rewards should be consistent with the Requirements of entry, difficulty and effort. Instead you could finish 11th...50000 damage below someone who finished 5th...get shafted on aero’s and receive HAAT gear. The message it sends is not positive.

    You do realize that 2 different conversations can be had about a topic and they are not directly connected, right?

    No one I have been responding to is talking about things being flatter. So I'm not sure on the connection there, as that was not what I was discussing, or responding to.

    The rewards structure has been in the conversation for a while, but they wanted to make this change first and then continue the conversation. Both of these points are being discussed as major points of player feedback about the content. Who knows what will come of it, but one is done and they will wait to see how this settles and then continue their conversation.
  • Themy
    71 posts Member
    Just finished our first Cpit after change. Thanks for making the raid a zergfest, it's SUPER fun now!
  • Themy wrote: »
    Just finished our first Cpit after change. Thanks for making the raid a zergfest, it's SUPER fun now!

    What is your guild's GP? How much time did it take? How many people participated?
  • Konju
    750 posts Member
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.
  • Nauros
    4157 posts Member
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...
    Revive the stores, the game needs it.
  • I started the raid after the update.
    We have 220mpg and we couldn't finish p1 whereas now we think we can go to end of p2. it seems fairer to us because we don't have a lot of GLs and we don't have a 7 star wat yet.
  • Nauros
    4157 posts Member
    Zouss57 wrote: »
    I started the raid after the update.
    We have 220mpg and we couldn't finish p1 whereas now we think we can go to end of p2. it seems fairer to us because we don't have a lot of GLs and we don't have a 7 star wat yet.

    P1 was entirely possible to finish without a single GL or Wat, just with enough standard Padme teams...
    Revive the stores, the game needs it.
  • if you just finish p1 by synchronizing as many people as possible, you worked a lot for nothing because you have to finish the entire raid so instead of shouting at my friends we decided not to run it again before it was changed.
  • Is it too early to go yell at the people claiming this would make the raid harder?????

    Love the changes, love all the people who can't do math complaining about how much harder it would be without it even being live.
  • Ultra
    7441 posts Member
    NataPda wrote: »
    Themy wrote: »
    Just finished our first Cpit after change. Thanks for making the raid a zergfest, it's SUPER fun now!

    What is your guild's GP? How much time did it take? How many people participated?

    380 mil

    About 29

    We think it’s possible to do it with 15

    P4 is just throwing as many teams per minute as you can so you can score higher than your teammates who are also doing the same

    P1 is tougher to score in than before the changes but still not difficult to clear

    overall the raid is a lot easier to complete

    P4 is not even challenging anymore since there are lots of teams that can do 2~4% like rebels / seps / per player etc
  • ShaggyB
    1962 posts Member
    edited March 19
    Nauros wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...

    Went from being able to beat it... to we are 8 hours in and still in phase 1
  • 295M guild

    Took about 8.5 hours because we had no reason to hurry.

    It was really nice to get my runs in when I had 5 or 10 minutes to spare.

    As an officer that helped with coordinating pushes in the old system, this is probably the 3rd best change to the game for me, behind Arena time changes and mod loadouts.
  • ShaggyB wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...

    Went from being able to beat it... to we are 8 hours in and still in phase 1

    How? Vader can still do 6-10% in P1. Padme can still do 3-4%. Were you relying on SLK for P1?
  • Konju
    750 posts Member
    ShaggyB wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...

    Went from being able to beat it... to we are 8 hours in and still in phase 1

    What size guild? How many battling?
  • MaruMaru
    2131 posts Member
    ShaggyB wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...

    Went from being able to beat it... to we are 8 hours in and still in phase 1

    How? Vader can still do 6-10% in P1. Padme can still do 3-4%. Were you relying on SLK for P1?

    Can you drop us a few other %s you saw if there's more.Trying to gauge what to expect from well known old teams.
  • MaruMaru wrote: »
    ShaggyB wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    Konju wrote: »
    I could easily be wrong, but FC Nova may be the guild at 382M GP. The post was within hours of the raid changes so there is a basic time frame as well, but number of players I cannot know.

    So it is fun for those at the top. Wonder what a report from mid-level guild will look like...

    Went from being able to beat it... to we are 8 hours in and still in phase 1

    How? Vader can still do 6-10% in P1. Padme can still do 3-4%. Were you relying on SLK for P1?

    Can you drop us a few other %s you saw if there's more.Trying to gauge what to expect from well known old teams.

    My teams and approx performance
    P1, Vader, 10%
    P1, Padme, 4%
    P2, SLK(r7)+NS, 9%
    P3, Shaak+clones, 3.5%
    P4, Rey+Jedi, 6%
    P4, JML+leftover Jedi, 2-3%
    P4, lots of leftovers for 100-300k
  • MaruMaru
    2131 posts Member
    Great, you shaved of %35 out of %400 all by yourself. Very promising.
  • gura
    20 posts Member
    290 M guild, very easy and relaxed now. 65 minutes.
    We were completing it before either but it was much more stressful
  • Nemyoda
    12 posts Member
    edited March 19
    I wonder if P4 isn't bugged though ? We're a 255M guild, we started the raid a few hours before the change, got through P1 and half of P2 that way with 14 squads, and then slowly inched our way through the rest of P2 and then P3 after the change. This is our first time seeing P4, and I only had 3 leftover squads, but the Rancor seemed to take extra turns even when he wasn't taking damage. At one point he was on ~80% TM, and I used FOO's special to give 100% TM to FOX, but the rancor took a turn instead and killed all my toons, didn't feel right, as I hadn't done any damage, and it should have been a "safe" move ! Anyone else noticed the rancor taking too many turns in P4 ?
    Edit: just figured, Fearsome Foe prevents you from gaining turn meter... that would explain my "bug"...
  • Fantastic change to the raid. My 290m guild got through it for the first time. Thank you!
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