Why don't people use yoda against Zader?

HQFireBall

If you use a QGJ lead with yoda modded for speed wouldn't he get his tenacity before Vader attacks?

Wildcats1203

Yes, but that involves removing two of your squad members for Yoda and QGJ. Aside from the initial Tenacity Up, they arent very good arena characters. You're usually better off just taking the debuffs and having two characters that are better than Yoda and QGJ on your team. Also, TFP can ability block Yoda, and if that happens he's basically dead weight for the rest of the fight.

pargame

HQFireBall

Well why not use that with kenobi allay and a Anakin?

HQFireBall

Lol

Zooey

Zader squads tend to be pretty tanky and can go the distance. You're exchanging blocking the first turn of debuffs for less damage overall. It's also tough to use if they've got Shore GK or another dual taunt setup.

Zipped

I think people go with Rex instead as he gives the tenacity buff as well as TM?

I'm not sure but I think they use him with clones as there's a nicer synergy

Bulldog1205

People do use that sometimes. To take real advantage of it though you really need to zeta QCJ and have Kenobi. That's no possible for a lot of people.

Dooku_for_days

Because B2.

HQFireBall

True

Mullato

Yea zQGJ L with a fast Yoda destroys Zader teams.

Darth_finch

Mullato wrote: »

Yea zQGJ L with a fast Yoda destroys Zader teams.

Except if their running B2 under zader..

Jetlife

It's a very good counter for him.
Rex is also a great counter because when enemy tfp does his aoe (if Rex doesn't get AB), Rex will gain tm and than give tm and tenacity up to your entire team. GG

HQFireBall

In my shard there are like no B2s

StormTro0p3R_H

Darth_finch wrote: »

Mullato wrote: »

Yea zQGJ L with a fast Yoda destroys Zader teams.

Except if their running B2 under zader..

You can manipulate B2 A.I. easily enough. It involves speeding both Anakin and Yoda faster that their TIE Pilot. IF you can do that, you're good.

Mullato

Darth_finch wrote: »

Mullato wrote: »

Yea zQGJ L with a fast Yoda destroys Zader teams.

Except if their running B2 under zader..

Well if they are using b2 then they are missing out on another key toon
- tfp
- Palp
- boba
- baze/shore

HQFireBall

Unless u take out plan for zader

LeoRavus

People do use this combo and they don't hold on defense. Immediately after Tie knocks out their foresight from QGJ, B2 wipes Yoda's tenacity up, then it's a gravy win.

Nikoms565

... And Zeta Maul is the rock that crushes those scissors.

bivox

In the arena I use wedge gibbs and ren as attackers .they do massive damage. I use stormtrooper han and scarif to sponge damge. Great team can usually barrel throught most teams with their high damage.

Waqui

Wildcats1203 wrote: »

Yes, but that involves removing two of your squad members for Yoda and QGJ. Aside from the initial Tenacity Up, they arent very good arena characters. You're usually better off just taking the debuffs and having two characters that are better than Yoda and QGJ on your team. Also, TFP can ability block Yoda, and if that happens he's basically dead weight for the rest of the fight.

1. Yoda can be faster than TFP and under QGJ lead he most certainly will be — hence TFP won't land a single debuff. (Yoda moves first probably followed by TFP before others move).
2. A tenacity up absolutely cripples empire teams unless they have a way of dispelling it before their debuffers' turns.
3. Did you ever see Zader throw his culling blade on a toon with no debuffs? It's hillarious.

So....I tend to disagree. Yoda's TU is certainly worth what you loose.

Mullato

Waqui wrote: »

Wildcats1203 wrote: »

Yes, but that involves removing two of your squad members for Yoda and QGJ. Aside from the initial Tenacity Up, they arent very good arena characters. You're usually better off just taking the debuffs and having two characters that are better than Yoda and QGJ on your team. Also, TFP can ability block Yoda, and if that happens he's basically dead weight for the rest of the fight.

1. Yoda can be faster than TFP and under QGJ lead he most certainly will be — hence TFP won't land a single debuff. (Yoda moves first probably followed by TFP before others move).
2. A tenacity up absolutely cripples empire teams unless they have a way of dispelling it before their debuffers' turns.
3. Did you ever see Zader throw his culling blade on a toon with no debuffs? It's hillarious.

So....I tend to disagree. Yoda's TU is certainly worth what you loose.

Exactly, if a Zader or Palp team doesn't have b2 I can auto battle it. But if they have b2 I have to manually try and play around him.

leef

yoda is a great counter to zader. If he is the best choice for your arena is debatable.

Mullato

It goes like this...
Yoda first turn BM
Tfp AOE dispels foresight
Boba AOE resisted and aayla counter stuns
Palp AOE resisted and aayla counter stuns
Vader AOE resisted and aayla counter stuns

B2 is the best counter.

Waqui

Zooey wrote: »

You're exchanging blocking the first turn of debuffs for less damage overall. It's also tough to use if they've got Shore GK or another dual taunt setup.

If they don't land their debuffs they will not:

1. get that dmg bonus on their basic (TFP).
2. remove TM from you.
3. get those huge TM gains from landing debuffs. (Are you aware of how slow Vader will be?)
4. get that huge dmg bonus on specials (Vaders culling blade on a toon without debuffs bare grazes it).
5. block/stun or prevent you from gaining your buffs like foresight from QGJ and such.

When I play my rebels on offense I make sure to have my Chirrut faster than enemy TFPs. After his first move (tenacity up) they are toast. Unless they included B2 I can auto the rest. I'm sure it's similar with Yoda and jedi.

Waqui

LeoRavus wrote: »

People do use this combo and they don't hold on defense. Immediately after Tie knocks out their foresight from QGJ, B2 wipes Yoda's tenacity up, then it's a gravy win.

Agreed. B2 can counter it on defense. But at least TFP doesn't land his block/buff immunity (which he wouldn't anyway with zQGJ lead).

Tactyou

Chirrut faster than TFP depends on mods. Pretty sure opponent TFP mods are crappy then if your chirrut is faster.

StormTro0p3R_H

Again...if we are talking zQGJ on offense versus a Zader defense, then either

(1) Let TFP AoE go first, whiffs and triggers B2 cleanse since Ahsoka has Crit Immunity buff, GK cleanses, Yoda Tenacity Up..game over if this is zeta and most likely even if it's not

Or

(2) Anakin goes first, before TFP (he is 4 speed up on TFP since QGJ lead) and his AoE triggers B2 who wastes his move on the foresight, Yoda goes (also before TFP since he's 17 speed up on him) and Tenacity Ups...

B2 is easy play around and a liability on defense. May make offense easier but defense is a chump. Baze would be better, but he's not too hard to play around initially, just harder to take down

There's another thread going about zQGJ on defense.

Zooey

Waqui wrote: »

Zooey wrote: »

You're exchanging blocking the first turn of debuffs for less damage overall. It's also tough to use if they've got Shore GK or another dual taunt setup.

If they don't land their debuffs they will not:

1. get that dmg bonus on their basic (TFP).
2. remove TM from you.
3. get those huge TM gains from landing debuffs. (Are you aware of how slow Vader will be?)
4. get that huge dmg bonus on specials (Vaders culling blade on a toon without debuffs bare grazes it).
5. block/stun or prevent you from gaining your buffs like foresight from QGJ and such.

When I play my rebels on offense I make sure to have my Chirrut faster than enemy TFPs. After his first move (tenacity up) they are toast. Unless they included B2 I can auto the rest. I'm sure it's similar with Yoda and jedi.

We're talking about zader lead, not EP.

1. Every hit will still remove TM even with tenacity up.
2. Debuffs do not help them move faster on anyone except EP.

And using Chaze is much different than QGJ Yoda lol.

Bulldog1205

Debuffs do help TFP move faster. He's nothing special if you have tenacity up.

Khayman

He is useable but really liable on defense. If he hit harder then using him would be more viable.