When will CG start taking cheating seriously again?

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    Whatelse73 wrote: »
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    EA is not cdziimd451u6.jpg
    enforcing their own TOS…I think that is a problem for everyone including EA.

    You have misinterpreted the TOS. They use the word "may" repetitively in their EULA in the section that describes enforcement. See below. The use of the word may is there to give them the prerogative to enforce as they see fit. It's not that they aren't enforcing their ToS. They are just exercising them in a way you don't like.

    I don't think they need another lawyer, even a free one. They pay enough money to lawyers to write their ToS in whatever way gives them escape to ignore their own policies, or strictly enforce them. It is a common thing for gaming companies to state such lawyerly policies. It is basically only as meaningful as they want it to be on any given day.

    At the same time, CG has made the claim they have a zero tolerance policy towards cheaters. But, they are doing the same lawyerly wriggling as you're helping defend EA doing. Zero tolerance doesn't actually mean zero tolerance, it means "if we feel like doing something about it, we will...."

    Policy and tos are different things. Tos' exist to give every right to them to use at their own leisure and try to close most of the doors that can give you rights you can end up exercising. They have binding things on their end in the tos, this is not one of them. That would need for them to promise you a cheat free service or sumtin like that which no company would ever do.

    It's ofc reasonable for a user to expect a policy to be closely followed and that is about trust/rapport in between the parties. No need to comment on how that bit is treated I guess xD.
  • Options
    Legend91 wrote: »
    State of the Galaxy: January 2023

    qdqvstf59v0h.jpg

    If this doesn't tell you nothing is being done, I don't know what will. I'm slowly getting fed up with all this tbh. Its a shame, I think the game is in a good place overall.
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    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Legend91 wrote: »
    State of the Galaxy: January 2023

    qdqvstf59v0h.jpg

    If this doesn't tell you nothing is being done, I don't know what will. I'm slowly getting fed up with all this tbh. Its a shame, I think the game is in a good place overall.

    I mean, kind of, but Sig keeps the channels of all the banned cheaters too. It was always going to hit the cap eventually.
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    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Legend91 wrote: »
    State of the Galaxy: January 2023

    qdqvstf59v0h.jpg

    If this doesn't tell you nothing is being done, I don't know what will. I'm slowly getting fed up with all this tbh. Its a shame, I think the game is in a good place overall.

    I mean, kind of, but Sig keeps the channels of all the banned cheaters too. It was always going to hit the cap eventually.

    Just adding 2+2 here.

    Months reporting the same individuals while they continue cheating - ✅
    Rampant number of new cheaters on the discord server - ✅
    CG being silent on this - ✅


  • Options
    Sure it reads as they have some wiggle room…however, many companies get into trouble even with TOS or warnings on their labels about products etc. it doesn’t mean they will or cannot be sued…especially a class action lawsuit. There is an expectation that what is stated in the TOS will be enforced and they reason why a player agrees to its terms. It should work both ways as I agree to the TOS with an expectation my investment would not be circumvented by something nefarious.
  • Ultra
    11543 posts Moderator
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    Legend91 wrote: »
    State of the Galaxy: January 2023

    qdqvstf59v0h.jpg

    it has reached the maximum number of discord channels per server but this also includes the list of inactive / banned cheaters so the image is very misleading

    Plus there are tons of unverified cheaters that people think are cheating but can't prove it / false accusations
  • Options
    Stop spending. Im pretty sure that would be noticed.

    Doesnt matter because there will be 3rd party subscriptions (youtubers/hotutils etc) to the whales who do spend.

    It wont change and banging on about it to fellow players wont change a thing. Take it straight to EA answers/twitter etc. Their image is more precious than moans.
  • Options
    TVF wrote: »
    Responses like the above are exactly why cheaters are rampant.

    That's an odd thing to say, I just wanted to see the cheaters you keep facing. Others are having no problems showing blatant cheating against them.

    You can honestly believe your 33000 posts are just tneutral, and your comments are just tying to see the cheaters who you don't believe exist because you can't tell the difference. If you do, some self assessment is in order.

    Here's an example. Last cycle, a guy loses 3 battles bottom front zone, and 1 top, then pauses. I clear botton knowing it means a win. Magically, 1 hour before the event ends. He clears bottom and top with no more drops. Simply put, if he could have done that without cheating, he would have initially. Did he use teams that "could" win according to swgoh.gg - probably.

    Good cheaters aren't the blatant examples you are looking for.

    That is my point, good cheaters only need to watch you and cheat in key moments. Very few cheat in ways where "your team of discord experts" can tell an obvious difference. It's as simple as remembering your best mods on offense teams to judge where your stats are within possible, then swapping all your best mods to D.
    You then use the well known hacks to adjusting your offense stats as if your best mods were on offense. I'd love to have my best mods on D and O. How many more battles do you think you win doing only what I've written, 25% more?

    If not that, just cheat in a key battle or two and you win a round.

    As for your accusation of others playing better, my opinion is play is massively overrated. Modding correctly and turn order matter in a couple counters, otherwise the game is p2w. I play in the bottom range of the top 10 guilds. Trust me, $ wins over skill every time.

    Also, the kyber 1/2 border is likely where most cheating happens. Whales don't need to, and lower level players don't care. I rhink if I were put in charge of catching cheaters, I'd do a comenable job relative to the current swath who don't even know what to look for. Add a companynwho won't even address the most obvious cases of cheating, and you are telling me cheating isn't underestimated. Ok, but I disagree.

    But sure,, believe what you will, this thread exists because cheating isn't an issue. You are just inocently curious while dismissing others, and since you've never seen cheating, obviously all the people threatening to quit are just sore losers who can't play.

    I don't cheat which is why I'm in this post, . . . but if I did, I assure you that you'd never know. Ask yourself, for every **** cheater who can't hide it, how many decent cheaters can. And you claim to have seen the obvious examples, . . . so what was your point again?
  • Options
    TvF, you can't honestly believe your 33000 posts are just tneutral, and your comments are just tying to see the cheaters who you don't believe exist because you can't tell the difference. If you do, some self assessment is in order.

    Here's an example. Last cycle, a guy loses 3 battles bottom front zone, and 1 top, then pauses. I clear botton knowing it means a win. Magically, 1 hour before the event ends. He clears bottom and top with no more drops. Simply put, if he could have done that without cheating, he would have initially. Did he use teams that "could" win according to swgoh.gg - probably.

    Good cheaters aren't the blatant examples you are looking for.

    That is my point, good cheaters only need to watch you and cheat in key moments. Very few cheat in ways where "your team of discord experts" can tell an obvious difference. It's as simple as remembering your best mods on offense teams to judge where your stats are within possible, then swapping all your best mods to D.
    You then use the well known hacks to adjusting your offense stats as if your best mods were on offense. I'd love to have my best mods on D and O. How many more battles do you think you win doing only what I've written, 25% more?

    If not that, just cheat in a key battle or two and you win a round.

    As for your accusation of others playing better, my opinion is play is massively overrated. Modding correctly and turn order matter in a couple counters, otherwise the game is p2w. I play in the bottom range of the top 10 guilds. Trust me, $ wins over skill every time.

    Also, the kyber 1/2 border is likely where most cheating happens. Whales don't need to, and lower level players don't care. I rhink if I were put in charge of catching cheaters, I'd do a comenable job relative to the current swath who don't even know what to look for. Add a companynwho won't even address the most obvious cases of cheating, and you are telling me cheating isn't underestimated. Ok, but I disagree.

    But sure,, believe what you will, this thread exists because cheating isn't an issue. You are just inocently curious while dismissing others, and since you've never seen cheating, obviously all the people threatening to quit are just sore losers who can't play.

    I don't cheat which is why I'm in this post, . . . but if I did, I assure you that you'd never know. Ask yourself, for every **** cheater who can't hide it, how many decent cheaters can. And you claim to have seen the obvious examples, . . . so what was your point again?
    Fieldgulls wrote: »
    EA is not cdziimd451u6.jpg
    enforcing their own TOS…I think that is a problem for everyone including EA.

    You have misinterpreted the TOS. They use the word "may" repetitively in their EULA in the section that describes enforcement. See below. The use of the word may is there to give them the prerogative to enforce as they see fit. It's not that they aren't enforcing their ToS. They are just exercising them in a way you don't like.

    Non laywers giving advice on TOS. Pro tip, just because a company writes something, doesn't give them license to violate statutes or common law.

    Pro tio as in pro of what?
  • Options
    And this is when thread like this start going downhill and we lose focus.
  • Starslayer
    2420 posts Member
    edited January 2023
    Options

    Here's an example. Last cycle, a guy loses 3 battles bottom front zone, and 1 top, then pauses. I clear botton knowing it means a win. Magically, 1 hour before the event ends. He clears bottom and top with no more drops. Simply put, if he could have done that without cheating, he would have initially. Did he use teams that "could" win according to swgoh.gg - probably.

    Good cheaters aren't the blatant examples you are looking for.

    A guildmate use this exact tactic when it didn’t start well. Make the opponent believes he yields, then fight at the last minute, hoping his opponent won’t finish the job properly thinking victory in the bag. Sometimes it works. Could also be a ‘i hate this game’ factor when it doesn’t go well, then you cool down, come back later and do a better job. It’s not cheating though. Could also be cheating. But it’s not the only scenario.

    If you state something for a fact, you can’t blame someone to ask for proof.

    Or maybe you’re convinced it happened quite often because you have information about how cheating works but it’s done well so it’s hard to show definite evidence ?

  • Options
    I just had one guy in our TW beat all 4 of our front lines (16 squads per area) with 3.5m GP and no GLs and very little relics. We of course had multiple GLs and 140-170k squads. He also beat squads multiple times per minute which of course is impossible. This is the first time I've noticed anything this bad and it's probably just because like many here have said he's just so blatant at cheating and not even hiding it.

    I reported him but have little faith anything will get fixed. I can abide poor updates and greedy cash grabs but not this.
  • Options
    Wayleran wrote: »
    I just had one guy in our TW beat all 4 of our front lines (16 squads per area) with 3.5m GP and no GLs and very little relics. We of course had multiple GLs and 140-170k squads. He also beat squads multiple times per minute which of course is impossible. This is the first time I've noticed anything this bad and it's probably just because like many here have said he's just so blatant at cheating and not even hiding it.

    I reported him but have little faith anything will get fixed. I can abide poor updates and greedy cash grabs but not this.

    Would be great if we could see TW counters like we do in GAC.

    I suspect if you asked the entire player base, they care more about the integrity of the game (and not facing cheaters in TW) over the super secret TW counters that the top 3 or 4 guilds (gauntlet?) use in TW.
  • TVF
    36671 posts Member
    Options
    I don't cheat which is why I'm in this post, . . . but if I did, I assure you that you'd never know. Ask yourself, for every **** cheater who can't hide it, how many decent cheaters can. And you claim to have seen the obvious examples, . . . so what was your point again?

    I wanted to see the cheaters that you say you have faced in the last several rounds, same way others have shown theirs.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
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    What @Jakdnels said. There has to be a similiar review option providedby EA/CG that shows how battles are won or lost.

    In terms of CG or even EA taking ownership of cheating it wont happen unless its significantly impacting income or reputation.
  • Options
    Played 6 years and have never encountered a cheater.
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    Screerider wrote: »
    Played 6 years and have never encountered a cheater.

    🤣
  • TVF
    36671 posts Member
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    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Screerider wrote: »
    Played 6 years and have never encountered a cheater.

    🤣

    You can laugh but I haven't either, and also am coming up on six years too.

    With that said I don't really know what the point of that post is, we all know cheaters are cheating.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Options
    Its funny because I faced more than 10 in 6 months 😫
  • Ultra
    11543 posts Moderator
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    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Its funny because I faced more than 10 in 6 months 😫

    What division are you?

    Probability of running into cheaters are more likely to be in lower divisions, instead of higher divisions like Kyber
  • ZurinFet
    261 posts Member
    edited January 2023
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    Ultra wrote: »
    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Its funny because I faced more than 10 in 6 months 😫

    What division are you?

    Probability of running into cheaters are more likely to be in lower divisions, instead of higher divisions like Kyber

    Yea because its very easy to spot them on lower divisions, first month I had 5 cheating squad arena, only 2 are still playing, around 4-5 again in fleet, only 1 still plays, this guy doesn't even play GAC. i think I had just once instance of cheating in GAC so far

    His fleet beats a full relic 7-8 7* Executor within 5 seconds every single day.

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  • Ultra
    11543 posts Moderator
    edited January 2023
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    it’s not about how easy it is to spot them

    it’s that they are pretty new so they don’t mind getting a ban since they have invested a few months and there isn’t much to lose + they aren’t here to play long term
  • ZurinFet
    261 posts Member
    edited January 2023
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    Ultra wrote: »
    it’s not about how easy it is to spot them

    it’s that they are pretty new so they don’t mind getting a ban since they have invested a few months and there isn’t much to lose + they aren’t here to play long term

    100%. But some do stick around, Iike the ones I keep reporting daily.

    At the end of the day, there's quite a few of us willing to help, and it'd be great to keep doing it knowing we're not wasting our time.
  • Lumiya
    1526 posts Member
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    Ultra wrote: »
    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Its funny because I faced more than 10 in 6 months 😫

    What division are you?

    Probability of running into cheaters are more likely to be in lower divisions, instead of higher divisions like Kyber

    This is what I think aswell.

    In general, I just don't think it's good, that those who do not face (so many) cheaters seem to use their experience as a basis to doubt others when they state that they face them more(regularly).

    I know they do not doubt that cheaters exist but it feels like they doubt or don't see that it is different and maybe more rampant for others (in other Leagues) and it leaves one with the feeling that they don't see the full scope of it because of that which in turn leaves others with the feeling of not being taken seriously/believed enough and the issue is not seen as serious enough and down played. Maybe not purposefully, but it inevitably has the effect that it gives others the feeling that it is implied they are exaggerating.

    We all know that of course there are people who don't know about certain counters or maybe are salty losers, but I think the definite numbers speak for themselves and those are only those we certainly know about. It is safe to assume that there are a lot more. And imho that is quite concerning.

    We are all made of star-stuff
  • TVF
    36671 posts Member
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    Speaking only for myself, I only doubted one person, and they still have declined to back up their claims. I believe everything else I've seen in this thread, including the theory that cheating is more prevalent in lower leagues because the risk is lower.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
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    TVF wrote: »
    With that said I don't really know what the point of that post is, we all know cheaters are cheating.
    With people saying they face a cheater every GAC, it just got me wondering why I haven't. Perhaps it does depend on where you are in the game, but, I mean, I also started at the bottom, so...

  • Options
    Screerider wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    With that said I don't really know what the point of that post is, we all know cheaters are cheating.
    With people saying they face a cheater every GAC, it just got me wondering why I haven't. Perhaps it does depend on where you are in the game, but, I mean, I also started at the bottom, so...

    Don't think anyone here said they face a cheater in every GAC, that would be very hard to believe
  • TVF
    36671 posts Member
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    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Screerider wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    With that said I don't really know what the point of that post is, we all know cheaters are cheating.
    With people saying they face a cheater every GAC, it just got me wondering why I haven't. Perhaps it does depend on where you are in the game, but, I mean, I also started at the bottom, so...

    Don't think anyone here said they face a cheater in every GAC, that would be very hard to believe

    "Almost" /= "Every" but still.
    Also, I face a suspected cheater almost every GAC. My guess is about 20% of the players cheat. Most do it just enough to seem reasonable.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Options
    ZurinFet wrote: »
    Screerider wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    With that said I don't really know what the point of that post is, we all know cheaters are cheating.
    With people saying they face a cheater every GAC, it just got me wondering why I haven't. Perhaps it does depend on where you are in the game, but, I mean, I also started at the bottom, so...

    Don't think anyone here said they face a cheater in every GAC, that would be very hard to believe

    No one is facing cheaters every battle of GAC, but at the same time, no one can be 100% sure they've "never" faced a cheater. It's not always the lobot solo clearing an LV team. Sometimes all they need to do is one move or attack that lasts 2 seconds in game and the rest is legit.

    Though I do recall in Titanfall, when it came to cheaters, if they caught you they'd put all the cheaters in one server and make them fight each other. I think that might be a solid option for CG to implement so they still get their influx of money and the cheaters can cheat all they want against each other.
  • Options
    Whether or not any one of us has never faced a cheater or not is irrelevant. I also have never seen anything suspicious in my GAC history. Cool. Yay me. How would me posting that as a comment be relevant to the discussion? Either I'd be a pointless distraction or I'd be insinuating something. The former is troll-y and the latter insinuates something ridiculous since there very clearly are a non-negligible amount of cheaters out there. And CG has refused to do anything substantial about it, which is a bad look.
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