Usually is debatable, but this time you are def off. In left field
I mean do you think 120 million GP guilds shouldn't be able to complete it?
Lol, ok, I'll humour you briefly,
120 mil guild, not really no. Let's overlook how absolutely useless using GP as a measuring stick is , but as an average guild with a GP of 120 mil, nope, you shouldn't be able to just jump on heroic STR .
Think about it, new raid, new design, made hard as hell for what is currently used. A average guild will have a diversely built roster collection. I mean come one, the average GP per member is less then 2.5 mil, and most will have nearly 1 mil in ships, plus, most will favor LS chars usually, so . .see the point there?
K, next,
If you had a guild of fifty specific players, with the specific squads for the new raid. And they had a GP of 100-120 mil, then yes they would be able to beat the raid, . .. What does that tell you . . Point of fact, the Devs have clearly,stated in interviews previously that they intend to shake up guilds and cause mass restructuring because the game isn't supposed to be three guys soloing raids while 47 log a zero. Hence why the STR is done in such a way that it requires every member to pull their weight or get replaced.
So,. .
If you have a solid crew, and you work together, that dreaded teamwork thing again I know, and you build the new required squads, just like we all did when Haat launched, and yes they ARE comparable , claiming they aren't is the true foolishness, then you will achieve all the way up to heroic STR .
Now, just because folks that have invested whichever medium , time or money or both, are able to handle heroic right away, doesn't mean that you need to copy them, traya looks good for sure, but is traya going to be the only good char? Nope.
Isn't it better to develop and build towards a goal ? Is there not a sense of accomplishment for getting better and hitting a goal? Why should you be able to to just automatically clear heroic of the latest and toughest raid just because you have a certain GP number? Do you see how that is absolutely out to lunch to assume your 2 mil roster should be good enough to take on the newest raid without getting better first?
We just completed our first heroic sith raid yesterday at 132mil gp with one 2.9mil guy who hasn’t logged in for over a wk (we thought we had a replacement for him before the raid but it just didn’t happen for some reason), a 2.95mil guy doing 300k total dmg and a 2.65mil guy doing 400k total dmg. That’s almost 9mil total gp of deadweight. So yes it definitely can be completed by guilds in the low 120mil gp range and no, we did not nitpick people with specific rosters. We did it as a guild together. If over half of your guild still don’t have jtr, those who do will be motivated to move on cuz they don’t know when it will come back and how many of your guild will get her when she comes back. If you have 35 JTRs in the guild, you can easily beat it. And yes, a guild in the 120-130mil range can have 35+ JTRs without being a majority p2p guild.
You know part of my argument is that those couple of guys you mentioned, the ones with the 300k damage and the ones with the 400k damage, they could be low GP accounts getting carried into having Traya before anyone in their shards and now they would be enjoying an effortless arena experience and a huge crystal boost over those who work extra hard to get the right swuad and they are 6 months behind. Then because they end up with 500 free crystals a day they can accelerate their advantage, boost their pilots so they can dominate in fleet arena too, and before you know it they are packing + half a mil GP over their shard mates and they dominate indefinitely.
And you know that your sounding more and more like you are whining and crying because your not able to c.c.c.i dunno what exactly, but each time you try prove a point you get further and further into that whiny entitled mentality category.
I'm not whining, I bet 100$ I could find a heroic Sith raid guild in the next couple of days for myself.
I just don't want to abandon my guild for it. I'm bringing up the issue of guilds breaking every time this thing happens. I like my guild and I think there's a lot of great people, I just can't wait for 3 months before I start farming Traya because that's 3 months added later on when everyone has her.
Then that's your choice... it's not about the toon or the raid or anything else. The game is about choices and you have made yours. They game shouldn't be changed to make this choice easier for you (or anyone). So many things in this game are about managment and choices, sometimes you have to stick to your guns and just go with what you want to do.
I'm down to 32 members right now. My guild is done for, from 119 million GP to 79. This is sad and it shouldn't be happening.
I'm not whining, I bet 100$ I could find a heroic Sith raid guild in the next couple of days for myself.
I just don't want to abandon my guild for it. I'm bringing up the issue of guilds breaking every time this thing happens. I like my guild and I think there's a lot of great people, I just can't wait for 3 months before I start farming Traya because that's 3 months added later on when everyone has her.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
I'm not whining, I bet 100$ I could find a heroic Sith raid guild in the next couple of days for myself.
I just don't want to abandon my guild for it. I'm bringing up the issue of guilds breaking every time this thing happens. I like my guild and I think there's a lot of great people, I just can't wait for 3 months before I start farming Traya because that's 3 months added later on when everyone has her.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
Dude leef, not to be offensive but you aren't the smartest guy out there are you? You think this post is about me the whole time? Did all my points pass over your head?
I'm not whining, I bet 100$ I could find a heroic Sith raid guild in the next couple of days for myself.
I just don't want to abandon my guild for it. I'm bringing up the issue of guilds breaking every time this thing happens. I like my guild and I think there's a lot of great people, I just can't wait for 3 months before I start farming Traya because that's 3 months added later on when everyone has her.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
The things you say show a lot about the time period that you joined the game. You could not possibly know the GP mark of guilds who could complete HAAT because, back then, there wasn’t such a number.
You couldn’t possibly compare it to today’s guilds anyways, the power creep is real and HAAT is only easy because there are toons that exist that can solo the whole thing (not even close to what was possible before). You won’t see anyone farming clones for HAAT anymore, a team which WAS a must have.
This isn’t the first raid that people called for weakening. Because back then, HAAT was impossible for many guilds, and guess what? There were plenty of reorgs back then. I was one of them. I outgrew my guild. And that’s ok, move on or get left behind.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
Dude leef, not to be offensive but you aren't the smartest guy out there are you? You think this post is about me the whole time? Did all my points pass over your head?
Well, alteast you're right about something, i'm definately not the smartest guy out there, haha. I do think i'm right about you though. Mainly because you don't have to be a genius to figure out your true motives
and i quote:
I'm not whining, I bet 100$ I could find a heroic Sith raid guild in the next couple of days for myself.
I just don't want to abandon my guild for it. I'm bringing up the issue of guilds breaking every time this thing happens. I like my guild and I think there's a lot of great people, I just can't wait for 3 months before I start farming Traya because that's 3 months added later on when everyone has her.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
Dude leef, not to be offensive but you aren't the smartest guy out there are you? You think this post is about me the whole time? Did all my points pass over your head?
Given that everyone who has posted in this thread disagrees with you, maybe it’s time to consider that your viewpoint is not “the majority” and that you don’t speak for the whole community?
Or maybe none of us are intelligent enough to understand what your superior intellect immediately grasped.
I don't think the devs have thought this through. Arena contains players from a wide range of guilds with a wide range of power. Some will be carried by their guilds and hey Traya way sooner than other and that's what scares me the most
Others have earned rights to be in the guild they are in Much sooner than their shard mates.
Usually is debatable, but this time you are def off. In left field
I mean do you think 120 million GP guilds shouldn't be able to complete it?
Lol, ok, I'll humour you briefly,
120 mil guild, not really no. Let's overlook how absolutely useless using GP as a measuring stick is , but as an average guild with a GP of 120 mil, nope, you shouldn't be able to just jump on heroic STR .
Think about it, new raid, new design, made hard as hell for what is currently used. A average guild will have a diversely built roster collection. I mean come one, the average GP per member is less then 2.5 mil, and most will have nearly 1 mil in ships, plus, most will favor LS chars usually, so . .see the point there?
K, next,
If you had a guild of fifty specific players, with the specific squads for the new raid. And they had a GP of 100-120 mil, then yes they would be able to beat the raid, . .. What does that tell you . . Point of fact, the Devs have clearly,stated in interviews previously that they intend to shake up guilds and cause mass restructuring because the game isn't supposed to be three guys soloing raids while 47 log a zero. Hence why the STR is done in such a way that it requires every member to pull their weight or get replaced.
So,. .
If you have a solid crew, and you work together, that dreaded teamwork thing again I know, and you build the new required squads, just like we all did when Haat launched, and yes they ARE comparable , claiming they aren't is the true foolishness, then you will achieve all the way up to heroic STR .
Now, just because folks that have invested whichever medium , time or money or both, are able to handle heroic right away, doesn't mean that you need to copy them, traya looks good for sure, but is traya going to be the only good char? Nope.
Isn't it better to develop and build towards a goal ? Is there not a sense of accomplishment for getting better and hitting a goal? Why should you be able to to just automatically clear heroic of the latest and toughest raid just because you have a certain GP number? Do you see how that is absolutely out to lunch to assume your 2 mil roster should be good enough to take on the newest raid without getting better first?
I agree up to a point. You're right about everything but I strongly disagree about the Traya part. You say that she won't be the only good character but honestly her kit looks like it counters everything in the meta.
She has anti buff, anti TM gain, anti counter attack, anti heal, anti everything mechanics. Her kit is so strong that she will become the meta and you're a smart guy, you know how the meta works. You know that if the meta shifts around just one team, nothing else around it can survive. That's the entire definition of the meta.
Now having that said, those who own her will almost without a doubt dominate arena effortlessly. The arena right now is built to the point where all teams can lose on defense. The things about Traya is that she won't lose on defense and therefore those who run her will simply dominate.
This is the problem for me, I wouldn't mind not having her if she was a regular character with decent capabilities, but she seems almost impossible to beat and that's why having patience isn't an option. This could guarantee some players a free top arena pass for months while you're missing out on crystals because you don't have her.
Yes I most certainly understand the sense of accomplishment but when it comes to arena payouts nothing matter more than possition and crystals, I'm not willing to compromise on that.
Now you're probably going to try and debate on whether she is as strong as I'm saying. Yes I know the same was said about CLS until GK-Zarriss started beating him consistently. The same was said about Talzin until imp troopers and CLS started beating her. And the same was said about JTR until NS and Palpatine beat her and the same was said about Palpatine until Rex comes from the graveyard and beats him.
But I have a feeling that this is different, nothing we currently have in the game can beat Traya's kit and if a character comes later on to beat her, they won't be farmable for months. Those are months during which Traya users dominate for free and with no effort and everyone else is losing crystals.
I hope I'm wrong but I kind of doubt it.
While the concern about Traya is currently justified, your example about Baze as a tank is a helpful qualifier. Baze wasn’t released until after the Tank raid was released. Point being? While Traya looks to be meta, I don’t doubt there will be something released/reworked between now and Traya’s entry into arena that will be a workable counter (if it isn’t out already).
While it sucks that your guild is negatively affected, I think people are overreacting to what they perceive (not know) the situation to be.
So I’ll chime in as there are a few things going on...
Number 1: no not “everyone is in a HST guild, our guild floats from 135-140 and have sub guilds with 30 JTR we got slaughtered on our attempt. Unless your guild has 40-50 JTR and supporting cast of NS and Others your spinning your wheels.
Number 2: longest player and high roller (I’m only the later) deserve this toon first for all the work put in. Sorry if you see it as a right and not a privlage.
Number 3: Hate to break it to you but Treya is a leader and of the Triumvant, if you didn’t spend to get 7* Sion your not going to be in the top anyway so your crying over nothing. GK can go in “any lineup” that’s what makes him amazing nothing else.
Finally: this game is the force there is always balance! There will be a counter to Treya and there will be a level and Mod increase that after the select few have access to Treya will be released and those is strong but reasonable guilds will be able to hard farm until new toons come out that will make it more auto in the future.
First of all. Han solo came out with the Droid meta. Shot first destroyed jawa engineer.
Kenobi was also great at the start in combination with chaze.
Traya will also ramp up the arena.
Every raid destroyed guild's. Don't tell me heroic sith raid is something different....
Han was trash before his rework, Kenobi had counters, Traya is a different story
Do you even play the same game as I do?
I think you are a bit crazy
Han was not viable anywhere in the game before his rework period
First of all. Han solo came out with the Droid meta. Shot first destroyed jawa engineer.
Kenobi was also great at the start in combination with chaze.
Traya will also ramp up the arena.
Every raid destroyed guild's. Don't tell me heroic sith raid is something different....
Han was trash before his rework, Kenobi had counters, Traya is a different story
Do you even play the same game as I do?
I think you are a bit crazy
Han was not viable anywhere in the game before his rework period
Lol, you know your wrong again here, Han was viable upon release, pre taunts getting released put an end to his easy use for awhile for sure, but he was totally useful when he debuted.
I suggest you try stick with real facts, not personal perceptions.
Why stop at lowering it just so 120m+ can do it? My guild at 30m should be able to do it too!
I shouldn't even respond to this troll comment but I'm just drawn to shut down the insanity.
No your 30 million guild shouldn't be able to do heroic, your 30 million guild shouldn't even be able to do HAAT. Please stop and get serious.
I didn't use 120 mil randomly. 120 million / 50 players averages a 2.4 million GP, this is actually pretty high and it's the kind of GP you achieve at around 2 years of playing the game.
So to answer your question if someone's played for 2 years I think they should be able to complete it, given that they are in a guild full of people who have played for that long also.
If all you're gonna do is throw out a ridiculous comment like that just to prove a point, you better do something more constructive and explain your reasoning
U can't base an ability to complete ANY raid on GP alone. 1st off, it's the highest tier of a brand new raid. It's not meant for everyone to b completing it. That is a goal, not a given.
Most players rosters favor LS toons bcuz they were the meta for so long and they outnumber DS toons.
U have what u need to compete and succeed in it or u don't.
A 100 mil GP guild that focused on DS primarily, has good mods, coordinates and communicates could sweep it on Heroic where a 140 mil GP guild w/ players focused primarily on LS , w/ garbage mods and poor coordination and communication could fail.
I understand all of your points but this only means one thing, the game is designed to destroy guilds. Because if you expect to have people sit around and wait 6 months to get their guilds up to speed for it and sacrifice their competitive advantage over it then you obviously don't understand how humans work.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
Not to beat a dead horse, but it really comes down to choice. I recently chose to leave the guild that I really grew in (lvl 65-85), due to pace of progression. But I stayed in their discord and still talk to them because they’re good dudes and they understand I just wanted to see more. So I moved from a 60M GP guild to a 100M GP guild who’s working on heroic prep for STR. They play this game for fun, not to be competitive, and that’s fine. Choose what play style you want and be happy with your choice.
I understand all of your points but this only means one thing, the game is designed to destroy guilds. Because if you expect to have people sit around and wait 6 months to get their guilds up to speed for it and sacrifice their competitive advantage over it then you obviously don't understand how humans work.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
Sounds like you don't understand how guilds are supposed to work.
There is a reason it is a TEAM EFFORT, build a SOLID base for a guild, and they will go far. But your opinion is obviously that your guild in not good enough and it is going to harm your game irreparably , which is comical to all of us that are watching your ravings about the new raid, which is actually doing exactly what it was designed to do since it was released.
I understand all of your points but this only means one thing, the game is designed to destroy guilds. Because if you expect to have people sit around and wait 6 months to get their guilds up to speed for it and sacrifice their competitive advantage over it then you obviously don't understand how humans work.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
Not true at all, you can choose to stay with them and help your guild grow and become better. Or you can choose to move on and play with people you feel are more at the level you want to be at.
No one is forced to do anything in this game, not leave a guild, not spend money, and not even spend time or plan dinner around a PO. These are all choices that you are free to make. Relax and have fun, or dont and be a hardcore player and have more fun. The choice is yours.
You feel forced because you want something you think will be great. You dont need to try to pawn that off on the "design" of the game.
I understand all of your points but this only means one thing, the game is designed to destroy guilds. Because if you expect to have people sit around and wait 6 months to get their guilds up to speed for it and sacrifice their competitive advantage over it then you obviously don't understand how humans work.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
That's the responsibility of being a guild leader though, set expectations. Either the hard cores are in the wrong guild, or the casuals are. If you didn't have enough to clear heroic then there were two choices, build better rosters and take longer to be able to clear it, or kick people who couldn't contribute enough and recruit stronger players for a quicker clear. If people aren't sticking around to build then their expectations weren't met.
General Kenobi was always awesome but the need for Kenobi was mitigated by the fact that Baze was a great Tank at the time as well and also with Darth Maul being meta, Kenobi would have been useless at the time. It wasn't until the Zolo rework and CLS that people realized how powerful the Titans were. And also most people didn't have a 7 star R2 and Trawn anyways. As Rex began to counter Maul people saw the opportunity to use Kenobi with Zarriss against the Rex teams and then guilds did break over haat.
He had counters dude. Maul was meta with anti Jedi synergy. Dooku could tag along with shock and also anti Jedi synergy, Nihilus would swallow tanks effortlessly and there was no counter attack meta to beat him.
You could easily beat GK using a Maul team even when the GK-Zarriss came to existence. It's just not the same, not having Traya won't be as forgiving as not having GK
The tank raid launched in October 2016. Baze wasn't released until November or December of 2016, and was 100% paywall (i.e., no marquee event or anything as those didn't exist) until March or April of 2017, when he went to a single hard node.
More people didn't have a 7* R2 or Thrawn when tank came out because they didn't exist until May and June of 2017, respectively.
Maul's kit didn't beat Kenobi/Zarriss. When zetas came out in November 2016, the time-out team was born. The time-out team was defeated when two things happened: the devs added x2 and x4 speed (February 2017) and the devs introduced, through a marquee event, Nihilus (also February 2017). So Kenobi existed for months before Nihilus existed.
I understand all of your points but this only means one thing, the game is designed to destroy guilds. Because if you expect to have people sit around and wait 6 months to get their guilds up to speed for it and sacrifice their competitive advantage over it then you obviously don't understand how humans work.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
Sounds like you don't understand how guilds are supposed to work.
There is a reason it is a TEAM EFFORT, build a SOLID base for a guild, and they will go far. But your opinion is obviously that your guild in not good enough and it is going to harm your game irreparably , which is comical to all of us that are watching your ravings about the new raid, which is actually doing exactly what it was designed to do since it was released.
A player's GP can only grow do much day by day and so does their guild's
Replies
I'm down to 32 members right now. My guild is done for, from 119 million GP to 79. This is sad and it shouldn't be happening.
so you just threw a hissy fit because you don't want to leave the guild you're in, but still want traya asap. So we can conclude your entire OP was just ****?
Dude leef, not to be offensive but you aren't the smartest guy out there are you? You think this post is about me the whole time? Did all my points pass over your head?
I'd say you nailed it perfectly @leef
You couldn’t possibly compare it to today’s guilds anyways, the power creep is real and HAAT is only easy because there are toons that exist that can solo the whole thing (not even close to what was possible before). You won’t see anyone farming clones for HAAT anymore, a team which WAS a must have.
This isn’t the first raid that people called for weakening. Because back then, HAAT was impossible for many guilds, and guess what? There were plenty of reorgs back then. I was one of them. I outgrew my guild. And that’s ok, move on or get left behind.
Well, alteast you're right about something, i'm definately not the smartest guy out there, haha. I do think i'm right about you though. Mainly because you don't have to be a genius to figure out your true motives
and i quote:
Given that everyone who has posted in this thread disagrees with you, maybe it’s time to consider that your viewpoint is not “the majority” and that you don’t speak for the whole community?
Or maybe none of us are intelligent enough to understand what your superior intellect immediately grasped.
Others have earned rights to be in the guild they are in Much sooner than their shard mates.
While the concern about Traya is currently justified, your example about Baze as a tank is a helpful qualifier. Baze wasn’t released until after the Tank raid was released. Point being? While Traya looks to be meta, I don’t doubt there will be something released/reworked between now and Traya’s entry into arena that will be a workable counter (if it isn’t out already).
While it sucks that your guild is negatively affected, I think people are overreacting to what they perceive (not know) the situation to be.
Number 1: no not “everyone is in a HST guild, our guild floats from 135-140 and have sub guilds with 30 JTR we got slaughtered on our attempt. Unless your guild has 40-50 JTR and supporting cast of NS and Others your spinning your wheels.
Number 2: longest player and high roller (I’m only the later) deserve this toon first for all the work put in. Sorry if you see it as a right and not a privlage.
Number 3: Hate to break it to you but Treya is a leader and of the Triumvant, if you didn’t spend to get 7* Sion your not going to be in the top anyway so your crying over nothing. GK can go in “any lineup” that’s what makes him amazing nothing else.
Finally: this game is the force there is always balance! There will be a counter to Treya and there will be a level and Mod increase that after the select few have access to Treya will be released and those is strong but reasonable guilds will be able to hard farm until new toons come out that will make it more auto in the future.
Han was not viable anywhere in the game before his rework period
Lol, you know your wrong again here, Han was viable upon release, pre taunts getting released put an end to his easy use for awhile for sure, but he was totally useful when he debuted.
I suggest you try stick with real facts, not personal perceptions.
Any reason to read through this one? I'm guessing not.
U can't base an ability to complete ANY raid on GP alone. 1st off, it's the highest tier of a brand new raid. It's not meant for everyone to b completing it. That is a goal, not a given.
Most players rosters favor LS toons bcuz they were the meta for so long and they outnumber DS toons.
U have what u need to compete and succeed in it or u don't.
A 100 mil GP guild that focused on DS primarily, has good mods, coordinates and communicates could sweep it on Heroic where a 140 mil GP guild w/ players focused primarily on LS , w/ garbage mods and poor coordination and communication could fail.
And yes I know how GP works, I've seen people with 2.5 million having a horribly managed account and my 2.1 looked way better. If I had the opportunity to swap accounts with him I'd never do it cause my account looked so much stronger.
But at the same time, we are forced to abandon these people
Sounds like you don't understand how guilds are supposed to work.
There is a reason it is a TEAM EFFORT, build a SOLID base for a guild, and they will go far. But your opinion is obviously that your guild in not good enough and it is going to harm your game irreparably , which is comical to all of us that are watching your ravings about the new raid, which is actually doing exactly what it was designed to do since it was released.
Not true at all, you can choose to stay with them and help your guild grow and become better. Or you can choose to move on and play with people you feel are more at the level you want to be at.
No one is forced to do anything in this game, not leave a guild, not spend money, and not even spend time or plan dinner around a PO. These are all choices that you are free to make. Relax and have fun, or dont and be a hardcore player and have more fun. The choice is yours.
You feel forced because you want something you think will be great. You dont need to try to pawn that off on the "design" of the game.
That's the responsibility of being a guild leader though, set expectations. Either the hard cores are in the wrong guild, or the casuals are. If you didn't have enough to clear heroic then there were two choices, build better rosters and take longer to be able to clear it, or kick people who couldn't contribute enough and recruit stronger players for a quicker clear. If people aren't sticking around to build then their expectations weren't met.
The tank raid launched in October 2016. Baze wasn't released until November or December of 2016, and was 100% paywall (i.e., no marquee event or anything as those didn't exist) until March or April of 2017, when he went to a single hard node.
More people didn't have a 7* R2 or Thrawn when tank came out because they didn't exist until May and June of 2017, respectively.
Maul's kit didn't beat Kenobi/Zarriss. When zetas came out in November 2016, the time-out team was born. The time-out team was defeated when two things happened: the devs added x2 and x4 speed (February 2017) and the devs introduced, through a marquee event, Nihilus (also February 2017). So Kenobi existed for months before Nihilus existed.
A player's GP can only grow do much day by day and so does their guild's
PETA disapproves.