Getting burned out on marquee and hard node cycle.

Replies

  • Kyno wrote: »
    Atlas1 wrote: »
    kyno I get where you’re coming from but it’s like you’re choosing between bad or worse. CG ought to be more creative with character releases so as not to irritate the player base with every new toon release. I for one am also burned out on marquee releases and single hard mode farms with a 5 attempt daily limit.

    100% agree. I was just pointing out this was a step in the right direction, they should have followed it up with one or 2 more. 8 attempts was a another good one, but they back out.

    Coming from the same person who was defending their decision to reduce free node attempts from 8 to 5 back when it happened, I would respectfully say that this response sounds a bit hypocritical...
  • Mzee
    1777 posts Member
    I understand that the people of CG have a hard time, on the one hand the community who feels burnt out, on the other hand there's the company people who want to see numbers. It must be very hard to find a balance that will satisfy all, however this is a big problem with games in general. We've entered a new era where people who are disconnected from gaming will invest into it, hoping for nothing but dollars. They are hurting the industry as a whole, just look at games like Fifa and NBA2k just to mention a few.

    We as gamers have to adapt and possibly look for a middle ground, this isn't @CG_Carrie 's fault, but we expect somebody to "represent" us too. We want a person who will stand up to the corporatists and explain how some things aren't just about money. We're all Star wars fans, we spend money on the franchise as a whole and not being able to enjoy our favorite characters in our favorite game because we can't afford the 2-350$ price tag feels like it's too much.

    The era of microtransactions. This has been going on for a number of years now.
  • Increasing the number of free attempts on hard nodes won't matter much, that's only going to require more energy and it will reduce the amount of characters you can farm at once. We have some pretty cool stores that are not being used for quite some time now
  • Boofpoof
    337 posts Member
    edited August 2018
    Kyno wrote: »
    Hard node farming and gear crunch are wrecking the game. Kyno will argue untill hes blue im the face that its not true.

    He'll say $$$$ to speed it up but how many times have you all refreshed and simmed 14 missions just to drop 1 piece of salvage or done your 5 hard node battle and dropped 1 shard then refreshed energy and the node only to get 0 shards the next time.

    So 6 months to a year to farm 1 character out of dozens that you cant gear anyway unless you buy full pieces at £20 each.

    Please show me where I said they were good for the game. I will wait...
    @UnstopableSteve

    @Kyno

    I get the feeling he isn't going to find it. Such an old discussion about drop rates so I'm not going there. I've been the very victim of the simming 15 missions and getting 0 drops for the gear I was simming for. I won't disagree that the gear wall (stun cuffs and carbantis) are a HUGE hurdle these days but with more ways to get them now (ship nodes) I can't complain too hard that they have at least attempted to make it slightly easier for those gear pieces.

    SWGOH Guild: Peace is a Lie SWGOH Profile: Boofpoof Discord: Buffpuff#3065
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
    Increasing the number of free attempts on hard nodes won't matter much, that's only going to require more energy and it will reduce the amount of characters you can farm at once. We have some pretty cool stores that are not being used for quite some time now

    The easy, competition-less stores are officially dead, though. We are left with the guild store (competes with gear), fleet store (competes with zetas) and GE store (Hyoda, Wampa, G12), and even those are underused...
  • Nauros wrote: »
    Increasing the number of free attempts on hard nodes won't matter much, that's only going to require more energy and it will reduce the amount of characters you can farm at once. We have some pretty cool stores that are not being used for quite some time now

    The easy, competition-less stores are officially dead, though. We are left with the guild store (competes with gear), fleet store (competes with zetas) and GE store (Hyoda, Wampa, G12), and even those are underused...

    Technically they do compete with shard shop (gear). But you're missing the point, this whole discussion about stores is really not about the stores, it's about shards/time. They could increase drop rates to 66% and it would cut farm times by 50%. They could increase it to 100% and it would cut down the time by 1/3.

    The problem is not whether stores will be used or not, the problem is for the devs to decide to cut farm times down so we don't have to spent months to farm characters. The whole 'store debate' is happening because we know the farm times of each store, personally I would be fine if the stores weren't ever utilized again, I just want to reduce farm times because spending 5-7 months on a character is way too excessive and I'm sure most of us see it that way
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Atlas1 wrote: »
    kyno I get where you’re coming from but it’s like you’re choosing between bad or worse. CG ought to be more creative with character releases so as not to irritate the player base with every new toon release. I for one am also burned out on marquee releases and single hard mode farms with a 5 attempt daily limit.

    100% agree. I was just pointing out this was a step in the right direction, they should have followed it up with one or 2 more. 8 attempts was a another good one, but they back out.

    Coming from the same person who was defending their decision to reduce free node attempts from 8 to 5 back when it happened, I would respectfully say that this response sounds a bit hypocritical...

    They have the data, we do not. If they think it is the way the game should be for the purposes of pacing, then it's a good choice. From a community standpoint I'm sure we would all love to have more attempts and be able to progress faster, that doesnt make it right for the game, but i can still think it's better.

    It's funny how thinking one thing is better doesnt make it the best thing for a larger system. It's almost as if you can feel one way, but still see the reason and logic for a situation to go against that.... maybe it's just me.
  • gufu21
    335 posts Member
    Nauros wrote: »
    t0neg0d wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    t0neg0d wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Whether or not someone is going to enjoy the game, is really more of a personal question. All we can do is hope they change iteams we dont like for a positive growth experience. This is always going to be evolving and changing.

    Sorta...

    If your customers become NOT customers, than it may be time to take some of that responsibility on.

    I'm 99.9% sure that the next hero's journey will require 4 single hard node farms & a new legendary that potentially requires another 5 single hard node farms. Why? Because there isn't anything else to choose from now =(

    There is - Solo. One guild store, two Cantina, one hard character node and one hard ship, both low energy. Plus Nest on a killer node, but she isn't really a part of the crew so I wouldn't expect her to be required. And we just got a Solo bundle...

    Who are you thinking they'll be needed for?
    My guess is the original Falcon. It makes sense, Solo was basically all about why it's so awesome and how Han got his hands on it. The only issue is that we still don't have original Chewie.

    Well poo. So do I farm Nest because she's way more useful than Young Lando, or do I hit his ships pve node to try to get ahead of the legendary requirements?
  • kalidor
    2121 posts Member
    The marquee timeline is a bit like an assembly line, and theoretically I agree with that sort of release structure. You get you 3* character, can play with a fully buffed out one to see if you like it, and there's packs available for those who sponsor the game. A bit later they're in Shipments, and if you really like the hero, you can drop 320cr/640cr every few days to get a head start on them. Meanwhile, new marquees are released. A bit later the first ones become farmable, the second ones end up in shipments, and another round comes out. That gives you plenty of time to get through the mudane gear levels (g1-9) for those you want, level them to 85, and upgrade the abilities, before you even start shard farming. And the ability-dependent heroes are usable almost immediately (nest, bastila).
    What I don't like is what "farmable" has come to mean. 20e nodes, 5 attempts per day (or 10 if you drop 50cr). And mostly darkside. Getting my lightside task in has become a pain, and heroes I started farming and buying crystals for months ago are barely on their way to 6*.
    What would be cool is if the marque event returned in the period after that. The second time you play it you get reduced shards per tier, and you have to use your hero (not an event supplied one). Kind of similar to a mythic. So not only do new players get a chance to lock these heroes, but older players get a bit of a shard boost (maybe 5/tier, 25 total). Nothing gamebreaking, but a morale-improving boost. So the release would look like:
    1. Initial marquee release, along with store packs
    2. (+6wks): In shipments for 320/640/1280 crystals
    3. (+6wks): farmable somehow (store, node)
    4. (+6? wks): marquee event return for additional shards, periodically returning every 3-4 months
    Having some appear in the bounties was pretty neat, but unless we start getting more of these events (III, IV, etc) and they alternate so there's at least 1 bounty per month, they don't hold too much interest for me.
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
  • When we get Legendary or HR-style it's just going to need all the toons that have been just released. That's not a let up, or a bone thrown - it's just putting to work the marquee train tracks they've laid.

    I disagree CG had a little tiffy over marquee reaction had some meeting and changed their minds. This is following a definite plan - predicated on making marquees just frustrating enough and now making you farm them for needed future toons. JTR redux, with 5 toons on a HN instead of just 2.

    All EA titles are based on frustration building sales, always making 995 of the player base feel "behind" whatever that means.
    #AcolyteShootsTwice
  • Madpup
    279 posts Member
    A big issue that is going to come up is we are going to soon be forced to farm multiple hard node characters for legendary events which has never been done before, even for heroic events. The hardest event to farm for was JTR, required two hardnode/guild store farms and the vets. It took about two months to finish when not taking BB8 into account. Now we are going to get legendary events, not heroic, that are going to take up to 6 months to farm for f2p because of just 1 possible hard node character being needed for a team.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Atlas1 wrote: »
    kyno I get where you’re coming from but it’s like you’re choosing between bad or worse. CG ought to be more creative with character releases so as not to irritate the player base with every new toon release. I for one am also burned out on marquee releases and single hard mode farms with a 5 attempt daily limit.

    100% agree. I was just pointing out this was a step in the right direction, they should have followed it up with one or 2 more. 8 attempts was a another good one, but they back out.

    Coming from the same person who was defending their decision to reduce free node attempts from 8 to 5 back when it happened, I would respectfully say that this response sounds a bit hypocritical...

    They have the data, we do not. If they think it is the way the game should be for the purposes of pacing, then it's a good choice. From a community standpoint I'm sure we would all love to have more attempts and be able to progress faster, that doesnt make it right for the game, but i can still think it's better.

    It's funny how thinking one thing is better doesnt make it the best thing for a larger system. It's almost as if you can feel one way, but still see the reason and logic for a situation to go against that.... maybe it's just me.

    This is like saying all polititions know best and we should just agree with them.

    Not even close. Polititions do not use data to justify or make decisions. I also never said we should agree with them, but that there is another side to a situation and it can be good, even without you knowing.
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
    gufu21 wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    t0neg0d wrote: »
    Nauros wrote: »
    t0neg0d wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Whether or not someone is going to enjoy the game, is really more of a personal question. All we can do is hope they change iteams we dont like for a positive growth experience. This is always going to be evolving and changing.

    Sorta...

    If your customers become NOT customers, than it may be time to take some of that responsibility on.

    I'm 99.9% sure that the next hero's journey will require 4 single hard node farms & a new legendary that potentially requires another 5 single hard node farms. Why? Because there isn't anything else to choose from now =(

    There is - Solo. One guild store, two Cantina, one hard character node and one hard ship, both low energy. Plus Nest on a killer node, but she isn't really a part of the crew so I wouldn't expect her to be required. And we just got a Solo bundle...

    Who are you thinking they'll be needed for?
    My guess is the original Falcon. It makes sense, Solo was basically all about why it's so awesome and how Han got his hands on it. The only issue is that we still don't have original Chewie.

    Well poo. So do I farm Nest because she's way more useful than Young Lando, or do I hit his ships pve node to try to get ahead of the legendary requirements?

    Lando's Falcon looked quite good itself and it's at the same node as him, so I would go for it. But bear in mind that the requirements are pure speculation.
  • Just add a new heist event that awards stun guns, stun cuffs and cabanties. I bet that alone would reduce alot of anger and frustration.

    Toss in furnaces/furnace pieces and I'm right with you. Only reason I half solo Rancor Heroic in my Guild is it's the only real way to have a high chance at furnaces. Everything else I can get, albeit slowly, but not as slowly as furnaces.
  • EclecticsScott
    369 posts Member
    edited August 2018
    Garmaddon wrote: »
    Legendaries are coming back in second part of the year. Carrie has said this on Reddit last night when responding to a thread about marquee characters and game changer videos. They have realised that people aren't liking the marquee events as much and have said that the plan was marquee events first half of the year which started in April then introduce legendary/hero journey events in second half of year.

    Can y’all stop arguing long enough for someone to comment on this? Did this actually happen? If so, why isn’t it on the official message boards? @CG_Carrie
    Ooba hutar.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Hard node farming and gear crunch are wrecking the game. Kyno will argue untill hes blue im the face that its not true.

    He'll say $$$$ to speed it up but how many times have you all refreshed and simmed 14 missions just to drop 1 piece of salvage or done your 5 hard node battle and dropped 1 shard then refreshed energy and the node only to get 0 shards the next time.

    So 6 months to a year to farm 1 character out of dozens that you cant gear anyway unless you buy full pieces at £20 each.

    Please show me where I said they were good for the game. I will wait...
    @UnstopableSteve

    I didnt say you said its good, just not an issue.
    So lets see you say it then. Hard node farming and gear crunch is having a negetive effect on peoples enjoyment of the game and needs to be addressed.

    Say it or argue against like I said.


    Someone's enjoyment of the game is on them. I think, as I have said, that the current release structure allows for planning and is better than it used to be as far as getting toons into the game.

    I have also said that hardnode farms are not great.

    I have never said they are not an issue, but they are a 100% free way for anyone to get a toon and with some smart planning and strategy can get a ton they really want quicker using free crystals to speed up the farm.

    Whether or not someone is going to enjoy the game, is really more of a personal question. All we can do is hope they change iteams we dont like for a positive growth experience. This is always going to be evolving and changing.
    Garmaddon wrote: »
    Legendaries are coming back in second part of the year. Carrie has said this on Reddit last night when responding to a thread about marquee characters and game changer videos. They have realised that people aren't liking the marquee events as much and have said that the plan was marquee events first half of the year which started in April then introduce legendary/hero journey events in second half of year.

    Can y’all stop arguing long enough for someone to comment on this? Did this actually happen? If so, why the **** isn’t it on the official message boards? @CG_Carrie

    Look up - kyno posted a pic of her comment on reddit. Not on forums because they don’t have to be, I guess.
  • Atlas1
    1713 posts Member
    edited August 2018
    Nauros wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Atlas1 wrote: »
    kyno I get where you’re coming from but it’s like you’re choosing between bad or worse. CG ought to be more creative with character releases so as not to irritate the player base with every new toon release. I for one am also burned out on marquee releases and single hard mode farms with a 5 attempt daily limit.

    100% agree. I was just pointing out this was a step in the right direction, they should have followed it up with one or 2 more. 8 attempts was a another good one, but they back out.

    And the current 5 attempts are still a step up from the "good" old days of 3.

    But, if we’re going to stay with hard node releases, the attempts really need to go back to 8. Even 5 is too low.
  • i was a little surprised they went back to 5, but i can only assume they were seeing too much of a drop in crystal usage/purchases. increasing the limit back to 8 would be nice, but it would have to come with increasing our energy accrual and/or total pool to help all that much. the rate at which we gain energy and the amount of bonus energy we get i'm sure has gone up in the past, but not since i've started playing (a little over a year ago now) and we've gotten a crap ton of new characters in that time.

    i'm fine with marquee as a way of introducing new characters, but as others have said it's a volume problem; too many too quickly. the new characters are greatly outpacing the resources to get them. and even if you have no interest in the new characters (and i have no interest in most of the ones we've gotten lately), you can't simply ignore them because you at least need to know how to counter them. as overly complicated as kits are getting, that's not a burden i care to have at the rate we've been seeing lately. and that of course doesn't take into account that events requiring certain characters or factions can come out of nowhere, so it's dangerous to ignore characters for that reason too.

    tl;dr: marquees are fine, but either slow the hell down or give us a comparable increase in resources.
  • Nauros wrote: »
    Intrapidoo wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Alot of this comes down to long term plans. If you are trying to keep up with the release pace, be ready to $$$.

    The game is a grind with a long cycle and a marathon pace, just make a plan and stick to the plan. Dont worry about the new and shiny unless that fits your plan.

    No it doesnt comes down to that. For example i spent a lot of time/resources along with half of my guild to farm geonosians and their ships. Focused everything entirely on them and theorycrafting an optimal reinforcement set for them. Now all that down the drain because of the new ship that is basically says to us "we want money all of you can suck it". And if you are not a whale thats the only place to get crystals to farm the still useless veterans to get JTR to start hsr and not even counting the rest of the teams.

    He is absolutely right about marquee's beeing way too frequent. So as everyone who believes the forum is **** thanks to bad moderations and no communication which is prevelant in the content updates that come is.

    And who's gonna have maxed Hound's Tooth anytime soon? You basically said it, just the whales. So let them have it, let them keep the top 10 in the arena, they paid good money for it. I highly doubt that the whole top 50 will start running the HT overnight...

    I battled one today, piloted by a fully maxed Bossk. It’s definitely a Tom FH ship to beat. But like Nest, burst damage (like stacking offensive attacks from Tie Silencer) seemed to work well against it. Then there’s the Thrawn Nuke.
  • EAS
    89 posts Member
    Time ago its was 1 or 2 marquees a month


    Look how it is now

    ****
  • BubbaFett
    3311 posts Member
    edited August 2018
    The biggest issue to me with these new marqee is that this game is about strategy and synergy.... Trying to analyze kits and synergy and think about future potential when cg is releasing these toons non stop is like trying to drink from a firehose.....

    I don't care how they are released..... I care that we, as players, whether ftp or whale, have time to absorb new toons and new abilities.....
  • I understand the Marquee Events and characters cadence release... of course you need to make money from the game, everything is a business!

    But the amount of new characters released this year, the locations chose to farm them afterwards and the resources we get for that is ridiculous... Makes you fell you are only falling behind!

    When you finally unlock something you've been chasing for almost a year, its time is long gone and you are 3 steps behind. This is getting too greedy!

    I know you're not supposed to get everything, but you should be able to keep up at least a bit.... Common' guys!

    And the worst think ever is that when you have issues, looks like no one care!
    I've opened up 3 tickets so far, including evidence from the problems I've found.
    The forst two were completely ignored, not even a message acknowledging the problem and saying "I am sorry". The third one I got at least an answer, never a solution neither a compensation.

    Do you guys even care about bug fixes and beeing resonable?
  • hello marquee my old friend :(

    https://youtu.be/HEHHtTJ3-e4

    OMG that was bloody awesome. Perfectly sums it up!
  • Intrapidoo wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Intrapidoo wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Alot of this comes down to long term plans. If you are trying to keep up with the release pace, be ready to $$$.

    The game is a grind with a long cycle and a marathon pace, just make a plan and stick to the plan. Dont worry about the new and shiny unless that fits your plan.

    No it doesnt comes down to that. For example i spent a lot of time/resources along with half of my guild to farm geonosians and their ships. Focused everything entirely on them and theorycrafting an optimal reinforcement set for them. Now all that down the drain because of the new ship that is basically says to us "we want money all of you can suck it". And if you are not a whale thats the only place to get crystals to farm the still useless veterans to get JTR to start hsr and not even counting the rest of the teams.

    He is absolutely right about marquee's beeing way too frequent. So as everyone who believes the forum is **** thanks to bad moderations and no communication which is prevelant in the content updates that come is.

    So you regret the plan and that is their fault? No one forced you down that road, that was your choice.

    You do realize you are getting the ship too, right?

    I'm glad yo see you are trying to be part of the solution and not part of the problem. Keep up the good work.

    I realize that yes, and i have the ship yes. But again its on a node that essentially makes it an 8 month farm without refreshes which i wont get because even if i finish vets before deadline thanks to the whales i'll be about of the spot i farmed for in fleet arena. So what do i do now?I can accept that theres nothing to do, accept it or try to say things that are just bad and get unnoticed like everyone else on this forum. Not to many options right? Especially counting in that Bossk is a really bad character that has minimal use in the game.

    Sure you can keep a long term goal and focus on a specific thing whatever it may be, but you need a certain amount of crystal/credit both normal and fleet credit to be able to sustain that. And no matter how many times anyone says something it doesnt go through. Not to mention 99% of the forum users are better game designers than anyone who ever worked for CG which is sad. The uncensored places like reddit and discord have better ideas day by day than CG designers have on their best days.

    Bossk is a bad toon in this game? Do you even play TW or BH events? Lmfao what a reach!
  • Verror
    18 posts Member
    edited August 2018
    “You don’t. Whales gonna whale”

    4m Gp kraken here and let me tell you it’s wearing out us too. Too much carachters in such short timeframe becomes frustrating.

    Add to that the very irritating nerfs and you see a lot of quits as it’s recently happening.
  • See, gear takes me so long that I'm not sure I mind it taking 6-8 months to farm a random toon. It's not like I'll be able to gear them sooner than that anyway; my backlog of factions to gear up is a year long. But all these new toons have me feeling very overwhelmed. Knowing that they might be needed for some game-breaking legendary AND that some of them are single hard node farms is pretty intimidating. We haven't had any legendary/HJ yet that's been gated by a single hard node. It also means that I keep pushing back farms like Baze because other things seem more important to the game's future.

    Also, it would be really, really nice if toons that were nothing more than platoon fodder (hi, Lobot) were moved to the dead stores so I didn't have to wonder about if and when to waste precious energy farming them. And I know some people have no problem with getting toons from the guild shop, but I'm really not a fan because of the aforementioned gear backlog. Maybe if STR dropped more guild tokens...
  • KueChael
    930 posts Moderator
    Legendary are as important as marquee characters, once released they give all of us some direction to aim for. Goals for accomplishing a farm of marquee characters to get a really good Legendary character. I agree that there are a lot of marquee characters being released, but that fuels speculation to who or how many Legendary characters could be coming. We are missing a Legendary (or 2) to break up the marquee events.
    The game is definitely a marathon. I appreciate characters that get the hard node+. Like Sion has 2 nodes, now Visas, Holdo and Nest have a bounty event.
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