Recently, a way to do significant damage to the AAT in phases 2 and 4 of the Tank Takedown raid have been discovered in the community. While we always enjoy seeing different strategies formed by Players to use in the raids, this most recent discovery disrupts our intent for the Tank Takedown Raid, which is to work together as a guild to overcome normally insurmountable foes.
I'm sorry @CG_Kozispoon , @Vampire_X , I like the game, I like the devs, I'm on here most weekdays... but I do call some bull on this. A number of players have said it, and I know I've posted it more then once:
The only real teamwork in this game is in the top of the arena. People collaborate to share payouts. It's a team where 24 players can, in theory if not also in practice with some luck, can get a #1 payout time. #1 every day, all week, forever. That requires some management and work. Potentially 168 #1 payouts. But half it - 12 players #1 it in a day - 84 #1 payouts a week.
Meanwhile - guilds get 2-3 Pit & 2 AAT raids a week. It's a real leaderboard, with only one #1 payout per raid - everyone else falling down from there. So Five #1 payouts in a supposed guild?
Five #1's in a week for 50 guildies to fight over. 84 #1's (potentially) for 12 arena 'shardmates' to share 100% evenly.
Again, I'm sorry, but I fail to see where you are encouraging guildies to fight together - verse arena where people really are supposed to fight against each other? And so on topic, RE Nute, I find the 'teamwork reason' ridiculous. On top of just saying you aren't going to do Nerfs... here it comes.
(for the people who want to say they get better raid rewards at lower level, it's all RNG, and it's because you are more likely to place < 3 and > 3 place - which is how a bias forms. Plus, it's RNG, unlike Arena which is guaranteed payout with crystals you can use to buy gear, which is the real limitation in this game.)
TL:DR - More Teamwork in Arena then in Raids, which are mini leaderboards. Nute is just an extension of the competitive neture of the raid and a how to better come out on top.
Recently, a way to do significant damage to the AAT in phases 2 and 4 of the Tank Takedown raid have been discovered in the community. While we always enjoy seeing different strategies formed by Players to use in the raids, this most recent discovery disrupts our intent for the Tank Takedown Raid, which is to work together as a guild to overcome normally insurmountable foes.
I'm sorry @CG_Kozispoon , @Vampire_X , I like the game, I like the devs, I'm on here most weekdays... but I do call some bull on this. A number of players have said it, and I know I've posted it more then once:
The only real teamwork in this game is in the top of the arena. People collaborate to share payouts. It's a team where 24 players can, in theory if not also in practice with some luck, can get a #1 payout time. #1 every day, all week, forever. That requires some management and work. Potentially 168 #1 payouts. But half it - 12 players #1 it in a day - 84 #1 payouts a week.
Meanwhile - guilds get 2-3 Pit & 2 AAT raids a week. It's a real leaderboard, with only one #1 payout per raid - everyone else falling down from there. So Five #1 payouts in a supposed guild?
Five #1's in a week for 50 guildies to fight over. 84 #1's (potentially) for 12 arena 'shardmates' to share 100% evenly.
Again, I'm sorry, but I fail to see where you are encouraging guildies to fight together - verse arena where people really are supposed to fight against each other? And so on topic, RE Nute, I find the 'teamwork reason' ridiculous. On top of just saying you aren't going to do Nerfs... here it comes.
(for the people who want to say they get better raid rewards at lower level, it's all RNG, and it's because you are more likely to place < 3 and > 3 place - which is how a bias forms. Plus, it's RNG, unlike Arena which is guaranteed payout with crystals you can use to buy gear, which is the real limitation in this game.)
TL:DR - More Teamwork in Arena then in Raids, which are mini leaderboards. Nute is just an extension of the competitive neture of the raid and a how to better come out on top.
Recently, a way to do significant damage to the AAT in phases 2 and 4 of the Tank Takedown raid have been discovered in the community. While we always enjoy seeing different strategies formed by Players to use in the raids, this most recent discovery disrupts our intent for the Tank Takedown Raid, which is to work together as a guild to overcome normally insurmountable foes.
I'm sorry @CG_Kozispoon , @Vampire_X , I like the game, I like the devs, I'm on here most weekdays... but I do call some bull on this. A number of players have said it, and I know I've posted it more then once:
The only real teamwork in this game is in the top of the arena. People collaborate to share payouts. It's a team where 24 players can, in theory if not also in practice with some luck, can get a #1 payout time. #1 every day, all week, forever. That requires some management and work. Potentially 168 #1 payouts. But half it - 12 players #1 it in a day - 84 #1 payouts a week.
Meanwhile - guilds get 2-3 Pit & 2 AAT raids a week. It's a real leaderboard, with only one #1 payout per raid - everyone else falling down from there. So Five #1 payouts in a supposed guild?
Five #1's in a week for 50 guildies to fight over. 84 #1's (potentially) for 12 arena 'shardmates' to share 100% evenly.
Again, I'm sorry, but I fail to see where you are encouraging guildies to fight together - verse arena where people really are supposed to fight against each other? And so on topic, RE Nute, I find the 'teamwork reason' ridiculous. On top of just saying you aren't going to do Nerfs... here it comes.
(for the people who want to say they get better raid rewards at lower level, it's all RNG, and it's because you are more likely to place < 3 and > 3 place - which is how a bias forms. Plus, it's RNG, unlike Arena which is guaranteed payout with crystals you can use to buy gear, which is the real limitation in this game.)
TL:DR - More Teamwork in Arena then in Raids, which are mini leaderboards. Nute is just an extension of the competitive neture of the raid and a how to better come out on top.
I agree with this on so many lvls it's not even funny. Raids should not even have damage counters every player gets the same reward if they participated when the raid is defeated.
While I get that they didn't intend for nute to happen what harm does it do? You could give everyone in the game a 7 star Kenobi it wouldn't matter. Still have to gear him and that isn't easy. Gear is the true pay wall in this game.
Recently, a way to do significant damage to the AAT in phases 2 and 4 of the Tank Takedown raid have been discovered in the community. While we always enjoy seeing different strategies formed by Players to use in the raids, this most recent discovery disrupts our intent for the Tank Takedown Raid, which is to work together as a guild to overcome normally insurmountable foes.
I'm sorry @CG_Kozispoon , @Vampire_X , I like the game, I like the devs, I'm on here most weekdays... but I do call some bull on this. A number of players have said it, and I know I've posted it more then once:
The only real teamwork in this game is in the top of the arena. People collaborate to share payouts. It's a team where 24 players can, in theory if not also in practice with some luck, can get a #1 payout time. #1 every day, all week, forever. That requires some management and work. Potentially 168 #1 payouts. But half it - 12 players #1 it in a day - 84 #1 payouts a week.
Meanwhile - guilds get 2-3 Pit & 2 AAT raids a week. It's a real leaderboard, with only one #1 payout per raid - everyone else falling down from there. So Five #1 payouts in a supposed guild?
Five #1's in a week for 50 guildies to fight over. 84 #1's (potentially) for 12 arena 'shardmates' to share 100% evenly.
Again, I'm sorry, but I fail to see where you are encouraging guildies to fight together - verse arena where people really are supposed to fight against each other? And so on topic, RE Nute, I find the 'teamwork reason' ridiculous. On top of just saying you aren't going to do Nerfs... here it comes.
(for the people who want to say they get better raid rewards at lower level, it's all RNG, and it's because you are more likely to place < 3 and > 3 place - which is how a bias forms. Plus, it's RNG, unlike Arena which is guaranteed payout with crystals you can use to buy gear, which is the real limitation in this game.)
TL:DR - More Teamwork in Arena then in Raids, which are mini leaderboards. Nute is just an extension of the competitive neture of the raid and a how to better come out on top.
I do more collaboration on my external shard chat than my guild chat and I'm the freaking leader of my guild. Agree. If you want to invest in mostly useless toons for the sake of doing better in guild raid rewards, let them do that.
While I get that they didn't intend for nute to happen what harm does it do? You could give everyone in the game a 7 star Kenobi it wouldn't matter. Still have to gear him and that isn't easy. Gear is the true pay wall in this game.
So just give away the best toon in the game to everyone? What about the people who invested heavily in Raid teams to get him before everyone else? This is ridiculous. Yes, his gear sucks. I have him at 7 stars and saved gear and poured cash into gearing him fast so I could gain an advantage in arena. Is this not the way it should be?
i hope they neuter p1 Kylo strategy along with this. I see little difference.
And clones since they can clear a phase too.
I am not saying is fair but certainly it's not the same. Tank raid was designed for gear 10 toons and mods 5. A "blue" gear toon be able to clear p2 is weird.
While I get that they didn't intend for nute to happen what harm does it do? You could give everyone in the game a 7 star Kenobi it wouldn't matter. Still have to gear him and that isn't easy. Gear is the true pay wall in this game.
So just give away the best toon in the game to everyone? What about the people who invested heavily in Raid teams to get him before everyone else? This is ridiculous. Yes, his gear sucks. I have him at 7 stars and saved gear and poured cash into gearing him fast so I could gain an advantage in arena. Is this not the way it should be?
Assuming that nute was the missing link to guilds doing haat it will still take months to unlock Kenobi much less 7 star him. My point was only this isn't gonna "break the game "
Come on guys can we please act reasonable here the Devs do not have the Man power to think of and try every team Comp in the game we the Players are there test group essentially and Even professional Games like Halo 5 or something like that that takes years to make still has unforeseen bugs. Can we please cut the Good Devs a little slack and Thank them for an awesome game
Maybe not every team comp. But there are only 5 jawas. And not that many characters like nute that provide tm gain. They should ALWAYS be testing any new/reworked abilities that involve tm manipulation, especially with jawas given their special aat ability.
there is no cooperation in guild when it comes to individual scores, otherwise the rewards wouldn't be random, tied by ID, and competing in ranking by score. the user is motivated completely since April 2016 to maximize his/her score in the raid...
Offer him a hearty handshake and a pat on the back.
I know there are lots of posts about this already, but most of them have gone so off-topic that I felt it might be necessary to start a new one. This one is directed at both the players and developers.
Now let's get to the point (in another lengthy post).
From a developmental standpoint, there are 2 basic ways of looking at any video game: as a product your company sells, and as entertainment your company provides (there's a possible 3rd way to look at it, which is as a social/political statement or work of art, but that's not relevant to this issue, so I'm not gonna touch it). As long as people enjoy your game and you provide a decent way for them to give you money, you're golden. It's all about balancing costs at that point. But wait, what does that have to do with Lugo?
Let's assume that EA does do quite a bit of testing before they release new content. Users have begun referring to the community as a bunch of beta-testers in a truly pejorative sense, but the truth is that this self-labelling is just an outward exertion of our frustration that the game keeps changing due to our perception that EA is releasing content without testing it extensively beforehand. I would urge us to consider that this point is both true and false. EA does TONS of testing, but their team is limited in number. The player-base, on the other hand, is literally millions of people. To put it into perspective, let's say EA has 100 people whose job is exclusively to test new content before it's release, and let's round out the player base to an even 1 million. That would mean that each of the EA employees testing the game would have to put in 10,000 hours of work to equate the player-base playing the game for 1 hour. Now, those are just arbitrary numbers I selected to make a point, but the reality is probably more extreme. EA most likely has far fewer that 100 people dedicated to testing, and the player-base is well over 1 million. This means that it is highly unlikely that EA will be able to foresee and test each and every possible way players will use the game. Considering that the plan for raids has always been to create a 5-character team, I find it very easy to imagine a circumstance in which the Nute-led jawa duo was never even conceptualized.
So, that's me letting EA off the hook for not catching this, and several other strategies, ahead of time (looking at you, Kylo-soloing P1 and Maul soloing P2-P4 in NAAT before the fix). You may disagree, and you're certainly entitled to do so.
Either way, here we are. From EA's standpoint, a player figured out how to "game the system" in a way that was never intended. From the user standpoint, Lugo played the game like a puzzle that needed to be solved, and he found a rather ingenious solution that nobody else had seen before.
Now let's connect all the dots.
EA creates new content for the game and does loads of internal testing. The new content works, with a few tweaks along the way. EA makes money and provides entertainment for its users. But EA doesn't have the man-hours to match the millions of people who play the game every day. MONTHS later, one of the millions of players comes up with a fun trick to tackle the new content. After that trick is discovered, it disseminates throughout the user base, allowing more people to make use of the trick, and (here's the really important part) continue to play the content and spend money in the game anyway.
So what should EA do with Lugo and his Nute/Jawa strategy?
Nothing. Just let it go. Focus on the upcoming content, and keep looking forward. Continue to provide new things for us to play and reasons for us to spend.
If EA decides to, they can apply what they've learned from this experience in several ways:
1) Invite Lugo and many of the other well-documented theory-crafters to become official beta-testers of new content before its release.
2) Allow any user to apply to become an official beta-tester
3) Require that all raid teams be made up of 5 characters, and auto-enroll all guild members at 0 damage in new raids.
There are many many many other things to learn from Lugo's discovery. It will be very interesting to see how EA decides to handle it.
If all raids require a 5 team roster, that would eliminate the zero damage period that many guilds use to ensure rewards for those who miss scheduled raid times. Many guilds are composed of members from all over the world.
i hope they neuter p1 Kylo strategy along with this. I see little difference.
And clones since they can clear a phase too.
I am not saying is fair but certainly it's not the same. Tank raid was designed for gear 10 toons and mods 5. A "blue" gear toon be able to clear p2 is weird.
You say weird I say awesome. It's awesome someone is continuing to playtest given this raid is old and there hasn't been any real new content since ships in November (7 months ago). New toons and marquee events are not challenging at top tier and the game will quickly go in a downward spiral. I think it's absolutely fantastic that someone figured a way to beat the raid with low tier toons. Who cares if heroic becomes more accessible for weaker guilds.
Ok. For the people that keep posting "I don't understand why people are crying about it" "let it stay" "they're fixing this before everything else" I'm going to try to help you understand a little bit. People have busted their butt and wallet for months to get teams up and running for the haat. Clones, resistance,zader teams, droids take ALOT to build to gear 11. This raid is supposed to be the toughest thing to accomplish in the game. It took my guild along time to be able to complete it...but we did. They didn't make the raid for 3 undergeared toons to solo a phase with very little effort to get them to gear 8. This lame threesome wouldn't even work until R2 came out and they buffed nutes leader ability. (Do you kind of see why people would be mad by this?) Yes the devs screwed up...by buffing nute. It's on them for what is happening right now. (If nutes leader ability is working as intended right now) If they nerf which I think they should, they should acknowledge their mistake and give an apology for creating something they didn't intend to do. Believe me they didn't intend for 3 chit toons to be able to shutdown the tank in topple. They also responded to this quickly because maybe just maybe they don't want the backlash of people complaining how they spent resources getting this little team going? Which if you had the 3 starred up it would take you a DAY to get them running. And I'll save you some typing....I think Zylo should be fixed also.
The tank raid was poorly designed, pretty much from the onset. Normal mode came out as if no one had even tested it, and it took those guilds that couldn't do heroic weeks to finish it. Then the devs nerfed it, and suddenly having a great jawa and jedi lineup didn't matter anymore, and we could barely keep it open for 12 hours. We've tried to set up rules but because there are no tools to log attacks by guild members they're nearly impossible to enforce. And the gulf between normal and heroic is still massive. P1 should have been the last phase, as it's the worst phase for damage and no one wants to waste heroes on it, so everyone just waits til nearly refresh time in Normal. And it's becoming clear heroic was meant for those who play this game as a second job. Heroic broke apart more casual guilds and punished those guilds that wanted to stick together and play the game as a GAME. AAT is simply the worst part of the game, IMO.
So I don't think the devs should do anything about Nute. The only people a nerf would hurt are more casual guilds. Hardcore guilds can just kick players that use this tactic if they choose to see it as cheap, and almost everyone in those guilds has Kenobi already. Nerfing him will also drastically reduce the exchange of tactics, in fear that a completely legitimate squad will bring on a nerf in the name of whatever the devs consider the spirit of the raid. Leave it be and let people enjoy the game.
Ok. For the people that keep posting "I don't understand why people are crying about it" "let it stay" "they're fixing this before everything else" I'm going to try to help you understand a little bit. People have busted their butt and wallet for months to get teams up and running for the haat. Clones, resistance,zader teams, droids take ALOT to build to gear 11. This raid is supposed to be the toughest thing to accomplish in the game. It took my guild along time to be able to complete it...but we did. They didn't make the raid for 3 undergeared toons to solo a phase with very little effort to get them to gear 8. This lame threesome wouldn't even work until R2 came out and they buffed nutes leader ability. (Do you kind of see why people would be mad by this?) Yes the devs screwed up...by buffing nute. It's on them for what is happening right now. (If nutes leader ability is working as intended right now) If they nerf which I think they should, they should acknowledge their mistake and give an apology for creating something they didn't intend to do. Believe me they didn't intend for 3 chit toons to be able to shutdown the tank in topple. They also responded to this quickly because maybe just maybe they don't want the backlash of people complaining how they spent resources getting this little team going? Which if you had the 3 starred up it would take you a DAY to get them running. And I'll save you some typing....I think Zylo should be fixed also.
His lead was actually nerfed, possibly to avoid a different exploit involving a stealthed lando or something along those lines.
Ok. For the people that keep posting "I don't understand why people are crying about it" "let it stay" "they're fixing this before everything else" I'm going to try to help you understand a little bit. People have busted their butt and wallet for months to get teams up and running for the haat. Clones, resistance,zader teams, droids take ALOT to build to gear 11. This raid is supposed to be the toughest thing to accomplish in the game. It took my guild along time to be able to complete it...but we did. They didn't make the raid for 3 undergeared toons to solo a phase with very little effort to get them to gear 8. This lame threesome wouldn't even work until R2 came out and they buffed nutes leader ability. (Do you kind of see why people would be mad by this?) Yes the devs screwed up...by buffing nute. It's on them for what is happening right now. (If nutes leader ability is working as intended right now) If they nerf which I think they should, they should acknowledge their mistake and give an apology for creating something they didn't intend to do. Believe me they didn't intend for 3 chit toons to be able to shutdown the tank in topple. They also responded to this quickly because maybe just maybe they don't want the backlash of people complaining how they spent resources getting this little team going? Which if you had the 3 starred up it would take you a DAY to get them running. And I'll save you some typing....I think Zylo should be fixed also.
His lead was actually nerfed, possibly to avoid a different exploit involving a stealthed lando or something along those lines.
Ok. But they raised his TM gain for stealthed Crits from 30% to 50% with the nerf.
They will have a "lugo" pack in a week for $49.99 and most everyone that has posted here will buy it and tell everyone they didn't. Life is funny sometimes.
I dont understand the big deal....I think the nute team is awesome someone was thinking out side the box....what is the difference in this team and zylo killing phase 1 if you kill this team you need to nerf zylo also im just saying that is only fair.....I wouldnt kill this team just cause someone found out the worthless nute is actually not a bad leader.....if anything just make it a zeta to be able to do this....you need to stop doing so much stuff until you release zeta for all the toons that dont have them.....i mean does this mean that teebo's team is gonna get nerfed cause they do so good in rancor its the same philosophy
I dont understand the big deal....I think the nute team is awesome someone was thinking out side the box....what is the difference in this team and zylo killing phase 1 if you kill this team you need to nerf zylo also im just saying that is only fair.....I wouldnt kill this team just cause someone found out the worthless nute is actually not a bad leader.....if anything just make it a zeta to be able to do this....you need to stop doing so much stuff until you release zeta for all the toons that dont have them.....i mean does this mean that teebo's team is gonna get nerfed cause they do so good in rancor its the same philosophy
I don't get how people can compare zylo solo to this nute/jawa solo. For zylo you need zeta and you can get max 400k damage and average 200k in single run. Which means you have to retreat all the time. When you retreat and come back then you lose some damage that others did with zylo or whatever team they used. So yes you can solo p1 with zylo, if all other guild members are not taking a part in phase 1.
On the other hand you have this nute/jawas compilation that can solo phase without retreating and using toons that are not fully geared. This team is making more damage, than my whole roster that Ive been working on for few months including clones, which are much harder to gear and star and they need zeta as well. You can call me selfish, but for me it's breaking the game, that such undergeared team can get 2x score of clone or resistance teams. Let it be able to do 2mil damage, since it really is nice idea to use those toons, but soloing whole phase is just too much.
And one more thing with nute/jawa you can push auto play button when topple. I seriously can't believe anyone can compare it to zylo solo...
Ok. For the people that keep posting "I don't understand why people are crying about it" "let it stay" "they're fixing this before everything else" I'm going to try to help you understand a little bit. People have busted their butt and wallet for months to get teams up and running for the haat. Clones, resistance,zader teams, droids take ALOT to build to gear 11. This raid is supposed to be the toughest thing to accomplish in the game. It took my guild along time to be able to complete it...but we did. They didn't make the raid for 3 undergeared toons to solo a phase with very little effort to get them to gear 8. This lame threesome wouldn't even work until R2 came out and they buffed nutes leader ability. (Do you kind of see why people would be mad by this?) Yes the devs screwed up...by buffing nute. It's on them for what is happening right now. (If nutes leader ability is working as intended right now) If they nerf which I think they should, they should acknowledge their mistake and give an apology for creating something they didn't intend to do. Believe me they didn't intend for 3 chit toons to be able to shutdown the tank in topple. They also responded to this quickly because maybe just maybe they don't want the backlash of people complaining how they spent resources getting this little team going? Which if you had the 3 starred up it would take you a DAY to get them running. And I'll save you some typing....I think Zylo should be fixed also.
I think you're missing the biggest issue with this. And that is the pathetic hypocrisy of the dev post addressing it.
I dont understand the big deal....I think the nute team is awesome someone was thinking out side the box....what is the difference in this team and zylo killing phase 1 if you kill this team you need to nerf zylo also im just saying that is only fair.....I wouldnt kill this team just cause someone found out the worthless nute is actually not a bad leader.....if anything just make it a zeta to be able to do this....you need to stop doing so much stuff until you release zeta for all the toons that dont have them.....i mean does this mean that teebo's team is gonna get nerfed cause they do so good in rancor its the same philosophy
I don't get how people can compare zylo solo to this nute/jawa solo. For zylo you need zeta and you can get max 400k damage and average 200k in single run. Which means you have to retreat all the time. When you retreat and come back then you lose some damage that others did with zylo or whatever team they used. So yes you can solo p1 with zylo, if all other guild members are not taking a part in phase 1.
On the other hand you have this nute/jawas compilation that can solo phase without retreating and using toons that are not fully geared. This team is making more damage, than my whole roster that Ive been working on for few months including clones, which are much harder to gear and star and they need zeta as well. You can call me selfish, but for me it's breaking the game, that such undergeared team can get 2x score of clone or resistance teams. Let it be able to do 2mil damage, since it really is nice idea to use those toons, but soloing whole phase is just too much.
And one more thing with nute/jawa you can push auto play button when topple. I seriously can't believe anyone can compare it to zylo solo...
Ok. For the people that keep posting "I don't understand why people are crying about it" "let it stay" "they're fixing this before everything else" I'm going to try to help you understand a little bit. People have busted their butt and wallet for months to get teams up and running for the haat. Clones, resistance,zader teams, droids take ALOT to build to gear 11. This raid is supposed to be the toughest thing to accomplish in the game. It took my guild along time to be able to complete it...but we did. They didn't make the raid for 3 undergeared toons to solo a phase with very little effort to get them to gear 8. This lame threesome wouldn't even work until R2 came out and they buffed nutes leader ability. (Do you kind of see why people would be mad by this?) Yes the devs screwed up...by buffing nute. It's on them for what is happening right now. (If nutes leader ability is working as intended right now) If they nerf which I think they should, they should acknowledge their mistake and give an apology for creating something they didn't intend to do. Believe me they didn't intend for 3 chit toons to be able to shutdown the tank in topple. They also responded to this quickly because maybe just maybe they don't want the backlash of people complaining how they spent resources getting this little team going? Which if you had the 3 starred up it would take you a DAY to get them running. And I'll save you some typing....I think Zylo should be fixed also.
I think you're missing the biggest issue with this. And that is the pathetic hypocrisy of the dev post addressing it.
I get that. Would you rather they say nothing and stealth nerf? Atleast they are warning people so they can stop farming the setup. And from this thread the biggest issue isn't the wording of a dev comment. It's that people are getting their cheap setup taken away from them.
Okay, everyone knows about the Lugo Manuever. Everyone agrees it is working as intended. Can we please just let the guilds manage this?
Each guild has their own Zylo rules, Start and Stop rules, zero damage registration etc. This is no different. The whole Rancor can be solo'd does that mean a fix is coming for that as well? We've had to level and gear up these little dudes for mods. They are otherwise useless. Except for the Lugo Manuever. This is merely one part of one phase. Please, throw us a bone and leave the mechanics alone.
even tho I didn't ever use nute untill now I have an issue with fixing things that aren't broken. I do hope I get to use him once before nerfs but still since 1 guy can solo P1, it comes up to guilds to impose restrictions
For example our guild bans soloing zylo due to being unfair to other guild mates
So in a way it is teamwork
Rancor has a hour for hitting with all ppl going in at once
I have a friend that has 5 people with zylo that start hitting p1 at once then let p2 up for a long time so low lvl players can get to hit > even tho thye don't carry their weight so to speek
Do theese things don't count? is this not working together?
I have 4 chat programs line slack etc... installed for coordonation and for the game alone, my browser has 15 links for the game like forum,swgoh, smithie, warrior and the youtubers
we do work together on chalanges and again I don't really know how bad nute is but my understanding is that he only works on P2 and maybe p4
Point is do you think top guilds will be ok with 1 guy soloing P1 with zylo then p2 with nute? No no we won't and since no one uses zylo in my guild I can tell you that that takes way more "intended behavior" then not having the option there
Ultimately it doesen't matter most abuses will not be large scale due to kicks from guilds and such so remove the retreat exploit frm zylo, maybe add a fix to clones, change jawa from 50% turn meeter to 45 or 47.5 but the true fix will be guilds imposing fair rules not these fixes....
So yeah nothing is really broke - except we can't solo rancor anymore with zeder (zeta return would be nice)
there is no cooperation in guild when it comes to individual scores, otherwise the rewards wouldn't be random, tied by ID, and competing in ranking by score. the user is motivated completely since April 2016 to maximize his/her score in the raid...
100% agree. The raid reward system needs equalized to promote true team building instead of worrying about nerfing a team that can allow anyone to compete for #1 prize box.
I do think that the nute "exploit" needs fixed but the raid rewards and ticket tracking needs fixed on a higher priority.
Replies
I'm sorry @CG_Kozispoon , @Vampire_X , I like the game, I like the devs, I'm on here most weekdays... but I do call some bull on this. A number of players have said it, and I know I've posted it more then once:
The only real teamwork in this game is in the top of the arena. People collaborate to share payouts. It's a team where 24 players can, in theory if not also in practice with some luck, can get a #1 payout time. #1 every day, all week, forever. That requires some management and work. Potentially 168 #1 payouts. But half it - 12 players #1 it in a day - 84 #1 payouts a week.
Meanwhile - guilds get 2-3 Pit & 2 AAT raids a week. It's a real leaderboard, with only one #1 payout per raid - everyone else falling down from there. So Five #1 payouts in a supposed guild?
Five #1's in a week for 50 guildies to fight over. 84 #1's (potentially) for 12 arena 'shardmates' to share 100% evenly.
Again, I'm sorry, but I fail to see where you are encouraging guildies to fight together - verse arena where people really are supposed to fight against each other? And so on topic, RE Nute, I find the 'teamwork reason' ridiculous. On top of just saying you aren't going to do Nerfs... here it comes.
(for the people who want to say they get better raid rewards at lower level, it's all RNG, and it's because you are more likely to place < 3 and > 3 place - which is how a bias forms. Plus, it's RNG, unlike Arena which is guaranteed payout with crystals you can use to buy gear, which is the real limitation in this game.)
TL:DR - More Teamwork in Arena then in Raids, which are mini leaderboards. Nute is just an extension of the competitive neture of the raid and a how to better come out on top.
Amen
I agree with this on so many lvls it's not even funny. Raids should not even have damage counters every player gets the same reward if they participated when the raid is defeated.
I do more collaboration on my external shard chat than my guild chat and I'm the freaking leader of my guild. Agree. If you want to invest in mostly useless toons for the sake of doing better in guild raid rewards, let them do that.
So just give away the best toon in the game to everyone? What about the people who invested heavily in Raid teams to get him before everyone else? This is ridiculous. Yes, his gear sucks. I have him at 7 stars and saved gear and poured cash into gearing him fast so I could gain an advantage in arena. Is this not the way it should be?
I am not saying is fair but certainly it's not the same. Tank raid was designed for gear 10 toons and mods 5. A "blue" gear toon be able to clear p2 is weird.
Assuming that nute was the missing link to guilds doing haat it will still take months to unlock Kenobi much less 7 star him. My point was only this isn't gonna "break the game "
Maybe not every team comp. But there are only 5 jawas. And not that many characters like nute that provide tm gain. They should ALWAYS be testing any new/reworked abilities that involve tm manipulation, especially with jawas given their special aat ability.
If all raids require a 5 team roster, that would eliminate the zero damage period that many guilds use to ensure rewards for those who miss scheduled raid times. Many guilds are composed of members from all over the world.
You say weird I say awesome. It's awesome someone is continuing to playtest given this raid is old and there hasn't been any real new content since ships in November (7 months ago). New toons and marquee events are not challenging at top tier and the game will quickly go in a downward spiral. I think it's absolutely fantastic that someone figured a way to beat the raid with low tier toons. Who cares if heroic becomes more accessible for weaker guilds.
So I don't think the devs should do anything about Nute. The only people a nerf would hurt are more casual guilds. Hardcore guilds can just kick players that use this tactic if they choose to see it as cheap, and almost everyone in those guilds has Kenobi already. Nerfing him will also drastically reduce the exchange of tactics, in fear that a completely legitimate squad will bring on a nerf in the name of whatever the devs consider the spirit of the raid. Leave it be and let people enjoy the game.
His lead was actually nerfed, possibly to avoid a different exploit involving a stealthed lando or something along those lines.
Ok. But they raised his TM gain for stealthed Crits from 30% to 50% with the nerf.
I don't get how people can compare zylo solo to this nute/jawa solo. For zylo you need zeta and you can get max 400k damage and average 200k in single run. Which means you have to retreat all the time. When you retreat and come back then you lose some damage that others did with zylo or whatever team they used. So yes you can solo p1 with zylo, if all other guild members are not taking a part in phase 1.
On the other hand you have this nute/jawas compilation that can solo phase without retreating and using toons that are not fully geared. This team is making more damage, than my whole roster that Ive been working on for few months including clones, which are much harder to gear and star and they need zeta as well. You can call me selfish, but for me it's breaking the game, that such undergeared team can get 2x score of clone or resistance teams. Let it be able to do 2mil damage, since it really is nice idea to use those toons, but soloing whole phase is just too much.
And one more thing with nute/jawa you can push auto play button when topple. I seriously can't believe anyone can compare it to zylo solo...
I think you're missing the biggest issue with this. And that is the pathetic hypocrisy of the dev post addressing it.
Great Post. My feelings as well
or the clones, GK Zader build leader teams?
what team work most guilds have the top 10 people doing 80-90% of total dmg
and soloing P1 with zylo? that came back months ago...with zeta on kylo
I get that. Would you rather they say nothing and stealth nerf? Atleast they are warning people so they can stop farming the setup. And from this thread the biggest issue isn't the wording of a dev comment. It's that people are getting their cheap setup taken away from them.
Each guild has their own Zylo rules, Start and Stop rules, zero damage registration etc. This is no different. The whole Rancor can be solo'd does that mean a fix is coming for that as well? We've had to level and gear up these little dudes for mods. They are otherwise useless. Except for the Lugo Manuever. This is merely one part of one phase. Please, throw us a bone and leave the mechanics alone.
What do we want?
JEDI LUKE
When Do we want it?
No nerf for NUTE!
even tho I didn't ever use nute untill now I have an issue with fixing things that aren't broken. I do hope I get to use him once before nerfs but still since 1 guy can solo P1, it comes up to guilds to impose restrictions
For example our guild bans soloing zylo due to being unfair to other guild mates
So in a way it is teamwork
Rancor has a hour for hitting with all ppl going in at once
I have a friend that has 5 people with zylo that start hitting p1 at once then let p2 up for a long time so low lvl players can get to hit > even tho thye don't carry their weight so to speek
Do theese things don't count? is this not working together?
I have 4 chat programs line slack etc... installed for coordonation and for the game alone, my browser has 15 links for the game like forum,swgoh, smithie, warrior and the youtubers
we do work together on chalanges and again I don't really know how bad nute is but my understanding is that he only works on P2 and maybe p4
Point is do you think top guilds will be ok with 1 guy soloing P1 with zylo then p2 with nute? No no we won't and since no one uses zylo in my guild I can tell you that that takes way more "intended behavior" then not having the option there
Ultimately it doesen't matter most abuses will not be large scale due to kicks from guilds and such so remove the retreat exploit frm zylo, maybe add a fix to clones, change jawa from 50% turn meeter to 45 or 47.5 but the true fix will be guilds imposing fair rules not these fixes....
So yeah nothing is really broke - except we can't solo rancor anymore with zeder (zeta return would be nice)
100% agree. The raid reward system needs equalized to promote true team building instead of worrying about nerfing a team that can allow anyone to compete for #1 prize box.
I do think that the nute "exploit" needs fixed but the raid rewards and ticket tracking needs fixed on a higher priority.