Zader STILL Solos .. Permanent solution for Heroic Rancor

Replies

  • Vertigo
    4496 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!
    @Baller
    If a TMR team does more damage it should be rewarded with more should it not? TMR teams don't get you that much of anything outside the Pit, this game is all about building different squads so you can accomplish different things. I understand that yes people who have built TMR teams get better Rancor rewards, but those teams do next to nothing outside of the Pit (Zader not really, but thats a Zeta ability and once you can farm zetas the Pit really shouldn't matter as much to you as you should have a fairly developed roster at that point). They want you to build more than one team, if Wiggs and Chaze or a R1 team could beat every game mode there would be no point for any other characters.
    It's not even really a "bottleneck" for TMR teams, it's just a "bottleneck" for better designed teams. Better designed teams do more damage overall and get better rewards. The best design for the Rancor is TMR. The best design for Phase 1 of the tank Raid is counterattacking party with GK. The best design for a P2 team is a nice Zader team or a well built Zody + scavenger squad, P3 has it's own best design in Chirpatine (originally) and a TMRish squad with Nihilus in it. P4 is all about having a good rebel team or having Zody + leia. Sure the Tank raid really requires you to have a lot of teams that might not otherwise be very useful, but that's because it's aimed at higher level more developed players. The Pit is the raid before that, and it's aimed at mid level players that can't really build 4 or 5 teams one for each phase. They can build TMR team though, and those teams will help them a lot.

    If you're that upset about not getting top rewards join a guild where they alternate the top players in the raid and have rules as to who does how much damage in each phase. There are plenty out there that do that, and those sound like your style. Or don't and continue to complain about people who have better built Rancor teams than you do. Either join a guild that's slightly more organized, or build up a TMR squad. Neither are very difficult to do.
  • TofuMao
    630 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    Well this is as naive as saying NERF Zmaul or Rex, I never bothered gearing them over gear 8 and I have to fight then in arena to get top 20 reward.

    Notice arena rewards are far better than rancor rewards and that is really a load of the same 25 people taking top spots, so stop whining and get yourself a decent TMR team, if you have it, great!!!! Nerfing the toons you said, many guilds would do much worse and split because they won't finish rsncor either.
    -1000
  • Zipped
    105 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    So by your theory people who get huge damage in HAAT from Zody and Zetas that have been spent specifically to do big damage on HAAT should be nerfed too?


    Because they would be "hogging the top rewards"


    Using a zader and teebo team is a strategy ...the rancor is an old out of date raid it's on farm for everyone now turn your eyes to HAAT making TMR redundant is ridiculous it would just take longer and reopen a boring raid
  • jjkriv
    429 posts Member
    Again,leave this rancor alone,come out with a new raid already...my guild just finally started beating heroic while the higher up guilds reaped all the awards for so long..the only people your trying to punish right now are the lower guilds and the lower levels who couldn't reap the rewards.fair is fair when the well isn't already dried up!
  • The Rancor raid was broken and boring LOOONNNG before teebo and zDV and people soloing it - there's just not enough to go around for 50 decent players and it's dead in less than 10 minutes. Why do anything to modify the raid if it's going to insta-die anyway? What's the point?
  • ProximaB1_
    1093 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    Most guilds I've been apart of have rules to change order for instance the guild I'm in now picks a faction that all guild members with 7* Han use on the raid. If you don't have 7* Han use anyone one squad you like it actually really fun and changes order of rewards every pay out. Mabe you need to convince your guild to come up with fun rules to make rancor fun. It's much more fun and helps new members out.
  • Baller
    58 posts Member
    Jjkriv - Yea because coming out and developing brand new content/raids is soooo much more practical than fixing the broken one. Look, Im not just trying to punish the lower guilds, EVERYONE deserves to be punished to a certain extent (ESP those who went zader/teebo to exploit easy rewards). By removing ALL TURN METER REMOVAL on RAIDS ONLY, this would be justified punishment against ANYONE and EVERYONE (including MYSELF) that went zader/teebo build to reap easy rewards. Absolutely NO refunds on Zader as well.

    Johnny - that is the whole point of making rancor buffer. If hes so easy to kill right now, WHAT IS THE POINT? Fans and gamers alike loseinterest in "easy" games. If you take turn meter removal away from rancor it will make the raid so much more fun and difficult.

    The REAL people to punish and blame here are the people who KNOWINGLY EXPLOIT the bug (Ahnold and LordSkunk etc...) and blast it all over youtube/reddit so that the lower tier F2P (and P2P) guys such as myself get CUNNIVED into spending all that time/$$/energy into a strategy completely revolved around exploiting a bug.

    As I said earlier, I have NO DOG in the fight here as I have BOTH Zader and a Teebo squad. But what is fair is fair, and if CG/EA devs are really serious about the quality of gameplay for the fans then they WILL DO WHATS RIGHT and FIX THIS BUG (by removing TMR on rancor).
  • Baller wrote: »
    Jjkriv - Yea because coming out and developing brand new content/raids is soooo much more practical than fixing the broken one. Look, Im not just trying to punish the lower guilds, EVERYONE deserves to be punished to a certain extent (ESP those who went zader/teebo to exploit easy rewards). By removing ALL TURN METER REMOVAL on RAIDS ONLY, this would be justified punishment against ANYONE and EVERYONE (including MYSELF) that went zader/teebo build to reap easy rewards. Absolutely NO refunds on Zader as well.

    Johnny - that is the whole point of making rancor buffer. If hes so easy to kill right now, WHAT IS THE POINT? Fans and gamers alike loseinterest in "easy" games. If you take turn meter removal away from rancor it will make the raid so much more fun and difficult.

    The REAL people to punish and blame here are the people who KNOWINGLY EXPLOIT the bug (Ahnold and LordSkunk etc...) and blast it all over youtube/reddit so that the lower tier F2P (and P2P) guys such as myself get CUNNIVED into spending all that time/$$/energy into a strategy completely revolved around exploiting a bug.

    As I said earlier, I have NO DOG in the fight here as I have BOTH Zader and a Teebo squad. But what is fair is fair, and if CG/EA devs are really serious about the quality of gameplay for the fans then they WILL DO WHATS RIGHT and FIX THIS BUG (by removing TMR on rancor).
    You really must be bored since now you're just trolling.

    The guild I'm in only has about 22 members that actively participate in the raids. We have just started beating the T7 Rancor. If TMR was gone, we'd be back to T6 looking at our 10 Han Solo shards. Yes, 3 members put zetas on Vader so that we can finish it. I use Jyn, Bistan and 3 fast Rebels. How does taking away TMR make the game better for us?
  • Tanbimb
    70 posts Member
    My big question is why on earth would you zeta luminara before vader? I can solo rancor without teebo or vader if you want it to be a challenge try different teams jyn lead works too
  • Baller
    58 posts Member
    Videofarmer- I was half kidding.. All jokes aside, if you couldnt beat Heroic Rancor before Zader, then you probably should not be in that raid. So do you think its fair for the other people in the same shards as the lower tier members of ur guild to be left behind while ur fellow guildmates reap the rewards of being carried by a fellow guikdmate that went vader? Is it fair that ur lower tier guild members are getting heroic prizes even when theyre not ready for it? There are plenty of level 85s that have yet to do a heroic but if you allow everyone to exploit this bug there will be level 50-60s in their shards with general kenobi. HOW is that fair?????
  • Baller wrote: »
    PLEASE devs do something about Zader..

    He can still solo Heroic Rancor too easily and is ruining the game for many people.

    Theres even people now AFTER the patch soloing Rancor WITH GEAR 7/8 toons..

    I have a PERMANENT solution to this zader bug WITHOUT having to refund zeta mats for zader users.

    How about making Heroic Rancor IMMUNE TO ALL TURN METER REMOVAL. Yes, that means teebo and rex will no longer be able to remove turn meter but at least you no longer have to worry about this zader bug.

    This will easily level the playing field for all P2P and F2P players.

    Besides, soloing Rancor is ABSOLUTELY BORING and was NOT what was intended when you made zader.

    Please do this for true dedicated gamers/sw fans that want to see a REAL balance in the game.

    Quit being a baby. Clearly you're just butt hurt cause you don't have Zader at 7* yet. Who the f*ck cares about balance? If you think there ever will be balance between f2p and p2p then clearly you aren't paying attention and once again are butt hurt because you don't want to spend money. I am for the most part f2p but have spent around $500-1000 in a year and a half and even I know that balance will never happen. Theres a huge gap between me and p2p players. There always will be. Otherwise whats the point in spending? Do you think the devs make these games for pure free pleasure? Their in it for the money clearly. Freeloaders can only get so far in their eyes. So don't complain about balance.
  • Folks would love nothing more to make bosses immune to EVERYTHING so they can do better than someone else, but then they'll whine like hell when they do like crud afterwards.
    SnakesOnAPlane
  • Heezyyyy
    95 posts Member
    This is ridiculous the AAT raid has FOUR different phases and is meant for 4 different teams at least. The rancor raid really only has 2 different phases and is clearly centered around 1/2 different TMR teams.
  • Baller
    58 posts Member
    Ccthompson - I am also a F2P player but I've spent a little under $500 on my account so I can pretty much say I represent about 60-70% of the playerbase. I'm not whining about ANYTHING. I have BOTH zader and teebo teams that can easily solo Rancor. As a matter of fact, I would say I'm as close to a whale (without actually being one) as you can get being mostly a F2P player, so removing TMR from Rancor would actually hurt me more than the normal playerbase. I just want a fair and balanced gamed that benefits EVERYONE. The damage will scale much better for the people who have built real squads rather than put together some cheesy TMR squad. JUST BE FAIR man
  • Alsend_Drake
    709 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    My Zader team rarely gets near soloing because the 50% chance of it not working having killed me off multiple times, the increased TM removal's been fixed (though I think TFP's debuff check's still bugged, saw him remove more than 20% in arena a few times) and my Rebel Squad routinely does much better, and I'm pretty raid gear starved.
    Overall, TM removal is a tactic, and is pretty specific to mostly working in the Pit, and somewhat in Arena. Other raids will have other factors, like the AAT raid and how TMR is less useful, be it GG's 10-hit timer, or the Tank's turrets, and the extra droids. IMO, making things flat out just not work suddenly is just limiting and can lead to annoyance.
    And tbh, threads like this tend to not do much than invite arguments, like in another game there was complaints about a debuff that was unremovable, unavoidable, with counters being almost nonexistent unless you're using a small pool of characters, that would make you routinely just not attack and not only lose a turn, but put the move on Cool down and consume it's resources, and if it did work, it would do half damage. Then you'd get punched a lot for trying. Then explode for a crazy amount of damage.

    Sure, there were a few counters, but they involved working around it. Why worry about doing damage when you can make the enemy kill themselves for you? Or you could try and manipulate their AI.
    But guess what, tons of threads asking for some balance, be it a way to mitigate one of the factors that made it so strong, make the damage reduction a bit weaker, or make the chance to lose a turn a bit lower, but nothing happened, and it remained unchanged until the game closed, even as other things that were much less of an issue got nerfed hard.
  • jackTHErandom
    1195 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    So your gripe is the reward structure?
    Dont you think that nerfing tmr is a bandaid applied to a spot that wasnt cut...

    Fixing reward structure requires reworking reward structure, not nerfing zader...


    I just saw OP's reply that teebo and zader squads exploit the system... What drugs are you on?
    People build squads that work to get better rewards -
    In RL you study to get a better job to have more income... That an exploit too?

    You, @Baller are a bloody jealous brainless zombie

    And on a last edit: @Baller what are you now? Ftp or someone who spent $500? Spending 500 bucks means you are p2p...
  • Wait... Is this one of those "i broke guild rules so i have to create a troll topic and defend it whatever the cost" things? I hope for you thats the case OP
  • @Bailer sounds like you're just mad that everyone else is just better than you. Try hitting level 10 then get back to us
  • Baller
    58 posts Member
    Jack- no , it is not the reward structure. My gripe is that this is a bug with vaders skill that is being exploited by lower/higher tier guys that should be fixed permanently.

    Zader's ability was NEVER meant to be exploited on heroic rancor the way it is being used now. I know Im not the only one out there that wants this nerfed.

    As I said earlier, I already have a zader team and a teebo team and can solo rancor easily with a bunch of gear 7/8 toons with literally NO MODS on 3 of them. How is that fair for the people that have been playing for a year but still havent conpleted their first heroic raid?
  • Pyrimis
    269 posts Member
    If you've been playing actively for a year, you shouldn't have any issues getting a Zader at this point. I haven't spent a penny on the game and I was able to farm what I need for this toon. Also, the actual bug they wanted to fix is fixed, confirmed by our 2 raids the last 3 days.
  • My two cents on this is that if you have people in your guild who repeatedly hog rewards because they have the teams built that do the most damage maybe you need to communicate such a complaint to your guild?

    Our guild has a few higher hitters who do mass damage comparatively to others, however, we run raids based on who can do what. That being said we all compete in every raid, so our hard hitters still take top spots cause we all still need gear. We do however talk and make requests of one another.

    People will always take the path of least resistance to gain the most reward. If TMR is the way to go that is what people will do.
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    But heres the thing.. Raid damage should be based off skill and strategizing your squad, not by focusing on leveling up Teebo/Zader.

    Strategizing your squad? You mean, by developing the toons, that are fit for the task? Toons that you would not use in arena but only in raids? And then giving them the mods that fit best, with lots of speed and .... potency??? Something you wouldn't do otherwise. Yeah! It should be based on strategizing your squad. You said it marn!

  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    I don't. Also I don't see a problem with clones/Leia teams destroying hAAT phase 4 to take first through 4th in my guild. They developed their squads — they earned it.

  • Vertigo
    4496 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    Dont you think that nerfing tmr is a bandaid applied to a spot that wasnt cut...

    It's more like getting a bruise on your leg and deciding to cut off your head because that way your whole body feels pain/no pain so it's "FAIR"
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »

    I WANT the lower level players to do better and not feel obligated to save zeta mats for vader when there are others they can zeta (barris,boba, luminara,zaul) there are so much more they can do.

    Without TM reduction many players still leveling up won't even be able to do heroic Rancor raids. They will be stuck in tier 6 for several months more without TM reduction.

    Your concern is not lower level players. Your concern is yourself and only yourself.

    Now, go out there and get Teebo ander Zader. Off you go!

  • He's just mad that he doesn't know how to do the rancor. Can a mod close this please. I'm sick of seeing this bumped to the top while I'm trying to find actual informative posts and I'm sure others feel the same way.
  • Vertigo wrote: »
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!

    Dont you think that nerfing tmr is a bandaid applied to a spot that wasnt cut...

    It's more like getting a bruise on your leg and deciding to cut off your head because that way your whole body feels pain/no pain so it's "FAIR"

    Fair enough
  • Woodroward
    3749 posts Member
    Baller wrote: »
    Vertigo - do you not see the issue with TMR teams bottlenecking rewards at the top?

    Guild rewards should be fairly distributed among members and shouldnt be funneled to the people who went TMR teams.

    People have spent hundreds if not THOUSANDS on gearing up for the new meta like sith who are notoriously bad in raids (besides vader)

    Just because you have a certain toon (zader,teebo, qgj, rex, bistan) doesn't mean you should be able to HOG ALL THE TOP REWARDS!!!!!


    Sure... Just because you have leveled your Sith doesn't mean you should be able to do well in arena by that logic.

    What you are talking about is the elimination of having to choose:
    Do I want to do well in raiding, or well in arena, or well in ships?

    The fact that certain teams are better in certain phases of the game is one of the BEST things about it. It's what gives it longevity. It gives us different goals to attain. It makes it so that there's always something new.

    Making people choose from a certain subsect of characters to be able to do well on the Rancor is not only not a bad thing, it is a necessary good thing to keep the game from becoming boring.

    So your other main complaint is that you're bored with the Rancor from what I gather. Well of course you are. Once you've beaten one facet of the game, it is time to start working on the next. Deciding to make lower content harder to make it more fun and challenging isn't something that should be decided based on the opinion of someone who outclasses the content.

    It's not like it is hard to build a good Rancor team. If people don't want to take the time to do so, then they have no room to complain about those that do.

  • Dreislao
    380 posts Member
    @Baller .... you represent 60-70% of the player base? That's some bold claim. You certainly do not represent me. You seem to have fooled yourself into believing your minority opinion is the voice of a majority. It's not. Get over yourself.
    I fight the good fight
  • How about an update to pit raids? It's been a year and half now. Hard mode, zeta.. a new 5th phase may Be? Pre phase 1, so phase current phase 1 can get all time zones a whack at it?
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