Turn Meter/Assist questions from noob

I'm on my third week playing, so still learning the ropes (level 52 F2P). I had two questions I was hoping a veteran could answer for me.

1) I've just unlocked Han and begun working to upgrade him. His taunt ability provides allies with additional turn meter. If some of my other heroes are already showing a full turn meter bar, does that mean that bonus is lost for them? How does that work exactly?

2) Phasma's leader ability allows for a random assist on attack. Does that include specials, like IG-86's guaranteed assist ability, meaning a chance at 3 attacks?

I was thinking a Phasma/Han pairing may be neat since both can fiddle with turns and speed. Is that practical at all, and if so what other characters would be good to use in that mix?

Replies

  • I am also curious for the answer to the 1st question.

    2) The bonus assist is always the normal attack, so no you will not get 3 attacks like in case of IG-86, but two at the most.
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    1) They do not the lose the extra on the turn meter, it is applied to next round. I run a droid team with HK as lead for his 30% turn meter gain on crit. When my AOE guys go, if they get multiple crits on an AOE, it fills their meter and spills into next meter. They often get to go twice in a row. For example, if my IG 88 goes and uses his AOE and gets 5 crits he gets 150% turn meter fill. He immediately goes again, and has half his bar filled towards next turn.

    Please disregard, this info is probably wrong.

    2) No. They only do the basic attack on an assist. But it does count towards cool down and can proc any abilities their basic may have. For example, on my droid team, if 86 calls 88 for assist, he does his basic which has a chance to apply heal immunity and if he crits, he gains 30% turn meter from HKs leadership.
    Post edited by CptCaveman on
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman wrote: »
    1) They do not the lose the extra on the turn meter, it is applied to next round. I run a droid team with HK as lead for his 30% turn meter gain on crit. When my AOE guys go, if they get multiple crits on an AOE, it fills their meter and spills into next meter. They often get to go twice in a row. For example, if my IG 88 goes and uses his AOE and gets 5 crits he gets 150% turn meter fill. He immediately goes again, and has half his bar filled towards next turn.

    Not 100% sure if this is correct.

    I have no experience with Han, but Phasma's turn meter increase doesn't increase beyond 100% as far as I'm aware.
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    CptCaveman wrote: »
    1) They do not the lose the extra on the turn meter, it is applied to next round. I run a droid team with HK as lead for his 30% turn meter gain on crit. When my AOE guys go, if they get multiple crits on an AOE, it fills their meter and spills into next meter. They often get to go twice in a row. For example, if my IG 88 goes and uses his AOE and gets 5 crits he gets 150% turn meter fill. He immediately goes again, and has half his bar filled towards next turn.

    Not 100% sure if this is correct.

    I have no experience with Han, but Phasma's turn meter increase doesn't increase beyond 100% as far as I'm aware.

    From my experience it is. I have been running no a droid team for a while. HKs leadership skill gives them 30% turn meter on a crit. When 88 or HK get multiple crits on a AOE, they immediately go again and I have seen them hit 5 crits, go again, crit again, and end up with over 80% of their turn meter filled.

    I think the only time they wouldn't go again is if they were tied with someone on enemy team for same action on the first round before the AOE.

    For example: 88 and another toon are tied for action, the rng picks one to go and picks 88. 88 goes and does his AOE and gets 5 crits giving him 150% turn meter fill. The enemy toon goes next since they were tied for original action, then 88 gets his extra turn from the meter fill. Either that or the rng decides again for the second tie. Not sure which it is yet.

    I cannot speak for Phasma as I don't own him, but I know it works this way on my droid team and would assume it works the same for him. He gives %45 turn meter to allies, so he can't trigger multiple attacks, but you should be able to notice if he is overfilling someone's bar and if it is spilling over into next rounds.

    For example... One of your toons is at 80% turn meter and Phasma does his skill giving him +45% turn meter gain. His bar should fill up and after he goes, his bar for next turn will be filled 25% already plus whatever rounds took place between those actions.
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    I went back and read EwokRampages speed guide again, and according to him, the extra crits would not result in filling the next turn meter, so I may be wrong here.

    I guess what I am seeing is when 88 or HK go it sets turn meter back to 0, say they get 5 crits on that turn with their AOE, this fills their turn meter instantly and allows them to go again. The 1st and 2nd action both count as a round and fill turn meter with normal speed value, which does spill over. The extra 50% doesn't get added to next meter, but the rounds between actions make it look like it does. The rounds between actions happen so fast, that it was making it look like it was partially filling next meter.

    Thanks for questioning that Capt Plat, made me go back and do more research. I will keep a closer eye on turn meters now to make sure this is what is happening.
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    according to the speed guide, you get to keep speed overages from your basic speed value, but not from turn meter bonuses. If that's the case, it should work like this:

    88 has 118 speed, so he would go on round 9 and end up with 1062 turn meter.

    So round nine happens, he takes action which drops turn meter back to 62 because he keeps the 62 speed overage. He does AOE and gets 4 crits giving him 120% turn meter gain, which fills his bar completely again allowing him to go again immediately on round 10, unless he is tied with another toon, in that case rng determines who goes first. Either the 62 overage is used up filling the beginning of his next bar, or it is retained for next round, not sure which, but probably used up.

    Round ten his meter is already full, so the 118 speed from his normal value gets added onto his full turn meter giving him 1118. He takes an action and does his basic move. The action reduces turn meter back to 118. He scores another crit which adds 333 to the 118 already left in turn meter giving him 451.

    Round 11 he is at 451 and gets another 118 added for 569.

    Round 12 he is at 569 and gets another 118 for 687.

    Round 13 he is at 687 and gets another 118 for 805.

    Round 14 he is at 805 and gets 118 for 923.

    Round 15 he is at 923 and gets 118 for 1022. Allowing him to go again and keep the extra 22 towards next round. That's three turns in 15 rounds from beginning of fight. Also 3 turns within 7 of first action, not bad. First possible action happens on round 7 for the fastest toons so that's three actions within first 9 rounds of action.

    The keepable overages and the new values added at beginning of round were leading me to believe that the turn meter fills were spilling over, but they are not. The rounds happen so fast that it's hard to track, especially when dealing with other variables like Poggles speed bonus.

    If anyone else wants to chime in and point out anything I may have wrong, please do.

    Sorry to give you bad info and sidetrack your thread OP. Least I learned something new today.
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    So speed overages from normal speed value is kept, but overages from bonuses are thrown out. So it should work like this:

    88 has a speed of 118. So he gets to go in round nine. 9 times 118 equals 1062.

    Round nine occurs. 88 gets his bar filled to 1062 and gets an action. The action reduces his turn meter back to 62 because he gets to keep his normal value overage. He does his AOE and scores 5 crits giving him 150% turn meter fill. His turn meter is filled from 62 to 1000.

    Round ten occurs. 88 has a full turn meter so he gets 118 added to his 1000 giving him 1118. He takes another action reducing his meter back to 118. He does basic and scores a crit giving 30% meter. He ends round at 118 plus 300 for 418.

    Round eleven occurs he gets 118 added to 418 for 536.

    Round twelve adds 118 to 536 for 654.

    Round thirteen adds 118 to 654 for 772.

    Round fourteen adds 118 to 772 for 890.

    Round fifteen adds 118 to 890 for 1008. 88 gets another action and is left with 8 on meter.

    So that's three action within fifteen rounds of beginning of fight. No toon moves before round seven so it is three actions within first nine action rounds. Also three actions within 88s first six rounds. That's pretty fast.

    The rounds that occur between actions happen fast and combined with regular overages and other variables like Poggles speed buff were leading me to believe meters could be overfilled, but that is not the case.

    The other interesting thing to note is that positive turn meter bonuses give a percentage of total bar. So a 25% bonus to turn meter gives 250 speed to that turn meter. A turn meter reduction gives a percentage of what is available. So a person with a turn meter with 800 speed reduced by 25% would leave them with 600, while a person with a turn meter of 400 speed reduced 25% would leave them at 300. Turn meters can't be reduced into negatives obviously.

    So stacking turn meter bonuses become redundant after a point, you can only fill it to 1000. But turn meter reductions always take a percentage so you could stack them indefinitely.
    Post edited by CptCaveman on
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • JeighKaeNeither
    243 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    CptCaveman wrote: »
    according to the speed guide, you get to keep speed overages from your basic speed value, but not from turn meter bonuses. If that's the case, it should work like this:

    88 has 118 speed, so he would go on round 9 and end up with 1062 turn meter.

    So round nine happens, he takes action which drops turn meter back to 62 because he keeps the 62 speed overage. He does AOE and gets 4 crits giving him 120% turn meter gain, which fills his bar completely again allowing him to go again immediately on round 10, unless he is tied with another toon, in that case rng determines who goes first. Either the 62 overage is used up filling the beginning of his next bar, or it is retained for next round, not sure which, but probably used up.

    Round ten his meter is already full, so the 118 speed from his normal value gets added onto his full turn meter giving him 1118. He takes an action and does his basic move. The action reduces turn meter back to 118. He scores another crit which adds 333 to the 118 already left in turn meter giving him 451.

    Round 11 he is at 451 and gets another 118 added for 569.

    Round 12 he is at 569 and gets another 118 for 687.

    Round 13 he is at 687 and gets another 118 for 805.

    Round 14 he is at 805 and gets 118 for 923.

    Round 15 he is at 923 and gets 118 for 1022. Allowing him to go again and keep the extra 22 towards next round. That's three turns in 15 rounds from beginning of fight. Also 3 turns within 7 of first action, not bad. First possible action happens on round 7 for the fastest toons so that's three actions within first 9 rounds of action.

    The keepable overages and the new values added at beginning of round were leading me to believe that the turn meter fills were spilling over, but they are not. The rounds happen so fast that it's hard to track, especially when dealing with other variables like Poggles speed bonus.

    If anyone else wants to chime in and point out anything I may have wrong, please do.

    Sorry to give you bad info and sidetrack your thread OP. Least I learned something new today.

    Bad info? This is all 100% correct. I can't really be said much better.

    Turn meter certainly can go over 1000. It's how one player seemingly goes first before another player with a full meter. Whoever is actually over 1000 goes first. Not all characters have the numbers to go over, but those that can, do, and have the advantage.
  • TL;DR...

    Sorry, guys, that's A LOT. :open_mouth:

    So, what's the bottom line? Do Han and Phasma play nice together?


  • [/quote]Bad info? This is all 100% correct. I can't really be said much better.

    Turn meter certainly can go over 1000. It's how one player seemingly goes first before another player with a full meter. Whoever is actually over 1000 goes first. Not all characters have the numbers to go over, but those that can, do, and have the advantage.[/quote]

    Yes, turn meter can and does go over 1000, but only from natural speed and not from any speed meter bonuses. The original question was if he uses Hans taunt when he has toons at full turn meter, will the bonus be wasted on those toons. The answer to that is yes, it will be wasted on those toons as turn meter bonuses don't spill over into next turn. It will give those toons a one speed value leg up for the next round though from their natural speed value being added to the already full turn meter at the beginning of the round.

    When two characters tie to act on the same round, meaning they both have turn meters at or over 1000, the AI uses RNG to determine which side goes. Once the AI selects a side to go first, any other toons on that side that are tied also get to go first. For example if both sides have 2 fast toons that act in round seven, there is a four way tie. The AI picks a side, then both toons on that side take action before the two from other side. This is why you see Leias going before Sids and dookus.

    I use Poggle and Geo on my droid team. They are close in speed(Pog a bit faster), so they act on the same initial round. When facing other droid teams with Pog as their fastest toon sometimes I go first, sometimes they do. If I do get to go first, my Pog goes and then my Geo goes, or my Geo goes then my Pog. But they both get to go before the enemy.

    Also, the turn meter might not be really full, it could be at 999 and look full, but the character would have to wait till next round to take action.
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman
    713 posts Member
    edited January 2016
    TL;DR...

    Sorry, guys, that's A LOT. :open_mouth:

    So, what's the bottom line? Do Han and Phasma play nice together?

    Yeah sorry, had to work it out as it is a bit complicated.

    The simple answers to your original question:

    1) Yes. The turn meter gain is wasted on toons with a full turn meter. But, that may not mean Han and Phasma don't make a cute couple.

    2) No. A call assist will only use basic attack, but it will proc any buffs/debuffs on that atk and count towards cool downs.
    It's a hard life pickin stones and pullin teats, but sure as gods got sandals, it beats fighting dudes with treasure trails....
  • CptCaveman wrote: »
    Sorry to give you bad info and sidetrack your thread OP. Least I learned something new today.

    You went above and beyond. No apologies, please - I thank you! That will definitely help me better time when to use abilities like that. My concern now is how the AI will choose to use the taunt for Han. We know it's going to use it on cooldown. Han isn't speedy, but not the slowest, either. He'll act before Fett and others. It looks like when AI controlled, only the speediest characters will really benefit regularly. I think I'll try it out and see how it goes.

    As for the other question regarding assists, it sounds like an assist won't call another assist. It does appear that if I press the 86 special button, that action can proc a Phasma assist, and also get the guaranteed assist from the special. Correct?

    Once I get more chars unlocked, I'm betting this game is going to be wicked fun with team design!
  • Today I found out something. I used GS assist, then Phasma called to assist, which in turn lead to the assist because of Phasma leadership skill calling Lumi. So three attacks on a single toon. I was like wow!!!

    Hope that helps.
  • its no fun when geo calls dooku for multiple attacks which then trigger phasmas skill to trigger dooku again for multiple attacks :( ... im pretty sure each attack by dooku has a chance to proc the extra attacks tho not positive
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