Just a thought to stop or change the nerf crusades.
January 22, 2016 6:35PM
edited January 2016
I have read a whole lot of threads for points that lead to nerfing certain characters like Poe or FOTP. I just wanted to see if we could perhaps think of alternatives to knocking a character off so bad that the nerf creates a backlash and then then next character that we consider op is then nerfed and the cycle continues. Balance is very important and changes do need to be made as players figure out mind blowing strategy's and combinations.
Perhaps there are alternative solutions.
For instance Poe is very powerful but it's more the combo's that we made with him as a player base then his kit. I mean the meter reduction is a bit over the top, but it might have been in development of the resistance and the first order they deemed the resistance a bit behind on turn manipulation and thus the first order won too many battles so ... perhaps they thought we can fix this let's give the resistance some meter movement and that will even this out ... ooops yea that worked a bit too well when the players pair Poe with qjj and fotp and other high damage character that will come out later. So why not change some of these guys powers to bring it more in line with the original creation? Don't nerf the idea of the character but perhaps how we manipulate your characters, devs? My idea would be to make the more powerful abilities that character have be linked to having a certain amount of a faction in your group. For instance Poe really should not have turn manipulation with a well thought out team it's really a flip of the coin at that first kill, which is whom ever's Poe goes first. But perhaps he should have it when he's with say 4 out of 5 resistance members or even 5 of 5. And then leave the rest of his kit intact with out the turn manipulation when paired with other synergies and factions. If we had done something like this with Barriss so that her heal was stronger with an all Jedi group we would probably have missed some of that crazy backlash, same with Qui-Gon if you see he is in every high end group then his Ally assist damage is only if the group is 4/5 jedi or 5/5 jedi or the damage assist is higher with Jedi then with out. Or the FOTP his damage might not be as scary if he is with a First order comp. This would make building those dream teams easier because if you over compensated in an ability you could "nerf" it by simply making it more faction specific, making faction teams useful and not ruining all the time put into a character. Thus your characters maintain who they are and you make building your faction teams as important as building dream teams.
I do not think this solves everything but it makes it so that when your player base invests heavily into something they still have more of that something after we as a community have seen that it needs to be addressed in either a positive or a negative way. It also allows for a 2 step process in the balance process, if something was too powerful with anything we combined will it still be too powerful after we narrow it's use to a faction? Then if it is again too powerful we can address it again.
Last I know there people pro and anti nerfing "x" character. I fall into this as well, but for this thread I hope we can look at how to better address nerfs and buffs to characters in general. And dev's if something like this is not possible let us know so that this thread can explore more options.
Perhaps there are alternative solutions.
For instance Poe is very powerful but it's more the combo's that we made with him as a player base then his kit. I mean the meter reduction is a bit over the top, but it might have been in development of the resistance and the first order they deemed the resistance a bit behind on turn manipulation and thus the first order won too many battles so ... perhaps they thought we can fix this let's give the resistance some meter movement and that will even this out ... ooops yea that worked a bit too well when the players pair Poe with qjj and fotp and other high damage character that will come out later. So why not change some of these guys powers to bring it more in line with the original creation? Don't nerf the idea of the character but perhaps how we manipulate your characters, devs? My idea would be to make the more powerful abilities that character have be linked to having a certain amount of a faction in your group. For instance Poe really should not have turn manipulation with a well thought out team it's really a flip of the coin at that first kill, which is whom ever's Poe goes first. But perhaps he should have it when he's with say 4 out of 5 resistance members or even 5 of 5. And then leave the rest of his kit intact with out the turn manipulation when paired with other synergies and factions. If we had done something like this with Barriss so that her heal was stronger with an all Jedi group we would probably have missed some of that crazy backlash, same with Qui-Gon if you see he is in every high end group then his Ally assist damage is only if the group is 4/5 jedi or 5/5 jedi or the damage assist is higher with Jedi then with out. Or the FOTP his damage might not be as scary if he is with a First order comp. This would make building those dream teams easier because if you over compensated in an ability you could "nerf" it by simply making it more faction specific, making faction teams useful and not ruining all the time put into a character. Thus your characters maintain who they are and you make building your faction teams as important as building dream teams.
I do not think this solves everything but it makes it so that when your player base invests heavily into something they still have more of that something after we as a community have seen that it needs to be addressed in either a positive or a negative way. It also allows for a 2 step process in the balance process, if something was too powerful with anything we combined will it still be too powerful after we narrow it's use to a faction? Then if it is again too powerful we can address it again.
Last I know there people pro and anti nerfing "x" character. I fall into this as well, but for this thread I hope we can look at how to better address nerfs and buffs to characters in general. And dev's if something like this is not possible let us know so that this thread can explore more options.
Post edited by Watsi on
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Move powerful abilities on characters to being faction specific. Like Poe only gets turn meter reduction with 4 or 5 members of the group being from the resistance.
Why not post this under an existing thread?
Why not contribute to the existing threads that you claimed you have read?
Even if "balance" is made to one hero, ur proposed change makes groups stronger and if one group is stronger, wouldn't it also be considered OP'?
Plenty more, but your whole paragraph structure hurts my eyes.
I'm guessing you are a high poster who created a new account to post more nerf / op mumbo jumbo to continue to stir the controversy. nerf this and nerf that. then threaten to quit this or threaten to report to BBB that.
It's all so negative.
Love how that was literally your 51st post...
This was also the first time I have posted, and though I admit I could have added to some discussion I felt that both sides to most of the discussions have been some what valid. I wanted to give something different, I can see the community does not respect that though so like I said Fair enough. I will consider this a post that was my idea for change and it was considered bad by most. Also thanks for your opinion on my post.
It's all good though, his point is still valid. I could have done many more posts before this, Either way I am interested by the fact that no one seems to think that this might be helpful. I must have been hit in the head harder that I thought.
I don't plan on making any new threads until I get my reputation up. There are thousands of threads to post in and thousands of posts to read. Most of my ideas have already been stated over and over. If I have a new "idea" I'd put in an existing thread. If I really want to create a new thread, I'd do so after understanding the gist of the forum.
I really like this idea.
His TLDR: Characters become OP because we can pair multiple OP characters together to synergize. So you take some of the biggest offenders such as Poe, FOTP or QGJ and limit their abilities effectiveness unless they're with a faction team.
This is a good idea, however it will still create OP teams like the HK Droid poggle teams. However without a taunter those teams are weaker.
I think some very intelligent nerfs need to happen as well tho to bring characters in line. Let's look at a few.
Multi attacks: Rey should be used as a base for multi attacks. She can attack 2-4 times, however each successive hit does less damage. If this were applied to characters such as FOTP, Leia, or Dooku, this simple change could bring their damage closer to balance.
Assists: Phasma leader ability presents a good baseline. When an ally is called in to assist, they do reduced damage. Another option could be they do full damage but their turn meter is reduced to 0. This helps them get to attack early, but not constantly. If QGJ called an ally but that ally did 75% damage instead of doing extra damage, he wouldn't be considered OP, but still very useful.
Turn meter manipulation: Again, Phasma is a great example. Phasma can slow the enemy, at about a 40% success rate, while doing minimal damage. Or Phasma can boost your teams turn meters, but at the cost of not attacking. You should have to choose between options when picking a skill to use. To do damage, or taunt, or turn meter manip, etc. Imagine if Luminara healed, AND did an ability block on the enemy at the same time. It would be too much. Poe needs his turn meter effect separated out as a separate skill.
If character actions had a basic baseline for how skills worked, it would lead to much more diversity and fun. Instead of limiting our options to compete.
Yes I agree. However the backlash seems a bit much. The 'Get over it' seems a bit tough and the 'go with the flow' seems to lack passion. I simply wanted to see if there was a way to better adjust characters. In the end you do just need to balance. I just thought since I could think of something different perhaps someone else could think of something better.
Your post is coherent and your idea is as "good" as any other here. --> Factions should indeed be made (a bit) more relevant. One way or another.
Side note: Paragraphs are your friend dude. Was a pain to read it.
I don't think limiting diversity is a good idea
Fully starring, gearing, and leveling a toon is a long and arduous process. This time or monetary commitment necessary should not result in an overnight nerf. That's like waiting 4 hours in a line at an amusement park and discovering when it's FINALLY your turn to ride that the workers decide to shut the ride down early. No wonder McDonalds now has breakfast all day now to stop the daily 10:31am raging...
Yeah because post count means everything!