Sith raid - fatigue

Replies

  • This raid is ****, it's killing the game, it's causing ppl to quit altogether. Look up the word "futile" in the dictionary... You stress and grind to gear toons, you stress and grind in battling this raid, and no matter the tier the rewards are ****. Then, long-time players are tired of posting tiny damage for **** rewards and leave... This has shredded my prior guild, now is shredding my current guild. It's not as if we are weak, we are moderately strong. But, keep cashing those checks EA/Disney, you will need that once the lawyers come in to drag this PoS into court as several other "loot crate" issues are hitting the Justice department.
  • Acrofales
    1361 posts Member
    Having progressed to heroic since my previous post here, I figured I'd update. Heroic STR is a great raid. It is the right length, sufficiently challenging, requires a broad roster and gives great rewards. All other tiers remain utter trash. It's a hugely long slog for a pathetic reward.
  • Caljr
    162 posts Member
    Acrofales wrote: »
    Having progressed to heroic since my previous post here, I figured I'd update. Heroic STR is a great raid. It is the right length, sufficiently challenging, requires a broad roster and gives great rewards. All other tiers remain utter trash. It's a hugely long slog for a pathetic reward.

    The Heroic had great rewards, now is trash since they patched. Before the patch always had full equipment XII, 2 equipments XII for top 3, and that cannot be brought with crystals most of time, after the patch dont even had equipments XII in 3 raids in a row, after the second patch that the devs said that had undone the nerf, most of prizes still dont have full equipments XII, even for top 3, but give 2-3 fragments of equipments XII, or give equipments XII like Multitool, that can be brought with crystals.
  • Acrofales wrote: »
    Having progressed to heroic since my previous post here, I figured I'd update. Heroic STR is a great raid. It is the right length, sufficiently challenging, requires a broad roster and gives great rewards. All other tiers remain utter trash. It's a hugely long slog for a pathetic reward.

    I would say that once we were beating the HAAT with a little cooperation and doing it in two days it also became a better event.

    We were doing T6 NAAT in just a few days and getting decent rewards for it. My group can do t6 Sith if we want to take a week of non-stop abuse... it's not worth it. We're doing lower tiers just so we don't have to hear the complaints. I have 20 people out of 50 hitting it... and you know what, I don't blame a one.

    Sure, the day we get up to Heroic, fine, it'll be great. But until then, the lower tiers are a slog fest. I have the teams, so I don't mind the P1 - I get more damage there then 2 & 3 infact. But even with the right teams, it's not fun. It's just a slog. The % better damage I get from manual over auto isn't worth it for Less-Than-Heroic.

    Played all through every event since this game began. Tournaments were the worse, as it really was an endless slog fest. This is a close second worst.
    #AcolyteShootsTwice
  • IronCross
    321 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    I just wish they added a 10x speed or could use sim tickets in the STR so I didn’t have to waste the time to push the auto button. I’m glad there are other categories in the game to keep us busy. If it was Arena and raids only this game would be dead. Love the bounty hunter changes and new events.
  • IG68
    3 posts Member
    I made an account entirely for the purpose of giving feedback on how bad this raid is. We're running tier 3 and the rewards are like 5 or 6 pieces of something that requires 20 pieces plus other things, so it ends up being something like 1/16th of a single item, for like a week's worth of grinding this stupid, unfun content. I don't even know how long it takes us to clear it because it is so uninteresting. Dramatically decrease the health pools on lower tiers, or increase (not weirdly change and then backtrack but straight up increase) rewards for lower tiers. We've had a couple folks quit too and a couple more adamantly express their exhaustion and disappointment.
  • Charzypants
    248 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    Thanks everyone for the feedback which is about 95% in agreement with this topic.

    I am the OP and I have changed my tone.. and here's why..

    Our alliance started running heroic and it is a game changer.. not because of the rewards but because I only need to do 4 total fights over 2 days and then get 2-3 days off. In comparison it was 20-25 battles over the same time frame for t6.

    This is still something that needs to be addressed for the health of the game.
  • AtlasMKx
    260 posts Member
    Marvel Heroes had Devs that refused to acknowledge the forum goers concerns about the health of the game, even staying false things like the players love BUE (biggest update ever). I watched that ship sink a slow painful death all the while the Devs remained in la la land. Anyways, with no responses whatsoever to any of these concerns I've lost all hope and have better things to do.
  • JaggedJ
    1352 posts Member
    All they need to do is make the raid quicker at lower levels and every other issue can be tolerated (even if DN is some of the worst design this game has) Dragging the raid out for several days, what does it really achieve other than burning players out?

    Reducing health isn't going to suddenly make it easy for a few players to do all the work.

    By the end of the day I will have completed 25 battles for the latest raid. 25 and may even sneak another refresh in if there's a small percentage of P4 left.

    There's nothing to be gained from dragging out these raids the way they are.


  • Natos
    138 posts Member
    add-on to what others have said. Lower tiers are a chore. Most of our guild coasts through. A few of us carry the load (I.e. about the top 5 of us do 3-4 times the damage as others), which is fine. I can't blame many for not wanting to carefully babysit squads through this ****.

    What I find particularly demotivating is P2. Not because it is hard, but because the person who times it well enough to hit it will likely be the top dawg of the raid. Doing good damage on P1, 2, and 3? Just filler to keep up, which are filled with frustrating random mechanics. Just totally unbalanced crap.

    Not that the reward for being on top matter much. Just an illustration of how completely lopsided the entire raid is.
  • Pile
    480 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    Thanks everyone for the feedback which is about 95% in agreement with this topic.

    I am the OP and I have changed my tone.. and here's why..

    Our alliance started running heroic and it is a game changer.. not because of the rewards but because I only need to do 4 total fights over 2 days and then get 2-3 days off. In comparison it was 20-25 battles over the same time frame for t6.

    This is still something that needs to be addressed for the health of the game.

    This is a tricky question so please bear with me. Would you say that the heroic level is easier than the lower tiers as long as you have the right number of "required" teams? My guild is doing tier 4 in 30 hours or so with 5 or 6 of us carrying the bulk of it. Leadership won't go higher until some of the lower members get stronger.
  • Pile wrote: »
    This is a tricky question so please bear with me. Would you say that the heroic level is easier than the lower tiers as long as you have the right number of "required" teams? My guild is doing tier 4 in 30 hours or so with 5 or 6 of us carrying the bulk of it. Leadership won't go higher until some of the lower members get stronger.

    As someone that has as of yesterday completed the SitH raid, having the right teams isn't enough. You have to have the right mods as well. Also, when you use your teams, you'll most likely be restarting a lot to get the right RNG for max damage. Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones. Every team is one and done, so you have to do all you can to do the max amount of damage. Unless you're the top guilds in this game, you won't be getting carried by a strong handful anytime soon. It takes everyone doing their part.
  • Range1974
    548 posts Member
    I have mixed feelings still. I just had a fleet shardmate quit because the game takes too much of his time to be competitive. My former guild ended up merging into an alliance cluster and moved about 18 heroic ready players up and the cluster sent T6 ready players over. We have now cleared heroic twice after failing our first attempt. Our last run was 13 hours and we had to pause to allow a few to put points on the board. We are definitely not on auto farm but it is nice to have team mates that can put up 10% damage on a phase
  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones.

    As someone who is doing T4, I'll just say that it's unfair to say "pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done." Sure that works, if you don't mind it taking twice as long as it should. If you're willing to do those same things as you lay out for heroic (strategy, specific teams, TM, abilities) it goes a lot faster, and frankly I think this is where lower tier guilds fail, throw up their arms in disgust, and say "the raid sucks!"

    Of course Heroic is different because you can't throw the same team at it again the next day, but in lower tiers people should be using the same basic strategies. And when you do, it works, and it's actually fun.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    ^Made my point for me.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • t0neg0d
    616 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    TVF wrote: »
    ^Made my point for me.

    I agree... but, at the same time, I can't blame people for doing it. It's a game after all... and if most (at least in my guild) have this attitude towards it, then CG missed the mark.

    You can't blame consumers for a terrible product. Well, you can... but you would be wrong.
  • Natos
    138 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones.

    As someone who is doing T4, I'll just say that it's unfair to say "pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done." Sure that works, if you don't mind it taking twice as long as it should. If you're willing to do those same things as you lay out for heroic (strategy, specific teams, TM, abilities) it goes a lot faster, and frankly I think this is where lower tier guilds fail, throw up their arms in disgust, and say "the raid sucks!"

    Of course Heroic is different because you can't throw the same team at it again the next day, but in lower tiers people should be using the same basic strategies. And when you do, it works, and it's actually fun.

    It might have been fun initially, however it's a grind now. The lower tiers take a loooong time to finish even IF you pay attention and use the right strategies. Why? Because the raid is still built around having the VERY specific teams you will need to do well in heroic, and those teams typically aren't held by lower tier guilds/players in large enough quantities to make the raid go faster.

    The rewards aren't worth competing for. Progress isn't apparent, or even possible in some instances (i.e., waiting to unlock the required legendary characters). Unsurprisingly, that becomes demotivating after a while...
  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    Natos wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones.

    As someone who is doing T4, I'll just say that it's unfair to say "pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done." Sure that works, if you don't mind it taking twice as long as it should. If you're willing to do those same things as you lay out for heroic (strategy, specific teams, TM, abilities) it goes a lot faster, and frankly I think this is where lower tier guilds fail, throw up their arms in disgust, and say "the raid sucks!"

    Of course Heroic is different because you can't throw the same team at it again the next day, but in lower tiers people should be using the same basic strategies. And when you do, it works, and it's actually fun.

    It might have been fun initially, however it's a grind now. The lower tiers take a loooong time to finish even IF you pay attention and use the right strategies. Why? Because the raid is still built around having the VERY specific teams you will need to do well in heroic, and those teams typically aren't held by lower tier guilds/players in large enough quantities to make the raid go faster.

    Again, if it's taking you more than a couple of days, you're doing the wrong tier.

    And there's lots of teams that work in lower tiers that are widely available, even if your guild doesn't have many JTR (we have six I believe).

    Zader
    FO
    NS
    Troopers/Thrawn
    Phoenix
    CLS Rebels
    etc.

    Yes you need some zetas for some of these to work but any moderately sized guild shouldn't have much issue with that.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • You are the only person defending it (partially because you're a forum troll)

    Out of order. @TVF is not a troll. He's a poster who makes a great contribution and speaks his mind. Not agreeing with him does not make him a troll.

    The Sith Raid splits opinion. Personally I really don't like it. It's horribly time-consuming and not remotely fun. None of my squads can do much on it at all but - here's the rub - the rewards are so pitiful that I don't find any encouragement to spend resources building up squads for it.

    However, I'm presuming that some like it. And good for them. The game is for everyone.

  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    edited May 2018
    The Sith Raid splits opinion. Personally I really don't like it. It's horribly time-consuming and not remotely fun. None of my squads can do much on it at all but - here's the rub - the rewards are so pitiful that I don't find any encouragement to spend resources building up squads for it.

    I would like better rewards. But the guild currency every three days is worth it IMO, especially when I'm enjoying the raid on its own merits as well. And the reason I'm enjoying it is because my squads can do a lot. Sure I have to restart a few times when I mis-time Nihilus, but for the most part it's fun blowing up Traya with Machine Gun Leia and Double Tap Magmatrooper in P3. It's fun watching Acolyte take 20 turns in a row in P4. It's fun stacking 20 dots with Zader on Nihilus or Sion and then blowing them all up with Boba. The rewards are a bonus. I wish they were a bigger bonus, but the raid itself is still fun if you put together some good teams. You don't even need JTR (although she's a lot of fun too).
    You are the only person defending it (partially because you're a forum troll). Though I'm sure in a couple of weeks you will start feeling it too. New people are cropping up in this thread almost daily . It eventually beats you down.

    This post is nearly a month old, and thanks to the additional work I've done on my raid teams since then, I'm actually enjoying it more. And several others in my guild feel the same. We finished a raid yesterday, can't start another one until tomorrow night, and I'm bummed there isn't one running today.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Natos
    138 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Natos wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones.

    As someone who is doing T4, I'll just say that it's unfair to say "pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done." Sure that works, if you don't mind it taking twice as long as it should. If you're willing to do those same things as you lay out for heroic (strategy, specific teams, TM, abilities) it goes a lot faster, and frankly I think this is where lower tier guilds fail, throw up their arms in disgust, and say "the raid sucks!"

    Of course Heroic is different because you can't throw the same team at it again the next day, but in lower tiers people should be using the same basic strategies. And when you do, it works, and it's actually fun.

    It might have been fun initially, however it's a grind now. The lower tiers take a loooong time to finish even IF you pay attention and use the right strategies. Why? Because the raid is still built around having the VERY specific teams you will need to do well in heroic, and those teams typically aren't held by lower tier guilds/players in large enough quantities to make the raid go faster.

    Again, if it's taking you more than a couple of days, you're doing the wrong tier.

    And there's lots of teams that work in lower tiers that are widely available, even if your guild doesn't have many JTR (we have six I believe).

    Zader
    FO
    NS
    Troopers/Thrawn
    Phoenix
    CLS Rebels
    etc.

    Yes you need some zetas for some of these to work but any moderately sized guild shouldn't have much issue with that.

    Like players aren't already trying to use other squads and STILL failing to progress? Please...

    Dropping a tier to speed things along only works if your guild is homogenous in terms of experience. In many instances (I dare so most) lower tier guilds have a few higher level players that have unlocked the "widely available" toons you list. Then a long list of players that have not, but still meet the listed tier requirements (i.e., they can participate, but not optimally).

    What's your solutions here? Drop a tier to speed things along that provides nothing for the higher tier players carrying the raid? Higher tier players leave the guild for a guild doing a higher tier (but not T6 or heroic, because they don't have THOSE teams yet)?

    Working within the set mechanics of STR is inherently demotivating. Not because it's "hard" but because it's random, tedious, and annoying for anyone not in a guild with 50 copies of themselves.
  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    Our guild has a wide range of players at different points of development. There's ways to improve your roster and do more in the raid, even if you just develop one team for that purpose and not five.

    Or you can complain it's too hard and annoying.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF wrote: »
    I wish they were a bigger bonus, but the raid itself is still fun if you put together some good teams.

    Yeah I can see that. Just, as I said, for the rewards on offer I don't feel it would be a good use of my resources to put together those teams. Just my opinion.

    So- as it stands - I slog through it on auto because of the Guild. Sometimes. Sometimes I don't even do that. Life's too short.

  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    What tier are you doing?
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF wrote: »
    What tier are you doing?

    Man I don't even know...we did one the other day that took about 8 days and one recently that took 2 or 3.
  • TVF
    22358 posts Member
    Lol.

    8 days was hopefully just a progress check, that's way too long otherwise.

    2 or 3 sounds in range for a lower tier.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Natos
    138 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Natos wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Tier 1-6 is pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done. Heroic requires a whole lot of strategy, specific teams, turn order manipulation, and knowing when to use each ability of your characters and the raid specific ones.

    As someone who is doing T4, I'll just say that it's unfair to say "pretty much hit auto 5x a day until the raid is done." Sure that works, if you don't mind it taking twice as long as it should. If you're willing to do those same things as you lay out for heroic (strategy, specific teams, TM, abilities) it goes a lot faster, and frankly I think this is where lower tier guilds fail, throw up their arms in disgust, and say "the raid sucks!"

    Of course Heroic is different because you can't throw the same team at it again the next day, but in lower tiers people should be using the same basic strategies. And when you do, it works, and it's actually fun.
    Yes you need some zetas for some of these to work but any moderately sized guild shouldn't have much issue with that.

    See, here's where you're not hearing people. Moderately sized guilds ARE having issues with things like this. To the point that it is taking SOOO long to get any kind of small progression that they loose all motivation to complete the raid AT ALL.

    Yes, some of the teams you list work. However, lower tier players also don't have access to most of them in numbers to make a difference in the time it takes to complete ANY tier. So, these players then spend weeks/months grinding out these teams for what? To still be stuck in the same
    TVF wrote: »
    Our guild has a wide range of players at different points of development. There's ways to improve your roster and do more in the raid, even if you just develop one team for that purpose and not five.

    Or you can complain it's too hard and annoying.

    Yep, that's what I'm doing, you know, if you purposefully ignore the part where I said it wasn't "hard".

    Have fun minimizing people's legitimate concerns with this albatross.
  • Naraic
    2243 posts Member
    You are the only person defending it (partially because you're a forum troll)

    Out of order. @TVF is not a troll. He's a poster who makes a great contribution and speaks his mind. Not agreeing with him does not make him a troll.

    The Sith Raid splits opinion. Personally I really don't like it. It's horribly time-consuming and not remotely fun. None of my squads can do much on it at all but - here's the rub - the rewards are so pitiful that I don't find any encouragement to spend resources building up squads for it.

    However, I'm presuming that some like it. And good for them. The game is for everyone.
    Ive 1.1 million gp which is not much compared to many. I have 3 g 12 characters and 4 gear 11 characters. I have 5 total zetas.

    Other than phoenix i dont have a single optimum team reasonably well developed.

    Guess what i still manage 2% or more in a day on any phase (6% on one boss in phase 4) when i do my 5 runs upto and including the tier 5 raid. Yes i restart if i dont manage to block nihilus's first attack annihilate with the defense shield but other than that let the rng fall where it will.

    So tier 5 sith raid could be done by a 55 million gp guild in 3 days 4 roster refreshes but the problem has crept into the community where people consider doing the raid beneath them. The guy with a jtr squad that pulls 5% on any phase on auto only jothers autoing 1 day out of 4 etc etc and the community decide sith raid is too hard.

    Guess what. Its tough but not really as bad as people pretend it is. The guild is usually the problem. People dont care. They do 1 run on auto during a raid and say they paticipated.
  • t0neg0d
    616 posts Member
    Naraic wrote: »
    You are the only person defending it (partially because you're a forum troll)

    Out of order. @TVF is not a troll. He's a poster who makes a great contribution and speaks his mind. Not agreeing with him does not make him a troll.

    The Sith Raid splits opinion. Personally I really don't like it. It's horribly time-consuming and not remotely fun. None of my squads can do much on it at all but - here's the rub - the rewards are so pitiful that I don't find any encouragement to spend resources building up squads for it.

    However, I'm presuming that some like it. And good for them. The game is for everyone.
    Ive 1.1 million gp which is not much compared to many. I have 3 g 12 characters and 4 gear 11 characters. I have 5 total zetas.

    Other than phoenix i dont have a single optimum team reasonably well developed.

    Guess what i still manage 2% or more in a day on any phase (6% on one boss in phase 4) when i do my 5 runs upto and including the tier 5 raid. Yes i restart if i dont manage to block nihilus's first attack annihilate with the defense shield but other than that let the rng fall where it will.

    So tier 5 sith raid could be done by a 55 million gp guild in 3 days 4 roster refreshes but the problem has crept into the community where people consider doing the raid beneath them. The guy with a jtr squad that pulls 5% on any phase on auto only jothers autoing 1 day out of 4 etc etc and the community decide sith raid is too hard.

    Guess what. Its tough but not really as bad as people pretend it is. The guild is usually the problem. People dont care. They do 1 run on auto during a raid and say they paticipated.

    I doubt anyone feels it's beneath them... misconception. When playing a GAME, people usually expect FUN. This raid failed to bring that to the table for many.

    You make it sound like a conspiracy that people aren't participating fully... once again... the problem isn't with the players... playing a game is a choice, something fun to distract you from other things that aren't fun. That only leaves one other place the problem could be...
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