No, because the Squish doesn't change your ranking. The same percentage of players are above and below you before and after the Squish.
Ranking has absolutely nothing to do with your division. It’s based on the skill number, which is constantly being driven downwards for everybody at the top by the skill squish.
No, because the Squish doesn't change your ranking. The same percentage of players are above and below you before and after the Squish.
Ranking has absolutely nothing to do with your division. It’s based on the skill number, which is constantly being driven downwards for everybody at the top by the skill squish.
Leagues and Divisions are allegedly designed to be consistent percentages of the player base. They can divide up the players before each GAC season into the same percentages each and every time if they want to. The Squish isn't what determines how these percentages are assigned, nor does it change your ranking.
The question for me is whether the percentage of players actively playing GAC that are in K1 has decreased significantly over time. If that is the case, then it seems problematic, whether due to "squish" or some other factor. Originally, when changing crystal rewards from Arena to GAC, the promise was essentially that we would do the same if not better than we previously were doing. But (using made up numbers here), if the original percentage of players in K1 was 10%, and it is now 5%, that is an issue because the playerbase as a whole is not doing the same or better than from Arena crystals. One would assume that for every player moving down from K1 another player would be moving up to take their place, so that the percentage should remain relatively stable over time (not taking into account new players joining the game/players leaving the game). Do we have access to the percentages of players in each league / division?
Actually pretty sure all of Kyber gets more GAC crystals than they ever got from daily arena, assuming 50/50 win rate.
But my question applies equally to each league/division: If the percentage of players in Kyber league are decreasing significantly and moving down (perhaps to a lower league), what is the explanation for this? Do players in Aurodium get the same/better than Arena? Because, if the percentages in Kyber are shrinking, I would assume the percentages in the lower leagues is increasing
See Darjelo's response for %'s. However, it was never framed for the other leagues. We were shown a chart and anyone in Kyber would be breaking even or doing better than had been the case with arena crystals. Taliana has posted population data, and pretty sure overall Kyber has stayed consistent.
This shows the Squish didn't change their Division, since they're still in K1. They're also getting a benefit of K1 rewards for having a K2 Skill Rating.
I think it just means this person ended up in K1 based on the Skill Rating ranges for the last Season, but they did not end up in the Top 2% of players, which is what K1 should be. So when the new Season lines were drawn, not being in the Top 2%, they end up with a K2 ranking. But benefit from K1 status for an additional time, which is nice.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
This shows the Squish didn't change their Division, since they're still in K1. They're also getting a benefit of K1 rewards for having a K2 Skill Rating.
I think it just means this person ended up in K1 based on the Skill Rating ranges for the last Season, but they did not end up in the Top 2% of players, which is what K1 should be. So when the new Season lines were drawn, not being in the Top 2%, they end up with a K2 ranking. But benefit from K1 status for an additional time, which is nice.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
You're right it's what I asked for. Thanks for that. It showed what I thought about the Squish not causing demotions, but I see how after the first match, demotions could then occur.
This shows the Squish didn't change their Division, since they're still in K1. They're also getting a benefit of K1 rewards for having a K2 Skill Rating.
I think it just means this person ended up in K1 based on the Skill Rating ranges for the last Season, but they did not end up in the Top 2% of players, which is what K1 should be. So when the new Season lines were drawn, not being in the Top 2%, they end up with a K2 ranking. But benefit from K1 status for an additional time, which is nice.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
You're right it's what I asked for. Thanks for that. It showed what I thought about the Squish not causing demotions, but I see how after the first match, demotions could then occur.
Even though the demotion does not happen at the time of the squish, does not mean the squish did not cause the demotion, which in the example provided, it did.
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Whether it does or does not change the rankings is irrelevant (and no one has yet provided numbers to prove one way or the other), it definitely does change divisions.
This shows the Squish didn't change their Division, since they're still in K1. They're also getting a benefit of K1 rewards for having a K2 Skill Rating.
I think it just means this person ended up in K1 based on the Skill Rating ranges for the last Season, but they did not end up in the Top 2% of players, which is what K1 should be. So when the new Season lines were drawn, not being in the Top 2%, they end up with a K2 ranking. But benefit from K1 status for an additional time, which is nice.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
You're right it's what I asked for. Thanks for that. It showed what I thought about the Squish not causing demotions, but I see how after the first match, demotions could then occur.
“Could”?
You’ve been given examples where demotion is 100% guaranteed to occur, regardless of the outcome of the first round in the next GAC.
I don’t know how you can play the semantics card and claim that the squish isn’t causing the demotion in those instances, other than being stubbornly obstinate and ignoring facts.
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Whether it does or does not change the rankings is irrelevant (and no one has yet provided numbers to prove one way or the other), it definitely does change divisions.
I'm pretty sure Taliana's charts show that rankings are not effected.
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Whether it does or does not change the rankings is irrelevant (and no one has yet provided numbers to prove one way or the other), it definitely does change divisions.
I'm pretty sure Taliana's charts show that rankings are not effected.
Yep, but i will still get 100% demoted tomorrow even if i win. It wouldn’t have happened without the squish.
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Whether it does or does not change the rankings is irrelevant (and no one has yet provided numbers to prove one way or the other), it definitely does change divisions.
I'm pretty sure Taliana's charts show that rankings are not effected.
Actually, a quick check from the post linked on the first page shows the rankings are effected. I took a sample of 4 seasons. K1 ranges in % of population from 3% to 11%.
You’ve been given examples where demotion is 100% guaranteed to occur, regardless of the outcome of the first round in the next GAC.
Right, but because the Squish doesn't change rankings, it's not the cause. Divisions are based on percentages.
I give up.
The squish has significantly reduced the number of players in Kyber 1. That’s a fact.
A player finishes a season in K1, is squished to a skill rating that is in K2 and it is mathematically impossible for them to reach a skill rating high enough to remain in K1 in their next match. That’s a fact.
The squish is demonstrably doing 2 things you insist it’s not doing. It is reducing the percentage of the player base in K1 (when you claim it is maintaining this percentage) and it is causing players to be demoted (you claim that failing to be in the top %age of players is the cause, despite the evidence that the squish is reducing this %age every time).
You need more reason than just wanting to be right to keep insisting things are the way you see them.
It is reducing the percentage of the player base in K1 (when you claim it is maintaining this percentage)
I haven't claimed this. I just said that Kyber 1 was probably intended to be the Top 2% of players. Yes the percentage is changing, but that's not because of the Squish. Since the Squish doesn't change rankings, the percentages must be changing. And if that's the case, that would happen with or without the Squish.
Actually, a quick check from the post linked on the first page shows the rankings are effected. I took a sample of 4 seasons. K1 ranges in % of population from 3% to 11%.
You see people swapping positions in the rankings?
Gac is a joke now. Game should be like fun, so gac too. What is the reason for a player to play when you go against opponents with 4mil gp more than you in chromium...if they play you dont have any strategy for this...it kills all the fun...there was fun in previous system (not saying i want it back) but i had more fun before than now, it is just effect of how gac skill rating is designed. At the begining it was ok. Was fun but after 2 years fun is gone..
Actually, a quick check from the post linked on the first page shows the rankings are effected. I took a sample of 4 seasons. K1 ranges in % of population from 3% to 11%.
You see people swapping positions in the rankings?
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
Actually, a quick check from the post linked on the first page shows the rankings are effected. I took a sample of 4 seasons. K1 ranges in % of population from 3% to 11%.
You see people swapping positions in the rankings?
Well, not if the ranking of where you finished the Season wouldn't put you in the Top 2% (or whatever) for Kyber 1. The Squish doesn't change rankings.
correct me if i'm wrong
divisions are based on SR
squish reduces everyone's SR in k1
how could the squish not affect how many people are in k1
Only if the squish algorithm accounted for the division cutoffs and population %, which apparently it doesn’t.
What?
You go below 3610, you drop out of K2. The squish pushes everyone in k1 down, and anyone near that cutoff point will be in K2 because of the squish.
Yes.
However if the algorithm was run division by division, and actually squished the top 2% above the 3610 rating, the next x% between the next division ratings, etc, etc, it could not affect how many people are in k1.
Better yet, get rid of squish and just make the skill ratings a diminishing returns formula based on current skill rating, since it seems like that’s the intent behind squish IMO.
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for life.
Instead of doing the Squish, they could change the 3610 SR minimum up to 3800 or whatever. It could change every Season based on whatever the Skill Rating is at the 2% mark. But then they'd probably also want to change the SR awarded/removed for each match, or some players may just move so far out, their SR wouldn't matter anymore.
This shows the Squish didn't change their Division, since they're still in K1. They're also getting a benefit of K1 rewards for having a K2 Skill Rating.
I think it just means this person ended up in K1 based on the Skill Rating ranges for the last Season, but they did not end up in the Top 2% of players, which is what K1 should be. So when the new Season lines were drawn, not being in the Top 2%, they end up with a K2 ranking. But benefit from K1 status for an additional time, which is nice.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
You're right it's what I asked for. Thanks for that. It showed what I thought about the Squish not causing demotions, but I see how after the first match, demotions could then occur.
This is what I was saying. You don't get demoted when the squish happens, but after the first match, even with a win you could get demoted. That is just not right. A win should not give a demotion
Not mine, from a guild member
"Congratulations on defeating" and "Relegation" should never be in the same message.
So yes technically CG didn't lie when the squish happens you won't change division, what they left out is after the first battle even if you win you may drop.
This is what I was saying. You don't get demoted when the squish happens, but after the first match, even with a win you could get demoted. That is just not right. A win should not give a demotion
Here's the offical statement from cg, when they implemented the skill squish...
It says it will not change what devision or league you are in. If the squish reduces kyber 1 by 90% it surely has a sgnificant impact for players throwing them out of k1.
The squish is supposed to change not much except the purpose of keeping players competitive by closing the skill points gap.
Well, *if* the code first assigns the Divisions and *then* applies the Squish, then the Squish isn't the process that's changing the Divisions.
I think another part is that while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
Winning should never result in a demotion.
Yup, been there. Skill squish pushed me so far out of the division I finished in (point wise) that I ended up relegating to a lower division despite winning my first match of the new season. It's so stupid.
Replies
Ranking has absolutely nothing to do with your division. It’s based on the skill number, which is constantly being driven downwards for everybody at the top by the skill squish.
See Darjelo's response for %'s. However, it was never framed for the other leagues. We were shown a chart and anyone in Kyber would be breaking even or doing better than had been the case with arena crystals. Taliana has posted population data, and pretty sure overall Kyber has stayed consistent.
It’s exactly the example you asked for tbf: while it didn't change division when squish was applied, you could actually win your next battle (increasing skill rating) and be demoted.
It’s a delayed relegation, as I will finished in K2 after first round, win or lose. It also means i need to score 6-3 to stay in K1 this season, even if i finished in K1 last season. I’m not complaining though, it it what it is.
You're right it's what I asked for. Thanks for that. It showed what I thought about the Squish not causing demotions, but I see how after the first match, demotions could then occur.
Even though the demotion does not happen at the time of the squish, does not mean the squish did not cause the demotion, which in the example provided, it did.
Whether it does or does not change the rankings is irrelevant (and no one has yet provided numbers to prove one way or the other), it definitely does change divisions.
You’ve been given examples where demotion is 100% guaranteed to occur, regardless of the outcome of the first round in the next GAC.
I don’t know how you can play the semantics card and claim that the squish isn’t causing the demotion in those instances, other than being stubbornly obstinate and ignoring facts.
Yep, but i will still get 100% demoted tomorrow even if i win. It wouldn’t have happened without the squish.
Actually, a quick check from the post linked on the first page shows the rankings are effected. I took a sample of 4 seasons. K1 ranges in % of population from 3% to 11%.
The squish has significantly reduced the number of players in Kyber 1. That’s a fact.
A player finishes a season in K1, is squished to a skill rating that is in K2 and it is mathematically impossible for them to reach a skill rating high enough to remain in K1 in their next match. That’s a fact.
The squish is demonstrably doing 2 things you insist it’s not doing. It is reducing the percentage of the player base in K1 (when you claim it is maintaining this percentage) and it is causing players to be demoted (you claim that failing to be in the top %age of players is the cause, despite the evidence that the squish is reducing this %age every time).
You need more reason than just wanting to be right to keep insisting things are the way you see them.
divisions are based on SR
squish reduces everyone's SR in k1
how could the squish not affect how many people are in k1
This you?
Only if the squish algorithm accounted for the division cutoffs and population %, which apparently it doesn’t.
What?
You go below 3610, you drop out of K2. The squish pushes everyone in k1 down, and anyone near that cutoff point will be in K2 because of the squish.
Yes.
However if the algorithm was run division by division, and actually squished the top 2% above the 3610 rating, the next x% between the next division ratings, etc, etc, it could not affect how many people are in k1.
Better yet, get rid of squish and just make the skill ratings a diminishing returns formula based on current skill rating, since it seems like that’s the intent behind squish IMO.
This is what I was saying. You don't get demoted when the squish happens, but after the first match, even with a win you could get demoted. That is just not right. A win should not give a demotion
Not mine, from a guild member
"Congratulations on defeating" and "Relegation" should never be in the same message.
So yes technically CG didn't lie when the squish happens you won't change division, what they left out is after the first battle even if you win you may drop.
Edit: Added image
Yup, been there. Skill squish pushed me so far out of the division I finished in (point wise) that I ended up relegating to a lower division despite winning my first match of the new season. It's so stupid.