[MEGA] Road Ahead: July 2021

Replies

  • th3evo wrote: »
    Oh dear. You really are struggling to follow this, aren’t you?

    I mentioned my crystal income before you asked for a farming guide. Because I was showing you how it’s possible to unlock GLs quickly without whaling. Remember, it was only part way through this exchange that you introduced the new player element, or any sort of “advice” being needed. I’ve already stated my advice to new players when it comes to GLs. Do other stuff first.

    I also said I started farming the characters instantly, again in response to you rudely mocking anyone who farmed Rose before she was announced as a requirement for Rey. I didn’t say I “had them” instantly. Because I don’t. None of my Bad Batch are even 6* yet.

    Please try to stick to the points in this debate in the relevant order. The forum sorts post chronologically so this shouldn’t be difficult.

    Oh dear. Patronizing DarjeloSalas strikes again.

    I felt I had no choice.
  • Starslayer wrote: »
    Something puzzle me now that Executor is a thing. What’s next ? Which iconic behemoth of a ship could become available later in game to match the power of the Executor ?

    Arvel Crynyd and the A-wing confirmed!
  • My heart sinks a little more with each update
    This is the Way
  • Time to enact Project Mayhem over at CG HQ. Wait…. I just broke the first rule of Project Mayhem.
  • MikKro
    333 posts Member
    Did the road ahead also nerf the number of Galactic Challenges?
  • SerylT2 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Vast majority of the community?

    Loudest, yes, agreed.

    You are the only one on here even arguing against any gear crunch relief. Even Kyne admits it does need to be addressed even as he made excuses for why the Dev's won't do it yet. So calm down there boy.

    Did you check their roster? They rarely upgrade characters beyond what is necessary (for GL requirements for example). With that strategy it makes sense to say there was no gear crunch. Or any crunch of any kind. Because if you dont spend your stuff you have enough. Especially if you have been around for years. At least TVF spent a little money. And overall what they say is valid.

    For me the point is: this kind of roster development is paint-by-numbers. The goals are set for you and you jump as high as someone else wants you to. And what frustrates me a bit is that the game rewards this approach too much while the money comes from somewhere else entirely: from the people who spend money on all the stuff that is nice to have or on personal favourites.
  • Starslayer
    1694 posts Member
    edited July 2021
    SerylT2 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Vast majority of the community?

    Loudest, yes, agreed.

    You are the only one on here even arguing against any gear crunch relief. Even Kyne admits it does need to be addressed even as he made excuses for why the Dev's won't do it yet. So calm down there boy.

    For me the point is: this kind of roster development is paint-by-numbers. The goals are set for you and you jump as high as someone else wants you to. And what frustrates me a bit is that the game rewards this approach too much while the money comes from somewhere else entirely: from the people who spend money on all the stuff that is nice to have or on personal favourites.

    Being a paint by numbers guys, I can only agree with that statement. Not sure about the spent money thing, it could be players wanting more paint.
    However, it doesn’t mean there are no strategy with this approach. From my end (can’t talk for every painter out there), there are enough pictures to paint so I can’t paint them all. And the choice is not only about the character I’ll unlock but also about the prerequisites. For instance, I unlocked jml partly because it was an opportunity to upgrade my rebels.
    But don’t think I don’t have fun. I like very much to have all these strategic choices to make.

  • TVF
    31764 posts Member
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    I for one love how every time the gear economy is brought up it always reverts to we as players must be wasting our resources if we don't have enough.

    It's the only thing under your control though.

    Is there a secret button I'm unaware of that lets me select what gear I get in raids? Please, enlighten me to where it is!

    TVF quoted only the part that fit his narrative. Right after complaining about bad faith arguments.

    I quoted the part relevant to my argument.

    I for one love how every time the gear economy is brought up it always reverts to we as players must be wasting our resources if we don't have enough. for the past year and a half I have only worked on GL reqs. I am struggling to push Cad & Bo Katan to G12.

    It's not about us players "wasting" our resources. You can't waste what you don't have. I've been getting crappy conquest loot boxes, something Crumb referenced as "easing" the gear crunch (spoiler alert: they've not eased anything); Tank rewards are and have always been horrible and they need to be improved. Raids have an awful lot of exclusive gear but they sure don't drop regularly for most of us.

    But CG knows all this. They've known it for ages. Gathering more data is going to tell them the same thing they've known the whole time. At a certain point you stop collecting data and start acting on it. CG has failed to do so. I suspect, given the ad that popped up yesterday for the gear everyone's low on but everyone needs for $25, that CG's new business model is to just get us to pay for it directly.

    You ignored the part where he talks about gear acquisition being mostly RNG based which isn't something under our control.

    1) Already addressed it from the other end
    2) "Mostly RNG" is still partly your fault, if you are relying on prize boxes to build your stockpiles
    3) Have a great day :smile:

    2.) Then why did Crumb say that those prize boxes in Raids, GC, Conquest and daily objectives, and the like alleviate gear crunch? If they aren’t meant to be sources of income why are devs specifically citing those as great sources of gear to alleviate the gear crunch?

    You'd have to ask Crumb. Believe it or not, I play the game that exists, not what the devs claim exists. And I don't rely on prize boxes. They help when you get good RNG, yes, but I don't live box-to-box.

    So then I’m curious how long it takes you for a GL farm. Better yet, just based on the first round of Lord Vader reqs, if you decided to go for him, what would your timeline be just for those? Hunter, Tech, Wrecker, Tusken Raider and Padme.

    Also, if you don’t get your gear from those prize boxes, where does it come from?

    1) I have all the gear for LV Group 1 plus all the Exec toons, and then some.
    2) I didn't say I don't get my gear from prize boxes, I said it's not the only source. And furthermore, if you collect more gear than you spend, the good hits from prize boxes will add up over time.

    Ok so you’re saying you have all the gear ready for Executor, LV group 1 and extra….

    Currently you have:

    Lord Vader:
    Wrecker- G2
    Tech- G2
    Hunter- G2
    Tusken Raid- G7
    Padme- R3

    That means you need:
    Wrecker- 250 kyro prods, 150 kyro computers, 450 mk3 carbs, 200 mk5 guns, 150 mk3 cuffs and 150 biotech components.

    Tech- 250 kyro prods, 150 kyro computers, 200 mk3 carbs, 100 mk5 guns, 50 Mk 3 cuffs, 50 mk8 biotech components

    Hunter- 250 kyro computers, 150 kyro prods, 100 mk3 carbs, 100 mk3 cuffs, 50 stun guns, 50 biotech components.

    Raider- 100 kyro computers. 400 mk3 carbs, 200 mk5 guns, 200 mk3 cuffs, 100 biotech components

    Padme/Gas- Relic material.

    So that means for just lord Vader you need to have….

    650 kyro prods, 650 kyro computers, 1150 mk3 carbs, 550 mk5 guns, 500 mk3 cuffs and 350 biotech components.


    Executor:
    Vader- R3
    Piett- G9
    Bobba- G12
    IG88- g11
    Dengar- g11
    Bossk- G12
    Imperial Tie- g12

    You need….

    Vader- Relic material

    Piett- 250 kyro prods, 150 kyro computers, 50 mk3 carbs, 100 mk5 guns, 200 mk3 cuffs, 150 biotech components

    Bobba- 100 kyro prods, 50 mk5 guns, 50 biotech

    IG88- 100 kyro prods, 50 mk3 carbs, 50 mk5 guns, 50mk3 cuffs, 200 biotech components

    Dengar- 100 kyro computers, 100 mk3 carbs, 50 mk5 guns, 100 biotech component

    Bossk- 100 kyro prods, 50 biotech components

    Imperial Tie- 100 kyro prods. 50 mk5 guns, 50 mk3 cuffs

    Bringing executor to….
    650 kyro prods, 250 kyro computers, 200 carbs, 300 mk5 guns, 300 mk3 cuffs, 550 biotech components.


    A grand total of

    1300 kyro prods
    900 kyro computers
    1350 mk3 carbs
    850 mk5 guns
    800 mk3 cuffs
    850 biotech components.

    You have all that and then some? Mind you this doesn’t include other G9-G11, G12, g12+, finishers or relic material. So add all that in tooThis is also just for 1 group of reqs for LV and the Executor….but hey, no need to relieve the gear crunch right?

    You don't think I did the math already? I have:

    2450 kyro prods
    1800 kyro computers
    3000 carbs
    2550 stun guns
    2000 cuffs
    1800 bio

    And all current GL other than SEE. And as already stated, $450 spent over 4.5 years.

    I’d love to see pictures of this

    Send me a PM reminder.

    Lmao ok. Excuses. Gotcha!

    ?????

    How is this an excuse? Send me a reminder so I can send it to you when I'm at a desktop that I can upload screenshots on.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of the change to the shipment tab. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    31764 posts Member
    Starslayer wrote: »
    SerylT2 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Vast majority of the community?

    Loudest, yes, agreed.

    You are the only one on here even arguing against any gear crunch relief. Even Kyne admits it does need to be addressed even as he made excuses for why the Dev's won't do it yet. So calm down there boy.

    For me the point is: this kind of roster development is paint-by-numbers. The goals are set for you and you jump as high as someone else wants you to. And what frustrates me a bit is that the game rewards this approach too much while the money comes from somewhere else entirely: from the people who spend money on all the stuff that is nice to have or on personal favourites.

    Being a paint by numbers guys, I can only agree with that statement. Not sure about the spent money thing, it could be players wanting more paint.
    However, it doesn’t mean there are no strategy with this approach. From my end (can’t talk for every painter out there), there are enough pictures to paint so I can’t paint them all. And the choice is not only about the character I’ll unlock but also about the prerequisites. For instance, I unlocked jml partly because it was an opportunity to upgrade my rebels.
    But don’t think I don’t have fun. I like very much to have all these strategic choices to make.

    Exactly. I'm having a lot of fun. If I weren't, no way I'd keep playing.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of the change to the shipment tab. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • AlexanderG wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Looooki wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nick_74 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Looooki wrote: »
    Sooooo let's get this out of the way ...

    Has CG replied to any of the post yet ?
    Is Doja leaving CG ? Why the silence and crumb taking the lead ?
    When is the update dropping (Specific date)

    And I guess the most important question ??
    - what data is CG using to arrive at this conclusion in the road ahead ?

    Yes they have.

    No. Because 1 - he is the lead, 2 - a little bit of not our business, not being rude, just saying people have lives.

    No date yet.

    Testing on relic levels.
    I Can understand that you need to do some changes but I don’t get the many of the nerfs like Thrawn and C 3po, how can this be related to relic levels?

    Also if you read the comment it pretty clear that relic 9 is not wanted at this time especially since even the biggest whales are having a hard time reaching relic 8.

    If my personal income was depending of a game like this and I got such a massive negative feedback I would be very worried

    The defense ignoring and such is what is based on relic levels, some of the other changes were based on making/keeping GLs in the tip tier vs counters requiring lower investment (their words not me defending anything).

    There will always be conflict when it comes to pushing development and the pace that which it can happen. Just like good character levels, shouldn't high level relic be harder to get or take longer? (Not taling about the other pinch points along the way)

    The game is always dying, and each thing will always be the last straw. They look at the constructive feedback and they do their best to advocate for what they can when things like this happen. Unfortunately the player base is not always going to have the knowledge or wherewithal to gauge long term effects or future content/additions. Or the ability this may grant devs to make new toons at many levels more efficiently or possibly update older toons. This is not the players fault or anything like that, it's just the nature of being on the outside. I am also not saying this is right or the only way it could be. Or anything like that.

    Kyno nobody has issues with rebalancing due to interactions with defense. That’s fine. However based on crumbs posts and the RA video itself, it’s clear they’re doing this to also neutralize non GL counters. That’s not ok, especially when after over a hundred pages regarding SEE and troopers, posts about JML vs DR, etc all of it was deemed WAI and ok by the devs. They had given it the green light and people invested specifically for counters to GL’s. Now they’re actively taking that investment away.

    As for the gear crunch, sure the newest thing should be the hardest to obtain sure. Unfortunately there’s hasn’t been any alleviation from GEAR 8 gear crunches… when getting from g8 to G12 is still an insufferable grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from G12 to G13 is still an insufferable grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from G13 to R7 is still a massive grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from R7 to R8 is a huge resource sink and only several months old, more progression is not ok. Getting from R8 to R9 is going to be a massive resource dump if R8 is any indication, and what’s more they keep forcing us to use the same relic materials all the way from R1 through R8. Every single piece is the same beyond R5. Carbonite boards, bronzium wiring, chromium transistors, heatsinks, electrium conductors, zimbiddles and of course the signal data’s….that’s just relic.

    Come on Kyno, I get you defending them as par the course but there’s nothing you can say to justify even more progression when G8 gear is still an issue 5 years into the game.

    I was specifically speaking to the player talking about intro of 9 when 8 is hard to get and expressed that, but that's for ignoring that and saying I am in any way defending anything about gear levels. Cheers.

    And I touched on that. R8 to R9 should still be difficult. Even getting to R8 should be tougher but any other mobile game in existence, even MSF with how money hungry and greedy they are have made gear progression easier as your time in the game goes on. Blue and purple gear? Used to be massive choke points like their G13 uniques and G15 currently are. Now? Purple gear is nothing. Getting to G12 is only bottlenecked by gold and training mats; which one will more available than the other, balancing it out over time.

    CG hasn’t done that. At all. They’ve actually made the grind from G8-g13 worse with the introduction of kyro techs. Another 2 gear pieces to farm under the guise of it “alleviating the stun gun crunch” lmao nope, still there! Just worse now.

    What you’re missing the point on even with the person you were talking to is that it’s not an issue of a several month old gear level being hard to obtain. It’s a 5 year old gear issue still being a massive choke point.

    I’m sorry but listening to crumb dance around the question regarding the gear economy in that podcast was the most disingenuous and maddening thing from that whole segment. He’s literally saying that they know how to get more gear to us but don’t want to because they don’t want to completely lose those bottlenecks at lower levels over time. Excuse me? I get keeping those bottlenecks in place so new accounts don’t just gear up in one week, but players that have been in the game for a year or two, let alone since day one, should not be unable to bring characters to G12 with little inconvenience given the bottlenecks still in place at G12, G12+, G13 and every relic level.

    But you are wrong, they have dealt with it "naturally" like they said they are sticking to, at the moment. That is why we have increased income of many pieces over time. Yes this was been fairly in line with the need, which keeps the pace where it is, but that is also needed. We have not slowed in any of these incomes which would be a sign of them not doing anything to address this.

    I am also disheartened by the direct statement that we will not see more of a distinct action to deal with gear (although I have been suspecting as such from the discussions I have had/seen), but I still think there are still possibilities for them to deal with this through existing game modes.

    I have not listened yet, but I get that, they still want a development cycle in the early stages like we had then.

    Also, their “natural” fixes haven’t done anything to specifically target gear crunches that are hindering us all. Crumb mentioned Conquest and GC’s….umm no that doesn’t guarantee even crunch gear rewarded when you have mk4 carbs and guns in the prize boxes and nerf the rewards as you progress rather than reward more. Same for GC’s as that’s more tuned for mod slicing materials.

    What natural things? The daily prize box? I’m sorry I think it’s been almost a month since I saw mk5 guns, mk3 cuffs or mk8 biotech as a prize from there.

    Kyro’s? That made the gear grind WORSE. Not better

    Raid rewards? The same tank rewards in both HAAT and HSTR? Mk6 thermals? Mk4 holodiscs. Mk10 and 11 weapontechs? To this day the best rewards are in the normal Rancor Raids. Crancor is a mixed bag because you could end up with G5 gear or something as great as fully crafted mk5 gun or kyro templates. However to this day I’ve gotten none of that. The best I got was fully crafted G12 gear like the mk12 blast armor.

    Where’s the natural help?



    How to actually fix it?

    Daily challenge rewards? Oh look a solution….

    Guaranteeing gear drops or upping the drop rates? I mean….that could work too.

    Reworking prize boxes in current game modes? That could work too

    There’s several ways for the to do it. They can do it. What they lack is will or the capacity

    How early does a player get r3 or r5? Having enough characters to do daily challenges doeant really sound like a later stage of a roster.

    What current prize boxes have an sort of real divide? Basically Conquest is the only one.

    There are not several ways that actually offer any divide, which is what they seem to be looking for.

    Just something off topic but still related to Gear Crunch. How abt CRancor ? They said they will flatten the reward structure. How has that turned out ? And CRancor is something new.

    Ok back to topic. Daily challenges should be updated, along with arena shop etc.

    Daily challenges can have a newer tier with better rewards

    Shops should be updated with current gear that is needed (add a cap if you want to stop people from hording)

    All these can be done by scaling up the difficulty. Is only a matter of does CG want to do it or not.

    Before someone stone me to death, CG has done this before. Take CRancor as an example. A reskin of the original rancor but much higher difficulty and "better gear" rewards.

    I agree there are many places they could add things to help with the pinch points. It seems they want to have it done in a way that doesnt just remove it all together and that there is some transition point, and they want to use existing modes. Sure this can be done, and sure it doesnt seem to be the highest priority, since it hasn't happened yet, but the current system is manageable and for some there is a level of understanding there.

    In the end changes will happen, and we will see how they want that transition to happen and at what point in development that falls. It is likely to not be a simple solution or as simple as some feel it should be, but we shall see.

    So you agree? There are day one gear bottlenecks that should be taken care of? There are many ways that they can do this, but they just have chosen to do nothing about it? Meaning that the whole podcast dance Crumb just pulled was a fallacy.

    Kyno, honestly the community is tired of their excuses as to why the gear economy is in the state it’s in. The system is not manageable anymore as they further require R8 as basic entry points to unlock units now. They’ve had almost a year since they claimed that they’re taking a hard and more in depth look at the gear economy. It takes longer than that? Ok, because they’ve known this was an issue for longer than that and still have refused to do something about it.

    There’s no excuse anymore. They can’t keep claiming they don’t know how to fix it after how long it’s been an issue. The economy needs rebalancing. Bottlenecks are totally fine in the game for the newest and even relatively new thing. Day one gear? Sorry but any other mobile game in existence similar to this one has relieved day one hour points as new gear progression is announced and implemented

    When have I said there isnt a bottle neck, day one is debatable, but sure things that have been in the game since day one are on the list. We have been discussing how to fix it, so yes there are pinch points that players need to manage.

    Yes they have been dealing with and looking at the situation in many ways. They have been keeping it going, even with some level of increasing demand. Before and after the shard increase they looked at a similar overhaul or changes, and have seemingly concluded that this cannot happen and preserve the points they wish to, so they are looking at a different approach to satisfy all the points in a natural way.

    Please show me the quote where they said they do not know how to fix this.

    The economy as a whole is not going to be rebalanced, that is what they are saying.

    Watch the podcast from the other night. When asked about the gear crunch Crumb danced around the questions regarding the gear economy and couldn’t give a straight answer and said they didn’t know how to tackle the gear economy yet. Sometime after the 50 minute mark for your reference.

    I'm not trying to argue against you or say the developers are right in this but when the community managers obfuscate or say "they don't know how" it seems to me that the issue here is those gear pieces probably generate a lot of revenue. So how do the devs go to the actual decision makers (at EA, presumably) with a proposal to include stun guns in challenges or whatever, without a way of offsetting the cost by raising revenue elsewhere?

    Like most businesses, I don't suppose they want to give away what they can otherwise sell.

    They say let's introduce relic 9! That's the whole point. They're adding gear levels but not alleviating earlier gear crunches. So they continue with the money they've been making and add even more

    I'm not disagreeing- I'm just speculating why the community bods dodge around the issue - they just don't want to say "we can't alleviate stun guns etc as gear brings in a tonne of cash".

    We know that kyros weren't meant to help, they were just a further hurdle for those that had managed to get on top of guns, cuffs et al.
  • Vengence
    1005 posts Member
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Nick_74 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Looooki wrote: »
    Sooooo let's get this out of the way ...

    Has CG replied to any of the post yet ?
    Is Doja leaving CG ? Why the silence and crumb taking the lead ?
    When is the update dropping (Specific date)

    And I guess the most important question ??
    - what data is CG using to arrive at this conclusion in the road ahead ?

    Yes they have.

    No. Because 1 - he is the lead, 2 - a little bit of not our business, not being rude, just saying people have lives.

    No date yet.

    Testing on relic levels.
    I Can understand that you need to do some changes but I don’t get the many of the nerfs like Thrawn and C 3po, how can this be related to relic levels?

    Also if you read the comment it pretty clear that relic 9 is not wanted at this time especially since even the biggest whales are having a hard time reaching relic 8.

    If my personal income was depending of a game like this and I got such a massive negative feedback I would be very worried

    The defense ignoring and such is what is based on relic levels, some of the other changes were based on making/keeping GLs in the tip tier vs counters requiring lower investment (their words not me defending anything).

    There will always be conflict when it comes to pushing development and the pace that which it can happen. Just like good character levels, shouldn't high level relic be harder to get or take longer? (Not taling about the other pinch points along the way)

    The game is always dying, and each thing will always be the last straw. They look at the constructive feedback and they do their best to advocate for what they can when things like this happen. Unfortunately the player base is not always going to have the knowledge or wherewithal to gauge long term effects or future content/additions. Or the ability this may grant devs to make new toons at many levels more efficiently or possibly update older toons. This is not the players fault or anything like that, it's just the nature of being on the outside. I am also not saying this is right or the only way it could be. Or anything like that.

    Kyno nobody has issues with rebalancing due to interactions with defense. That’s fine. However based on crumbs posts and the RA video itself, it’s clear they’re doing this to also neutralize non GL counters. That’s not ok, especially when after over a hundred pages regarding SEE and troopers, posts about JML vs DR, etc all of it was deemed WAI and ok by the devs. They had given it the green light and people invested specifically for counters to GL’s. Now they’re actively taking that investment away.

    As for the gear crunch, sure the newest thing should be the hardest to obtain sure. Unfortunately there’s hasn’t been any alleviation from GEAR 8 gear crunches… when getting from g8 to G12 is still an insufferable grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from G12 to G13 is still an insufferable grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from G13 to R7 is still a massive grind, more progression is not ok. When getting from R7 to R8 is a huge resource sink and only several months old, more progression is not ok. Getting from R8 to R9 is going to be a massive resource dump if R8 is any indication, and what’s more they keep forcing us to use the same relic materials all the way from R1 through R8. Every single piece is the same beyond R5. Carbonite boards, bronzium wiring, chromium transistors, heatsinks, electrium conductors, zimbiddles and of course the signal data’s….that’s just relic.

    Come on Kyno, I get you defending them as par the course but there’s nothing you can say to justify even more progression when G8 gear is still an issue 5 years into the game.

    I was specifically speaking to the player talking about intro of 9 when 8 is hard to get and expressed that, but that's for ignoring that and saying I am in any way defending anything about gear levels. Cheers.

    And I touched on that. R8 to R9 should still be difficult. Even getting to R8 should be tougher but any other mobile game in existence, even MSF with how money hungry and greedy they are have made gear progression easier as your time in the game goes on. Blue and purple gear? Used to be massive choke points like their G13 uniques and G15 currently are. Now? Purple gear is nothing. Getting to G12 is only bottlenecked by gold and training mats; which one will more available than the other, balancing it out over time.

    CG hasn’t done that. At all. They’ve actually made the grind from G8-g13 worse with the introduction of kyro techs. Another 2 gear pieces to farm under the guise of it “alleviating the stun gun crunch” lmao nope, still there! Just worse now.

    What you’re missing the point on even with the person you were talking to is that it’s not an issue of a several month old gear level being hard to obtain. It’s a 5 year old gear issue still being a massive choke point.

    I’m sorry but listening to crumb dance around the question regarding the gear economy in that podcast was the most disingenuous and maddening thing from that whole segment. He’s literally saying that they know how to get more gear to us but don’t want to because they don’t want to completely lose those bottlenecks at lower levels over time. Excuse me? I get keeping those bottlenecks in place so new accounts don’t just gear up in one week, but players that have been in the game for a year or two, let alone since day one, should not be unable to bring characters to G12 with little inconvenience given the bottlenecks still in place at G12, G12+, G13 and every relic level.

    But you are wrong, they have dealt with it "naturally" like they said they are sticking to, at the moment. That is why we have increased income of many pieces over time. Yes this was been fairly in line with the need, which keeps the pace where it is, but that is also needed. We have not slowed in any of these incomes which would be a sign of them not doing anything to address this.

    I am also disheartened by the direct statement that we will not see more of a distinct action to deal with gear (although I have been suspecting as such from the discussions I have had/seen), but I still think there are still possibilities for them to deal with this through existing game modes.

    I have not listened yet, but I get that, they still want a development cycle in the early stages like we had then.

    Also, their “natural” fixes haven’t done anything to specifically target gear crunches that are hindering us all. Crumb mentioned Conquest and GC’s….umm no that doesn’t guarantee even crunch gear rewarded when you have mk4 carbs and guns in the prize boxes and nerf the rewards as you progress rather than reward more. Same for GC’s as that’s more tuned for mod slicing materials.

    What natural things? The daily prize box? I’m sorry I think it’s been almost a month since I saw mk5 guns, mk3 cuffs or mk8 biotech as a prize from there.

    Kyro’s? That made the gear grind WORSE. Not better

    Raid rewards? The same tank rewards in both HAAT and HSTR? Mk6 thermals? Mk4 holodiscs. Mk10 and 11 weapontechs? To this day the best rewards are in the normal Rancor Raids. Crancor is a mixed bag because you could end up with G5 gear or something as great as fully crafted mk5 gun or kyro templates. However to this day I’ve gotten none of that. The best I got was fully crafted G12 gear like the mk12 blast armor.

    Where’s the natural help?



    How to actually fix it?

    Daily challenge rewards? Oh look a solution….

    Guaranteeing gear drops or upping the drop rates? I mean….that could work too.

    Reworking prize boxes in current game modes? That could work too

    There’s several ways for the to do it. They can do it. What they lack is will or the capacity

    How early does a player get r3 or r5? Having enough characters to do daily challenges doeant really sound like a later stage of a roster.

    What current prize boxes have an sort of real divide? Basically Conquest is the only one.

    There are not several ways that actually offer any divide, which is what they seem to be looking for.

    Ahnald has a completely F2P account that’s 9 months old and has only 2 toons at R5. He has 3 or 4 more at G12 and the rest are scattered gear levels. He said it’ll be at least a couple
    More months before he will have a full team of g13 characters. So to get enough toons for those next level of daily challenges, it would take 18-24 months to get enough toons for those levels. You mean after 2 years players shouldn’t have access to relief from the G8 through g11 gear crunch?

    At what GP?

    Also, if there is a place to make it easier to get past a punch point, those will likely be added to a planned farming guide and be happening quicker than the estimate there. Also, once you hit one team, it makes getting the rest of the toons get there quicker, which is something they would need to balance in a situation like this.

    Not saying it's not a possibility, but it's not "oh just do this" simple, like you say it is.

    We also dont know where they really want that line to be. I suspect it's more GP than time based, but that is a guess, and I suspect Conquest will be used,as it's new and has a threshold.

    Umm no that’s not true. For the daily challenges you need tanks, attackers and support/healers for each one respectively. A full team of 5 has a mixture of both. You need 15 toons to handle those challenges.

    Also I believe he is at 1 mil GP just about because he is specifically farming for SLKR, he only has KRU and Hux at R5. OGKylo, FOTP and FOSTP are G12. All others are G11 through G8 for FO. The rest of his roster I believe is around G9/10. That’s after almost a year with dedicated F2P farming. You mean to tell me he’s gonna get 15 toons to R3 by years end? Stahp. That’s him not spending a dime. Can others get there faster? Sure, if they spend. Which…isn’t there the point?

    We all know where CG wants the crunch to be at. This dancing around the question is old. And I mean OLD. That’s why I’m seeing people on here, including myself who spent a fair amount of money on this game go F2P over this. I’m glad. I sincerely hope this affects their bottom dollar enough where they finally wake up and cut the nonsense already.

    I’m not going to pay my hard earned money on a game where my monetary and in game investments are trivialized by arbitrary nonsense and constant flip flopping policy on their end. I can’t tell you how happy I am that I waited to splurge on my 4th GL to see what Lord Vader had in store for us. Saved myself quite a bit of coin.

    I am aware how they work, how many attackers are in the SLKR requirements, and I dont think they have a requirement on the number of toons, but they could add that.

    So once you break open that door, you are accelerating farming right there at that point. Again, just saying those in particular are not as simple as you make it seem, but we can move on.

    Yes that’s the point, once you reach a certain point in your roster development, specific gear should be easier to get. You do realize the mk3 carbs are in various locations including the daily challenges and that’s still a choke point in gear farming l, albeit very lower compared to other gear pieces?
    You mean to tell me that putting Mk5 stun guns in the tank challenge, mk3 cuffs in the support/healer challenge and mk8 biotech components in the attacker challenge at that relic level entry is too much? You’d literally be bringing those 3 gear pieces on par with mk3 carbantis. Would it be an immediate roster boost to G12? No you still need to pick and choose where to use that gear and on who but it alleviates the gear crunch up to G12. You’d still have G12, G12+, G12 finishers and all the relic materials as your choke points….how is that not only creating the jumping divide point they’d want, or making it too easy to get too much gear too early….my lord I feel like I’m talking to a wall here whether it’s you or the dev team and their instance in acting like all is fine

    But what if that point is different than you wsnt it to be, because you are putting it fairly early, which they seem to be saying they dont want to do. So again, just not as simple as you say.

    Really? “What If” and “I don’t wanna” 😂
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    TargetEadu wrote: »
    [quote="Kyno

    If you think they are dishonest, no answers will ever be enough. They are not likely to share direct values or details.

    I'm not sure of a single game that has a beta program and allows those players to speak about the testing done. They dont need your faith.

    While Kyno and I still disagree about what level of info sharing would be ideal, we did have a sidebar about the "they don't need your faith comment." Basically, there was some pronoun confusion. He thought I was attacking the testers, and his response "they" are the testers, not CG.

    I feel like the Beta Testers should still have the faith of the players to know what they want… the point of Beta Testing is that we have faith (or in many cases, don’t) that they will test releases and give feedback in a way that makes the feature better for us.

    (Mainly I’m just trying to fix that quoting disaster.)

    From my understanding people have faith in these members of the community, even though they may not know they are part of the program.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    edited July 2021
    Kyno wrote:

    If you think they are dishonest, no answers will ever be enough. They are not likely to share direct values or details.

    I'm not sure of a single game that has a beta program and allows those players to speak about the testing done. They dont need your faith.

    Answer: World of Warcraft

    Beta testing is typically the stage just before release. By the time you reach that almost all the bugs should be worked out and you are almost ready to go. I think you are confusing this with Alpha (unit) testing.

    If that’s not part of your SDLC, that’s different discussion.

    What your player (customer) base is upset about is the lack of professionalism in the responses. When you say “They don’t need your faith” is pretty much saying “we don’t care”.

    From my understanding they run an open beta, which is a different type of beta. Not to be confused with an alpha group.

    You can see the other posts about my response.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.
    There are more than 24 POs in a day dude - there are a handful of xx:30 and the like
  • MaruMaru
    2641 posts Member
    edited July 2021
    *
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.

    Only top 5 pays decently. You are artificially stretching it beyond reason to drive your argument. You are inventing people that are capable of top 10...but not 1, or top 20 but not 5.

    My argument has nothing to do with me being good, just that what I'm doing being possible by being both arena top farming since the game existed.

    I've yet to see a shard as active as 24*5 people circulate the top. The cordon at the top warrants that not to be case. Theoratically possible =/=reality.

    All I was outlining was possible locations for players to get to, and saying that even if you were the second best, there is still a fair amount of room where others can get to, and make it work. In my previous post I also said make it work at many levels.

    I am working from the understanding that the point is to have fun, and that to some being competitive is fun. People want more gear to have more toons ready or at a higher level to have fun with them. That doesnt mean players (more than just you) are cant make it work and have fun.
  • Nauros
    5165 posts Member
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.

    Only top 5 pays decently. You are artificially stretching it beyond reason to drive your argument. You are inventing people that are capable of top 10...but not 1, or top 20 but not 5.

    My argument has nothing to do with me being good, just that what I'm doing being possible by being both arena top farming since the game existed.

    I've yet to see a shard as active as 24*5 people circulate the top. The cordon at the top warrants that not to be case. Theoratically possible =/=reality.

    Hey, I'm usually capable of top 20 but rarely reaching top 5. Was I invented by Kyno?
  • MaruMaru
    2641 posts Member
    edited July 2021
    Nauros wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.

    Only top 5 pays decently. You are artificially stretching it beyond reason to drive your argument. You are inventing people that are capable of top 10...but not 1, or top 20 but not 5.

    My argument has nothing to do with me being good, just that what I'm doing being possible by being both arena top farming since the game existed.

    I've yet to see a shard as active as 24*5 people circulate the top. The cordon at the top warrants that not to be case. Theoratically possible =/=reality.

    Hey, I'm usually capable of top 20 but rarely reaching top 5. Was I invented by Kyno?

    Quite possibly! Are you over the old gear crunch and think that you don't need much of those anymore? (you forgot to mention -the other arena- which makes your daily revenue around 600-650 crystals)
  • TVF
    31764 posts Member
    Nauros wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.

    Only top 5 pays decently. You are artificially stretching it beyond reason to drive your argument. You are inventing people that are capable of top 10...but not 1, or top 20 but not 5.

    My argument has nothing to do with me being good, just that what I'm doing being possible by being both arena top farming since the game existed.

    I've yet to see a shard as active as 24*5 people circulate the top. The cordon at the top warrants that not to be case. Theoratically possible =/=reality.

    Hey, I'm usually capable of top 20 but rarely reaching top 5. Was I invented by Kyno?

    I was.

    Y'all blaming me for me when you should be blaming him.
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of the change to the shipment tab. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    31764 posts Member
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of the change to the shipment tab. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Majority of SWGOH players:
    p4xjilinqar4.jpeg

    TVF:
    g6l36usdt23x.jpeg
  • TVF
    31764 posts Member
    I also have health insurance :sunglasses:
    The CGDF is no more. Now we hate CG because of the change to the shipment tab. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    MaruMaru wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    BaronFlame wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Many players are making it work, F2P with multiple GLs, and so on. Manageable meaning players are making it work at many levels.
    Making it work because they don't have the recourse isn't the same as making it work because it is "understandable". I guess players are making it work, the same way swallowing a drop of water while parched can still be called drinking water.
    Kyno wrote: »
    Again, some people are understanding that there is a pace and that you can still work within that constraint.
    Again understanding isn't the same as "having no choice in the matter".

    Players who say they are f2p (I point this our because they are not speeding up thing with $$) claim to be very competitive. That seems to be making it work, on a real level since they are playing against other players who are either also making it work or are spending $$.

    We all have many choices in the matter, in fact that's what players rely on to make things work, choices.

    I'm one of those, please don't use us for your argument. We've been farming both arena tops forever to make it work...which is by the nature of arena top not feasible for the population at wide.

    Yes, yes, of course I should not point to examples that support the argument you dont like. Sorry about that.

    That's just lol, as you well know I'm by far a minority amongst f2p. It doesn't lift the problem at large in any meaningful way. If it was upto me, do NOT lift the old gear bottlenecks, just gimme g12+ and kyros!

    I dont know about by far, but I never said this was a majority. But players can and do make it work, even not at your level.

    You know by far simply by calculating how many people can possibly fit on arena tops (where you can assume all are f2p if you want to). That by a simple token makes me by far a minority amongst f2p.

    Top 10, or even top 20 have a decent payout, and there are a lot of shards, but also we have 24 POs in a day.... that's a lot of possible spots, and while I understand you are certain that you are a minority, and "by far", there is no actual way for you to know that, or even provide any data to that. So while you may be good, you are not the only one, and may not be "by far" the minority.

    Only top 5 pays decently. You are artificially stretching it beyond reason to drive your argument. You are inventing people that are capable of top 10...but not 1, or top 20 but not 5.

    My argument has nothing to do with me being good, just that what I'm doing being possible by being both arena top farming since the game existed.

    I've yet to see a shard as active as 24*5 people circulate the top. The cordon at the top warrants that not to be case. Theoratically possible =/=reality.

    All I was outlining was possible locations for players to get to, and saying that even if you were the second best, there is still a fair amount of room where others can get to, and make it work. In my previous post I also said make it work at many levels.

    I am working from the understanding that the point is to have fun, and that to some being competitive is fun. People want more gear to have more toons ready or at a higher level to have fun with them. That doesnt mean players (more than just you) are cant make it work and have fun.

    Cool, so keep not addressing the gear crunch people are rightfully complaining about and make it about your abstract idea of fun (under the gear crunch that does or doesn't exist? decide)

    How am I not addressing the gear crunch?

    I have acknowledged this, a few times at this point.

    And yes players do have fun, i know its shocking that someone would point out that through thoughtful planning and management of resources, some players out there have fun, but its true.

    I hope and have expressed and show/linked many of the thoughts and ideas about this to the dev team. As I express to many players in different threads that while this is part of the process and the process can take time (longer than player want) the best way to enjoy yourself is to find ways to work around/through the issues, because even if/when they do get addressed that plan will very likely still work and help you get even further.
  • Ravens1113
    4644 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »

    So now follow up. How long did it take you to hoard all that? What’s your daily arena finish and what’s your daily fleet finish?
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