Perhaps doubling everything but Core Gear would have been a good compromise.
Not cutting down relic scrap price or doubling challenges is only solution.
With removing tier 1-3 from relic level 7+ it shouldn’t affect high tiers to much.
But they decided to do it without doubling challenges which was the main source of relic scrap(low gear tiers that wasn’t touched in phase 1).
And in-game communication is needed. And also fair message “Your current stock of gear will be cut down on half for relic scrap”, because CG itself didn’t point at all on current stock cutting directly.
I think the part in bold is an exaggeration. This was discussed in another thread and the difference for CCBs in terms of challenge gear is extremely small.
Im just not focusing on relic currently. When i get 7 star skiff and disguised leah... ill likely get annoyed. But those 2, jabba and ben solo are my current list to do. Ill worry with aphra requirements when you can farm f2p the last character... until then, thry can go to gear 11 and sit.
The double thing wont resolve the issue. Those who didnt hear and then spent whatever gear they would have doubled will be upset that they didnt get the memo and the extra gear.
As opposed to those who didn't spend their thousands of stash and had it's value halved. Both seem "unreasonable", whatever that means here.
CG had a statement that that the doubling/halving was net neutral for relic levels. If you look at heat sinks, daily challenges gives roughly 60 each of carbs, cuffs, guns, gold8, and callers. Throw in 70 pieces of those gear pieces, and that is 370 gear pieces that was previously worth 74 heat sinks but is now worth only 37. That is almost 2 relic levels worth of heatsinks per week that were lost from passive farming, more when you consider that GCs also were not doubled. Now while I was not and am not salvaging carbs, I have exchanged the other pieces for heat sinks. In any case, the change was neither neutral nor minimal in regards to heatsinks.
It is true that the recent changes to the doubling/halving of salvage gear had a minimal effect for circuit boards. That said, when the relic system was designed, it was common for accounts to have thousands of this low-level salvage gear. I’d contend that the original exchange rate to get CCBs was poor but not really noticeable until your stores were exhausted. With their focus on us engaging with relics, not halving the exchange rate would be more accurate for what we are bringing in, rather than what we had stored up.
CG had a statement that that the doubling/halving was net neutral for relic levels. If you look at heat sinks, daily challenges gives roughly 60 each of carbs, cuffs, guns, gold8, and callers. Throw in 70 pieces of those gear pieces, and that is 370 gear pieces that was previously worth 74 heat sinks but is now worth only 37. That is almost 2 relic levels worth of heatsinks per week that were lost from passive farming, more when you consider that GCs also were not doubled. Now while I was not and am not salvaging carbs, I have exchanged the other pieces for heat sinks. In any case, the change was neither neutral nor minimal in regards to heatsinks..
If you are salvaging cuffs/guns/eyeballs/callers for heatsinks that's on you. Those should never be used for heatsinks by anyone.
My eyeballs often wait for their salvage pieces.
My cuffs often wait for cheddaks
My guns often wait for carbs
My callers often wait for kyros
I know that built holos are the best exchange rate, but I often have a need for them.
Regardless, of how you advise getting heatsink, this is a counter to CGs statement that the doubling/halving was net neutral for relic salvage - it isn’t.
My eyeballs often wait for their salvage pieces.
My cuffs often wait for cheddaks
My guns often wait for carbs
My callers often wait for kyros
I know that built holos are the best exchange rate, but I often have a need for them.
Regardless, of how you advise getting heatsink, this is a counter to CGs statement that the doubling/halving was net neutral for relic salvage - it isn’t.
You should go back and read the statement. Not the line, the whole thing.
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for life.
Yes, the way the devs used “net-neutral” is being misquoted by many:
Helps ensure these changes accelerate gear, but remain net-neutral to the Relic system
So the intention was that doubling the gear drops would be net neutral - not that the entire relic system would be unaffected.
Exactly. Relic system remains unaffected. Player stash gets screwed.
They basically expected you to dump everything into relics the day before the patch or be ok with your gear being worth half what it was the day before.
That should have been said in game as a warning a week out to make that decision.... or better yet... not done
The double thing wont resolve the issue. Those who didnt hear and then spent whatever gear they would have doubled will be upset that they didnt get the memo and the extra gear.
As opposed to those who didn't spend their thousands of stash and had it's value halved. Both seem "unreasonable", whatever that means here.
edit note.. when i say all their gear i am speaking of impacted and just to lazy to writr impacted multiple times.
You have several groups that are trouble spots and a single solution wont fix for all.
Group 1. Those who didnt spend all their gear and it is now worth half at scavenger
Group 2. Those that did dump their gear at the scavenger but wouldnt have if a doubling was to occur
Group 3. Those who just geared a character or multiple characters, but would not have if a doubling was to occur
Group 4. Anyone who bought gear and didnt scrap before patch as it now has a different overall value than the day before... yet no refund occurred
And those are just a few off the top of my head. So how do you resolve it for them?
Short of not doing the scavanger reduction, it wont be possible to please everyone.
So the best thing they could have done is be honest and open on the forums (sorta did that but id like more acknowledgment of how this negatively impacted player investment) AND made an announcement in game pointing you to a document/the forum to read about what was going to happen.
Those who have a small roster with only a handful of relic characters that still think the scavenger value of their gear being halved makes it “worthless”. Even though they still have well over a hundred characters they could apply the gear to in exactly the same way as before.
Before the tired old “CG apologist” trope gets wheeled out, I completely agree that an in-game message in our inboxes, even if all it did was point players to the forums for the details, should have been issued. Yes, serious players should take steps to keep informed, but to suggest this absolves the devs of any responsibility to give the player base a pointer to an upcoming major change doesn’t sit right with me.
Some of the loudest complainers about this issue spend half their time on the forums complaining about how few relic characters they have. Yet they also seem to think that their g12 gear - which would help them take more characters up to relics - has had its value halved. The g12 gear has more than one purpose. And its value for one of those purposes was not affected whatsoever.
Those who have a small roster with only a handful of relic characters that still think the scavenger value of their gear being halved makes it “worthless”. Even though they still have well over a hundred characters they could apply the gear to in exactly the same way as before.
Before the tired old “CG apologist” trope gets wheeled out, I completely agree that an in-game message in our inboxes, even if all it did was point players to the forums for the details, should have been issued. Yes, serious players should take steps to keep informed, but to suggest this absolves the devs of any responsibility to give the player base a pointer to an upcoming major change doesn’t sit right with me.
Some of the loudest complainers about this issue spend half their time on the forums complaining about how few relic characters they have. Yet they also seem to think that their g12 gear - which would help them take more characters up to relics - has had its value halved. The g12 gear has more than one purpose. And its value for one of those purposes was not affected whatsoever.
Oh im not forgetting them.... there is more than what i listed and then several corner case smaller user groups.
I also agree the devs screwed up here. They didnt properly warn the user base of the negative impact. Even in the road ahead its only mentioned, not explorered or explained on how to avoid the negatives to your impacted gear.
Lack of in game pointing to the information and lack of clarity.... thats why i have an issue with it.
Long run im sure the extra gear will make me move on... but they did just take some value from me in the short term. That doesnt respect my investment.
Put it this way. Scopely, over in MSF, does a weekly blog and sends an in game link to it. Thats all that has to happen to have fairly given warning. Its on me to go read it or skip it. CG doesnt require a forum account and they dont give in game links to it regularly.
Perhaps steal from the competition and start a weekly info dump with in game notification... thats all this needed.
The drop was ~~doubled, so should be net neutral (more or less)
And what about the hundreds of thousands of pieces we all had saved up over YEARS that instantly lost half it's value? Even with the double drops it will be years to get enough to match what we already had. And don't say that "you should have already converted" because hundreds of thousands of players have no access to forums or could have intuitively known this was about to happen
Should have scrapped it ahead of time I guess?
Like the rest of us?
Did you or did you decide to keep your gear and start working on lower gear characters in your roster?
I scrapped most of it, because now I will be able to acquire it much faster for the gearing WHEN I decide to work on those specific toons.
The biggest factor is whether or not players knew about the change. For those who didn't, they didn't get the opportunity to scrap anything and got screwed. For those who did, at least a choice was in play.
Really the devs need to only make positive changes for those out of the loop.
The drop was ~~doubled, so should be net neutral (more or less)
And what about the hundreds of thousands of pieces we all had saved up over YEARS that instantly lost half it's value? Even with the double drops it will be years to get enough to match what we already had. And don't say that "you should have already converted" because hundreds of thousands of players have no access to forums or could have intuitively known this was about to happen
Should have scrapped it ahead of time I guess?
Like the rest of us?
Did you or did you decide to keep your gear and start working on lower gear characters in your roster?
I scrapped most of it, because now I will be able to acquire it much faster for the gearing WHEN I decide to work on those specific toons.
Which is fair.
However, had you not known due to lack of in game announcement.... you might feel upset you didnt get to choose
It seems somewhat interesting that people who do regularly post on the forums complain about something which was pretty clearly communicated on the forums. With plenty of notice given too.
I didn’t read these forums myself until about a year ago. Then I noticed that multiple updates in-game stated that for more information I should check posts in the forums. I did so, and lo and behold there was indeed a bounty of additional information. If you want to know what’s going on in the game, read the forums. CG say that regularly. They give enough in game, and tell us where to find the rest. It’s not their fault if people are too lazy to go and find the information, it’s not exactly hidden.
Whether we knew about it before or not, it's still an extremely unhelpful thing to do. It wouldn't solve the major problem. Everything now is a long grind, pieces for 6* mods, pieces for relics, pieces for other gear types. Cg claimed they would help with the gear crunch, all I can see is they've done nothing at best, and made it alot harder at worst.
I believe that any announcement SHOULD be given in detail in game (not just swgoh but every game) and yet we are bombarded with store buys. By accepting CG saying check forums we are accepting that a large percentage of the player base wont, hence the after event complaints. Its why they link info offgame, such as pack probabilities, its designed to duscourage users reading too much into it.
For instance, this whole forum is for the swgoh player base but arent we seeing the same users contribute? It shows that people cannot be bothered or willing to reinforce what are some really good and positive ideas/solutions.
It seems somewhat interesting that people who do regularly post on the forums complain about something which was pretty clearly communicated on the forums. With plenty of notice given too.
I didn’t read these forums myself until about a year ago. Then I noticed that multiple updates in-game stated that for more information I should check posts in the forums. I did so, and lo and behold there was indeed a bounty of additional information. If you want to know what’s going on in the game, read the forums. CG say that regularly. They give enough in game, and tell us where to find the rest. It’s not their fault if people are too lazy to go and find the information, it’s not exactly hidden.
Whether we knew about it before or not, it's still an extremely unhelpful thing to do. It wouldn't solve the major problem. Everything now is a long grind, pieces for 6* mods, pieces for relics, pieces for other gear types. Cg claimed they would help with the gear crunch, all I can see is they've done nothing at best, and made it alot harder at worst.
A lot harder? A lot? Really? I get that you're upset about it but they didn't make the gear grind "a lot" harder by doubling the gear drops and halving the relic value. It's not a lot harder - it's approximately 2% slower to get CCBs. 2%. It could be 5% slower and it still wouldn't be "a lot". Haven't we kicked this dead horse enough? There were no posts on this thread for two weeks - why did you bring it back?
F2P since the last time I bought Kyros, Crystals, or the Conquest Pass.
It seems somewhat interesting that people who do regularly post on the forums complain about something which was pretty clearly communicated on the forums. With plenty of notice given too.
I didn’t read these forums myself until about a year ago. Then I noticed that multiple updates in-game stated that for more information I should check posts in the forums. I did so, and lo and behold there was indeed a bounty of additional information. If you want to know what’s going on in the game, read the forums. CG say that regularly. They give enough in game, and tell us where to find the rest. It’s not their fault if people are too lazy to go and find the information, it’s not exactly hidden.
Whether we knew about it before or not, it's still an extremely unhelpful thing to do. It wouldn't solve the major problem. Everything now is a long grind, pieces for 6* mods, pieces for relics, pieces for other gear types. Cg claimed they would help with the gear crunch, all I can see is they've done nothing at best, and made it alot harder at worst.
A lot harder? A lot? Really? I get that you're upset about it but they didn't make the gear grind "a lot" harder by doubling the gear drops and halving the relic value. It's not a lot harder - it's approximately 2% slower to get CCBs. 2%. It could be 5% slower and it still wouldn't be "a lot". Haven't we kicked this dead horse enough? There were no posts on this thread for two weeks - why did you bring it back?
Imagine if they had quadrupled old gear, then it would have became impossible!
Replies
My focus remains gear 12 on all my older toons
It is true that the recent changes to the doubling/halving of salvage gear had a minimal effect for circuit boards. That said, when the relic system was designed, it was common for accounts to have thousands of this low-level salvage gear. I’d contend that the original exchange rate to get CCBs was poor but not really noticeable until your stores were exhausted. With their focus on us engaging with relics, not halving the exchange rate would be more accurate for what we are bringing in, rather than what we had stored up.
If you are salvaging cuffs/guns/eyeballs/callers for heatsinks that's on you. Those should never be used for heatsinks by anyone.
My cuffs often wait for cheddaks
My guns often wait for carbs
My callers often wait for kyros
I know that built holos are the best exchange rate, but I often have a need for them.
Regardless, of how you advise getting heatsink, this is a counter to CGs statement that the doubling/halving was net neutral for relic salvage - it isn’t.
You should go back and read the statement. Not the line, the whole thing.
Which statement would you like me to read?
https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/260057/road-ahead-november-2022#latest
So the intention was that doubling the gear drops would be net neutral - not that the entire relic system would be unaffected.
Exactly. Relic system remains unaffected. Player stash gets screwed.
They basically expected you to dump everything into relics the day before the patch or be ok with your gear being worth half what it was the day before.
That should have been said in game as a warning a week out to make that decision.... or better yet... not done
You have several groups that are trouble spots and a single solution wont fix for all.
Group 1. Those who didnt spend all their gear and it is now worth half at scavenger
Group 2. Those that did dump their gear at the scavenger but wouldnt have if a doubling was to occur
Group 3. Those who just geared a character or multiple characters, but would not have if a doubling was to occur
Group 4. Anyone who bought gear and didnt scrap before patch as it now has a different overall value than the day before... yet no refund occurred
And those are just a few off the top of my head. So how do you resolve it for them?
Short of not doing the scavanger reduction, it wont be possible to please everyone.
So the best thing they could have done is be honest and open on the forums (sorta did that but id like more acknowledgment of how this negatively impacted player investment) AND made an announcement in game pointing you to a document/the forum to read about what was going to happen.
Those who have a small roster with only a handful of relic characters that still think the scavenger value of their gear being halved makes it “worthless”. Even though they still have well over a hundred characters they could apply the gear to in exactly the same way as before.
Before the tired old “CG apologist” trope gets wheeled out, I completely agree that an in-game message in our inboxes, even if all it did was point players to the forums for the details, should have been issued. Yes, serious players should take steps to keep informed, but to suggest this absolves the devs of any responsibility to give the player base a pointer to an upcoming major change doesn’t sit right with me.
Some of the loudest complainers about this issue spend half their time on the forums complaining about how few relic characters they have. Yet they also seem to think that their g12 gear - which would help them take more characters up to relics - has had its value halved. The g12 gear has more than one purpose. And its value for one of those purposes was not affected whatsoever.
Oh im not forgetting them.... there is more than what i listed and then several corner case smaller user groups.
I also agree the devs screwed up here. They didnt properly warn the user base of the negative impact. Even in the road ahead its only mentioned, not explorered or explained on how to avoid the negatives to your impacted gear.
Lack of in game pointing to the information and lack of clarity.... thats why i have an issue with it.
Long run im sure the extra gear will make me move on... but they did just take some value from me in the short term. That doesnt respect my investment.
Put it this way. Scopely, over in MSF, does a weekly blog and sends an in game link to it. Thats all that has to happen to have fairly given warning. Its on me to go read it or skip it. CG doesnt require a forum account and they dont give in game links to it regularly.
Perhaps steal from the competition and start a weekly info dump with in game notification... thats all this needed.
I scrapped most of it, because now I will be able to acquire it much faster for the gearing WHEN I decide to work on those specific toons.
Really the devs need to only make positive changes for those out of the loop.
Which is fair.
However, had you not known due to lack of in game announcement.... you might feel upset you didnt get to choose
Whether we knew about it before or not, it's still an extremely unhelpful thing to do. It wouldn't solve the major problem. Everything now is a long grind, pieces for 6* mods, pieces for relics, pieces for other gear types. Cg claimed they would help with the gear crunch, all I can see is they've done nothing at best, and made it alot harder at worst.
For instance, this whole forum is for the swgoh player base but arent we seeing the same users contribute? It shows that people cannot be bothered or willing to reinforce what are some really good and positive ideas/solutions.
A lot harder? A lot? Really? I get that you're upset about it but they didn't make the gear grind "a lot" harder by doubling the gear drops and halving the relic value. It's not a lot harder - it's approximately 2% slower to get CCBs. 2%. It could be 5% slower and it still wouldn't be "a lot". Haven't we kicked this dead horse enough? There were no posts on this thread for two weeks - why did you bring it back?
Imagine if they had quadrupled old gear, then it would have became impossible!