GMY/Fulcrum/Ezra/General Kenobi/Bastilla?

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Gorem
1184 posts Member
edited July 2018
What I have not seen the game changers show yet is a bastila led team with making sure she goes first. You get your five Jedi team to go first cause Bastila, Then use her assist on GMY, GMY will go next no matter what his speed is, he then spreads all the buffs to everyone (Again, no idea why they don't do this), Which you follow with the others.

I'd focus on Sion first cause really, what the Jedi need against the meta is a way to make all of their buffs un-removable, Sion gets one turn not ability blocked you get reset to nothing. Take him out first round before the entire opposing team gets a turn, means no worries about losing it all. (though really, unless the AI is smart enough, more often then not your player led Sion will get his ability off, so unless the AI gains intelligence, a ability to make buffs un-removable would be key for defence)

Plus then they use their aoe's, ability blocking the others is a bad idea since Yoda gives Tenacity up, which makes you immune to Vaders/Palps/Nihilis first turn. Only worries will be characters like Thrawn or Traya. But really, getting a stun on Nihlis afterwards to stop his basic would give your entire team lots of turns with all the buffs.

Fulcrum could special the buffs away then regain them all on her next turn, That's a lot of damage from her.

I can see Old Ben also being useful here, purely because the AI always makes him use his tm removal first (which can also apply ability block, I mean it can be a good thing to do that, just wanted to avoid Nihilis basic :D and until Bastilla's tenacity from her leader is fixed as it appears to not be working, relying on Yoda's tenacity buffs seems to be key)

Replies

  • May work better if you can get hoda in there. Master's Training really boosts the damage.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    The problem I have with Hermit Yoda is from what I've seen, he's useless on defence. Sure you can use him well enough on offence for max damage, but on defence he appears to be terrible.

    Besides that, he's also the hardest of them all to farm up unless you are getting lots of stars in tb, and even then still will take some time. course, Kenobi will also be a long farm too, as well as Fulcrum, kinda sucks that the good Jedi (Or Fulcrum) take so long to get.
  • Unfortunately, it seems like any jedi team is going to drop like a rock on defense so that is likely unavoidable. Hoda is a long farm but likely needed for jedi luke, who will likely make jedi meta, and good for the sith raid so helos you eventually get traya too. My prediction is that jedi luke will likely come later this year, likely around the time cls first came out. Though they may wait until later in the year to give those that got traya first some time on top. Then in feb, we'll likely get darth revan to shift it back to ds for awhile.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    Yeah, it seems that really the thing that makes the current DS meta so good is that they work on defence, the AI seems to know how to use them. Which is rather unfortunate.

    And true that we will need him for Jedi luke, but unless his leader ability is even more op or he has something that truly breaks the game, I still doubt he will push the sith out for a Jedi Meta. He will have to be so crazy broken, lol.
  • Ninjah9
    810 posts Member
    Yea Bastila's battle meditation is weak. I'm more excited about the possibilities with jolee and gk. With the right jedi you could launch like 7 swarm attacks in a row!
  • Poxx
    2288 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    Doubt he'll be any more broken than any other meta, all he needs is to be anti-sith. But, no worries, Sith won't even be meta when and if we ever get jedi Luke.

    They will dangle that carrot in front of our noses until the game starts to die and use his release as a last-ditch effort to squeeze the player base for $$.
  • Guest
    518 posts Member
    Ninjah9 wrote: »
    Yea Bastila's battle meditation is weak. I'm more excited about the possibilities with jolee and gk. With the right jedi you could launch like 7 swarm attacks in a row!

    Yeah, well... GK hit like Jolee and Jolee hit like Bariss. See what it means ? You can send you whole squad but what's the point if the entire squad hit 10k on crit with a full assist ?
  • Ninjah9
    810 posts Member
    Go back to KOTOR and listen to the description of her battle meditation ability, increasing the moral and endurance of the jedi while literally debuffing the sith. That could have directly translated to this game. She should have something similar to palpatines ability against the jedi and rebels. They definitely dropped the ball on that one
  • There are some videos showing Bastila's leader ability in action ... and how much it sucks.
    Sure, your team can go first, but it is a leader ability that expires after two turns or so.
    - the TM bonus applies to the first round
    - the auto-taunt applies only to the first round. But, since you get the TM bonus, your tank (say GK) will get a turn before the enemy team, and the taunt has expired before the enemies take a turn. Thus, this part of the leader ability doesn't even make sense
    - the Tenacity Up and 35% Offense apply only if you have the starting Protection Up buff. Once that is gone, you lose the entire leader ability and have to play on without one.

    So, before the enemy takes a turn your tank has lost its taunt, and after maybe 2 turns you lose the protection, tenacity, and offense ... and you are sitting ducks.

    In theory, if you COULD take out Sion in the first round, it might be useful. But Jedi can't take out Sion in the first round. So, on Sion's first turn, you lose all your buffs, and its game over.

    If it was more like Mace's Capital Ship (while Republic allies have protection ...) rather than "while Jedi allies have Protection Up", it might be more useful, since you can regen protection (via Hoda, for example), to keep the leader ability going.
  • @Caiaphas GMY's Battle Meditation grants protection up for two turns as well. Granted, Sion's AoE dispel is a problem, but protection is readily available given the number of turns GMY gets. As you pointed out, OB's ability block is very useful, and when zeta'd provides a really nice solution to the lost taunt problem. If you're that worried about Sion, you could also use Aayla to effect a stun (making sure to mod her for crit chance).

    I actually ran into a zBastila lead yesterday (GMY, GK, OB, and Ezra rounded out the team) and I couldn't touch them with a standard Titans/OB comp. GMY effectively hid behind both taunts and spread protection up all over the place before I could generate enough damage to remove one of them. I only tried once and it's quite possible I played it very poorly, but there's promise there IMHO.

  • I feel like these Jedi would absolutely kick butt...if Traya, Sion, Nihilus weren’t the meta. That’s basically the counter. AOE buff dispel, offense reduction of buffs, buff immunity outside of turn (isolate), and annihilate. It seems like the Jedi should have been released first and the Sith to counter them.

    Outside of the Sith and Boba/Geo Spy, I feel like these Jedi are pretty awesome.
  • kevsmart
    492 posts Member
    https://youtu.be/H8QYS9jWI6o

    On paper it doesn't look like the Jedi with Fulcrum should work against Traya, the reality is different. I stomped him when I was on offense (though ATF still took out Traya in 1 WW) but there aren't many teams that hold on defense these days anyway, this at least shows that it is possible to win.
  • Thanks for the vid, @kevsmart :)
    Do you know his swgoh.gg account, to check mods, zetas ...?
  • Roopehun
    344 posts Member
    (...)

    Outside of the Sith and Boba/Geo Spy, I feel like these Jedi are pretty awesome.

    Can you please clarify what do you mean by Boba/Geo spy?
  • kevsmart
    492 posts Member
    ddlooping2 wrote: »
    Thanks for the vid, @kevsmart :)
    Do you know his swgoh.gg account, to check mods, zetas ...?

    His: https://swgoh.gg/u/thechosen1/
    Mine, for reference: https://swgoh.gg/u/barfolomew/
  • @kevsmart Thanks, I appreciate it. :)
  • Roopehun wrote: »
    (...)

    Outside of the Sith and Boba/Geo Spy, I feel like these Jedi are pretty awesome.

    Can you please clarify what do you mean by Boba/Geo spy?

    They destroy buff heavy teams. Boba has an attack that does 30% more damage for each buff/debuff a character has. Geo Spy has one that does 40% more. You could rack up some 100k+ attacks against these Jedi they are loaded with buffs.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    Roopehun wrote: »
    (...)

    Outside of the Sith and Boba/Geo Spy, I feel like these Jedi are pretty awesome.

    Can you please clarify what do you mean by Boba/Geo spy?

    They destroy buff heavy teams. Boba has an attack that does 30% more damage for each buff/debuff a character has. Geo Spy has one that does 40% more. You could rack up some 100k+ attacks against these Jedi they are loaded with buffs.

    Yeah, I'm doing the 200 battles through GW, and whenever I see a Boba I make sure he dies first, because I know he can one shot anyone he decides. Boba owns Jedi so hard.
    I feel like these Jedi would absolutely kick butt...if Traya, Sion, Nihilus weren’t the meta. That’s basically the counter. AOE buff dispel, offense reduction of buffs, buff immunity outside of turn (isolate), and annihilate. It seems like the Jedi should have been released first and the Sith to counter them.

    Outside of the Sith and Boba/Geo Spy, I feel like these Jedi are pretty awesome.

    Pretty much, the moment Traya is lead you can't do anything with Jedi. Palp counters Jedi, Traya lead counters, Sion counters, Nihilus stops rezzing and removes buffs...

    I honestly don't understand the point of Jolee, The last thing Jedi needed is another healer who hits for nothing. Sith have total offence and control and are meta, jedi has all the healing and buffs and are not meta, so what Jedi get? Another healer.

    And I Agree with the other poster, Bastilla's Ability should really have been a buff to all jedi and a nerf to all Sith on use, make it like she uses it, it takes her out the battle but makes the others stronger and the enemy weaker.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    kevsmart wrote: »
    https://youtu.be/H8QYS9jWI6o

    On paper it doesn't look like the Jedi with Fulcrum should work against Traya, the reality is different. I stomped him when I was on offense (though ATF still took out Traya in 1 WW) but there aren't many teams that hold on defense these days anyway, this at least shows that it is possible to win.

    Now that is interesting.

    Whats the main thing Fulcrum does? Dps, what the Jedi need? Dps, so hopefully if there is other changes, Jedi get the DPS they need to help, but its obvious that they don't want Jedi to be meta now, they want Traya to dominate, just be funny if we find more stuff like this that does beat her.
  • Gorem wrote: »
    Yeah, it seems that really the thing that makes the current DS meta so good is that they work on defence, the AI seems to know how to use them. Which is rather unfortunate.

    And true that we will need him for Jedi luke, but unless his leader ability is even more op or he has something that truly breaks the game, I still doubt he will push the sith out for a Jedi Meta. He will have to be so crazy broken, lol.

    I think he may. He's bound to hit like a truck. More dps than cls or jtr for sure. Probably on par with sion or traya. Not sure if his lead will be super good but he'll have the jedi tag so he'll be able to benefit from gmy lead or other good jedi leads. He'll probably have two uniques that aid a jedi team in some way or another. So if you put him on a team with gmy and ezra that gives you two decent dps toons and one really good one. Add in gk and hoda and you could be a contender since jedi luke could actually take out toons like sion. Not to mention you could make his lead have good anti sith synergies. It coukd be similar to vaders unique except for the team. A jedi team that has a few decent attackers and gains 5 or 6 speed for every jedi ally and each sith enemy. It could also be extra tenacity for the team so the debuffs don't stick. Or both. And that's just the lead. They coukd put that on a unique. They could also add a unique where jedi luke or the team gain turn meter for resisting debuffs and have high tenacity that can't be cleansed. That shuts down nihilas's drain force. There are many possibilities.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    Gorem wrote: »
    Yeah, it seems that really the thing that makes the current DS meta so good is that they work on defence, the AI seems to know how to use them. Which is rather unfortunate.

    And true that we will need him for Jedi luke, but unless his leader ability is even more op or he has something that truly breaks the game, I still doubt he will push the sith out for a Jedi Meta. He will have to be so crazy broken, lol.

    I think he may. He's bound to hit like a truck. More dps than cls or jtr for sure. Probably on par with sion or traya. Not sure if his lead will be super good but he'll have the jedi tag so he'll be able to benefit from gmy lead or other good jedi leads. He'll probably have two uniques that aid a jedi team in some way or another. So if you put him on a team with gmy and ezra that gives you two decent dps toons and one really good one. Add in gk and hoda and you could be a contender since jedi luke could actually take out toons like sion. Not to mention you could make his lead have good anti sith synergies. It coukd be similar to vaders unique except for the team. A jedi team that has a few decent attackers and gains 5 or 6 speed for every jedi ally and each sith enemy. It could also be extra tenacity for the team so the debuffs don't stick. Or both. And that's just the lead. They coukd put that on a unique. They could also add a unique where jedi luke or the team gain turn meter for resisting debuffs and have high tenacity that can't be cleansed. That shuts down nihilas's drain force. There are many possibilities.

    Interesting Idea's, He must have a lot of that cause from my understanding, they will want him to break the meta the moment he's released. Maybe what they should do is give him like a 40Zeta unique that makes him gain all the speed of the entire enemy team :D
  • Gorem wrote: »
    Gorem wrote: »
    Yeah, it seems that really the thing that makes the current DS meta so good is that they work on defence, the AI seems to know how to use them. Which is rather unfortunate.

    And true that we will need him for Jedi luke, but unless his leader ability is even more op or he has something that truly breaks the game, I still doubt he will push the sith out for a Jedi Meta. He will have to be so crazy broken, lol.

    I think he may. He's bound to hit like a truck. More dps than cls or jtr for sure. Probably on par with sion or traya. Not sure if his lead will be super good but he'll have the jedi tag so he'll be able to benefit from gmy lead or other good jedi leads. He'll probably have two uniques that aid a jedi team in some way or another. So if you put him on a team with gmy and ezra that gives you two decent dps toons and one really good one. Add in gk and hoda and you could be a contender since jedi luke could actually take out toons like sion. Not to mention you could make his lead have good anti sith synergies. It coukd be similar to vaders unique except for the team. A jedi team that has a few decent attackers and gains 5 or 6 speed for every jedi ally and each sith enemy. It could also be extra tenacity for the team so the debuffs don't stick. Or both. And that's just the lead. They coukd put that on a unique. They could also add a unique where jedi luke or the team gain turn meter for resisting debuffs and have high tenacity that can't be cleansed. That shuts down nihilas's drain force. There are many possibilities.

    Interesting Idea's, He must have a lot of that cause from my understanding, they will want him to break the meta the moment he's released. Maybe what they should do is give him like a 40Zeta unique that makes him gain all the speed of the entire enemy team :D

    That may be goinga bit far but he could have a unique that gives other jedi like 300% offense while allive. The number could be set however much is needed to make jedi meta but not op.
  • Ninjah9
    810 posts Member
    Guest wrote: »
    Ninjah9 wrote: »
    Yea Bastila's battle meditation is weak. I'm more excited about the possibilities with jolee and gk. With the right jedi you could launch like 7 swarm attacks in a row!

    Yeah, well... GK hit like Jolee and Jolee hit like Bariss. See what it means ? You can send you whole squad but what's the point if the entire squad hit 10k on crit with a full assist ?

    Yea that's true, I'm not saying it would be the most devastating move ever, but would be cool. What would be more practical is launching like four in a row, and then launching one like every other turn. And with Ezra you could attack like 4 times in a row with the swarm. The extremely disappointing thing is that cg decided to get cute with the language of the ability, to specifically make it unusable with kenobi's synergy. I mean like that makes total sense, he can't have synergy with kenobi because that would make him great jedi character to use and cg just doesnt believe the jedi should be a viable faction. Fml
  • Ninjah9
    810 posts Member
    @Gorem Yes! She needed a sith nerf according to KOTOR canon that is exactly what her battle meditation does! And if ANYBODY else is tired of cg nerfing the jedi and agree with the KOTOR interpretation of her ability then please hit the like button on this and my previous comment. Let's see if we can get the developers attention and wake them up to the fact that they are disappointing their fans and therefore their customers. Would really appreciate the support I believe this can be fixed if we get enough fans to speak up about it.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    Haha yeah, they have mostly stuck to lore based abilities so you'd think her battle meditation would nerf sith while buffing jedi, because yes, that is exactly what its supposed to do.

    Btw everyone, its more viable to use her now that her leader is fixed, she actually makes you ignore more of the sith now.

    Her leader was not granting the 150% tenacity or the damage bonus of 35% before. So now even if Sion gets his aoe off, no one gets pain, and you still have the protection up for buff purposes. it also means you don't need to focus him anymore, can leave him for last as you will not get pain.
  • Gorem wrote: »
    Haha yeah, they have mostly stuck to lore based abilities so you'd think her battle meditation would nerf sith while buffing jedi, because yes, that is exactly what its supposed to do.

    Btw everyone, its more viable to use her now that her leader is fixed, she actually makes you ignore more of the sith now.

    Her leader was not granting the 150% tenacity or the damage bonus of 35% before. So now even if Sion gets his aoe off, no one gets pain, and you still have the protection up for buff purposes. it also means you don't need to focus him anymore, can leave him for last as you will not get pain.

    It might be a good idea to get rid of Sion before he gets to Held by Hatred though. He also hits really hard and removes all your buffs, so he’s definitely a threat.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    Well yeah of course, its just that I was watching the GC's vids and saw the full Jedi teams owning palp led teams with Traya in them, and Sion was saved till last, they won each one. Traya downed first then palp.

    Main issue will be Traya led teams, but realistically, a full Jedi meta is possible on newer shards now. Any shard with no Traya could be dominated by jedi now, and that feels good.
  • DarkHelmet1138
    1918 posts Member
    edited July 2018
    We have a bastilla lead in our shard in the top ten now. I went after it thinking it would be an easy win compared to traya teams but after the fix I got destroyed with their team on defense. I run pap lead, no traya yet. So it is arena viable now.
  • Gorem
    1184 posts Member
    We have a bastilla lead in our shard in the top ten now. I went after it thinking it would be an easy win compared to traya teams but after the fix I got destroyed with their team on defense. I run pap lead, no traya yet. So it is arena viable now.

    Yup, Palp lead will lose against bastille led jedi teams now, They were good before, gaining 35% offence across the board and 150% tenacity has made them suddenly awesome.
  • Caiaphas
    114 posts Member
    Aye, Bastila seems to make Jedi viable on Defense, and you can still beat Palp teams, and Palp teams with Traya in it on Offense, Still can't beat Traya lead teams, though... we are probably in for another 6 months of Sith :(
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