@CG_TopHat there's people who've invested hundreds of dollars into the nightsisters...one thing you shouldn't do in a game where you make characters cost that much is nerf them. Acolyte won't he able to double tap through foresight anymore making nightsisters even less viable in arena...and the worst is yet to come to any who've heavily invested in NS. Zombie, who is integral to the nightsisters, is going to get nerfed too. Please rollback the change, and just change Traya's isolate for the raid only...she can stay the same in all other areas of the game. You guys are making a mistake. People aren't going to want to drop money on the game anymore if you do stuff like this.
This really is unacceptable. I’ve invested heavily in the NS team and alcolyte.
She’ll be useless now as we all used for stealth and to double tap thru foresight .
More changes too? I’ve got 4 zetas on this team, all gear 12 except for my zombie. You’re going to have to refund a lot more than just just daka’s Zeta.
This. I'm in the same boat - multiple zetas, NS are my arena team. I know I've had to migrate arena teams over time to keep in the 75-150 range (I'm FTP), so I guess now will be the time yet again. AC will be useless without her double attack to see through foresight and double revive.
I really don't want to build a silly ZPalp team like everyone else...
@CG_TopHat i can agree with many people here the acolyte change is both good and bad in there own aspects... why not make the very simple change to asajj's zeta/lead where you can only gain the turn meter one per turn like with Nute Gunrey's lead. doing just that should fix any exploit, i think, plus not change any viability of the characters in any area of the game.
Disagree, this would annihilate the NS team in the raid.
@CG_TopHat Shame on you for doing any change at all. If you really wanted to do what's right and good for the game and your players, you would have accepted your responsability for making a feature (Sith raid) so unfun, so unbalanced and too complicated and RNG based.
I think you would have done a better job by apologizing for making the Sith raid.
Gotta feeling this is going to be like the feedback thread for the Sith Raid, ignored for 50 pages.
If you keep having an issue with how people play the Sith Raid, then the common factor is the raid is the problem, not the characters. Stop changing the characters that are being used as intended to kill any fun what so ever in the raid, and just change the raid.
Why can't they limit the Asajj lead TM gain to once per turn like they did on Nute Gunray? OK, it screwed the only useful aspect of Nute so he's useless now, but the issue is Acolyte getting double TM gain on her turn due to the double attack on basic. If it can only trigger once per turn the loop is broken but Talzin double resurrect and foresight breaking are preserved.
Actually, Nute is once until the characters next turn, since we're trying to break it on Acolyte double tap basic, we only need to limit it to one per turn.
I actually dislike the changes completely because it breaks a team I was building so it means I've been wasting my farming priorities but if it's going to get changed, the current change sucks and breaks Talzin lead.
zAsajj, Acolyte, Visas, Talia/Echo/R2, Death Trooper. Although not an infinite loop like the team they're fixing, I was hoping to get mad deathmark proc loops with good rng. I never even got to test because I'm still farming.
Gotta feeling this is going to be like the feedback thread for the Sith Raid, ignored for 50 pages.
If you keep having an issue with how people play the Sith Raid, then the common factor is the raid is the problem, not the characters. Stop changing the characters that are being used as intended to kill any fun what so ever in the raid, and just change the raid.
At least fix the bug, when Acolytes attack hits an enemy with foresight the attack of the revived toon misses as well. That makes no sense since the Acolyte's attack should have consumed it. If the revived NS attacks then one of the most common complaints about the foresight-based teams will be solved.
A possible solution for the 1 not revived NS could be to make sure MT AOE Plague cant be evaded or resisted.
So, let me get this right. Not going to unseat abilities or gear on NS A because you havent changed her....except for the bit you have changed her to be less effective? Do you even read your own posts?
Are you not able to see the impact of MT zeta when NS A wont double hit? Why on earth did you not mention that in your post? I can only assume because this is another utterly horrendous untested change -made by you to attempt to fix one of your many, many mistakes. I wish i worked in a job where I could make so many fundamental mistakes and still keep my job.
Whats the best similar game that EA has nothing to do with?
I wish you guys were not so sensitive and that we could speak our minds.... but I have seen you ban too many people who disagree with you before....i do wish you could know what I really want to say to you though. Shame that you cant.
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It totally seems like they don't read replies. On several threads people have said they don't use paper Zombie strategy. They never mention it.
If Zombie gets nerfed I will have to zeta Daka. That puts me way behind schedule. Zetas don't come easy.
But I don't exist, so whatever.
I use acolyte under asajji lead in rancor, the double hits help with tm reduction to solo on auto, as well as in extra foresight removal in arena. and other changes coming. your slight changes, as it appears to some, are big for me that enjoyed playing nightsisters. Am I going to to be able to get a refund for money(not time) that i put forth to get my team where i wanted, if so change away, if not go back to the drawing board and rethink.
I have an easy fix for zombie. Won't break anything. Add a skill. An attack that allows zombie to damage herself like Talia's cleanse. It won't kill paper zombie any faster since they die quickly anyway, but will allow high gear zombie to drop health faster. Maybe it gives protection up to a toon and loses health or something. It is a skill, a player doesn't have to use it. Thus making health loss optional.
Or an attack zombie is undead. Undead life force is negative energy. So a negative energy attack using a % of zombie current health as damage. Better gear, higher health, more damage.
Acolyte in TW is NERFED.
Acolyte in P4 AV, Daka, Talia, Initiate teams is NERFED.
^^^ (Best F2P P4 Sith Team) ^^^
Acolyte in Arena is NERFED.
Asajj in Arena is NERFED.
then all this talk about zombie who isn't even on the team is even more concerning...
Is the intent to nerf Nightsister Faction or is it the fix the ability to Solo P3?
The Loop is caused by Qi'Ra giving Acolyte Health Steal Up every turn. This only happens if 2 critical hits land, so I'm not sure if you could go the whole p3 landing 100% crits, but if you could you can solo P3 using Qu'Ra and Acolyte under Asajj.
The Loop is also caused by Traya Isolate giving Health Steal Up to Acolyte under Asajj lead.
ASAJJ AND ACOLYTE ARE IN BOTH TEAMS BUT THEY ARE NOT THE PROBLEM.
THE PROBLEM IS REALLY HEALTH STEAL UP IN SITH RAID.
Can I suggest Removing Health Steal Up from The Sith Raid as a Fix? @CG_TopHat
Leave all characters alone this will have 0 Impact on all other raids and game modes. All the players will be happy and you will have accomplished the goal of no team being able to solo the Sith Raid.
I encourage anyone to poke holes in this fiz as I believe this is the BEST SOLUTION with the LEAST IMPACT to players and still NERFS Qu'Ra or Traya with Acolyte and Asajj. Nothing will need to even be refunded and everyone will be happy... unles the intent is to nerf Nightsisters then this wouldn't accomplish that goal.
You have been promoting the NS Nerfs posting stuff like the above.
FYI Some players don't have Talzin and Zombie to 7* yet. In addition -
Acolyte is used in ARENA and one may argue Arena Credits are the real lifeblood of the game so a nerf to NS vs Rey teams and Jedi teams with all their evasion would severely hurt the NS arena teams.
Nute and Acolyte is used in TW, its one of TI's "best in the game" TW Offense teams.
My suggestion of removing health steal up from ONLY the sith raid fixes the loop interaction with BONDS OF WEAKNESS. while leaving all other characters alone.
Devs can keep health steal up in every other mode as long as they don't introduce another BONDS of WEAKNESS to interact with teams like NS and Health steal up.
No Health Steal up in HSTR and everything works out fine. Hundreds of thousands even millions of NS users are not impacted at all. Devs can keep Health Steal up in every other game mode and on new characters. The problem interaction is with Bonds of Weakness and Health Steal up on a fundamental level.
Yes taking away the double attack for double damage keeps damage about the same & stops the glitch you discovered. But as a player that uses nightsisters & has invested most of my game resources & spendings on this group. You are still greatly hurting the acolytes in game usefullness. Without the twin attack you are lessing her pvp usefullness with both Talzin & Ventress leads. Currently under a talking lead she can revive 2 sisters with one at & under Ventress lead she get 2 chances at TMR. Damage is only a small part of what makes that hero usefull. Also this change to her kit weakens nightsisters as a team against the HPIT raid, again the loss of a TMR chance. I understand you felling you need to stop this unplanned by you imbalance in the game. But changing an already established hero the players like myself have invested much time, resources, & cash into is unfair. While your not waking my current PVP strategy much your greatly hurting my HPIT scores. What I can't understand is why not change Traya? Her ability is what make this possible & she is still relatively new to the game. The other Hero that currently give HPSteal boost don't do it to the level she does so it doesn't make a high count attack combo at most they give 1 extra set of attacks.
You have been promoting the NS Nerfs posting stuff like the above.
FYI Some players don't have Talzin and Zombie to 7* yet. In addition -
Acolyte is used in ARENA and one may argue Arena Credits are the real lifeblood of the game so a nerf to NS vs Rey teams and Jedi teams with all their evasion would severely hurt the NS arena teams.
Nute and Acolyte is used in TW, its one of TI's "best in the game" TW Offense teams.
My suggestion of removing health steal up from ONLY the sith raid fixes the loop interaction with BONDS OF WEAKNESS. while leaving all other characters alone.
Devs can keep health steal up in every other mode as long as they don't introduce another BONDS of WEAKNESS to interact with teams like NS and Health steal up.
No Health Steal up in HSTR and everything works out fine. Hundreds of thousands even millions of NS users are not impacted at all. Devs can keep Health Steal up in every other game mode and on new characters. The problem interaction is with Bonds of Weakness and Health Steal up on a fundamental level.
No again. Maybe they wanna keep it, because Nihilus ignores protection and otherwise you need a healer...? They wan't destroy every team comp for the future, because of acolyte.
HEALTH STEAL, like what Rey teams do in P1, works even without HEALTH STEAL UP. They are 2 completely separate abilities FYI.
HEALTH STEAL UP is a special ability that grants bonus Healing, in addition to the normal healing. This bonus healing is what causes the loop. It can be turned off for Sith raid and no kits need to be changed.
Change the raid not the toons. The raid has been a broken boring exercise from the start.
How could Sith raid possibly be such a sacred cow that toons we worked hard on have to be destroyed?
Zombie gets it and she doesn't even have anything to do with it. The raid is becoming an excuse for any nerf.
So You have a problem with a single character in a few phases in a single raid combined with certain other characters. And You try to convince everyone that changing that one character EVERYWHERE in the game has the least impact? I’ll just add one more to the queue of players complaining about the disability to shoot trough foresight with second arrow if it is removed. If there is such an obvious point where the character gets broken, I wonder how many not-so-obvious ones there are?
Please make Acolyte's basic unavoidable if you proceed with the proposed changes. Without the double tap it will destroy her most important use. I got 6.2 million against the HSR yesterday with Nightsisters, and I don't use Acolyte. She isn't needed for that.
Her best use is in Territory Wars against JTR teams. If she can't double tap she's useless. Making her basic unavoidable on top of the proposed changes helps fix that. It doesn't make up for her missing out on some TM reduction, and extra assist calls under Ventress, or MT, but it's better than nothing.
Thank you for rolling back the earlier rushed nerf. Please consider this addition so Acolyte isn't ruined.
To be perfectly honest, i don't like this change that much, although it's much better than changing bonds of weakness mechanic
I run NS obviously in arena, and for now, the only fights i really struggle with are the ones against Traya or EP. With the addition of Bastilla teams, I had a break from fighting for positions because it's quite a "time-consuming" but easy enough fight the 90% of the cases.
With this change in the early turns (when my entire team is still alive vs Bastilla), I have to remove protection from Kenobi (or Old ben), that means that my acolyte always could land the second attack despite him having prevision.... Now with this change I won't be able (and the other ones running NS), to get off some of the protection...Will have to see it live, but it seems it may give an advantatge vs Bastilla with GMY teams.
Cheers
basically you struggle with any team that's meta lmao
Replies
This. I'm in the same boat - multiple zetas, NS are my arena team. I know I've had to migrate arena teams over time to keep in the 75-150 range (I'm FTP), so I guess now will be the time yet again. AC will be useless without her double attack to see through foresight and double revive.
I really don't want to build a silly ZPalp team like everyone else...
how so?
I think you would have done a better job by apologizing for making the Sith raid.
If you keep having an issue with how people play the Sith Raid, then the common factor is the raid is the problem, not the characters. Stop changing the characters that are being used as intended to kill any fun what so ever in the raid, and just change the raid.
@CG_TopHat
I actually dislike the changes completely because it breaks a team I was building so it means I've been wasting my farming priorities but if it's going to get changed, the current change sucks and breaks Talzin lead.
zAsajj, Acolyte, Visas, Talia/Echo/R2, Death Trooper. Although not an infinite loop like the team they're fixing, I was hoping to get mad deathmark proc loops with good rng. I never even got to test because I'm still farming.
The voice of reason. Hey CG, hire that guy.
But what about the possibly 2 revived NS?
At least fix the bug, when Acolytes attack hits an enemy with foresight the attack of the revived toon misses as well. That makes no sense since the Acolyte's attack should have consumed it. If the revived NS attacks then one of the most common complaints about the foresight-based teams will be solved.
A possible solution for the 1 not revived NS could be to make sure MT AOE Plague cant be evaded or resisted.
So, let me get this right. Not going to unseat abilities or gear on NS A because you havent changed her....except for the bit you have changed her to be less effective? Do you even read your own posts?
Are you not able to see the impact of MT zeta when NS A wont double hit? Why on earth did you not mention that in your post? I can only assume because this is another utterly horrendous untested change -made by you to attempt to fix one of your many, many mistakes. I wish i worked in a job where I could make so many fundamental mistakes and still keep my job.
Whats the best similar game that EA has nothing to do with?
I wish you guys were not so sensitive and that we could speak our minds.... but I have seen you ban too many people who disagree with you before....i do wish you could know what I really want to say to you though. Shame that you cant.
.
If Zombie gets nerfed I will have to zeta Daka. That puts me way behind schedule. Zetas don't come easy.
But I don't exist, so whatever.
All will be nerfed.
Or an attack zombie is undead. Undead life force is negative energy. So a negative energy attack using a % of zombie current health as damage. Better gear, higher health, more damage.
Acolyte in P4 AV, Daka, Talia, Initiate teams is NERFED.
^^^ (Best F2P P4 Sith Team) ^^^
Acolyte in Arena is NERFED.
Asajj in Arena is NERFED.
then all this talk about zombie who isn't even on the team is even more concerning...
Is the intent to nerf Nightsister Faction or is it the fix the ability to Solo P3?
The Loop is caused by Qi'Ra giving Acolyte Health Steal Up every turn. This only happens if 2 critical hits land, so I'm not sure if you could go the whole p3 landing 100% crits, but if you could you can solo P3 using Qu'Ra and Acolyte under Asajj.
The Loop is also caused by Traya Isolate giving Health Steal Up to Acolyte under Asajj lead.
ASAJJ AND ACOLYTE ARE IN BOTH TEAMS BUT THEY ARE NOT THE PROBLEM.
THE PROBLEM IS REALLY HEALTH STEAL UP IN SITH RAID.
Can I suggest Removing Health Steal Up from The Sith Raid as a Fix? @CG_TopHat
Leave all characters alone this will have 0 Impact on all other raids and game modes. All the players will be happy and you will have accomplished the goal of no team being able to solo the Sith Raid.
I encourage anyone to poke holes in this fiz as I believe this is the BEST SOLUTION with the LEAST IMPACT to players and still NERFS Qu'Ra or Traya with Acolyte and Asajj. Nothing will need to even be refunded and everyone will be happy... unles the intent is to nerf Nightsisters then this wouldn't accomplish that goal.
Better not I use my cannon fodder. To set up my better teams.
You have been promoting the NS Nerfs posting stuff like the above.
FYI Some players don't have Talzin and Zombie to 7* yet. In addition -
Acolyte is used in ARENA and one may argue Arena Credits are the real lifeblood of the game so a nerf to NS vs Rey teams and Jedi teams with all their evasion would severely hurt the NS arena teams.
Nute and Acolyte is used in TW, its one of TI's "best in the game" TW Offense teams.
My suggestion of removing health steal up from ONLY the sith raid fixes the loop interaction with BONDS OF WEAKNESS. while leaving all other characters alone.
Devs can keep health steal up in every other mode as long as they don't introduce another BONDS of WEAKNESS to interact with teams like NS and Health steal up.
No Health Steal up in HSTR and everything works out fine. Hundreds of thousands even millions of NS users are not impacted at all. Devs can keep Health Steal up in every other game mode and on new characters. The problem interaction is with Bonds of Weakness and Health Steal up on a fundamental level.
HEALTH STEAL, like what Rey teams do in P1, works even without HEALTH STEAL UP. They are 2 completely separate abilities FYI.
HEALTH STEAL UP is a special ability that grants bonus Healing, in addition to the normal healing. This bonus healing is what causes the loop. It can be turned off for Sith raid and no kits need to be changed.
How could Sith raid possibly be such a sacred cow that toons we worked hard on have to be destroyed?
Zombie gets it and she doesn't even have anything to do with it. The raid is becoming an excuse for any nerf.
Her best use is in Territory Wars against JTR teams. If she can't double tap she's useless. Making her basic unavoidable on top of the proposed changes helps fix that. It doesn't make up for her missing out on some TM reduction, and extra assist calls under Ventress, or MT, but it's better than nothing.
Thank you for rolling back the earlier rushed nerf. Please consider this addition so Acolyte isn't ruined.
basically you struggle with any team that's meta lmao