[MEGATHREAD] Road Ahead: June 2022 - Datacrons

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  • Ultra
    11574 posts Moderator
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    Gifafi wrote: »
    Literally no one:
    CG: 8 trillion words

    people wanted communication, well... you got more words from CG in one post than last year
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    This RA is the first time I felt the need to voice myself on the forums and make an account. You said, you wanted feedback on the post, so these are my thoughts. I'll address the Datacrons as the last point because this RA showed more pressing problems.

    1. First of all concerning making money: I understand that games NEED to make money. CG is a corporation and not a welfare organizations. I completely understand that. But I am more willing to spend when I feel that either I can support a "good" organization or when I get something in return. You (CG) showed that you are primarily interested in heavy spenders and not in keeping me as a client. So I could only pay for my personal advantage. And the amount of "starvation" people are feeling is off the charts. I understand that in a resource management game, people need to feel that there is always a bigger goal. But the amount people are expected to throw at the is quite ludicrous. So currently I reduced my spending because I feel if I spent money, it'll not benefit my account but only throw me into the next ring of "starvation". And up to this RA I considered myself a heavy spender.

    2. You said you wanted feedback. But anytime the community gives feedback, the reactions are as if almost no feedback was given. Tiny improvements are made but mostly it's like you're waiting for the negative feedback to blow off and then return back to "normal", essentially ignoring most of the feedback. Why am I still writing this? Because I have still hope in this game and you as a company. If it's delusional or well placed can only be decided by your actions.

    3. This RA has very little for the player base/community. If we take out Datacrons it's mostly: the Grand Inquisitor is coming. With almost no new information. I even would accept some "We _can't _talk about more for now". But this was rather disappointing. Especially as the GI currently has taken up no and it's mostly a toy for the top end accounts.

    4. Datacrons. They are looking more interesting that what we have seen in the leaks. And it could probably be even fun. But after what happened to conquest, turning from a fun game mode to an awful slogging task that feels more like a job than a game, I'm very conflicted and feel that the burden of proving that you, CG, can devise more than money making machines but actually fun improvements is completely on your side.

    This RA threw my motivation to an all time low and I'm currently on my way to unlock my next GL. Please give us as a player base something which is primarily fun. This game needs something where it's fun to engage again. Please read the constructive comments in this thread and try to listen to the player base. There's so many things not addressed in the RA that people were waiting for (Sim HSTR and continuing the gear phase are the obvious mentions) that this is quite disappointing.

    I hope for the best.
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    I actually like how this could work out BUT I'm already facing 5-6 mil opponents in GA and I'm sitting at 2.6 this will defiantly make my matches harder.
  • flux_rono
    2137 posts Member
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    This is horrible and seems like it will be even more confusing then omicrons. Yes last month this worked but suddenly this month the abilities are gone and i didnt realise because the devs make TEMPORARY global abilites and stats.

    Just no, this is bad and should just be permenet buffs or cancled all together
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
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    The game is buggy, freezes are still an issue, ships are a mess, the last new piece of major playable content was conquest a year ago, but what CG gives us? A new progression system designed to continually extract money without providing a permanent boost. This is truly a culmination of the direction they have been taking over the past years...
  • Tom1991
    28 posts Member
    edited June 2022
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    How is this meant to revitalize less used parts of my collect when putting a relic 3-7 requirement on it. They said the same thing about conquest, and just like conquest I’ll be using the top of the my roster, just like I already do in TW and GAC. Just a bad way for hard counters to become inconsistent because apparently that’s fun to CG

    [CM - Edited to remove profanity]
    Post edited by EA_Mako on
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    You've GOT to be kidding. How much time do you all think we have??? Simply put, we don't have the time to mess with this after we're done running in circles doing all the other stuff the game requires on a daily basis.

    I'm really feeling like you see me as a Dollar Sign, not a person with other things to do in their life. So yeah.... NOT HAPPY.
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    We got this "Road Ahead" over a month ago from someone on Reddit.

    Nothing to see here folks. Just tone deaf CG as usual. Why do you think it got leaked in the 1st place. CG doesnt listen to it's players. Are we really surprised by this by now?
  • Starslayer
    2421 posts Member
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    3 more months of hoarding it is.
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    Looks like another horrible thing for majority of the player base and more garbage linked to conquest.

    I already quit my guild because I refuse to make time to play conquest after CG decided to deliberately take the fun out of it.
    (Had all GLs before unlocking Maul, still literally years away from the other conquest unlocks)

    Looks like I’ll have to quit this more casual guild too if I start dragging them down and start my own one man guild.

  • DeusArt
    134 posts Member
    edited June 2022
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    I don't think that blind critics helps and will try to be constructive.
    1. First of all I like requirements of datacrons. It means that this mechanic will be late game advantage. It's good because I, for example, could focus on my main priorities(getting Executor).
    2. Another positive side - no effect on ships and fleet arena is still the biggest source of crystals(I'm right?).
    3. Also positive - special resources for updates. No needs to lowering progress from gearing and relicing other units.
    4. I like idea to make it temporary, but 3 months is too short period. As example I need a month or more to relic unit that is needed for datacron, and does it worth it? Relic him only for one month playtime or just skip it. On my opinion 1 year period would be excellent, we have time build roster for datacron.
    5. What means dismantled? How much resources we will receive from it? Will it be 1 to 1 or 1 to 0.8 or 1 to 0.5? It's important question. Would it be better to spend resources when we have a chance or just keep it until there will be really few good datacrons? Of course as player I want to it to be 1:1 and saving my global progress across account.
    6. Also, I think GLs should excluded from datacrons. It will be a reason to work on roster at all, not only rushing GLs.
    7. And yes, like was said in this thread before - there should be huge update for gear farming to make datacrons useful for masses.
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
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    GRANDOLA wrote: »
    I firstly would like to acknowledge that the economy of the Datacrons being seperate is appreciated. I like the layout and implementation so far in relation to their release and the abilities I have seen are powerful and worth pursuing.

    I would have 2 main questions I think need addressing that I didn't see asked so far(Sorry if I missed them).
    1. With the Datacrons being tied to the new cycles that now come with GAC and conquest, will any delay due to bugs(looking at previous conquests being cancelled due to issues) be reflected in the Datacron lifecycle? If conquest gets pushed back a week(and possibly moves GAC) will my Datacron be extended to match?
    2. Will the conquest pass and pass+ be giving more materials to users to manage Datacrons?

    The economy is separate, but there is still the relic requirement. So the strain on existing resources is there, just a bit more sneaky. And with the gear changes dead halfway into phase 1...
  • zatho
    747 posts Member
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    These Sets share a common structure (think: common, uncommon, and rarer versions of each Material type), but each can only be used for its matching Datacrons. This is intended to ensure that Players can chase each set without worrying about “missing out” on future opportunities. It also ensures the system can reduce inflation over time, allowing us to keep upgrade costs more stable over time and a fair start to each new Set’s release.

    That sounds more like they don't want us to hoard currency and then max out a single datacron f2p. Again nice words that shall deceive us about their true intentions.
  • Zedstar
    22 posts Member
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    Maybe the idea is to keep ignoring the players and to keep doing stuff no one wants to get us all to quit and then they can move 100% on to LOTR new game.
    I have never known a company to ignore the fans and players so much and just to continually bring out stuff A. No one wants and B. That is going to potentially ruin the playing experience 🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤯
  • Options
    So, shortly:
    - one more grind
    - broken teams may become even more broken.

    Fatigue is the word.
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    First of all, I loved how CG has been doing over last months. Broadening the roster, making older characters more viable, and a fun new faction that will probably come full circle when Grand Inqisitor arrives. Even the GAC changes where I was fully against, turned out to be one of the greatest things they did. (Lets not talk about LV tho, still not happy about that). And honestly, I do get the *idea* of adding another layer of strategy and new power creep to keep the game interesting and to keep people invested. But the one thing that absolutely makes me uncomfortable to a new undescribable level and I absolutely loathe, is the temporary aspect to it. Also it might add complexity to frustrating extent with GAC in mind. We'll have to see how things work out in reality, but absolutely without a doubt not happy with this. High investment for something temporary, yikes, no thank you.
  • joelgs23
    251 posts Member
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    I want to like this, but the timing is not good with all the other more pressing issues in game like Fleet load outs, massive gear issues, etc.
  • Gavsta
    203 posts Member
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    👎 .... nothing else to say which is either constructive or printable.
  • flux_rono
    2137 posts Member
    edited June 2022
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    deleted
  • Lumiya
    1575 posts Member
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    @CG_Tusken_Meathead @CG_SBCrumb I have real concerns what this means for new/mid game players and where it leaves them in the game.

    Relics - Right now players get stuck around G7/8 when they gear characters. The (high) amount of gear and relics needed is something these players will struggle with immensely. Having R5 or even R7 is already very difficult for them, but to have them on so many characters, especially non meta characters is impossible.
    This means smaller players with smaller rosters will have a disadvantage.

    Datacrons and materials - The better stuff is exclusive to Conquest hard mode or big guild players, so everyone below that will automatically have a huge disadvantage again.

    RNG of rolls will put these players again in a disadvantage situation, because they likely will have a harder time to be able to reroll. Nevermind the fact that even these rerolls will be pure RNG. Although this might also apply to bigger players.

    Add to that, that Datacrons will only be temporary, even if these smaller players would like to gear up those characters, they will likely not have enough time to even do so before the Datacrons are gone again. To make such a huge investement for something they can only use for a short amount of time and what would derail their current project, means again that they would likely not (be able to) do it.

    This all would be maybe ok, if these players would not have to engage in GAC with bigger players. As it is now, GAC is the main source of crystal income for players and these bigger players already have an advantage over the smaller players because of roster size/depth.
    GP differences of 3-4M GP + are found on a regular basis throughout all Leagues and with the Datacrons added, it will give these bigger players even more advantage over the smaller/mid game players they are matched with.

    How are all the new/mid game players supposed to see or feel that they have a fair chance against their opponents? They see the Gap between them and the bigger players is made even bigger with GP gated characters and Datacrons. All this does is giving them the feeling, that they will never be able to catch up and the gap widens more and more. The more it happens, the more they feel a lack of incentive to even stay in the game and keep playing or to spend money.
    Maybe the idea was that they would feel more incentive to spend, but noone is going to spend money if they see that they need at least 2 years of playtime before they are even able to start getting into those modes that will allow them to start getting new/better things, because it will again take time until they have enough to be able to do something with it. I don't think the prospect of needing at least 3 years until you are at that point, without knowing how the game will look then or what else will be added, is a good outlook for any new/smaller or mid game player.

    Are there some plans to make it easier for every new/mid game player to catch up and closing the gap a bit more?
    We are all made of star-stuff
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    Ultra wrote: »
    Gifafi wrote: »
    Literally no one:
    CG: 8 trillion words

    people wanted communication, well... you got more words from CG in one post than last year

    And all for a change which virtually every player has indicated to CG, after the recent leak, was absolutely NOT wanted, and was a terrible direction for the game yet they still go ahead with it blindly ignoring everyone who actually plays the game - yeah, great communication!
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    Question: Was the workload that datacrons add for TW officers considered during the design process?

    Context:
    I believe it's in CG's best interest to increase the creation of high GP guilds to incentivize spending, and to raise engagement of game modes such as Territory Wars. High GP guilds strongly depend on motivated TW officers, who are now forced to deal with raised complexity for no additional rewards, on an already highly time pressurized game mode.

    Adding additional complexity for these handful of people who are keeping high gp guilds running, leads to burnout and thus guilds falling apart when nobody wants to replace them. I would strongly recommend more closely working together with these key cogs in the entire machine you've built, because I'm not getting the impression you've recognized their importance to your bottom line.

    If you want to raise GAC and TW engagement and help older players catch up, then consider massively rewarding players or guilds for beating opponents significantly over them in GP. A 3.5M GP player beating a 6M player in GAC should earn way more rewards than for beating someone of their own GP. A guild in TW that faces a guild with 30M more GP that lost twice should be able to earn at least triple the rewards if they can pull off a miracle win.
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    CG: Datacrons give you a stronger reason to care about upgrading a character over time and have it be a valuable addition to your roster at day 1, or for months and years down the road.

    Truth: Umm, no! Actually Datacrons are the exact OPPOSITE of that, since they are temporary and disintegrate after no more than 90-days they give you LESS REASON to care about upgrading a character with them, as they do NOT make for a valuable addition since they are temporary, and do NOT last for 'years down the road'! They are actually just a blatant attempt to grab money from whales whilst ruining the game balance and fairness for everyone else!

    Worst game change ever made by a million parsecs!!
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    I’m just excited for a new in-game currency. Can never have enough of those. I wish there was an in-game currency that you could use to hire your own private investigator to help you understand that last road ahead post.
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    1. The bandwagon must be nearly full now?
    2. I have a feeling that a lot of people pooing on this, don't fully understand it.
    3. I doubt there's anybody who fully understands it yet.
    4. Worst thing in the game for me is the jump in the power curve between top legendaries and GLs. I've liked how CG have tried to address this over the last year.
    5. This may help let teams punch up to GLs.
    6. Oh JMK is getting a datacron in the first batch. :( I guess he really needed it............

    I don't fully understand the fuss about gear shortages. As I understood it, CG were going to make changes until they were happy with the balance. I guess they reached that. Personally, I don't overly care about mk3 carbantis and mk5 stun guns anymore. I never have a shortage like I did.

    It does annoy me that they created a new gear sticking point with the shock prods though......

    So I'm not sure if I don't get carbanti and stun gun shortages because they addressed it enough or collecting shock prods stops me getting short of them. A bit of both I guess.
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    I really understand that EA does not exist for public welfare and has to generate a good income and that you have to motivate your players to invest some money in the game. But inventing Datacrons will be a dead end that will bring players to quit the game. Why?

    The fun of this game was always to work towards a goal you set yourself like beating CPit, getting this GL or join the top 5 of ship arena. You permanently have to learn how new teams/characters behave in differnt situations of the game to develop strategies how to stand against difernt combinations of teams. Sure, this game had always beeing like living organism and things were constantly changing. E.g with eventing Omicrons a so far quite unuseful toon become important for TW od GAC but these changes came toon by toon an were permanently. You were able to learn about the new abilities and develop a new strategy against it.
    Datacrons will wash this away. The team you easily beaten last GAC could be an absolute nightmare, now. Not permanently but maybe for 3months. Because all things are steadily changing there is no chance anymore to develop a strategy against something. Fighting in GAC or TW becomes more or less a roulette.

    The other point is: This game is very time consuming if you want to play on a half competemptive level. With Datacrons the time you need to invest in the game to do all the research and reorganising will increase that it could overburden people.
    I definetly do not want to live in the game.

    And last but not least:
    Your motivation to use omicrons for a comback of older or not useful teams is quite ****. Why?:
    If a team is not useful I did not invest resources to bring it up to relic level.
    So the datacons will be of no use. And I won't interrupt my carring farming project to invest in a team that will work great with datacrons - for a couple of days.

    Wrap up:
    NO, I DON'T WANT THIS ****
  • Ferril9909
    57 posts Member
    edited June 2022
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    Questions
    I'm walking through an unlock in my brain, and have written out the scenario below and questions that came to me:
    Level 1 to 2 - upgradeable but cannot be used?
    at Level 3 - at this point they become useable and LS or DS specific, for relic 3 toons and up?
    Level 4 to 5 - upgradeable, but do only stats from Levels 1-3 apply to relic 3 toons and up, or do relic 5 toons and up get the bonus immediately?
    at Level 6 - faction specific bonus unlocks. Do the level 4-5 upgrades now apply? Do they apply to only the unlocked faction, or the alignment, for relic 5 and up?
    Level 7 to 8 - upgradeable, but do only stats from Levels 1-6 apply?
    at Level 9 - toon specific bonus unlocks. Do bonuses from level 7-8 upgrades now apply? Do the level 7-8 upgrades apply only to the unlocked toon at 9, or the unlocked faction, or the alignment?

    Is there a limit to how many datacrons from a set one person can have/apply?

    Will I be able to see opponent datacron types/upgrades prior to attack phases?

    Will datacrons be part of the squad loadouts section, with a unique/non unique option?

    Are the rolls/rerolls weighted in anyway, or is it even chance for X number of options available for that specific roll type?

    A video showing these being upgraded and applied to a mixed relic level set of squads would probably be useful.
    Post edited by Ferril9909 on
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    1. The bandwagon must be nearly full now?
    2. I have a feeling that a lot of people pooing on this, don't fully understand it.
    3. I doubt there's anybody who fully understands it yet.
    4. Worst thing in the game for me is the jump in the power curve between top legendaries and GLs. I've liked how CG have tried to address this over the last year.
    5. This may help let teams punch up to GLs.
    6. Oh JMK is getting a datacron in the first batch. :( I guess he really needed it............

    I don't fully understand the fuss about gear shortages. As I understood it, CG were going to make changes until they were happy with the balance. I guess they reached that. Personally, I don't overly care about mk3 carbantis and mk5 stun guns anymore. I never have a shortage like I did.

    It does annoy me that they created a new gear sticking point with the shock prods though......

    So I'm not sure if I don't get carbanti and stun gun shortages because they addressed it enough or collecting shock prods stops me getting short of them. A bit of both I guess.

    You say you don’t understand so I’ll just at least address that point. There are 4 phases to this gear fix they were thinking. We are in phase 1 still…. Where is the rest?

    You don’t have problems with cabantis and stun guns… I do. And the kyrotechs. Some characters needed if between 100-300 of each. People are annoyed because we’ve had these issues for a couple of years now. And now there is a new system to dedicate our time and resources to for both old and new players, except for new players.

    I’ve been relatively quiet on CG and their issues but this new system is complete bull and releasing a good year or two too early.
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    Zedstar wrote: »
    Maybe the idea is to keep ignoring the players and to keep doing stuff no one wants to get us all to quit and then they can move 100% on to LOTR new game.
    I have never known a company to ignore the fans and players so much and just to continually bring out stuff A. No one wants and B. That is going to potentially ruin the playing experience 🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤯

    This
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