Why Is This Lando Team Going Before My JE?

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Yudoka
1274 posts Member
Twice now I've tried running my JE droid team against this one Lando team and in both cases the opposing team went before my JE.

My JE is 201 speed plus his bonus of +50. The Lando team's fastest character is Han at 198 speed plus Lando's +15 lead. But both times almost all the characters on the opposing team get to take the first action, resulting in most of my guys dying.

I've looked at all the stats and can't figure out how this is happening. Little help?
They groaned, they stirred, they all uprose, Nor spoke, nor moved their eyes; It had been strange, even in a dream, To have seen those dead men rise.

Replies

  • Pics or didnt happen.

    No seriously, nothing can tell you something helpful without some more details
  • What other charas are on that lando Team?
  • Is there danger zone on the team. Wedge and Biggs get big speed boost
  • APX_919
    2468 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    That shouldn't be happening...JE's speed should clear 250+ and with his special get all your allies' TM up to make a move. With you running a Jawa/droid team, I can't see how he is going first.
    "Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen...mostly"
  • 7AnimalMother
    2053 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Is he running wedge and/or biggs with 192+ speed? If so, they get a +45 bonus at the start from Wedges Unique and +15 from Lando.

    192 + 45 + 15 = 252 = goes before your JE.
  • The times I have issues with that is when Han shoots and stuns JE so he can't do recalibrate. It happens quickly and JE comes out of stun immediately, so it's easy to miss.
  • APX_919
    2468 posts Member
    Is he running wedge and/or biggs with 192 speed? If so, they get a +45 bonus at the start from Wedges Unique and +15 from Lando.

    Had forgotten about that, THAT makes a lot of sense now.
    "Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen...mostly"
  • Yudoka
    1274 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Edit - Nevermind. Just Red Wedge's special.
    They groaned, they stirred, they all uprose, Nor spoke, nor moved their eyes; It had been strange, even in a dream, To have seen those dead men rise.
  • Yudoka
    1274 posts Member
    Thank's for talking me through this, guys. Now it all makes sense. They're going first by 2 speed.
    They groaned, they stirred, they all uprose, Nor spoke, nor moved their eyes; It had been strange, even in a dream, To have seen those dead men rise.
  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff. And even Anni AOE is huge against glass cannon droidz.

    So farm uber speed mods to remain RNG viable on offense, only. Or ditch droids.
  • Yudoka
    1274 posts Member
    LastJedi wrote: »
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Lando/Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff.

    Yup. I've started to see a big decline to my droid team a few weeks ago. The standard now seems to be Emperor/Lando teams. This Lando/Wedge team is not something that I've seen before but they win on speed like you said which then chains into half my team dying before I can do anything. The Emperor/Lando team is usually damned if you do, damned if you don't as leaving either Emperor or Lando alive means bad stuff from then on. Oh well. Looks like P2P are finally getting their day while others are catching up. No biggie. I'll grind out Wedge just in time for another flavor of the month.
    They groaned, they stirred, they all uprose, Nor spoke, nor moved their eyes; It had been strange, even in a dream, To have seen those dead men rise.
  • APX_919
    2468 posts Member
    If you have both EP and Lando to face, turn the game off and walk away silently muttering a prayer to RNGesus that this team will not be back. Yeah, I know there are counters but f2p has fewer of them.
    "Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen...mostly"
  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Emporer Lando with dual taunters? If you have B2, you can usually beat that, but it still RNG. Yeah, droids have been stuffed in top arena for some time, now, on my shard. Only the best droid teams make it to the top, and they don't stick around long. I'm sure even these whale droid teams are frustrated. My shard had LOTS of maxed droids a month ago. Over half those teams are gone.
  • LastJedi wrote: »
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff. And even Anni AOE is huge against glass cannon droidz.

    So farm uber speed mods to remain RNG viable on offense, only. Or ditch droids.

    Don't be dense. Droids are fine. JE goes still goes first if equipped with the identical mods of Wedge/Biggs, and Wedge and Biggs are very squishy. Only raid Han ensures a Rebel Victory, and raid Han is not a good idea to leave in on defense because 1. he is squishy and 2. the ai has him shoot the wrong character half the time on.

  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    FWIW, Rex always trumped droids. P2P have had their day from day 1 until now. I think other way around.. Wiggs gives F2P a legitimate shot on Rex for the first time in history (Maybe not us droidies, but at least other F2P).... but with SHT coming, this seems to be shortlived.
  • LastJedi wrote: »
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff. And even Anni AOE is huge against glass cannon droidz.

    So farm uber speed mods to remain RNG viable on offense, only. Or ditch droids.

    Don't be dense. Droids are fine. JE goes still goes first if equipped with the identical mods of Wedge/Biggs, and Wedge and Biggs are very squishy. Only raid Han ensures a Rebel Victory, and raid Han is not a good idea to leave in on defense because 1. he is squishy and 2. the ai has him shoot the wrong character half the time on.

    Would you risk attacking a han in defense when you got other options?

    Ich run him myself and I avoid him. Only thing I avoid more is wiggs with a faster sthan than mine
  • Miepmorp wrote: »
    LastJedi wrote: »
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff. And even Anni AOE is huge against glass cannon droidz.

    So farm uber speed mods to remain RNG viable on offense, only. Or ditch droids.

    Don't be dense. Droids are fine. JE goes still goes first if equipped with the identical mods of Wedge/Biggs, and Wedge and Biggs are very squishy. Only raid Han ensures a Rebel Victory, and raid Han is not a good idea to leave in on defense because 1. he is squishy and 2. the ai has him shoot the wrong character half the time on.

    Would you risk attacking a han in defense when you got other options?

    Ich run him myself and I avoid him. Only thing I avoid more is wiggs with a faster sthan than mine

    It depends what my other options are....

    Like I said, raid han attacks the wrong toon about 50% of the time.
  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Don't be dense. Droids are fine. JE goes still goes first if equipped with the identical mods of Wedge/Biggs, and Wedge and Biggs are very squishy. Only raid Han ensures a Rebel Victory, and raid Han is not a good idea to leave in on defense because 1. he is squishy and 2. the ai has him shoot the wrong character half the time on.
    Even if you have identical speed mods and go first, you will still need RNG to win. You will not automatically win. Wiggs can defend if Biggs assist attack 88, 88 is ohko. You cannot guarantee kill without triggering Biggs. 86 assist does not guarantee finish on Wedge. And if RG on the team, you gotta relay on AOE which triggers Biggs.

    As for leaving Han on defense... lol. You think your droid team has better defense? You are wrong. Your droid team is completely walked over.

    Raid han hitting JE even one in 5 is better defense than your droids can possibly muster. Your shard may be behind on the times, but it will catch up. Please don't call me dense for knowing what you do not.
  • Relax. Biggs attacks the wrong character a lot too. In my experience, there are two boogie men for droids - Rex and Aayla (boogie woman, I guess). There was a Wiggs team that had Aayla on it, and I could never beat it. AoE that triggers a counter that almost always stuns is brutal to droids. Stuns and getting out turn metered are what is the undoing of droids.

    The best thing to do for droids is to delete this post. The Wiggs team on my server that has Lando is running Wedge as lead. I knock them out for first at payout on a regular basis. If he figures this out - might be a problem...
  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Yup. Biggs hits hk or whatnot, quite a bit. You can totally win most of the time. The fact that under AI it CAN win at all against your droids is what is called DEFENSE. This is something your droid team does not have a shred of. This is why droids are what you might call.... not good.

    The fact you can't beat a wiggs team with aayla to save your life, or several rex squads for that matter, are bonus points.

    Calling Han Solo bad on defense is the funny part. That's why I responded how I did. 20% chance of defense is more than you got with your droids. Your droids can't defend against a paper cup.

    If you have only 80% chance to win, that is potentially one battle and 10 minute timeout. If you can avoid that and still get to the next tier, by ~100% winning against a droid team, most people will eventually learn to do that.

    When this happens, this is when droids will fall off the radar on your shard. And you will stop giving advice on droid teams. It will be as relevant as how to mod Sidious and Lumi.

    Unlike some people think, droids are not auto 100% win on offense in end game. They are RNG win on offense, auto-lose on defense. You can't climb fast enough to maintain high payout using droids. And some teams will flat out block you. Unless you have the better mods by far. In that case you would still do better with a different squad.
    Post edited by LastJedi on
  • That's kinda harsh. Even at their peak, rex owned droids. And what you mean by a deeper roster?

    Something that includes at least 5 of:
    anni, ep, rex, fac, Wedge, biggs, lando, St han, rg, b2, 5s, aayla?

    Of course droids didn't get many of those toons. Cuz anyone with rex was running rex. And most all the other toons are recent additions. Along with je and nebit and 2 other new jawas, droid users were busy diversifying their droid toons. Sigh.

    Cheap and easy? Purple gear is purple gear. All gone and I wish I could scrap my entire droid squad for a couple stun cuffs and a blueberry muffin. :)

    Ease up. We all have common enemy. Rex. Rebs and ep are gonna be hit with a hammer soon enough, too, after they get their time in the limelight.

  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Fwiw, I am happy for rebs. They seem to be doing what droids never could - actually stand toe to toe with rex. I don't mind that at all. Even though I am watching from the sidelines, I love seeing those f2p orange flight suits staking out former rex territory. I hope it lasts. At least long enough for me to finish a wiggs team that can punch rex in the face just once. A win without praying to rng God. And knowing rex can't beat me on auto 100%.
  • Yudoka wrote: »
    LastJedi wrote: »
    Well, here ya go.
    Biggs assist attack pulls ST Han. Han gains TM? plus his lando lead, this is enough to beat JE?

    Welcome to end of droids. Until you also have uber speed mods, your JE speed advantage is nothing. Droids do not circumvent need for uber speed mods, lol. Droids are done. You have RNG chance to beat Wiggs. You can RNG chance to beat Rex. Everybody else can kick ur teeth in 99%.

    Even if you go first, you will need RNG to beat Lando/Wiggs. Cuz your aoes fill Biggs and trigger ST Han Bluff.

    Yup. I've started to see a big decline to my droid team a few weeks ago. The standard now seems to be Emperor/Lando teams. This Lando/Wedge team is not something that I've seen before but they win on speed like you said which then chains into half my team dying before I can do anything. The Emperor/Lando team is usually damned if you do, damned if you don't as leaving either Emperor or Lando alive means bad stuff from then on. Oh well. Looks like P2P are finally getting their day while others are catching up. No biggie. I'll grind out Wedge just in time for another flavor of the month.


    To be honest, droid teams are experiencing what non droid teams were experiencing for months. One or two dead guys before you get to go. Wiggs and Landikin teams are very tough on speed but rex led teams are superceding them already so droid teams are pretty much 3 generations ago now.


    It's not rocket surgery.
  • Droids might not give you #1, but they are still extremely effective in the arena.


    My tip: Just farm speed mods for 2 weeks strait, so your JE has around 234 base speed. Then you will always go first against Wedge/Biggs teams. Kill Wedge first and you are good to go.
    SWGOH.gg profile - Our guild, 3720 to 1, has 1 spot open! [49/50].
  • Shoretrooper will be useful to droid teams.

    He provides droids a significant and much needed defensive boost to the raid Han sniping as well as the Wiggo ohko.
  • Even the mods are not helping the droids. My JE is 240 base speed and all the droids are maxed, was top 3 for months. Now the team is pushed back to 40-50 in 1-2 hours. A slow STHan in the team helps a lot, to keep the wheel spinning, but it is not enough.
  • LastJedi wrote: »
    FWIW, Rex always trumped droids. P2P have had their day from day 1 until now. I think other way around.. Wiggs gives F2P a legitimate shot on Rex for the first time in history (Maybe not us droidies, but at least other F2P).... but with SHT coming, this seems to be shortlived.

    For number 1, I daily have to beat Rex Lando EP StHan SF with my droid team. Odds are about 50/50 after I started single fire EP first. I think that is ok odds since he is running Rex as lead

  • LastJedi
    3047 posts Member
    edited October 2016
    Oaraug wrote: »
    LastJedi wrote: »
    FWIW, Rex always trumped droids. P2P have had their day from day 1 until now. I think other way around.. Wiggs gives F2P a legitimate shot on Rex for the first time in history (Maybe not us droidies, but at least other F2P).... but with SHT coming, this seems to be shortlived.

    For number 1, I daily have to beat Rex Lando EP StHan SF with my droid team. Odds are about 50/50 after I started single fire EP first. I think that is ok odds since he is running Rex as lead

    We all have similar story. But bad news. That ends soon for most of us. Unless ur on a super inactive server, there is not enough time in the day for most droid teams to even get to the top of the heap. Just an fyi for you, bud. Expect the climb to get longer and harder everyday. Rex isn't even a choice. It is a one way slide. Expect that number to increase. Never decrease.

    One day all ur battles will.be 50/50. Wiggs is pretty tough, too. And ur climb will be long.
  • The Meta Report on swgoh.gg currently shows that hk-47 lead still accounts for 8% of the #1 teams out of 622 users. While the stats show that Lando, Wedge, Rex, and Palpatine have higher numbers, it is interesting to note that the droid lead is currently higher than Phasma, Ackbar, and Old Ben. While the previous "meta" has experienced a big drop, droids have held on. While 622 servers might not be all of them, that is enough to account for over 12M players (at ~20,000 per server). It's a non-trivial sample size in other words.

    If you expand out to rank 1-10, it goes up to 11% with hk-47 lead while the old meta drops off even more.

    What does this mean? Droids do have staying power. Don't let one dogmatic naysayer tell you otherwise.
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